Pat Catney
Lagan Valley · Social Democratic and Labour Party · Northern Ireland
“I am delighted that he will get his own private Member's Bill through, which will bring equality, again, within teaching. He had to do a huge piece of work on the back of that. <BR /> <BR />It makes me proud to be part of this Assembly.”
“I am excited for the future. I will go back to the Minister. I have done so twice and will do it again. I do not know how the relationships required by the Bill's cross-cutting nature will go or which Department will hold the powers that the Bill provides to ensure that period products are available as widely as possible.”
“I have done that with every single Member whom I have met out there and talked to. I thank Members across the Chamber for their kind words to me personally today. This is not electioneering, folks, but I will tell you this. As we walk out and face the general public, no one knows what way they are going to go.”
“When I started out, I did not know the whole process of where or how it goes, but I know the process now, and I know that there is a lot of work, including from the civil servants. Mr Deputy Speaker, I will go back to tell you about when I had the little pub next door to Churchill House.”
“I will not be much longer, folks. I want to say that, as I was coming down this morning, I had the radio on, and I heard about an art project that is going on in Belfast. This may well be my last opportunity to speak about the ring of steel.”
“There was a bit of toing and froing, and I did not know which Department was going to lift the Bill and take up the chalice, which some people may have thought was a poisoned chalice. I thank the Minister, Deirdre, for taking that chalice. It was brave and correct to do that.”
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“That is a distinct and separate duty from that which is imposed by clause 3, which requires the Department of Health and public service bodies to publicise the locations at which products must be available under the arrangements that are set out in clauses 1 and 2. <BR /> <BR />Clause 7 provides definitions for three key terms that are used throughout the Bill, namely "period products", "types of period products", and "references to a person's needs". Sustainable options are explicitly allowed for under clause 7(b). <BR /> <BR />Regarding the use of gender-neutral language in the Bill, the Equality Commission and the Bill Office made it clear to me that all legislation requires such language.”
“Clause 4 requires each Department to issue guidance to public service bodies to support them in the exercise of their duties under clauses 2 and 5. That guidance must be fully consulted on. Clause 5 requires public service bodies to publish a written statement describing how they have developed their arrangements for the provision of free period products with regards to the guidance from the Department. <BR /> <BR />Clause 6 requires each Department, individually or jointly with another Department, to publish information about the location where free period products would be available from public bodies. The Departments may choose how best to do so.”
“<BR /> <BR />As I said earlier, clause 3 requires the Department of Health and specific public service bodies to ensure reasonably easy access to products, to respect dignity, to make a reasonable choice of types of products obtainable, and to publicise their availability. Clause 3(2) provides that arrangements that are established and maintained by specific public service bodies:”
“<BR /> <BR />The use of the scheme in clause 1 will reduce the need for a person to use the provision in clause 2, but it is very unlikely to eradicate that need. It was, therefore, important to make products available under the provision in clause 2, but also to limit them so as not to overburden public service bodies and not to have extensive over-provision and wastage. <BR /> <BR />Regulations under clause 2 are subject to the affirmative procedure, which will be approved by resolution of the Assembly. Clause 2(10) allows regulation on public service bodies to take effect on different days. That is to allow a consultation to be carried out and published before the statement is produced.”
“In addition, regulations must be made to specify the bodies that are listed in clause 2(2) so that free period products are made available from healthcare locations and educational establishments. I wanted there to be as much flexibility as possible, so clause 2(3) allows for the products to be supplied by the public body or a third party. The best location in the premises may also be specified. I highlight the restrictions in the number of products that are available under clause 2(6). It is important to distinguish between the universal scheme that is proposed in clause 1 and the provisions that are set out in clause 2. Clause 1 provides period products to fulfil all of a person's needs, while clause 2 aims to supply products that a person might require at a specific place and time.”
