Chris Hazzard
South Down · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland
“The order I am bringing forward extends the power for my Department to pay a grant to NI Water in lieu of domestic water charges. The current powers to pay a grant will expire on 31 March 2017, and the Water and Sewerage Services Act 2016, which was passed by the Assembly in January last year, provided the power to extend that date by an…”
“I thank those Members who have commented on the motion this evening. Some general issues and several specific points have been raised. <BR /> <BR />I will turn first to Mr Farry's question: why, for the period of time?”
“I am delighted that the Alliance argument around water charges does not chime with more of the electorate and that the particular reason does not hold sway, because this Executive certainly are not for turning on this issue. There will be no water charges for domestic customers, and we have ensured that.”
“<BR /> <BR />The second point that Mr Farry raised was around governance issues and the way forward. They are all issues that I have given thought to and that, I have no doubt, would have featured in the mandate in the time ahead, but we are not at that point today. The Assembly is about to be dissolved.”
“However, the imminent dissolution of the Assembly means I have decided to bring the draft order here today. <BR /> <BR />The grant provides NI Water with the funding to enable it to maintain drinking water supplies and deliver sewerage services.”
“I believe that this order will reinforce the Executive's commitment not to bring in water charging for households, and I thank the Members for their support.”
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“The issue of international passenger transport is being considered as part of a detailed assessment of the potential impact of a withdrawal from the EU. All of these considerations will feed into negotiations going forward. However, it is essential to make sure that British Government Ministers keep at the forefront of their thinking the unique set of circumstances that apply on the island of Ireland when it comes to passenger transport. There are many journeys across the border every day, with passengers travelling for work, education and leisure purposes. It is very important that people in the North and South continue to have a choice of transport services at their disposal and can enjoy free movement on this island when and where they wish.”
“I have been dealing with coastal erosion. On two or three occasions, I have had meetings with my colleague Michelle McIlveen, the Minister of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs, and I have no doubt that the Departments will continue to work on it. I, too, come from a constituency, South Down, that has suffered from this in recent years in places such as Killough, Rostrevor and Warrenpoint. I know how important it is. Work is going on to develop the best way forward, first and most important to assess exactly where we stand. I know that Scotland has done work over the last number of years on assessing where exactly they stand with their coastline, and there is merit in us doing that here as well.”
“This is not a plan that will be foisted on communities; it is a plan that communities will play a central part in taking forward.”
“In my short time in post thus far, I, too, have been into the areas that have suffered badly, and there is a great sense of frustration. As I said to the previous Member, it struck me that there is a sense of acceptance that we are where we are and we need now to learn how we live with this and ensure that it does not ruin our lives every winter. I think that is the situation that we have got to. The other thing that strikes me is that the farming community is central to this and will be central to the flood strategy steering group and the recommendations going forward.”
“An action plan is being drawn up by officials from Rivers Agency, and, given that input from other Departments is required, this will then be taken forward by the flood strategy prevention group.”
“The one word that repeats itself throughout this is "resilience". I think that there is an acceptance among Governments that the situation is not one of eradicating flooding but that it is something that we have to manage. That is a position that we are coming to. <BR /> <BR />In dealing with flooding, how do we then go forward? The 10 high-level recommendations include increased research and development into our farming practices and flood plains; improvements to communications during flood events; collaboration to further develop the multi-agency approach; a focus on civil contingency and emergency planning; and connecting resources to make the best use of our collective skills.”
“The Member is correct to talk about the resilience in the rural community, and Mr Strong points to this. There were five commendations in the report. The first was for distinct leadership by the then Agriculture and Rural Development Minister, Michelle O'Neill, and the chief executive of Rivers Agency, David Porter, during the period. The second was for the notable support and guidance from the Ulster Farmers’ Union, and the third one was for the strong resilience shown by many in the rural community. This goes wider than just flooding. We know that in periods of very cold weather with ice and snowy conditions the rural community stands up. It had the vision to engage with natural flood management systems, and there were sustained efforts by emergency planning groups and community resilience and services.”
“My Department is currently preparing an action plan to allocate responsibility for progressing the recommendations in the report through the flood strategy steering group, as this includes representation from other Departments.”
