Jim Shannon
MP for Strangford · Democratic Unionist Party · United Kingdom
“I thank the Minister for those answers. This has happened three times in three years. Normally, on the third strike, you are out. Instead, the chief executive gets an £871,000 bonus. For people in Northern Ireland, a flight to Great Britain is a basic utility. When NATS crashed, my constituents were entirely cut off.”
“When it comes to lobbying, Northern Ireland has a peculiar circumstance where one party can be involved in politics in Northern Ireland and at the same time be involved in politics in the Republic of Ireland. When it comes to the accountability that the hon.”
“Member for North East Fife referred to this—everybody knew every officer in the area where they lived. Different times mean different pressures and different needs, but I have always supported community policing in all my years as an elected representative, throughout my time on the council and in the Northern Ireland Assembly before comi…”
“I will say this to the Minister: although policing is a devolved matter for us back home, I want to make some comments, if I may, about the focus of the police, which means they sometimes do what is unnecessary. I will give an example.”
“The hon. Gentleman is a Leicester City supporter, as I am; we do not have to seek our sorrows at this moment in time, but that is by the way. More importantly, his comments underline the issues for local independent pharmacy owners. As the hon.”
“That is the reality for these people, who have consciences, feel compassion and want to care for their patients and customers. The impact is clear, because almost 90% of pharmacies in Northern Ireland were unable to pay their wholesaler bill in January. Think about what that means for a second: that is real pressure.”
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“Sometimes, people hear statistics and are sceptical. I always think about “lies, damned lies, and statistics”, but the stats are important because they set the scene. Many times when we are looking at the objectives and targets for the NHS, we need the statistics before us, because they indicate the policies that hopefully the Government will follow. Lung conditions, including COPD, are the largest cause of emergency hospital admissions, especially in winter, when respiratory admissions can increase by some 80%. These figures are worrying; we are in that season now, and we could see that figure. The rate of emergency admissions to hospital for COPD in England increased by 9% in 2024 compared with 2023; unfortunately, they are increasing consistently.”
“I want to begin with a general point on the modern service frameworks. There is much to be thankful for in what the Government are doing and we want to focus on that as well, but there are also things that we want to ask for. Although the APPG warmly welcomed the initiative of the modern service frameworks, the Minister will not be surprised that we were disappointed that respiratory health was not included in the first wave. Respiratory health is an ideal candidate, I believe, as do others inside and outside the Chamber, for the next wave. What can the Minister do to include respiratory health in the next wave of the Government’s 10-year plan for health, which we very much welcome and are encouraged by? The outcomes of COPD are widespread and have a huge impact on the NHS. I will give some statistics to show that.”
“As always, I am indebted to Sarah Sleet and her wonderful team at Asthma and Lung UK for their outstanding help and ongoing support. Without their enormous help to me and the APPG that I chair, we just could not manage as well as we do. I also want to say a special thanks to Jonathan Fuld, the national clinical director for respiratory disease, for his expert advice and counsel. I pay tribute to the ongoing work of our expert stakeholder groups, which comprise senior clinicians, industry, professional bodies and other experts. We have Zoom meetings because that is the best way for us to come together from all over the United Kingdom and it means people do not have to travel. When we have our Zoom meetings we have fantastic contributions from all over the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and sometimes further afield.”
“Last night she was not there because she is a judge on “Strictly Come Dancing”. She was there to tell the story of how she cares for and looks after her mum, who has COPD. There are two sides to the lady—the side we see on TV and the caring side. The previous debate was about unpaid carers across the United Kingdom, in all constituencies, and the work that they do. It was a pleasure to take part in that debate and to see so many there. As chair of the APPG for respiratory health, I will cover a number of issues today around COPD. I will frame my comments around the latest initiatives and also the current policy direction. Hopefully we can try to marry those two together so that we can have a focus and a target to do better. To make that happen, of course, we need Government and ministerial support.”
“Yesterday was World COPD Day, so I pay tribute to the wonderful work carried out by so many organisations and individuals to draw attention to the illness. We had an event here last night, which was well attended. The people in the Gallery are those who do the hard work for the all-party parliamentary group for respiratory health, which I chair. We had a great event last night with many excellent speakers. I want to reflect on the organisations and individuals that attended last night to draw attention to the illness. Hugh McKinney is going to look at me and say, “You mentioned that lady again”, because last night one of our special guests was Shirley Ballas of “Strictly Come Dancing”. I could not dance if my life depended on it—I have two left feet—but that lady can.”
