Jim Shannon
MP for Strangford · Democratic Unionist Party · United Kingdom
“I thank the Minister for those answers. This has happened three times in three years. Normally, on the third strike, you are out. Instead, the chief executive gets an £871,000 bonus. For people in Northern Ireland, a flight to Great Britain is a basic utility. When NATS crashed, my constituents were entirely cut off.”
“When it comes to lobbying, Northern Ireland has a peculiar circumstance where one party can be involved in politics in Northern Ireland and at the same time be involved in politics in the Republic of Ireland. When it comes to the accountability that the hon.”
“Member for North East Fife referred to this—everybody knew every officer in the area where they lived. Different times mean different pressures and different needs, but I have always supported community policing in all my years as an elected representative, throughout my time on the council and in the Northern Ireland Assembly before comi…”
“I will say this to the Minister: although policing is a devolved matter for us back home, I want to make some comments, if I may, about the focus of the police, which means they sometimes do what is unnecessary. I will give an example.”
“The hon. Gentleman is a Leicester City supporter, as I am; we do not have to seek our sorrows at this moment in time, but that is by the way. More importantly, his comments underline the issues for local independent pharmacy owners. As the hon.”
“That is the reality for these people, who have consciences, feel compassion and want to care for their patients and customers. The impact is clear, because almost 90% of pharmacies in Northern Ireland were unable to pay their wholesaler bill in January. Think about what that means for a second: that is real pressure.”
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“Those who are proven to have committed sexual offences should not find shelter under an NDA. We must revise the legislation accordingly, and I hope the Minister will give us that reassurance. The victim has a right to be heard; we can and must make that easier, in a way that ensures they feel confident and reassured that their concerns and complaints are taken on board.”
“Commercial confidentiality is one thing and should be protected, but when it becomes something else—protecting wrongdoing in the business—that has to be taken on. For many victims, the trauma of the reporting process is too much. When they do go through it, the appearance of an NDA they signed, believing it referred to keeping silent about business practices, now means they cannot speak about their abuse. This is simply not right. The right hon. Member for Sheffield Heeley referred to victims; some of those who have spoken to me say they never knew what an NDA meant, and they are petrified by the legal complications and implications. I support the right hon. Lady in her efforts and hope she is successful. We are all here to support her in the goals she seeks to achieve on behalf of all our constituents.”
“We must change the legislation and offer the protection for victims that is so needed. There are loopholes for legal professionals to use. I have no issue with legal professionals doing the job they are paid to do. The hon. Member for Congleton is honourable in every sense of the word, and used her position well to help others. However, we know that loopholes are there and must be closed, to protect not the people who are seeking to sell a story to a tabloid but those who have been abused and cannot speak or warn others. They are petrified of the system and the legal complications that surround them. That is not the purpose behind an NDA and the Government must clarify that in legislation. I ask the Minister to ensure protection for those who have signed NDAs without realising that they went beyond what they thought.”
“What has not been right for some time is that staff are pressured into agreeing to blanket NDAs, which are then abused by those in power to cover over bad behaviour or, even worse, wrongdoing and criminality, with the rights of victims taken away. We have seen very public cases of how NDAs covered up the most vile and disgusting acts for decades, and the time has come to put that right. I very much look forward to the Minister’s contribution. He is an honourable person who takes on board our issues and questions, and hopefully comes back with answers. I believe in the principle of clean hands. A person deserves protection if they have done nothing wrong. When someone with access to a good lawyer can tie a victim in knots, we know there is something wrong with the system.”
“Even though we did not have many examples of it, we still need to have the same law in Northern Ireland as here, with the same protection for people. Gordon Lyons’ actions are to be congratulated: they were the first of a number of steps taken in Northern Ireland to send a message that people could no longer hide behind NDAs to protect themselves when they had clearly done wrong. Initially, NDAs were created with a view to commercial sensitivity, and the reasons behind that could be understood, but they are not used for that any more. They are used for other reasons, which is where the problems are.”