“<BR /> <BR />Clause 1(2) allows a person to obtain sufficient products to meet their needs "while in Northern Ireland." For those who live in Northern Ireland, under clause 1(8), that means all their needs, including when abroad on holiday. Anyone visiting Northern Ireland can obtain the products that they require during their stay. The Department must consult on its proposed arrangements, and the consultation results must be published. The location of where the products are available must be published annually. <BR /> <BR />Clause 2(1) places a separate duty on each Department to specify via regulations which of the public service bodies within their functions must make period products obtainable free of charge in their premises.”
“That should be read in conjunction with clause 3, which is central to the entire Bill. It states that any arrangements established by the Department must make free period products available in a way that is reasonably accessible and respects dignity; a reasonable range of products should be available; and the scheme must be advertised. The idea is that the Department has discretion in the precise arrangements made. <BR /> <BR />Members may be aware of the c-card scheme for obtaining condoms, and the Department may be minded to do something similar for period products. However, any such scheme must also take into consideration those who cannot register for a card. Provision in clause 1 allows for products to be obtained by another person on behalf of those who need them and for products to be delivered.”
“Clause 1 places a duty on the Department of Health to make sure that period products:”
“<BR /> <BR />The importance of that aspect of the Bill cannot be stressed enough. A survey of over 1,000 UK girls found that half are embarrassed by their period and are afraid to ask for help because of that. YouGov found that 43% of girls have witnessed their peers being bullied or shamed about their period. According to the Council for the Curriculum, Examinations and Assessment (CCEA) period poverty survey of August 2021, 53% of pupils who menstruate felt embarrassed buying period products, while 56% had to ask to borrow from a friend or teacher. A quarter of the population has their period at any given time. How can we still have that level of stigma around such a normal bodily function? <BR /> <BR />I will take a moment to talk about the main clauses of the Bill.”
“When speaking with campaign groups, I learnt about the disturbing link between domestic abuse and period poverty. I listened to mothers who told me about using food banks to get products so that their children could eat, and to workers who had to choose between paying for the train to go to work or buying tampons. That cannot be acceptable. <BR /> <BR />However, as important as it is, the Bill is about more than period poverty. In fact, its main goal is to make the provision of products universal, like any other form of healthcare, and to allow those who menstruate to do so with dignity. That is not radical or extreme. It is the right thing to do. It is about saying that menstruation is normal, and, therefore, free universal access to tampons, pads and reusable options should be normal, too.”
“One in seven reported having to borrow products due to cost issues, with one in 10 having to improvise. That is a very blasé way of saying that one in 10 girls reported needing to use things like toilet roll, old clothes or even newspapers because they could not afford their products. Forty per cent of girls in the United Kingdom have used toilet paper because they could not afford period products. Shockingly, it is estimated that 137,000 children in the UK have missed school days due to period poverty. Further research shows that one in five UK women will struggle to access period products at some point in their life.”
“The influence of her Bill on mine is clear to see, so much so that, if we were to go back to school, I would justifiably be written up for plagiarism. The Bill is in front of the House only because of her groundbreaking work. I am eternally grateful for her support and guidance. <BR /> <BR />It is important to understand the dramatic impact of period poverty. Every day, across the world, 800 million people have their period, 500 million of whom lack the proper resources to care for their period. In the UK, a survey by Plan International found that one in 10 girls reported that they had been unable to afford period products.”
“I have no doubt that they will continue to do so as it progresses through the legislative process. I was honoured to stand with some of those campaigners on the steps outside to encourage Members to support the universal provision of period products. <BR /> <BR />I thank the Chair of the Education Committee, Chris Lyttle, for his guidance and support, and also for bringing the petition for free period product provision to the Assembly to highlight the need for this legislation. I personally will be sorry to see him leave the Assembly. His calm, astute and beneficial contributions will be sorely missed. <BR /> <BR />At this stage, I must also mention the work of Monica Lennon in bringing a similar Bill through the Scottish Parliament.”