“I beg to move, That this House has considered World COPD Day. It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Mr Efford. I thank the Backbench Business Committee for making time for this debate. I am always pleased to see the Minister in her place—she knows that—and we look forward to her answers to our requests on behalf of our constituents. I am also pleased to have other colleagues here, including the shadow Ministers for the Conservatives and for the Lib Dems, the hon. Members for Farnham and Bordon (Gregory Stafford) and for North Shropshire (Helen Morgan), and also my good friend, the hon. Member for Surrey Heath (Dr Pinkerton). I am glad to be able to raise the issue of chronic obstructive pulmonary disease.”
“I want to put on the record a big thank you to all those who participated, to Hugh, Will and the team in the Public Gallery for all that they have done, to you, Mr Efford, for your patience, and to the civil servants—they are not often thanked, but let us thank them for what they do. Question put and agreed to. Resolved, That this House has considered World COPD Day.”
“I am looking to her to see whether the Government can deliver on that. Prevention is better than cure. We must work harder to introduce a vaccination programme. The hon. Member for Blaydon and Consett referred to housing and air quality. We need a pathway to work so that those with long-term illnesses can come back to work. The Minister set out lots of positive things. She referred to deprivation, which we all know about. She spoke about spirometry care from hospital to the community, pulmonary rehabilitation, which is key to reducing COPD, and lung cancer screening—all good stuff.”
“The pressure on the NHS is enormous. He said that pulmonary rehabilitation treatment is a key way of responding, and we very much welcome that. He also referred to other COPD interventions, and said that this is a year-round emergency. I am very pleased to have the Minister here to respond to our requests. Anyone listening to her speech would recognise that she is keen, eager and energetic in giving us the answers that we are looking for. I am conscious of the look that you are giving me, Mr Efford, so I will be very quick. She said that her mother has COPD, and therefore this is a personal issue for her. She is as keen as all of us to see results. She set out the case for the prevention of COPD, and said it is the next disease to be considered in the respiratory service framework—hopefully in the next phase.”
“He also talked about access to data and to medical care for COPD. It is sometimes a postcode lottery in the United Kingdom, and that has to change. The hon. Member for North Shropshire (Helen Morgan) talked about chronic bronchitis and rehabilitation. She said that early diagnosis reduces the cost to the NHS. Shortness of breath means that there should be more checks for COPD. She said that anyone over 35 should get checked. That is very wise—we should all take note of that. She also referred to the Lib Dem ambition to recruit another 8,000 GPs, and she spoke about vaccination. The hon. Member for Farnham and Bordon (Gregory Stafford) made an excellent speech—it was a real pleasure to hear it. He referred to the inequality and deprivation across the United Kingdom, and talked about how to do spirometry tests better.”
“I thank all hon. Members for their contributions. I particularly thank the hon. Member for Blaydon and Consett (Liz Twist). She and I have been friends for ages and ages—so far back that I maybe had hair at that time. She underlined two issues: access to public transport, and how difficult it is for people to return home from hospital. She was keen to welcome the progress on the Tobacco and Vapes Bill and on access to drugs. She is no longer a Parliamentary Private Secretary, so she can now be active on the APPG—we are very much looking forward to having her energy back. The hon. Member for Surrey Heath (Dr Pinkerton) also set the scene very helpfully. COPD never goes away; it escalates, so how do we address it? He said that there were 200,000 admissions to hospital due to respiratory ill health in the last year.”
“I use the railways every Monday, Thursday and on other days in the week. The things that passengers look for, as well as those I talk to who come over here from Northern Ireland, are price, punctuality, space and comfort. Can the Minister assure us that those things are central to the Government’s obligation to the passenger? Let me add another factor. When it comes to safety, sometimes pedestrians stray on to the tracks, thereby holding up the trains. What is being done to ensure that security is taken into account?”
“I thank the Minister for his strong words and his answers, which encourage both hon. Members and those who are listening. Let us be clear and succinct: Russian ships have twice entered British sovereign waters, and to add to that aggression, they have been tracking our RAF pilots with lasers. Our enemy has breached our waters disgracefully, disregarded neutrality and shown disrespect. The facts and the evidence are there. To quote Winston Churchill, who I loved when I was a boy and who was certainly my hero: “We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be”. Will the Minister confirm that this is a form of attack, and that the might of our armed forces is poised, their equipment is trained and they are ready to go?”