“Non-Disclosure Agreements make it harder for other victims to come forward and help hide perpetrators behind a cloak of anonymity…While there is little evidence of NDAs being used in Northern Ireland higher education settings, I still fully support the Can’t Buy My Silence campaign’s aim of bringing an end to this practice which is why I wrote to the local higher education institutions asking them to sign the pledge…I welcome the collective leadership shown by Northern Ireland’s higher education sector in signing a pledge which demonstrates their clear opposition to the buying of victims’ silence.” That was in 2022, but how wise those words are today, as was the leadership that Minister Lyons gave at that time in Northern Ireland.”
“In 2022, in his then role as Economy Minister, my colleague at the Northern Ireland Assembly, Gordon Lyons, was one of the first to come out in support of the publicly funded universities that were speaking out against the use of NDAs to silence victims of abuse. Others have outlined how NDAs can be abused, which is the point I wish to focus on. Gordon Lyons issued a statement at the time, which said that “sexual harassment and bullying is completely unacceptable and complainants should never be bought or bullied into silence simply to protect the reputation of the institution they study or work at.”
“It is a pleasure to speak in this debate. Mr Betts. I congratulate the right hon. Member for Sheffield Heeley (Louise Haigh) on setting the scene, and I commend the hon. Member for Congleton (Mrs Russell), who has brought a vast amount of knowledge to the debate. She is not a practising solicitor any more, but all the knowledge she has learned has contributed greatly to the debate, so I thank her for that. That does not take away from anybody else, by the way—I appreciate that others will contribute their expertise. This is an issue in every avenue of life, from public to private life.”
“The right hon. Member is right to highlight the issue. Although the technology is moving, for those of us in coastal and rural areas, the new digitalisation will cause problems where there is a dependence on landlines. If we have electricity cut-outs and storms, which we have had this last year, the system will not work. For those in rural and coastal areas, such as the right hon. Gentleman, myself and many others here, the problem is that it just does not work.”
“In future, will the Minister ensure that we engage collectively as a nation, despite our having different guidelines, so that universities and jobs are protected and all our students are supported?”
“There is always a balance to be found, and we need to get that right. Universities can use partnerships with businesses to try to find cures to the world’s diseases, which Queen’s University and Ulster University both do, along with others across this great United Kingdom. If we allow our universities to suffer financially, they will face challenges such as reduced funding for academic programmes, limited grants and diminished support. Although we must encourage students to attend universities and pursue their dreams, the facilities must be financially supported to allow that to happen. I look forward to hearing from the Minister, and I have a request. There will never be a debate when I do not ask for something, but I ask in a respectful way.”
“Yes, universities rely on fees to deliver fantastic programmes across the board for lots of people, and they train our young ones for the future to get them the jobs that will help the economy to grow, but it is no secret that the levels of tuition fees are extortionate, and they will have to be paid back. In addition, it is worrying that one in five graduates, or around 70,000 students a year, would have been financially better off if they had not gone to university. That tells me that many students will ask whether they should go to university or get a job and not have a debt to pay back in the future. That is a worrying statistic that we cannot ignore. I seek the Minister’s thoughts on how that can be addressed. There is a parallel between supporting students and supporting our wonderful universities.”
“The House of Commons Public Accounts Committee has warned that higher education providers are potentially exposing themselves to significant financial risks if future growth in international student numbers is not high as they expect or had hoped. For example, Ulster University back home in Northern Ireland did experience increases in income, with tuition fees from international students rising by more than 50% in the 2021-22 financial year, reaching some £12 million. Although it is understood that we cater for and are generous in welcoming international students, as we should be, when I spoke to students in my constituency it became clear that many are put off going to England, Scotland and even Northern Ireland for university placements because of the intense tuition costs.”
“In the 2012-13 financial year, the combined income of higher education institutions in Northern Ireland was approximately £502.9 million. Fast forward to 2023, and Queen’s University—Northern Ireland’s primary education facility—reported a total income of £474.2 million. I thank Queen’s University and Ulster University for the partnerships they have and for trying to find cures for some of the great diseases and problems, including heart disease, diabetes, cancer, cardiac arrest and eyesight issues. Furthermore, there are growing concerns about the higher education sector’s reliance on international tuition fees.”
