Rachel Woods
North Down · Green Party · Northern Ireland
“We have to get it right, but we are not starting from scratch. We only have to look across the water or down the road to the public and private sectors that already offer that type of leave. <BR /> <BR />I now turn to the comments of other Members.”
“<BR /> <BR />It is time to end the coercive control that criminal gangs have over our communities. Victim and survivors' voices must be heard and reflected in our laws and policies. Minority groups should not be sidelined or silenced. We need to educate from a very young age.”
“There is no direct cost to employers from safe leave, and it is needed to deal with the issues related to abuse. We need to destigmatise abuse and tackle root causes, misogyny and toxic masculinity. <BR /> <BR />I agree with Mr Weir's comments. We should not need to have the protections in place.”
“I thank every Member who spoke during the debate for their comments and support for the Bill. I will address the Minister's comments first. I thank him for being here, and I am glad that he is feeling better. <BR /> <BR />The Assembly cares, and we need to work constructively together to help.”
“<BR /> <BR />As I said at Second Stage, period poverty must be viewed through the lens of children's rights and how the Bill meets our obligations under the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (UNCRC).”
“<BR /> <BR />I take this opportunity at Final Stage to thank officials and members of the councils who took the time to discuss with me their policies, the background to them and how they are working in practice: thank you for everything that you are doing for your staff, and I hope that, should the Bill pass, your regional Parliaments an…”
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“I thank the First Minister for bringing this matter to the House today. It was truly awful to hear of the death of Sir David Amess MP on Friday and what had happened to him. We can all reflect on the activities. We all know what it is like to be in public life and to have that kind of attention. It is an essential part of our democracy that politicians are able to meet their constituents, and we must find ways to make sure that they can do so safely. This kind of violent behaviour cannot be tolerated, and no one ever deserves to have their life taken from them for representing their constituents and being in public life. <BR /> <BR />It is so unfortunate that we have been here before. We heard earlier from Mr Givan and Mr Allister about something that will always sit with me: the brutal murder five years ago of Jo Cox.”
“to ensure that no worker is discriminated against because of their age. Does the Minister agree with me that a 17-year-old doing the same job as a 24-year-old should be paid the same wage? When can Members expect to scrutinise the age, goods and facilities and services Bill that will ensure that no worker is discriminated against because of their age?”
“ban zero-hours contracts and introduce an:”
“I thank the Minister for his answer, but the New Decade, New Approach agreement stated that:”
“I thank the Member for giving way. I point out to other Members that in clause 4(b), which deals with protected persons, that is covered by:”
“I thank the Member for giving way. He has been generous with his time. Does his exact point about harassment law recognising that this needs to be a course of behaviour, as in more than one occasion, and his outlining of the restraining order requirements not point to the need for the Bill? You cannot have a restraining order on the basis of one instance of harassing behaviour; it is for future behaviour. In the instances that we are talking about, generally speaking, the women will not go back to the clinic.”
“<BR /> <BR />We will not tolerate groups of people standing outside GP surgeries and chemists that provide prescriptions and healthcare advice and administer vaccination programmes, for example, so why do we not condemn the behaviour outside other clinics, which obviously affects women much more than men? <BR /> <BR />I thank my colleague for all her work on the Bill. It has taken years to get to this point, as she outlined, and I urge all Members to support the Bill progressing at Second Stage.”
“A similar motion passed in Derry City and Strabane District Council. Also in that year, Ards and North Down Borough Council voted on a motion from us to condemn all harassment and intimidation taking place outside facilities in Northern Ireland that offer reproductive healthcare. That included attempts to physically block access to facilities and filming and recording staff and clients entering and leaving the building. That passed unanimously at committee. I note that some Members of certain parties that sit on those councils are commenting on the Bill today, totally against what their members have done at council level.”