“Their door has always been open, COVID permitting, and they have guided me skilfully through the process. I must also thank my own team, including Ally, for their work on the consultation, and the Bill Office team and Jonny for his research for today, supported by Frank and Christine. <BR /> <BR />Standing here, I feel the expectations of generations of equality campaigners who have worked tirelessly to get us to this point. I look at the current generation of local campaigners and am in complete awe of their knowledge and determination. People like Katrina McDonnell from the Homeless Period Belfast, Alexa Moore from TransgenderNI, and Grace Boyle, who runs the Northern Ireland Period Poverty Action Group, have given me crucial advice and helped me throughout the process of getting the Bill to this stage.”
“As you have stated, Mr Speaker, there is no time limit on the debate, so I will just make my speech. If other Members speak, I will take note and answer them at the end. <BR /> <BR />Though it may seem that the debate will be a highly directed one on a very specific piece of legislation, the Bill touches on the universal concepts of equality, mutual respect and the right of all citizens to live their lives with dignity. I am proud to advance the Period Products (Free Provision) Bill, but I do so full of the knowledge that it has been a complete team effort. I want to thank the Bill Office team and the drafters for working with me to get the Bill to where I wanted it to be, particularly as they have been inundated with proposals from Members.”
“Minister, I was not a Member at the time, but, as far as I am aware, those powers were handed back to Westminster, and I know that Sinn Féin was the party that handed them back. I thank the Minister for her answer. My question is about the thousands of poor people who have been left without that money, are accumulating debt and are feeling the worst constraints of coming out of the pandemic. They have been left behind because of backroom deals that have been done here in Stormont.”
“First Minister, are you not embarrassed by your antics over the whole Brexit issue? Simply, yours is the party that owns it. You tripped in and out of Number 10 with Boris Johnson. Take ownership of it and get on with what you agreed and what you liked at the time.”
“With rights come responsibility. As I have stated, it is five times more likely that you will be one of the ill ones in hospital if you are unvaccinated and over the age of 50. If the First Minister wants to increase vaccination, why does he not make the decision to mandate passports? Will he confirm whether all his MLAs are double vaccinated? Yes or no? Simple.”
“I beg to introduce the Period Products (Free Provision) Bill [NIA 39/17-22], which is a Bill to secure the provision throughout Northern Ireland of free period products; and for connected purposes.”
“Thank you joint Minister for your answers so far. The money that is going into the NSMC will drive tourism in the canal structure. I speak to businesses all the time, and not one has said anything to me or whispered a concern about the authority of the European Court of Justice in respect of the governance of the protocol. Minister, do you agree that the jurisdiction issue set out by the party opposite, which seems to have lifted the ball and run off with it, was a British nationalists' Brexit concern and that they should not play fast and loose with the Good Friday Agreement?”
“Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. <BR /> <BR />The Department estimated that £10·5 million was needed for, among other things, features to support an Executive policy on domestic use of the COVID passport. Will the Minister provide an update on work that has taken place over the past three months?”
“Yes, you are having it, sir. <BR /> <BR />It was needed for, among other things, features to —.”
“— to reconsider your comments. In response to a question for written answer asked on 5 July, the Minister said that his Department estimated that £10·5 million was needed for, among other things —.”
“I thank you for your reply, Minister. I hoped that you would bring that scheme to the Executive meeting last night, but it was not there. I was extremely disappointed by the statement, issued in your name today, that appears to question the sincerity of my party on that issue. You may want to take this opportunity —”
“We need a scheme that invigorates our community energy sector to help people to find innovative, local solutions and to realise affordable, renewable energy production that will take our communities out of fuel poverty so that families are not cold this winter.”
“Every year, we have an average of just over 900 people who lose their life and are recorded in the ridiculous statistic of "excess winter mortality". How can that be acceptable in 2021? How many of those anonymously recorded in that ridiculous statistic have lost their life due to fuel poverty? <BR /> <BR />My apologies for going a little off-topic, Mr Deputy Speaker. I cannot stress enough the impact that a properly set up small-scale green energy strategy could have. We need a scheme that gives proper incentives without producing the ridiculous situation where people were paid more to produce less.”