“Mr Vickers, you are very kind to give me the challenge of four minutes; it will probably be an eight-minute speech in four minutes. I thank the hon. Member for Bedford (Mohammad Yasin) for setting the scene so very well and for providing lots of detail and information. I wish to give a Northern Ireland perspective. We witness hundreds of students going to different areas in the UK to study. There is no doubt that the financial stability of our higher education facilities is important, so it is vital that we are here to discuss it. As in many other areas, Northern Ireland has a different set of guidelines when it comes to higher education. Our approach is distinctive, because we have oversight from a Government Department: the Department for the Economy.”
“Can the Secretary of State further outline what representations he has made to Cabinet colleagues to ensure that the UK industrial strategy pays more than lip service to the position of Northern Ireland’s manufacturing industry, as seen in aerospace, shipbuilding and defence, which has a global reputation for being top-class? How will he advocate for our own Government to invest in those sectors even further and even better?”
“I commend my right hon. Friend for bringing this debate forward. He is immensely proud of the Irish Guards, as am I. In Newtownards, we have the second largest Irish Guards Association—after Liverpool. The reputation of the Guards from the Ards, as they are well known, is secure, with Ards and North Down borough council granting the freedom of the borough to the Irish Guards in 2022. Does he agree that we can all be proud of the reputation, service and legacy of the Irish Guards, wherever we live in this great United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland—and those in the Republic of Ireland who served in the regiment as well?”
“I am not sure whether it is the same person, but Simon Nichols, a colour sergeant from Newtownards and one of the Guards from the Ards, trained personnel at Sandhurst—he actually trained Prince William and Prince Harry; one of them turned out well, while the other one I am not so sure about—and was instrumental in looking after the soldiers, male and female, who went through there.”
“The hon. Lady led the charge in the 9.30 am debate, and she is doing the same at 4.30 pm—well done for both. I just want to back her up. Does she agree that the Green Book review has to have a view to each area of the United Kingdom, and must not simply point all roads to London and the south-east? We are all aware that, in other areas, UK policies and procedures that work well in London do not translate to rural local authorities, so we need a review of that. Is the hon. Lady saying exactly that?”
“The Minister is an incredibly honourable man, and he is much liked in this House, so I say this with all gentleness. My constituents are telling me that the deal with the Indian ocean territory is overwhelming and that the cost factor is something that they cannot quite understand—and neither can I. Does the Minister understand why pensioners in my constituency and across this great United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland are wondering why, at a time of reduced help and aid, the Government are handing over sovereignty of land and then renting it back at a cost to the public purse? Will the Minister outline where the money will come from, when it has been decided that pensioners and ill people on personal independence payments cannot have the support they deserve due to the lack of money within Government?”
“I thank the Minister very much for his answers, and for his understanding and honesty. Hamas are terrorists, murderers, rapists, and child killers. They hide their AK47s and their weaponry in children’s beds. They hide their missiles in their schools, hospitals and houses. What steps have the Minister and the Government taken with the UN to bring all the kidnapped hostages home alive, rather than in the coffins that were paraded around by Hamas terrorists—murderers—at the last hostage handover? What steps are they taking to underline the point that the Israelis would not be intensifying their plans to strike were the murderous Hamas not content to hold hostages and fire rockets into Israel daily?”
“It will have security implications for every branch of policing and the armed forces in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and it must be struck down as not only ultra vires but factually incorrect. Those who carried out the attack on the Royal Ulster Constabulary station did so with the intent to take life, and they were rightly assessed as doing that and dealt with in an appropriate manner. This republican rewriting of the truth must end now in this Chamber.”
“First, I commend the right hon. Gentleman on securing this debate. He has been a stalwart supporter of the armed forces on every occasion in the time that I have been in this House. He has been a supporter of what is right and of justice, and he sets a standard for us all to follow. I commend him for that, and I thank him. I also thank him for working alongside my party leader, my right hon. Friend the Member for Belfast East (Gavin Robinson), and the shadow Secretary of State, the hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Alex Burghart) on these issues and for moving things forward with this Adjournment debate. Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that the message sent through this coroner’s report is a massive overstepping of power?”