“The Bill, and showing support for it, would be an important step in realising that the harassment of anyone who is using any form of healthcare facility throughout Northern Ireland will not be tolerated. No matter what our opinions may be about certain aspects of sexual and reproductive healthcare services provision in the country, it is of the utmost importance that rights are protected and upheld. No matter what type of healthcare services people require, everyone should be free to access advice and services free from harassment and verbal and physical abuse. <BR /> <BR />The creation of safe access zones is a step forward that has been discussed and debated in the Commons and in council chambers across Northern Ireland. A recent motion passed unanimously in Belfast City Council following on from same in 2017.”
“The Justice Committee and the Assembly looked at that when they dealt with the Domestic Abuse and Civil Proceedings Act (Northern Ireland) 2021, and we ensured that a requirement for the activity to occur on one or more occasion was included in the Act for that reason. Secondly, the police do not come out to every incident that is reported to them. As we are aware, the Police Service is stretched and under extreme pressure to deal with other issues. Thirdly, without the Bill, the actions that can be taken are reactive and do not protect women from the present situation. Even if the harassment laws were strengthened, there would still need to be a course of conduct to meet the definition of harassment. <BR /> <BR />A proactive and preventive method is needed.”
“They also have to go through the courts system, and all Members will know the issues with that and the significant barriers that are in place. I understand that there has been only one successful conviction that was not overturned for an assault on an employee of a sexual and reproductive healthcare charity. However, that offender is still allowed to stand outside and continue their actions. <BR /> <BR />Perhaps that answers some of the questions that Members posed about the adequacies and inadequacies of the current law and why the Bill is needed. First, those entering a building for an appointment or consultation might not return, so the behaviour does not come under the protection of current harassment laws because it is not a course of conduct.”
“So will members of the Justice Committee, given that we are currently looking to strengthen harassment laws in the Protection from Stalking Bill, which is nearing the end of its Committee Stage. There must be a course of conduct involved, and clause 6 criminalises behaviour in a geographic location rather than dealing with perpetrators or potential victims. That is why it is needed and that is what makes it different from the harassment and stalking legislation in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />Restraining orders were also mentioned. As we know, those are not sufficient, they are not open to everybody and they do not protect people from abuse or harassment in the way that would be needed in these cases.”
“Protest should not mean intimidation or harassing behaviour, and those involved in those cases do not have the right to impede access to healthcare. I do not see that type of protest occurring outside GP surgeries or, indeed, in chemists or counselling offices. If it was, it would not be accepted and action would be taken. The behaviour amounts to harassment and intimidation, and a number of the people involved have even been charged with assault. <BR /> <BR />As Mr Allister and other Members will know, the harassment laws in Northern Ireland only cover actions that occur on two or more occasions. Mr Allister asked earlier about clause 6, and he will know only too well the inadequacy of the harassment laws.”
“I thank the Member for his intervention. I complete agree: it is not for unsolicited strangers to offer so-called counselling services to anybody who is at a crisis point. That goes for anything, be it a healthcare matter or any matter or at all. There are plenty of support services out there, although there needs to be a lot more crisis support for people, should they need it. <BR /> <BR />Protest is not against the law. As we heard, everyone has a right to protest, and it is deeply embedded in our recent history as a method for change. Protest is a necessary and crucial part of our society, but the actions and images used by those groups and individuals and the words that they express to anyone entering or leaving those buildings are not acceptable.”
“That level of discomfort should not be experienced by anyone. <BR /> <BR />It is a disgrace that that kind of behaviour goes on. We need to send a strong message that condemns that type of behaviour and that states that such behaviour will not be tolerated. Unsolicited approaches must not be made to anyone who is entering a registered pregnancy advisory bureau or clinic. Likewise, other activities that are designed to cause distress, such as filming, recording, so-called counselling and pamphlet distribution, must not happen.”
“She confronted me, touched and pushed my arm, asked me whether I knew what my baby looked like and said that I would regret what I was going to do. Why is anyone harassed like that for entering a building for a meeting? On leaving the building, I was met by more people outside. One had a poster of a graphic image that would not be shown on TV before the watershed. I was followed down the street by a different lady who asked me if I was at a crisis point in my life and whether I needed her advice. The last thing that anybody at crisis point needs is the unsolicited harassment of a stranger and to be shouted at on the street. The last thing that anyone needs when entering their workplace is to be called a murderer. No one should have to endure such behaviour in accessing healthcare or their workplace.”