“Of course, meeting our renewable energy target is important. However, if the scheme is pitched right and is done in combination with the wider strategy for sustainable energy, we may have the ability to completely transform how communities acquire energy. <BR /> <BR />My main interest is in how we can use an all-encompassing energy strategy to tackle the devastating levels of fuel poverty in Northern Ireland. Fuel poverty is another area in which Northern Ireland tops the leader board. It is an area in which we definitely do not want to top the leader board, but 22% of our population is fuel poor. A huge amount of stress and terrible anxiety come with fuel poverty. A huge number of preventable health issues come from living in cold, damp, mould-ridden properties and homes.”
“I speak in broad support of what the Member for Upper Bann is trying to do with the introduction of his private Member's Bill. The Member is completely correct about the stagnation in the community energy sector, and it needs to diversify into the renewables sector. As the Bill moves through the process, I hope to fully scrutinise how its provisions will help to achieve its stated goal. <BR /> <BR />It is important to get this right from the start. I do not need to mention the failure of past energy schemes, whether that was in how incentives were set up or how they worked in the real world. Let us just say that we do not have the best track record. We must get it right, so that the scheme has qualitative and quantitative value and because its impact can be much wider than just reaching a renewable energy target.”
“— I just thought, "Surely —". Thank you, Mr Speaker.”
“This week, we are now fighting about what we call this place. When I listened to those families in their campaign —”
“<BR /> <BR />I thought back to the debate that we had previously on how this place should better reflect the Northern Ireland that we all live in and about the need to get away from the petty squabbles of "us and them" and whataboutery.”
“It was impossible not to feel the grief of all the families who were there. <BR /> <BR />It is one of the few moments on this hill when I have had to just stop and take it all in. I listened to the families share their memories of their loved ones. I listened to Brenda Doherty tell the story of her mother, Ruth Burke, who died in March 2020. Brenda talked about the importance of the memory stones as unique and individual. I listened to Aoibhínn O'Sullivan talk about how the pandemic had robbed her not only of her father Hugh Higgins, a teacher from Newry, but of the opportunity for her and her family to grieve him. I listened to them talk about their campaign for a permanent memorial to the people who were lost during the pandemic to be created in the grounds of Stormont.”
“I agree with restrictions, and they are completely necessary to guard against more unnecessary loss of life. However, we cannot comprehend the loss and lack of closure that has been felt by families across our community. They have not had the chance to attend the funerals of their loved ones, come together as families to support each other in person in those terrible times. They have not held a hand or said goodbye to loved ones. <BR /> <BR />Last night, I had the opportunity to meet those who have lost loved ones. They have come together to create the Memory Stones of Love group. The small, hand-painted tokens were placed at the heart of the steps of Stormont.”
“Thank you, Mr Speaker, for giving us the opportunity of Members' Statements. It is a great move and gives democracy a chance to be accountable. Thank you from us lowly Back-Benchers. <BR /> <BR />I will speak about a COVID-19 memorial. Some 2,548 lives have been lost to the pandemic over the past 18 months. That is 2,548 people who cannot be here, living their life, because of the pandemic. That is 2,548 stories that have been cut short before their time. That is 2,548 families who will have to go on without loved ones to share in their joys, miseries and the mysteries of what the future brings. <BR /> <BR />That number also records 2,548 families who have not been able to grieve properly due to the restrictions caused by the pandemic, and that is a double whammy.”
“I did not want to interrupt you. Yesterday, I had a little gamble or a little punt on the golf, but I can take it or leave it. There is nothing wrong with that when it is under control. I take on board what Mr McGuigan said; he is not in the Chamber now. When gambling gets out of control, I understand how difficult that can be. I have seen that at first hand. May I add that I wish your young son the best of luck as he goes across to university? He will get an education in that betting office that he will never get in a university. Good luck to him.”