“I know that the Minister does not have responsibility for Northern Ireland, but I add that information because it shows how things are back home. I will give an example of how we have managed to overcome the problem. There are many risk factors for eating disorders, including genetics, psychology, trauma, abuse and—a large one for young people today—social media, to which the hon. Member for Bath referred. It is important to remember that eating disorders can affect anyone, not just young people and not just women. It has been said that early intervention is essential for improving outcomes and for reducing the duration of the disorder. There is commonly a stigma around eating disorders; more often than not, people suffering with an eating disorder feel extreme shame.”
“Eating disorders present a significant health concern that affects all age groups back home. A study has found that some 16.2% of 11 to 19-year-olds in Northern Ireland met the criteria for a probable eating disorder. We are quite worried about that in Northern Ireland; I certainly am in Strangford, because it is absolutely shocking. Between April 2022 and March 2023, the charity Beat delivered 603 helpline sessions to individuals aged 18 to 22 in Northern Ireland—a massive 225% increase, which is very worrying. Action Mental Health has revealed that between 50 and 120 people in Northern Ireland develop anorexia every year, and around 107 develop bulimia, which are worrying figures. There are approximately 100 admissions to hospital for eating disorders every year.”
“May I wish you well in your first debate in your new role as Chair, Mr Stuart? It is your first debate, and I am sure you will keep us all in order. You are always in order in the Chamber, so that sets an example. I jest, of course. I commend the hon. Member for Bath (Wera Hobhouse) for leading today’s debate. She is greatly to be commended for having spoken about the issue in Westminster Hall and the main Chamber for so many years. I am grateful to be able to contribute to the debate; as the DUP health spokesperson, I have dealt with many issues on which people who have been suffering with eating disorders have sought help and support that will benefit them in the long term. As I always do in these debates, I will give some background on the situation in Northern Ireland, which replicates what other Members have said and will say.”
“The funding for mental health and for the services that deal directly with eating disorders must be improved to ensure that people who need it have access to behavioural therapy, nutrition education, monitoring and, in some cases, in-patient care and hospitalisation. I look to the Minister for his commitment to ensuring that those are a priority and that he will engage further with the Education Minister and the devolved nations to ensure that schools are equipped to protect young people and have the knowledge of the early signs that they may require help.”
“I know the mum and dad very well; they both served in the Police Service of Northern Ireland. They were extremely worried about their daughter. It would be no exaggeration to say that she was probably on the point of death. The mother went to the then Health Minister in Northern Ireland, Edwin Poots; they approached me and I spoke to the Minister over here. We were able to get her transferred from Northern Ireland to St Thomas’ hospital, just across Westminster bridge. Today, that young lady has been cured; she is a mother to two children; she has a business. All those things happened because of the co-ordination between Northern Ireland and the Health Minister here, so there was good news at the end.”
“I thank my hon. Friend for his wise words, as always. He reminds us of the pressure that is on everyone. It is important that our schools have the tools. They need to support young people who may be suffering or on the verge of suffering with a serious eating disorder. Beat’s SPOT—school professionals online training—was introduced to enhance teachers’ ability to identify and respond to potential signs. There is potential for further teaching within our local schools to promote awareness of the dangers of social media and of how it is often not a positive reflection of reality. Young people do not have to look a certain way and are often unaware of the health dangers of eating disorders, which are completely distorted by social media and the internet. Back in 2012, a constituent came to see me.”
“I commend the hon. Lady for securing the debate, and she is right to highlight the issue affecting children but also adults. Does she agree that the news that some pensioners are carrying out their own barbaric dentistry should send shockwaves about the affordability and accessibility of NHS dentistry? Does she also agree that there is a need for immediate intervention in each trust area, whether in Somerset, Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland?”
“Although we have few world war veterans—in the Greyabbey branch that I was in, they are all away now; there was only me left, and I have transferred to the Millisle branch—we have veterans from the Falklands, the Balkans, Afghanistan, Iraq and Northern Ireland, after a 30-year terrorist campaign. They all deserve our thanks and our respect. More importantly, all are deserving of our support, which must begin with an enhancement of help from the Government, as we acknowledge the proven toll of service on mental health. It is no longer a taboo subject, and if we are happy to talk about it, it follows that we are happy to act on it. I know that when the Minister responds, none of us here will be found wanting. I congratulate him.”