“I thank the Minister for his answers and for his strong focus on the Ukrainian children. I also thank the hon. Member for Paisley and Renfrewshire South (Johanna Baxter) for all that she has done—we appreciate it. The trafficking to Russia and forced adoption of Ukrainian children is truly despicable. The re-education camps that are brainwashing children to forget—or to erase—their Ukrainian heritage are detestable, and the need for British involvement is undeniable. Will the Minister please outline what steps we will take to bring those children home to their families, instead of accepting that they are prisoners of war, which is disgusting, inhuman and contemptible?”
“In Northern Ireland, we have dealt with the spread of extreme forms of paramilitarism in our prisons, and we have learned that the influence of the most hard-line prisoners spreads easily and completely; there are those who enter prison for, perhaps, petty crime and come out the other end with hatred they never felt before. Those with extremist views should not be able to proselytise and convert people —younger inmates in particular—to extremist views. Legislative change has been mentioned. Given what we have learned in Northern Ireland would it be helpful— I always try to be helpful—for the Minister to contact the prisons Minister in the Northern Ireland Assembly to get their ideas? Perhaps we can be helpful to each other.”
“I am deeply concerned by the continuing persecution of Falun Gong practitioners in China, including some disturbing and well-documented allegations of forced organ harvesting. Will the Leader of the House urge the Foreign Secretary to outline what concrete actions the Government will take to press for an immediate end to the unethical harvesting of organs from religious minorities in China and to ensure the protection of the Falun Gong against transnational repression in the UK?”
“Will the Minister work alongside a Northern Ireland Assembly Minister, the Assembly and us to deliver for everyone?”
“On this occasion, efforts fell short in committing to the manufacturing industry in the way we wanted. I will mention Spirit AeroSystems, the plane manufacturer, and the contribution made by Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland may be a small nation, but we are mighty—a word not often used—just like small David, who took on big Goliath in the Bible and beat him. Alongside Scotland, Wales and the mainland, specialist manufacturing is crucial to economic prosperity. There must be an unwavering determination to achieve that. I ask the Minister to engage with me and my hon. Friend the Member for East Londonderry (Mr Campbell) and other Northern Ireland MPs to ensure that, when it comes to helping each other, to make this great United Kingdom of Great Britain even greater and better, we do that together. It takes that commitment.”
“The good news with Thales is that, with Government help, 200 new jobs have been created there. There are also important apprenticeship opportunities. Given my age, I have known some of the young fellows there since they were born. Aged 18, 19 or 20, they now have jobs at Thales, with fantastic opportunities, a good wage and help with their student fees. I have met unions on various occasions to hear their concerns, and have brought this issue to the Floor of the House to seek assurances. There are some things I ask of the Minister. It would not be right to take part in this debate without highlighting the risks in the manufacturing industry relating to job security. At times like these, the Government are able to step in. That is my Great British Government, and everybody’s Government, whether we voted for them or not.”
“There is a keen interest in science, technology, engineering and maths study and employment in Northern Ireland, especially from young people and from women who have leading roles in manufacture. We are doing and seeing good things happening; we see equality and opportunity. This is a good news story. Northern Ireland is home to major companies such as Thales and Bombardier. Bombardier at one stage had two major factories in Newtownards, hiring hundreds of people from the local area, showing our skill in the design and manufacture of composites and polymers. I usually visit Thales at least once a year with my right hon. Friend the Member for Belfast East (Gavin Robinson), who told me that the majority of the workforce live in my constituency of Strangford, so it is obviously to my advantage to be there.”
“Library research highlights that in 2023, Northern Ireland added £2.2 billion gross value added in manufacturing economic output. In 2024, around 900 direct jobs were supported by the defence industry. Defence plays a crucial role in Northern Ireland, but it does not get its full percentage of defence contracts. I gently put that point to the Minister to get a helpful answer. The defence sector should get more contracts, although there have been lots of commitments. With great respect, Northern Ireland people—men and women—have proven themselves as leaders in their contribution to the sector. The best is yet to come, with more young people becoming interested in all aspects of manufacturing and engineering.”
“Thank you for calling me early, Mrs Harris; you are very kind. I am sure hon. Members are wondering why. I thank the hon. Member for Calder Valley (Josh Fenton-Glynn) for securing today’s debate. In his short year and a half in the House, he has shown himself to be assiduous on behalf of his constituents. He works hard, with a key focus on the subjects he brings to the House, both in the main Chamber and here. Well done to him. Our manufacturing sector is crucial to the UK-wide economy. We must not forget the unique build-up of this country. I always say that we are better together, and there is no Scots Nats person here to tell me otherwise—not that that is a bad thing, but anyway. Whether it be Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland or England, we can do it better, with a significant contribution to the manufacturing industry.”