“The report was an evidence-based study, which sought to obtain facts from a wide range of stakeholders, covering farming, engineering, environment and governance. It is clearly well informed, wide-ranging and challenging, and I am very impressed by the extensive nature of the engagement carried out. I believe that the considerable time taken to listen to those impacted by last winter’s floods was time well spent. The findings in the report are set out using the theme of resilience throughout, and it focuses on a number of sectors such as farmers, staff and land use. Importantly, the report highlights that flooding is not something that can be solved but is a reality that we must learn to live with and manage.”
“This year. I have also announced, as you have seen, a joint initiative between ourselves and Dublin about improving the service line. This is not fake news.”
“That is why they are now going to review the situation with services in Newry and enhance them where necessary. <BR /> <BR />That is the situation. This is not fake news. I do not get into the realm of fake news. As I said, the people who I have been talking to in Newry over the past few days are, obviously, different from the people who the Member for Newry and Armagh has been talking to over the last few days. Local people are excited by the fact that they are going to see improved rail services —”
“The only person who should be ashamed is the Member. The people of Newry will experience improved rail services as a result of me making these decisions. I am not sure whether the Member has been aware, or been awake, in recent weeks, but I will remain the Minister for Infrastructure over the next number of weeks. I have had conversations with Translink, and we have talked about the enhancements that are needed in Newry.”
“I thank the Member for her question. As I said, in response to my concerns, a joint service improvement team has been put in place to look at all the different aspects of how we improve the line. The team will not be looking at security issues alone, but I have no doubt that that may be something that it looks at.”
“I regularly have conversations with Translink. We have discussed the recent delays on the Derry to Coleraine line, which the Member alluded to. The delays are down to barriers at Bellarena and a faulty track circuit at Castlerock. You go too far by suggesting that we need an entirely different approach and saying that the standard is not what it should be. I go back to my original answer: the 2016 results showed a perfect score of 100% for reliability. That is a fantastic score, and fair play to all those who achieved it.”
“<BR /> <BR />In response to my concerns, a joint service improvement team has been established, representing NI Railways and Irish Rail, with the objective of addressing performance issues associated with the Enterprise service. I expect to see improvements in those services.”
“My Department monitors performance on an ongoing basis as part of the conditions of the service agreement that it entered into with Translink in October 2015. <BR /> <BR />I am aware of a number of delays on the Derry to Coleraine line that arose in early December 2016 following the activation of new signalling. It is clear that the performance issues at that time were not satisfactory, but Translink has worked hard with the contractor to address the issues during the bedding-in period. I am also aware that, following the recent refurbishment project, the Belfast to Dublin Enterprise service experienced a series of service delays.”
“The performance of bus and rail services provided by Translink, including NI Railways (NIR), is independently monitored, and results are published twice a year. The results of the spring 2016 monitor were published on 22 September 2016 and showed that NIR exceeded the charter targets for punctuality and, overall, achieved a perfect score of 100% for reliability, which is a very creditable performance. <BR /> <BR />Detailed analysis of punctuality data is compiled per services and reviewed on a daily, weekly, monthly, 26-week and annual basis by NIR. Poorly performing services are then monitored, and action plans are developed to enhance performance. When disruption occurs, NIR acts immediately to minimise delays and return services to the planned timetable.”
“<BR /> <BR />Just for clarity again, no meters have been installed in domestic properties since 6 July, and that has saved £100,000. Ms Armstrong wants to talk about wasting public money, but this is public money that we have actually saved. Again, straying from the points raised here today, the Alliance Party goes back to its fervour for introducing water charges. Water charges have been rejected by the people, as we saw in Alliance's recent performance at the last election. The people do not want water charges, and that is something that this Executive will stand up for. <BR /> <BR />Finally, I believe that these regulations will reinforce the Executive's commitment not to bring in water charges for households. I thank Members for their support today and ask the Assembly to approve the regulations.”
“I thank the Members who have commented on this motion. Some points have been made on general and specific issues, and I will turn to them now. I want to thank the Chair of the Committee, not just for his constructive comments today but for the way in which the Committee has approached this issue from the start. I welcome that. <BR /> <BR />Mr McCrossan made a number of points, the first of which was that there was wastage of some £13 million. The actual figure is £1·3 million, Daniel, so you might want to look at your figures again a bit more closely. He said that Sinn Féin is now, somehow, following the SDLP's example and finally doing the right thing. It was your party that walked away from the Executive, Daniel. It could have been you standing here today and not me doing this, but the SDLP decided to do otherwise.”