“They have been known to follow women and their families along the street, and they take photographs of individuals who have entered or exited the building without the person's permission or consent, and they then threaten to publish those photographs. As we know, intimidation reached such a level at one location that volunteers came forward to offer people the opportunity to be escorted into the building if they felt that they needed it. Ms Bailey was one of those volunteers. I thank her for that and for outlining her experiences. <BR /> <BR />I, too, was subjected to the behaviour that has been outlined. On one occasion when I went to the clinic for a meeting with staff members, I was grabbed by a woman holding a plastic doll as I approached the building.”
“If they were protesting against the law, as they see it, they could stand outside the seats of government, but they are not doing that every day. The sole purpose of their actions is to harass women who are accessing sexual and reproductive healthcare, and they have no regard to the reasons or motivation of the women for doing so. <BR /> <BR />These people target only women of what they perceive to be childbearing age, or those whom they deem to be involved. It does not matter if they are going into the building for work purposes or to access legal healthcare, contraception, other family planning matters or advice. They are all deemed to be legitimate targets by the people who congregate outside.”
“I support the Bill at Second Stage. I thank my colleague for bringing it forward and for all the work that she has put into it over the past number of years. I will start by declaring what the Bill is not: it is not a Bill that removes the right to protest, congregation, religious expression or belief, or freedom of speech, and nor does it deal with reproductive healthcare itself. The Bill is about safety and preventing harassment and intimidation. It is also about access to a balance of competing rights. People are congregating outside a number of healthcare facilities here. As we heard, that can be threatening and intimidating to those entering the building, including the staff who have to run the gauntlet to access their place of work. Those people are not conducting a peaceful protest that is directed at people in elected office.”
“<BR /> <BR />As we look to the future — allegedly to build back better, although evidence suggests otherwise — will the Executive prioritise health and well-being, a roof over people's heads and warm, secure homes with food on the table, or will they continue on an obsessive quest for capitalist growth that will only exacerbate and entrench inequalities in our society? It is not working, and it is not serving our population. We need a radical overhaul of how we do business that reduces inequalities. We must have a just transition so that no one is left behind and that builds an economy where the markets are designed and public money is used to conserve and regenerate resources rather than squandering them.”
“I thank the Member for her intervention. I am not aware of Executive business as I am a member of a non-Executive party. Certainly, I would welcome the elusive Executive business that we are supposed to be debating rather than Members' statements and motions. We are tasked with the job of legislating, and that is what we need to do. <BR /> <BR />There is much to do. The five-week wait for universal credit must be changed. The disgusting two-child cap needs to go. We must protect funding for our independent advice sector to ensure that people get the support that they need. Where is the anti-poverty strategy? Where is the youth homelessness strategy? Where is the feminist recovery plan being implemented by all Ministers? Where is the childcare strategy?”
“Women who were already struggling are now under even more financial pressure as they, their children and their families are pushed further into poverty as a result of the pandemic. <BR /> <BR />In Northern Ireland, 42% of people were already in fuel poverty. We are now facing yet more fuel price increases that will land on the public at a time when furlough is ending and we are entering the winter. <BR /> <BR />Legislation must be introduced and passed to extend the welfare reform migrations. Where is it? Why is it not being debated today instead of the private Member's motion? No offence, it is good to do that, but where is the legislation to do something?”
“The motion refers to food bank reliance and homelessness. We know that, in 2019-2020, Trussell Trust food banks gave out 45,000 three-day emergency food parcels in Northern Ireland, and that was before the pandemic. <BR /> <BR />Research shows that social security policy change had a disproportionate impact on women. Since 2010, 86% of savings to the Treasury from tax and benefit changes have come from women. In Northern Ireland, we know that one in five children already lived in absolute poverty. Last year, 6,219 young people were accepted as homeless. Those shocking statistics are from the recent Northern Ireland Youth Forum's (NIYF) peer research on youth homelessness. There are strong links between female poverty and child poverty.”