“I hope the Minister will forgive me if he is going to address my earlier request, which related to the Northern Ireland Assembly Minister back home. I know that he travels to Northern Ireland and has an interest in Northern Ireland, and it is important that we work together. Will he give the commitment I mentioned?”
“I wish to be helpful, as I always try to be. I have spoken to the hon. Gentleman and I congratulate him on the debate. We had a local government reorganisation in Northern Ireland, reducing councils from 26 to 11. The idea was to save money and make the system more accountable. It did not save any money and became more bureaucratic, and the people were the ultimate sufferers. If reorganisation is not done right at this stage, problems will occur down the line later.”
“If we look at the cultural climate across most western countries, attitudes were shaped by fear, silence and, in some cases, religious views. This was not spoken about.”
“She was the prime mover: she created a hub in the area, which was a brand-new idea that gave young people and others a place to come together, talk about things, relate, socialise and have a chance. Alongside other things that were happening, the hub helped to reduce the suicides in that town, so I have never forgotten Rev. Mairisine. Indeed, I met her last Friday night at the mayor’s do over in Bangor. There she was, as bright as ever and with that wonderful smile. That lady motivated the people of the area, the community groups and others to come together and try to help, so I am always deeply indebted to her. I remember that when I was younger—this goes back to the title of the debate—a stiff upper lip was expected. That was the demand of the day, but that approach is not helpful attitude to take to mental health.”
“He took us through his experience: he did us proud and did his family proud in how he dealt with the things he faced up to. When I was first elected to this House back in 2010, the constituency of Strangford took in a new part, Ballynahinch. Around that time—in 2010, 2011 and certainly in 2012—there was a spate of suicides of young men in the area. It was horrendous. It was almost impossible to comprehend what was happening. However, a local Presbyterian minister, Rev. Mairisine Stanfield, galvanised the community in Ballynahinch to come together. What a lady she is! She organised all the churches and the individuals, who were all hurting and all wanted to know what to do.”
“When I thought about this issue, and I have given it a lot of thought because it is so real to all of us, I went back and forth in my mind about the title of this debate. The motion refers to “reducing the stigma associated with suicide”. I believe that we need to normalise talking about how we feel. I say that as a man, because men—myself included—seem to have some difficulty in understanding the issues that we face, especially the difficult aspects, relating them to others and acknowledging that we are not alone in having these thoughts. It is important that we recognise that, and that there is help for so many. The hon. Member for York Outer (Mr Charters) is not here, but anyone who heard his Prime Minister’s question today will know that he lived the story that he told. We need to recognise what suicide truly is.”
“It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Mr Mundell. I thank the hon. Member for Richmond Park (Sarah Olney) for setting the scene, as she so often does. I know that this issue is very close to her heart; indeed, it is very close to all of us. I will give a couple of examples from Northern Ireland. They are never easy stories to tell, but both of them are solution-based. I will tell them without mentioning any names or specific details, so we can consider what steps we are taking to address the issue. It is a real pleasure to see the Minister in his place—I wish him well in his role—and, as always, to see the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Hinckley and Bosworth (Dr Evans). He and I seem to be tag-teaming all the time on health issues in Westminster Hall and the main Chamber.”
“With great respect, they are not always the answer. I urge the Minister to tell us how the Government will do more to ensure that those services are properly funded so that we can help more people stop making that final decision, which some feel is the only way forward.”
“To give a Northern Ireland perspective, our dads and grandads who suffered during the troubles were told to be silent at that time and swallow their feelings. Some of them had PTSD—we never knew what that was until the last few years, by the way. That has had a knock-on effect on how we deal with issues now. We must do more to ensure that talking about mental health is as normal as talking about the weather or the news. That is how we will reduce the stigma. Transparency and openness is the way forward. First and foremost, we must ensure that help is accessible and available in this country. That is our responsibility. Our mental health services are not where they need to be. More should be done to provide counselling services, as opposed to going to the GP and walking out with a prescription for anti-depressants.”