“It therefore makes sense to cease wasting valuable resources by installing water meters. The motion demonstrates the Executive's commitment to protecting people's personal finances and to reducing the financial burden on NI Water. I commend the motion to the Assembly and ask that it approve the regulations.”
“The regulations that I am bringing forward today remove the requirement on NI Water to install water meters at domestic properties connecting for the first time to the public water supply. The practice of installing meters currently costs the public purse around £200,000 a year, and, given that they are not used, it is a nugatory expense, and one that cannot be sustained in the current financial climate. The Assembly will be aware of the commitment of the Executive not to bring in water charging. It is the intention of the Executive to continue to bear the cost of water charges, on behalf of domestic customers, for the next five years. In addition to the regulations, I have instructed my officials to prepare the necessary legislation to extend my Department's powers to pay the subsidy to NI Water up until March 2022.”
“Last year, when there was an issue regarding special educational needs in the Education Authority, John O'Dowd, the previous Minister, stepped in. It is maybe time to do that on this issue. <BR /> <BR />I know I am time-bound, so, finally, as the Member who spoke previously said, it is important that we look at different ways to consult, but it is also important that we do not take away from the consultation process. I fear that, as with the social security offices, which are also going under review, we have maybe taken away something from the consultation processes. I therefore ask the Minister to re-engage on that.”
“Take Killowen, Ardnabannon and Delamont: those centres are vital, and, no doubt, that has been touched on. The centres and their staff are very much part of the local community. They are also part of the learning process. Many of our young people, including kids who come out from Belfast, benefit from the environmental learning and heritage in the likes of the Mournes, Kilbroney and Carlingford lough in South Down. We see it all the time. That is their bed of learning when it comes to outdoor living and outdoor learning. It would be a travesty if we somehow could not re-engage with the consultation, speak to the centres and find an appropriate way forward that matches the needs and outcomes of the Department. <BR /> <BR />It is for the Department and the Minister to take the decision on this.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Apologies, we were in Budget discussions. That was very timely, given the subject matter, I suppose, but it is why I missed the earlier contributions. The number of people here today is testimony to the feeling about the issue we are discussing. I have been here for five years, and I do not think that I have seen an Adjournment debate with so many people at it, so fair play to Colin and to everybody else for being here. <BR /> <BR />When we look at the small sum of money that is being talked about here and the money that Ministers, such as the Education Minister and I, have to look towards saving, something that should be borne in mind is the outcome that the centres give not just to our children but to the local economy.”
“I do not mean to be facetious, but everybody in the Chamber could say exactly the same thing about their part of the world. That is the situation that we find ourselves in. As I mentioned, we have a structural maintenance backlog in the region of £1 billion. We know the economic forecast that is coming, especially from the Chancellor's statement last week, and that will not change over the next number of years — if anything, it may get sharper. We need to take a longer strategic view. I know that projects in a number of areas deal with road safety, so we need to look at what and how we prioritise. While in post, I will certainly continue to do that.”
“Absolutely. I accept that. I know that £2 million has been spent on dealing with coastal erosion in that part of the world. I know that the Committee visited the Ards peninsula just recently. When you travel down the County Down coast to Warrenpoint and Rostrevor, you find similar problems that the Departments are starting to have to grapple with, and they will have to continue to grapple with them, perhaps at an accelerating rate, over the next number of years. That is why Michelle McIlveen and I have brought a bit of focus to this issue, and the two Departments will have to work together and set out a number of targets that we want to meet over the next number of years.”
“Due to the economic climate over the last number of years, there is somewhere in the region of a £1 billion backlog in structural maintenance. I will not solve that today or tomorrow. We need a longer-term strategic view on how to do that. It will be a very difficult thing to do in the economic climate in which we find ourselves.”
“As outlined, I am meeting the Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs Minister, Michelle McIlveen, next week to take forward a number of proposals for dealing with coastal erosion. It is an issue that we have to deal with and manage. We cannot eradicate it, so we need to work with it. I come from a rural background and a rural constituency. When I came into post, I made clear that we needed to do more in rural areas. It may be a drop in the ocean — excuse the pun — but the £10 million that I put towards investment in rural roads has gone down well in rural areas and is providing a good service. It is only a drop in the ocean. We require hundreds of millions of pounds more for structural maintenance.”