“I have to agree with Mr Frew. Oddly, his speech makes him sound like a member of the naughty corner. However, Ministers here have failed.”
“Thank you. <BR /> <BR />I thank the Member for his intervention. I was just coming on to that and his earlier speech. This hardship is not because of the pandemic. We have had huge and growing inequalities across our society for decades.”
“The question for the Executive is whether they can dig deep to effectively safeguard, with the powers that Ministers do have, our most vulnerable from the cruelty of austerity measures. As Mr O'Dowd asked, are they prepared to do so?”
“The Trussell Trust's research shows that the uplift has provided vital breathing space to hard-pressed budgets, with seven in 10 of those on universal credit since early 2020 saying that the increase has made it easier to afford essentials. That anyone would even countenance taking away the uplift from the most vulnerable is shocking, but it is not surprising from the Tories. <BR /> <BR />We know that there should be no going back to the way that things were before the pandemic. We all talk a lot about building back better. Given that Westminster is ploughing on with cutting the uplift, what will the Executive do to ensure that people here are protected and keep the rate that they are on?”
“I am in favour of today's motion. The reality of the pandemic's impact is that it has fallen disproportionately on the most vulnerable individuals along racial, ethnic, occupational, gendered and socio-economic lines. Inequalities in people's protection from and ability to cope with the pandemic show the urgency of the changes needed to reassess what is important, which is our population's health and well-being into the future. <BR /> <BR />The £20 uplift in universal credit at the start of the pandemic was a clear recognition that the basic payments were not enough for anyone at any time, pandemic or no pandemic, so, going back to what was before is unthinkable.”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. Can he point to exactly where in the Climate Change (No. 2) Bill the just transition is delivered?”
“The anticipation for my closing remarks is real. I have two sentences left, so I will conclude by saying that we are the first generation to truly feel the effects of climate breakdown and that we are the very last to be able to do anything about it. We can and must do better, for there is a lot of work to be getting on with. We need strong, ambitious climate legislation to deliver a true just transition for every person in Northern Ireland and not just a carbon Bill.”
“That argument is completely morally bankrupt. If we do not invest in a zero-carbon economy and society now, we will be left in pretty short order. Even the explanatory and financial memorandum admits that Northern Ireland is not immune to the severity of the impacts of a changing climate and that it is important that it plays its part in the global effort. However, with no targets and shabby environmental regulation, our businesses will wake up one morning and realise that they cannot compete, and it will not be their fault; it will be the fault of the House for not providing the much-needed leadership.”
“Again, we must question this and reflect the will of the Assembly, which has been shown many times in motions on a just transition. Why is it absent from the Minister's Bill? Perhaps the Minister can outline in his summing up why just transition is not in the Bill. Perhaps it was an oversight to leave out fairness in all of this. <BR /> <BR />Maybe some Members need reminded that this is a "Code red" for humanity. This is an emergency. It is not a case of, "Keep calm and carry on". Low ambition is not good enough. We cannot wait around any longer. I have said before and will say again that there are siren voices that urge us not to do anything too radical: "Why spend money on cutting emissions when we are only a tiny part of a huge global economy? Let the others do the harder work, and we can follow later".”
“The Assembly has a unique chance, through legislation, to change the course that we are on to irreversible climate catastrophe and to build back better in the context of the pandemic. We need to rebuild with a transformative green new deal and with the foundations of a just transition. We need to end investment in fossil fuels. We need to implement the moratorium on hydraulic fracturing that the Assembly voted in favour of last year, and we need to put a final stop to Dalradian's gold mine in Tyrone, to name but a few things that we need to get on with. <BR /> <BR />The transition to a green economy must be underpinned by the values of social and environmental justice and the principle that nobody gets left behind.”