“Males in Northern Ireland are consistently three to four times more likely to die by suicide. It also noted that for males aged 15 to 49, such as those I referred to in Ballynahinch and Newtownards, suicide was the leading cause of death in 2023, followed by drug-related deaths. Male suicide in Northern Ireland has been a painful and persistent issue for years, and the stigma around it can make things even harder for those who are struggling. The harsh reality is that men do not talk. We tend to be private about our health issues. There is a very strong cultural script back home that we just get on with it; we do not want to come across as weak or unable to cope, which is how we fear it would be perceived. Furthermore, for many men and their families, the pattern is passed down from our parents.”
“It is really difficult, sometimes, to deal with things. The hon. Member for Ashford (Sojan Joseph) spoke about the suicide rate among farmers. This is not about pointing fingers—I do not want to do that—but I can say from the family farms that I know in Northern Ireland that the pressure on farmers today due to the family inheritance tax is incredibly worrying. I will leave it at that. While any suicide is devastating, I would like to focus on the stats surrounding male mental health and suicide in Northern Ireland. The Northern Ireland Statistics and Research Agency revealed that there were 171 male suicides registered in Northern Ireland in 2023, which accounted for some 77.4% of all suicides. My goodness me! We men—that includes me and every one of us—need to have a look at how we deal with these things.”
“I thank my hon. Friend for her words of wisdom. I know that she has tried, before and during her time in this place, to address the issue of online access to information about how to commit suicide. I cannot conceive how that can be available; maybe I am from a different generation, but the availability today is scary. It is not the Minister’s responsibility, but I know that he will give us some ideas on how to tackle that. People did not talk about mental health in the past. There was no awareness, and psychological conversations were not had day by day in the way they are today. We had a spate of suicides of young men in Newtownards a few years ago, and it was so tragic. There was a wee group of young boys who ran about together. One committed suicide, and unfortunately the other four or five all did the same.”
“I commend the hon. Gentleman for securing this debate. He is right to underline the issue of GPs. Does he agree that access to healthcare must begin with access to the local GP surgery, and that the Government must prioritise training and retraining GPs to ensure that people can access their GP and do not head straight to emergency care at the local hospital when it is not necessary? GPs first—then, everybody else can do better.”
“I thank the Minister for that answer. I also thank him for his energy and interest in Northern Ireland. We hope to have him in Strangford shortly for a visit. Between 2019 and 2022, there was an increase in economic value of 19% in the Northern Ireland film sector, and there is the potential for much more. I live on the beautiful Ards peninsula—it is not beautiful because I live there; it was beautiful before I ever lived there—and in my constituency of Strangford there is the potential for much more. How do the Northern Ireland Office and the Minister intend to work further with Northern Ireland Screen to promote the high quality and the lower costs in Northern Ireland? We have lots to offer—let’s take advantage of it.”
“I commend the hon. Lady on bringing this debate forward. In Northern Ireland, the figures for ME have unfortunately risen from 7,500 to 12,500 in the past few years. We have no clinical lead, no specialist services and no commission care pathways. We need research. Queen’s University Belfast is really good with research partnerships. Does the hon. Lady agree we should spend the money on research and find the cure? It has been said that the cure for cancer will come in 10 years’ time. The cure for ME could come too if research money were put into it.”
“Does he agree that those who flee persecution must be protected in the legislation?”
“I welcome what the Government are trying to do, and the thrust of what the Minister is saying, but I think that the Minister and the hon. Gentleman are referring to the fact that we have to ensure that there is a bit of muscle behind the legislation. My colleague Lord Weir was very clear in the other place about our party’s point of view on the legislation. There are people from across the world who flee their home because of persecution or human rights abuses, and who have nowhere to go. Does the hon. Gentleman share my concern about those who can never go back to their country again? I know people who came to Newtownards in my constituency six or eight years ago, and there are six Syrian families who are still there. They are established in the community.”
“When the Vikings came to Strangford, it was called the strong fjord. That is where the name Strangford came from. We have a history that I believe someday we may even realise to our advantage. Those things all matter and it is crucial that we look to the future, and at how our current actions are impacting the future of our globe and our listed properties. As we celebrate the 80th anniversary of UNESCO, we are reminded of the power of education, science, culture and communication, and that much more must be done to preserve it.”
“UNESCO has revealed that climate change is one of the biggest threats to world heritage properties. The issues range from coral bleaching to severe forest fires and droughts. We are increasingly seeing the devastating impacts that climate change has on all aspects of our world and especially on world heritage sites, which we must endeavour to protect. The UK National Commission for UNESCO launched a report to coincide with the opening of COP30 in Brazil, alongside 2025 being the International Year of Glaciers’ Preservation. The findings were shocking, to say the least. Since 2000, glaciers have lost some 6,500 billion tonnes of ice, which threatens the water supply of more than 1 billion people. I hope that someday, perhaps, my constituency of Strangford will become a UNESCO site, because it goes back to when time began.”