“Are we to demolish Belfast City Hall because we need a big roundabout at Belfast City Hall? We need to talk about moving people, not cars, in and out of Belfast.”
“I would not have stood in the House recently and made the decision to proceed with the York Street interchange if I did not accept the arguments that it is a strategic piece of infrastructure that not just the city of Belfast but the economy as a whole requires. I absolutely accept that, but, as I also pointed out, right now, I do not have the financial ability at my disposal to build everything that we want, so I need to prioritise. When looking at the economy — we need to get to this as well — we continue to talk in the House and on the public airwaves about moving cars. We need to talk about moving people. Moving people in and out of Belfast city is good for business; moving cars is not. What are we to do after York Street? Are we to bulldoze half of Great Victoria Street because we need two extra lanes in Great Victoria Street?”
“There are other statistics we could bring out. I mentioned that already. Had you asked for the fatality statistics for York Street interchange and compared them with the fatality statistics for the A5 and the A6 — you just did that with something else — you would have an entirely different set of statistics. I may be wrong, but I am not aware of any fatalities at the York Street interchange. I may be wrong about that. I am aware of nearly 50 fatalities on the A5 in the last decade. As I said, for me, strategically, there are a number of criteria that we can base this on. Certainly, one of the most important, for someone in my position, is to make our roads as safe as possible.”
“Yes. I took the opportunity recently when meeting the unions to open up a continual and regular engagement with them. I sensed a frustration on their behalf that they maybe did not have that in recent years. I am certainly keen to open that up. I think it could be productive for my Department to do so.”
“I engage regularly with Translink officials. I also had the opportunity to meet them. We had a very productive meeting with union members from Translink lately. The Member has raised an important issue, and the next time I meet Translink officials, I will raise it.”
“Absolutely. The upgrade of the A6 is an Executive flagship project so, in short, the money is going nowhere else.”
“<BR /> <BR />On the back of the decision, I took the opportunity to discuss with officials the technical possibilities of moving forward with the Moneynick section, which the Member, as a commuter, will know all too well. That is something we are actively now looking at. Preliminary work is ongoing on the stretch. That work will continue on that stretch at the very least. If we can progress with works within the legal contracts that have been agreed, we absolutely will.”
“Not a problem. As I said last week, while I was disappointed, of course, that Justice Maguire came to the decision he did, I was not overly shocked or surprised, given that the bar is quite low when you are applying for leave to challenge that. I was pleased that he rejected five of the six grounds of the appeal. My Department will very speedily get our papers into the courts. I even welcome the remarks from Justice Maguire when he recognised the strategic importance of that piece of investment and that we need to have a speedy resolution to it. I am absolutely confident that, when it comes to the substantial hearing in the new year, the Department will be successful.”
“Yes. The Member will appreciate that the diary is hectic, but, looking into the future and the new year, I would be happy to sit down and take five minutes to discuss it.”
“Again, I have nothing instinctively against reviewing something like that. If the Member wants to correspond with me to shed some light on what he believes to be the problem, I would be more than happy.”
“I recently took the opportunity at a North/South sectoral meeting to speak with Michael Ring TD, the Minister of State for Regional Economic Development. I think that Fine Gael is certainly sensitive, coming out of the last election, that perhaps it was rejected in western and more regional parts over the lack of development in regional areas. So I think that Michael Ring has a sense that he wants to do something. He is very keen to work on projects such as this, to bring regional balance to investment. Also, next month — actually, in a couple of weeks — I have a meeting with Shane Ross, the Minister for Transport, to discuss a number of transport issues. Top of the agenda, of course, will be the A5.”
“<BR /> <BR />I was recently in Carrickmacross speaking to local people who said that their town would be dead if it were not so close to the major infrastructure linking Belfast and Dublin. I have spoken to the chief executives of councils along the proposed route of the A5 — Donegal, Cavan, Fermanagh and even into Mid Ulster — and they are crying out for this piece of investment. I am determined, obviously, to work with partners in Dublin to deliver. It was not perhaps as short as saying absolutely yes, but yes, they should.”