“That gentleman had a hat on his head with a band around it, and he was convinced that For Auction would win the 2-mile Champion Hurdle. To cut a long story short, I did not know that he had lifted his savings and put everything on For Auction. He walked about Cheltenham with that hat on his head, and, that night, when I went to bed, I noticed that the room had filled up with smoke. As I tentatively looked over to him, I could hear him praying. I saw all the burned-down butts and the ashes, and he was praying to get out of it. He had used all his savings. That cost him his job, it cost him his marriage, and I never saw that man ever again from that day. That is the price that people pay. <BR /> <BR />We will support the Bill, but the Minister needs to scale up her ambitions and quickly.”
“My colleague from Lagan Valley has talked about the mental impact that it has. In real terms, however, as I have gone through my working life, I have seen it and the harm that it causes to families. When men — gambling was male dominated in earlier days — found themselves gambling everything and borrowing to gamble, they would do anything for that gamble. They believed wholeheartedly that the next bet would get them out of it. <BR /> <BR />I will tell one little story very quickly. We ran a trip from the bar to Cheltenham, and I ended up sharing a room with a gentleman whose name I will not mention. He always seemed to be a very lucky gambler. I did not smoke, and that year was the second year that a horse called For Auction was running.”
“<BR /> <BR />As other Members said, where is the action on fixed-odds betting terminals? Where is the commitment to care pathways for those with gambling addictions? On virtually every measure, the Bill is weak, weak and very weak. Ultimately, while any legislation is welcome and, most importantly, should move towards tackling problem gambling, more research is needed urgently in order to better understand why our levels of gambling addiction are so incredibly high. The Bill needs to focus on the economic and social factors that have led to those high levels of addiction. We need to look at what has been done in other jurisdictions in order to help those 40,000 members of our community who are living with the massive impact of gambling addiction. <BR /> <BR />I have spoken about those who find themselves addicted to gambling.”
“I have known people who gamble. I have known professional gamblers in my lifetime, some of whom are very witty and funny. One in particular was always dressed immaculately in new suits and shiny shoes. More times than enough, that man had no money, but he always was well dressed. His answer to me would have been, "It's not a sin to be skint, but it's a sin to look skint." Gambling is an addiction that can drive you to that. <BR /> <BR />I am disappointed that the ambition of the Bill falls far short of addressing the problems of gambling and of providing help to those who need it most. The Minister's party, as has been stated, has a policy document that goes far further than the Bill in front of us today. It seems that there are words, folks, but no action.”
“<BR /> <BR />I listened to an MLA from South Down, who stated that, when this Building was closed for three years — the first three years that I was elected to it — they went to the South of Ireland in order to develop a strategy; a strategy that they are not implementing in the North of Ireland, where they have the power to do it. They are calling for it in the South, but they have the power to implement that strategy here. Why is that? It is some gamble to try to pull that off and tell us what they are trying to do here, where they have the power to do it, while calling for it in the South. <BR /> <BR />Gambling addiction destroys lives and tears families apart. Folks, those who find themselves addicted to gambling will neither put in them nor on them. It is all about the bet. It is all about that big win. It is all about tomorrow.”
“Those fixed-odds betting terminals are set to pay out a percentage of the income that comes into them. For every £100 that they take in, they will pay out only £70. Some could be set lower or higher. That needs to be noted as we discuss the Bill. It needs to be set and regulated in such a way that it at least tries to be fair. <BR /> <BR />The Bill also has a number of glaring omissions. Since April 2020, there has been a ban on using credit or debit cards as a direct form of payment for gambling machines or any other form of gambling in England. Why is there no similar provision in the Bill?”