“Hopefully, we will not be under water but living in retrofitted warm homes, of course. <BR /> <BR />Why does Northern Ireland not deserve to be net zero? Are we to continue to lag behind? Given that the Climate Bill for Northern Ireland at Committee Stage has a net zero target and this one does not, it begs this question: why the difference? What is the problem with the additional and much-needed 18%? <BR /> <BR />There is a lot lacking in the Bill, as many have noted, but most importantly for me is the absence of any principles, let alone mechanisms, for a just transition to net zero. Without those, it is fundamentally impossible to transition to net zero, which we must do, without leaving people behind.”
“Provision could be made only to allow targets to be revised upwards, and I do not see any reason why they would go downwards. <BR /> <BR />I also question the lack of oversight and accountability in the Bill. This will be a monumental challenge to everyone in society, so we need to have public buy-in and trust in the process. There needs to be independent oversight and democratic accountability in the Bill, giving the Assembly a stronger oversight and scrutiny role. Creating an independent Northern Ireland climate commissioner is a simple way of doing that. However, if the 82% reduction from baseline is not met, what protections are in place to ensure that targets are met? Most of us in the Assembly will not be sitting here in 2040, let alone 2050, to scrutinise the legislation.”
“<BR /> <BR />I take it that that flexibility will be used to amend targets only for the better, by which I mean that, if we are doing better than expected, we should get to net zero quicker.”
“<BR /> <BR />Clause 1, as we know, includes a target of an "at least 82%" reduction in greenhouse gas emissions by 2050, using baselines from the 1990s, depending on the gas. Never mind the issues that many have already outlined in possibly not meeting 82%, we know that that is not enough. <BR /> <BR />The Bill also allows DAERA to establish carbon budgets, which outline the maximum greenhouse gas levels for Northern Ireland for time periods noted in clauses 2 and 3 . I note that each budget is designed with the allowance that the Department can amend and alter the targets in clause 4, which means that that clause gives the Department the power to change clauses 1, 2 and 3, either specifying a different year or a different percentage. That is linked to clause 31.”
“I am glad to get the opportunity to speak on the Bill at Second Stage. I do not intend to speak for long, as others have covered a lot of detail already. <BR /> <BR />I will make a brief comment, as others have done at the start of their contribution. It is worth noting that, at this time last year, we had no climate Bill, and now this is the second in a matter of months to reach Second Stage in the House. It is good to see what can be done when there is a will. We do not need to kick cans further down the road or bury heads in the sand. <BR /> <BR />Moving on to the principles of the Bill, I wish to comment on two aspects: the target and the lack of a just transition.”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Does he agree that victims and survivors of domestic abuse in Northern Ireland should be entitled to safe leave from their job, should they need to avail themselves of it?”
“The removal of the uplift for universal credit will be devastating, given the end of furlough and the increase in energy prices that we have been discussing. Can the Minister provide any update on the fuel poverty strategy? What preparations is she making to help with fuel poverty for this winter? For example, is she working with the Minister for the Economy on a fuel bank fund?”
“I thank the Minister for attending the Chamber today. He will be aware that I have written many times to his Department about constituency issues to do with this. How long is it between an application for continuing healthcare and a decision? If, for example, a person applied for a continuing healthcare assessment 10 years ago, was not assessed and sadly died, what appeal mechanism is there against payment of fees that have been charged by the trust and passed to that person's family members?”
“I thank the Minister for his detailed answer. The Minister will be aware that assessments of that nature are guidance-based and that there is no legislative mandate to provide outcome and risk-based regulatory assurance. How does his Department ensure that assessments for ecological and biodiversity impacts are followed up and verified? Would he support legislation to strengthen those assessments in order to ensure that developmental impacts are properly considered?”
“<BR /> <BR />The Bill will improve the operation and effectiveness of the justice system as well as enhancing public safety and improving services for victims of sexual offences and victims of trafficking and exploitation only if it is well resourced and financed, if people are aware of it and if people are trained in it and know how to use it. It will go some way to closing the gaps, resolving inconsistencies and modernising our law. Of course, there is much to do. As I said at the start, I welcome the Bill, but I will look at clauses that can be improved. It has taken a long time to get here, and there should be more provisions in the Bill dealing with a wider range of issues, but I thank the Minister for bringing it forward.”