“The legion is a place of solace and of understanding, and a place where people can be signposted to help and support. It is essential that the Royal British Legion continues to operate in communities throughout this United Kingdom, and to do so it needs more than Government thanks: it needs support. The Royal British Legion issued in a statement in Belfast saying that it is under immense pressure to help veterans with their mental health. It cited the statistic that over the past three years the legion has seen a 44% increase in veterans presenting with complex and mental health needs. I know for a fact that that is a real and valid concern.”
“The Royal British Legion describes itself as being “at the heart of a national network looking after our Armed Forces community.” It provides recovery and rehabilitation services, and expert advice and guidance, to service personnel and their families, as well as campaigning “to improve the lives of everyone in the Armed Forces community and make sure their voice is heard.” I should have declared an interest: I am a member of the Royal British Legion Millisle branch, and I served in the Ulster Defence Regiment and the Royal Artillery for some 14.5 years as a part-time member. The Royal British Legion clubs in Comber, Newtownards, Ballywalter and Millisle are greatly used by society and community groups and residents associations to carry out training and host events.”
“Some £40 million was raised and Northern Ireland raised £1.3 million, so in proportion to our size we give, by a large percentage, more to the British Army, the Navy and the Royal Air Force through the British Legion and through the poppy appeal than most other areas of the United Kingdom.”
“I commend the hon. Member for Hinckley and Bosworth (Dr Evans) for his commitment to our veterans and the armed forces. It is a real pleasure to see the Minister in his place: the hon. and gallant Member is well known for his service in uniform, but also for his commitment to veterans. We thank him for that and look forward to hearing his contribution later. The Royal British Legion in Northern Ireland may be small, given its population of 1.9 million, but the heart of the veterans and the fundraisers is massive. That is why the small membership in Northern Ireland raises more than its share of the funds raised in the United Kingdom by the British Legion.”
“I commend the hon. Gentleman for raising the issue. As well as affecting people’s jobs and their ability to get to work, it has an impact on those in the countryside who need transport to get wherever they are going, whether that is for a doctor’s appointment, for work or for a visit to relatives. The impact is compounded for those who live in rural isolation. Given what the hon. Gentleman is outlining, does he feel that a commitment from the Government is needed to sort out the shortcomings of the rail line?”
“There is a blurry line between relationships education and sex education but I will always be a voice for parents, and for them to deem what is appropriate for their child to be taught in school. There must be regulation to ensure that, should a school decide to implement changes to RSE, a parent has a right to withdraw their child, if it is going the wrong way and the parents do not like it. I put that marker down as well. I urge the Government not to push forward any changes that would diminish parental authority and control. I ask the Minister to continue to speak with her counterparts in the devolved nations to ensure that parents who are genuinely seeking to safeguard their children are afforded respect, in terms of the classroom syllabus, and have their rights to reasonably held views protected. Parental rights, first and foremost.”
“I am putting the marker down clearly for parents, on behalf of their children. There are issues of a personal nature and matters of morality, and it is best left to parents to decide how to raise their children. Their input into this process must be critical. It is not for the state to decide the morality and standards of each family in the United Kingdom. I say that with respect to people. I want to be quite clear: we understand that parents raise children differently. I may disagree with others about what they choose to teach their children, but this is a democratic society, where all values must be respected, no matter how much we disagree with them, in order to uphold freedom of conscience and religion.”
“I am pleased to see the Minister in her place. She always tries to reassure us, and I seek such reassurance in her response. The sensitive approach that I described was welcomed by parents, and speaks well of a school that looks at education holistically, including home life, which is part of who we are. There is no doubt that teachers play a central role in helping children to grow into successful adults who are equipped with the skills that they need to be safe in a fast-moving world. It is a much faster world than the one in which I was brought up, but I am of a certain age, so people will probably understand that. Some of the most contentious issues will be taught in RSE. I believe that parents have every right to exercise their authority over what they deem safe and appropriate for their children to be taught.”