“<BR /> <BR />There is a dire need for legislation to tackle the issue. While I agree with some of the provisions in the Bill, I cannot help but find that, overwhelmingly and as a whole, it is limited. The introduction of the levy in clause 14 is positive but not mandatory, and it refers only to bookmakers, bingo clubs and amusements. That will limit its effectiveness. The offence that is proposed in clause 7 of inviting a person who is under the age of 18 to play gaming machines is to be welcomed, but its impact will be limited if we do not tackle the grey area of fixed-odds betting terminals. You like to think that you have a fair chance when you gamble. Even in one of yesterday's matches, when you might have backed the American or European team, there was always a winning bet in the middle, as it could have been a draw.”
“In 2016, an NIO officer described the prevalence of problem gambling in Northern Ireland as extraordinary. I call it completely shocking. Not only do we have the highest prevalence of problem gambling in the UK, but our rate is four times that of England. A further 4·9% of people are at moderate risk and 6·7% of people are at greater risk. <BR /> <BR />When I was thinking about the Bill earlier, I thought of myself working in the bar, and you normally find a bookmaker's office beside a public house. I want to give those who find themselves gambling a small statistic. It is not an attack on the bookies, but, when you walk into a bookmaker's shop, you will find six holes or little units for paying in but only one for paying out. As my colleague from North Antrim said, the odds are against you.”
“Fourteen years is a long time for the residents who live around that dump. Will the Assembly take the issue seriously? The mountain is absolutely stinking.”
“I will leave you with the words of another resident that sum up very well what we have all had to live with:”
“Imagine living in these conditions and tell me if you would just sit by when officials tell you that nothing can be done. One resident told me that the smell lingered through the night, from about 11.00 pm until the morning when they leave for work. It has been that way for months. The resident said:”
“I will speak about the awful odour that comes from the Mullaghglass landfill site. Last week, the Minister talked about how the site was compliant and how extra gas wells had been added, but the fact is that the odour from the site has continued to have a massive impact on residents across Lisburn and Belfast. <BR /> <BR />The problem is fully across Lisburn and Belfast; I live in north Lisburn and smell the odour in my house, up to 4 miles from the site. I have received complaints from as far away as Finaghy Road North in Belfast and Belsize Road in Lisburn. That is almost a 5-mile stretch — 5 miles where people's daily lives are impacted by the foul stench of rotten, putrid cabbage. Surely I do not need to ask whether that is acceptable. <BR /> <BR />I want Members to listen to what residents have told me about the smell.”
“An opt-out system could directly help 180 people a year and would boost our overall consent rate to achieve, hopefully, the gold-standard rate of 80%. Our rate of consent has not moved significantly in years, so we must act now, folks. <BR /> <BR />I congratulate the tireless campaigners who have worked so hard to see the Bill be introduced in the Assembly. It is now on us to knuckle down and get it passed. That is the job that we are elected to do. We are elected not to squabble over nonsense but to make decisions and pass legislation that will improve and, in this case, save people's lives. More of that, please.”
“A lot of legislation is being passed in the Chamber, and a lot of private Members' Bills are coming through before we finish the mandate. I ask those who pulled the Assembly down before or who are threatening to do so to think long and hard. It is about working together and trying to get legislation through. I am not going to give a lecture to anyone, but think long and hard before making any reckless decisions. <BR /> <BR />There are currently 115 people on the transplant waiting list. Those are 115 lives that we can directly save by passing this legislation. It is a situation that, unfortunately, happens every year. Eleven people who were on the waiting list in 2020 lost their life. We have gone through 18 months of unimaginable loss, but those 11 lives could have been saved had we brought forward the legislation.”
“The Bill is the result of a long campaign by a number of hugely dedicated individuals who have put their life and soul into bringing forward a change in law in Northern Ireland. There is widespread public support for that change. There is an increase in the number of people who choose to be on the register across the UK, with Northern Ireland being the only place without a deemed consent system. The time is now to get the legislation passed as soon as possible, and I thank the Minister for bringing it forward. <BR /> <BR />Other Members have stated how important it is that the legislation be passed. Some have called it the elephant in the room. I was elected here about four years ago, and, for three years, this place sat empty. That was not my choice. Rather, it was forced on me.”