“We must all have access to and avail ourselves of education on what a healthy relationship looks like, what consent is and what it is not and where to get support and information. We must be careful not to stigmatise. This is all about keeping people safe, so I hope that the Committee will get sight of the amendments before Consideration Stage, if they are available, as it will be crucial that they get the scrutiny that they require. <BR /> <BR />The Minister and a number of Members mentioned provisions that are not in the Bill. Like others, I wanted to comment on what was excluded, but I note the previous Chair's comments about my not doing that, so I will leave that to another time.”
“It needs to be recognised that court cases involving sexual assault and harm involve battles over intimate relationships and the trauma and issues that they bring. We know from Gillen and from previous examples how women especially can have their private lives literally put on trial and how gendered myths are involved in that process. There is therefore much to be done and to be considered as part of the new rough sex defence. <BR /> <BR />Widespread education is key to a lot of things that we are discussing today and that we have discussed previously. Proper, age-appropriate and mandatory relationship and sexual education must be in place in our schools, colleges and universities.”
“We need to look at cases where people who kill their partner during sex are still being charged with manslaughter because the bar to charge and convict for murder is too high to meet. That was seen in a recent case in Darlington. The Women's Resource and Development Agency has suggested that we need a new offence that would capture such forms of extreme violence and allow for appropriate sentencing in accordance with the culpability of the defendant. Making it specific in legislation would not prevent defendants claiming that the death occurred by accident, but it would be progress and a step in the right direction. <BR /> <BR />I recognise that this is a complex and complicated area of law.”
“The law must be clear that you cannot consent to serious injury in the form of so-called rough sex or the '50 Shades of Grey' defence, as it is now known. The defence can be deployed by perpetrators of intimate partner abuse and violence. It is appalling that a victim of serious assault has to attend court to answer questions around their consenting to violence during sex, having to relive their experiences of harrowing sexual violence, and I cannot imagine how painful it must be for family members going through a trial where the rough sex defence is used by the defendant. <BR /> <BR />There are issues in taking the same approach to that in England and Wales, however, and they have been identified previously. I know that they were brought to the Department's attention through its recent consultation.”
“Recently, through the Domestic Abuse Act 2021, England and Wales legislated for a ban on the rough sex defence, but the campaign group We Can't Consent To This has collated and shown 60 examples of women who were killed through so-called "sex games gone wrong" in the UK since 1972. The claim, as we know, is that the victim had consented to having serious harm inflicted on them for sexual gratification, so the perpetrator must lack the intent to kill or cause grievous bodily harm. The issue is highly contested and highly gendered. According to We Can't Consent To This, 115 people, all but one of them women, have had to attend court, where it was claimed that they consented to violent injury.”
“In 2019-2020, 2,082 sexual offences against children were recorded, which was around 60% of all sexual crime, but the volume of young people who journey through the system is unclear. Can we have and publish desegregated data for under-18s? Do we need to legislate on that, or can it be done through a different way of collecting and publishing data by process? <BR /> <BR />During the progress of the Domestic Abuse and Civil Proceedings Bill, a number of Committee members raised the rough sex defence and discussed why it was important to abolish it. Unfortunately, there have been many instances where people have been killed that have attracted much discussion and attention.”
“<BR /> <BR />Without seeing the exact text of the proposed amendment, I am not able to comment further on it, but, at this stage, I will raise a point with the Minister about data collection that the NSPCC, I know, has raised previously. There is a problem with data collection. I have raised it during the passage of previous Bills. We have had debates about the importance of data collection and what it means for resourcing. Without robust, reliable figures on the volume of victims and witnesses, our ability to design a system to respond effectively to the need is limited. There is open data on the number of offences reported to police of all sexual abuse crime against under-18s.”