“Many Members will be aware that there has been a shift in the content that schools teach and that is approved by boards of governors, who should be allowed to ensure that RSE in taught in line with community values. There should be a commitment to best practice and good relations between parents and teachers. That always has to be there, and is a key issue in schools. Such commitment is found at Victoria primary school in Newtownards, in my constituency of Strangford, where parents were brought to an open night, the evening before teaching was to take place with the children, to allow interested parents to know the way in which sensitive topics would be taught, and give them tools that could help them to follow up with their child afterwards. I felt that was a constructive and positive way forward.”
“It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Sir Jeremy, for the third time this afternoon—we are on a roll here. I commend the hon. Member for Epsom and Ewell (Helen Maguire) for securing this debate, on a subject that can be quite difficult—I think that is a fair way of putting it. I will give a parental perspective. The hon. Member and I are not in opposition to each other, but I want to put my view on record. I am pleased to represent the case for Northern Ireland—I understand that my hon. Friend the Member for Upper Bann (Carla Lockhart) will do something similar—and parents who want to have a say on what their children are taught in school. My contribution will be about the importance of parental rights.”
“I thank the Minister for her answers to the questions. Waiting lists are clearly beyond the pale. If the Government were able to address the remedial pension savings statement, we might be in better position to entice our doctors to take on additional hours. Will the Minister confirm that this is a Government priority, and that there is an understanding that a functioning NHS requires straightforward paths to working overtime, and payment at every level?”
“I thank the Minister for her answers to the urgent question—no one can doubt her compassion or understanding, given the way she has answered. I am mindful of the fact that children are our future—as a grandfather of six, I understand only too well what it means to have them there—but 18,000 children are left in limbo throughout every region of the United Kingdom, and to get to the point where there is no confirmation of whether essential therapy can continue is terribly disheartening, to say the least. These children feel abandoned. How will the Minister ensure that the lack of a decision, and the hesitation, will not add to their sense of abandonment?”
“Before we go any further, let’s get the other point of view.”
“First, I commend the hon. Gentleman. I spoke to him before the debate, so he knows where I am coming from. I have a very different opinion, and the hon. Gentleman knows that; he respects that, and I respect him. I just wanted to put that on the record. This is clearly a devolved matter, so England, Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales will make their own decisions separately. The hon. Gentleman has outlined his point of view, but does he agree that the hunting community deserve to have their voices heard and considered in that legislative process? The hunting community would dispute some of what has been said tonight. Just for the record, as a hunting man—one who has never hunted with horses or hounds—I think the hunting community should have the right to pursue it. What does the hon. Gentleman think?”
“The hon. Member may not be aware that nearly $20,000 was donated from the United States to Sinn Féin’s 2017 Assembly election campaign—representing nearly one third of Sinn Féin’s spending in that election. Those who have been so exercised by political donations here have often done nothing to close the loophole that allows huge amounts of foreign money to influence politics in Northern Ireland. Nowhere else in the world would it happen that someone would be paying the bills of a foreign political party, yet that is what seems to happen with Sinn Féin. Does he agree that this loophole must be closed very quickly?”
“Continuing that line of thought, Northern Ireland will need to be part of such a new legislative ruling. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that we must all be subject to the same rules in this great United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland?”
“The rising number of mobile phone thefts has caused great concern among many of my constituents. By the way, I am not technically minded—I know very little about how my mobile phone works—but many people have everything on their phones: their bank details are on that phone; their life is on that phone. If their phone is stolen, they are in big trouble. How will we restore confidence in the general public on mobile phones and having all our details on them?”
“I thank the Minister very much for his answers; he understands the issue incredibly well. He will be aware of the recent judgments made in respect of human rights, in particular those involving discrimination against the Jewish community. Will he outline whether the deputations included discussions of faith and freedom and people’s ability to practise their faith, and what the outcomes are envisaged to be to secure the right for people to hold and live their faith, no matter what that faith is, in Bosnia and Herzegovina?”
“I thank the Minister for her statement and for her compassionate words, which encapsulate, I believe, the opinion of all of us in this Chamber. The major earthquake in Myanmar has caused over 2,000 deaths and the collapse of numerous high-rise buildings, temples and houses, destroying families and livelihoods and dispersing families in all directions. What discussions has the Minister had with counterparts or officials about ensuring that everything is done to get children to a place of safety with the necessary aid, and that efforts will be made to reunite any displaced children with their families as soon as is humanly possible and with all urgency?”