“It is one of Northern Ireland’s UNESCO heritage sites and was designated as such in 1986, meaning that its 40th anniversary will be celebrated next year. Hundreds of thousands of people visit each year; it is a much-loved attraction. In July 2024, only very recently, Gracehill in County Antrim was added to the UNESCO world heritage list as part of the Moravian Church Settlements. Northern Ireland is famed for its religious settlements—for its religious beliefs—and it is only right that we should have something like that. If we look abroad through UNESCO’s website, there are 1,248 properties on the world heritage list, so that gives people an idea; it is quite selective. They are properties that the world heritage list considers as having outstanding universal value.”
“I also love the idea of UNESCO’s 80th anniversary, and—without being morbid—I love going round graveyards, looking at the old headstones and getting a bit of the history of the area. I love going round churches as well, where we have the same experience, and going round UNESCO sites. Their designation can go back 80 years, but churches may go back 300 years or more, and graveyards go back to whenever people were first buried, which is the beginning of time. For Northern Ireland, there are a few important UNESCO-related milestones to note, so I am pleased to be here to give the local perspective. The first relates to the Giant’s Causeway. It is said that that is where the giants walked and lived—I am sure it is quite true.”
“It is a real pleasure to serve under your chairship, Mr Dowd. I want to say a big thank you to the hon. Member for Mid Derbyshire (Jonathan Davies) for setting the scene incredibly well on a subject in which we should all be interested. It is wonderful to be here to celebrate UNESCO’s 80th anniversary—I am just 10 years behind it. It is the specialised agency dedicated to strengthening our shared humanity through the promotion of education, science, culture and communication. I and others believe that we must continue to protect UNESCO and advance education, so it is great to be here for that purpose. I love history; indeed, it is probably the only subject I excelled at in school, or did well at in school—that may be a better way of putting it.”
“On a point of order, Mr Dowd. I am probably not the only Member who has noticed that this Chamber seems as cold as a butcher’s fridge. It was the same yesterday. Have you had any indication when the heating might be turned on?”
“I commend the hon. Lady and understand exactly her frustration in relation to having infrastructure in place. In my constituency we have been pursuing the Ballynahinch bypass for over 35 years—15 of which I have been pursuing it as an MP. We now finally have a date, but such situations hold back development and housing potential, and affect businesses in the short term. Does the hon. Lady agree that such things need to move much more quickly, otherwise they will be the death knell for the towns that we all represent?”
“Here is a pithy question, which I hope will be important for us in Northern Ireland. Will Northern Ireland receive a dedicated share of UK-wide peatland funding schemes such as those covered by the Nature for Climate Fund?”
“I thank the Minister for his statement; we are greatly encouraged by the steps the Government are taking. I chair an all-party parliamentary group—some Members here are members of it—and we had our website hacked and stories replaced. I have also had conversations that were under surveillance by the Chinese Government while in Northern Ireland, so I am glad the Minister has acknowledged this wide-scale threat. While pouring moneys into security is good, there must be a ramification for trade outcomes where Chinese agents are involved in espionage. The mishandling of the recent court case can never be repeated, and the Government must send the message that our language is set, our defences are raised, and we are not to be trifled with by any foreign powers, certainly not by the Chinese Government.”
“Further to the point made by my right hon. Friend the Member for Belfast East (Gavin Robinson), the Republic of Ireland Government and the Garda Síochána have to respond on the things on which they fell short. For instance, when my cousin was killed and others were killed, the killers crossed the border to sanctuary and safety. There was collusion between the Garda Síochána and the people responsible for those murders. Those are some of the things we need within this process. Can the Secretary of State assure all of us, on behalf of our constituents, that the justice we all seek will happen through this Bill, because I am not quite sure of that at the moment?”
“On accountability, I think we all want justice for those victims who have never had justice. I think of the four Ulster Defence Regiment men of Ballydugan, for instance: there was no justice for them and nobody was ever made accountable. My cousin Kenneth Smyth was murdered by the IRA and they fled across the border. No one was ever made accountable. Does the hon. Member feel that the justice that my family and all the other families want cannot be delivered through the Bill?”