“In short, absolutely yes. I think now is probably a timely period. Once the £400 million was promised, and then the crash occurred and the Dublin Government seem to have got nervous and put £75 million back on the table. As we approach a mid-term review of national infrastructure investment in the South, it is timely for the Dublin Government to consider putting all of the £400 million back on the table. I think that a lot of people see the A5 simply as a project for the North and the Northern Executive. That is simply not the case. This is a key infrastructure project that would open up the entire north-west region, so I think there is a responsibility on us in Belfast and on the Dublin Government to do all that we can.”
“Again, there are a number of these projects across the place. I know that Lisburn and Castlereagh City Council is looking for one. In my area of Downpatrick, there is a need to address this type of project — projects where, up to now, finances from central government have dictated, "Look, we just simply do not have the money. Sorry, folks. Sin é. It is on the shelf, and that is it." I think that we should certainly look at whether there are other ways out there. Are there tools at our disposal here that we are not using? So I say to the Member that I am more than happy to look at it. If he wants to correspond with me, put some of these ideas down and have a discussion, I am more than happy to do that.”
“At the NILGA conference, I took the opportunity to talk about greater partnership and about delivering some of these projects. Certainly, I have got from the business community a sense of a fresh approach; they want to do more also. I do not want to say no to everything. For me, everything is on the table. Let us consider it, but I caveat that by saying that it has to work in the best interests of the public purse in the long term.”
“Yes. Formally and informally, as I have mentioned in previous answers, I have had discussions with the Finance Minister quite regularly since coming into post, most particularly regarding finance. As I have mentioned, there are somewhere in the region of £5 billion of projects sitting in my Department at different stages. Some of them are simply concepts on a piece of paper but some of them may be nearing the end — we all know well. I will get approximately £1·5 billion over the next few years to develop infrastructure capital projects. You can see that there is a massive gap between what we could do and what we can do. I have certainly put on record from the start that I want to look at equipping myself with a toolbox of funding arrangements and ways to finance these. I am aware that a number of councils are very keen.”
“The logic applied to previous questions was that prevention is better than cure. In this instance, we have engineered solutions that have the highest impact. I have no problem, when the works are complete in the next couple of months, in corresponding again with the Member and looking at this again if he feels that there is still a problem.”
“There are therefore no plans to provide additional vehicle-restraint systems at the roundabout at this time. It should be borne in mind that vehicle-restraint systems are used to protect the occupants of a vehicle from striking an off-road hazard after loss of control of the vehicle. The provision of high-friction surfacing is aimed at preventing loss of control of the vehicle in the first place.”
“My Department’s Transport NI is aware of a number of collisions in the vicinity of the Ballygrooby roundabout, including loss-of-control incidents for vehicles exiting the roundabout onto the A6 Castle Road travelling towards Antrim. Following an investigation of the causes, a scheme is being developed to provide high-friction surfacing and an amended white-lining layout on the exit towards Antrim from the Ballygrooby roundabout to address loss-of-control incidents. It is anticipated that that work will be completed in early 2017. <BR /> <BR />As part of the investigation into collisions at the roundabout, an assessment was carried out for the provision of additional vehicle-restraint systems on the exit from the roundabout towards Antrim. The location, however, did not meet the criteria for a scheme proposal to be taken forward.”
“I have not had any specific discussions with Lisburn and Castlereagh City Council. The scheme first came on to my horizon when the Finance Minister, Máirtín Ó Muilleoir, talked about it. As someone who knows the lay of the land in that part of the world, I think that it would be a fantastic asset. It could also play a vital role in alleviating congestion from the city, considering the success of the Cairnshill park-and-ride facility. A greenway there from Carryduff through Belvoir forest would be a great asset. I encourage the council to do all that it can during the detailed design. Like other schemes that I have mentioned, it could be a huge asset.”
“I was delighted and privileged to launch the greenway plan just outside Dundrum on the old Belfast and County Down Railway line, which used to bring hundreds, if not thousands, of tourists from Belfast to north and south Down, including to Newcastle, my part of the world. There is no reason why we cannot extend out for active travel and cycling. When you talk to anyone involved in the tourism industry, they tell you that they want active tourism or activities that take people out of the city to destinations such as Newcastle. This can definitely be part of that. Some of the schemes for the glens and another one to link Carlingford lough and Lough Neagh are very exciting. There are some great schemes for us to be excited about over the next five to 10 years.”
“I only wish that I had the money to start work tomorrow. As I say, it would be a fantastic project. Yes, I am more than happy to do so.”