Mr Clive Betts
MP for Sheffield South East · Labour · United Kingdom
“I wholeheartedly welcome the Foreign Secretary’s statement, both its content and its tone. I would like to ask about his discussions with our colleagues and allies in other countries who are looking to implement similar sanctions.”
“I offer two congratulations: first, to my right hon. Friend and constituency neighbour, the First Secretary, on her well-deserved promotion—I am sure she will do an excellent job. Secondly, I congratulate her and the Prime Minister for their real commitment to devolution, which I have wanted to see for an awfully long time.”
“I apologise for the fact that—as I have explained to you, Madam Deputy Speaker—I will have to leave straight after my question to chair Westminster Hall. I thank my right hon. Friend for doing this very challenging piece of work. I think that the theme of fairness, for the people who need benefits and for taxpayers, is right.”
“On the other hand, so many constituents with really serious conditions get turned down for PIP, and can get it only if they struggle through the appeal system, sometimes without any help at all. So the system is not fair to anyone at present.”
“When the previous Government let the contract, we were in a situation in which procurement could not properly take account of the past record of companies, and I understand that the Government have now changed that.”
“I will dive very deeply into the question, Madam Deputy Speaker. The Chair of the Committee sends his apologies for his absence; he is presently in a Committee meeting.”
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“If he decides to appoint commissioners and they find that they need extra resources, particularly to help the young people who have been exploited and abused in the past and now need counselling and other assistance, will he respond positively to any request they make for such financial assistance?”
“I thank the Secretary of State for the fact that as Chair of the Select Committee I had an advance look at the report. I have also spoken to Louise Casey, who is going to come to the Committee so that we can explore some of these issues in more detail. I wholly agree with the Secretary of State that this is not a party political matter just because this is a Conservative Secretary of State and this is a Labour council; this is about putting arrangements in place to help the children of Rotherham, who have been let down in the past. May I press him on one point, however?”
“The Minister will be aware that paragraphs 17 and 111 of the national planning policy framework contain a commitment to “brownfield first”. When the Select Committee did its recent inquiry into the operation of the NPPF, it received more complaints about one issue than any other—concerns about inappropriate speculative applications, not just in the green belt but in green fields in general. Will he agree to look very carefully at the Select Committee’s recommendations to speed up the process of local plan adoption and to ensure that those local plans have a higher percentage of brownfield within them? There is real concern about this issue on both sides of the Chamber.”
“If our constituents have problems with the delivery of public services, ultimately they have recourse to the ombudsman. That was true of parents who had problems with working relationships in their children’s schools until 2012, when the Government changed the policy. Now, if a parent has a problem with an academy, they can go to the Education Funding Agency, but not with a complaint about the school, only with a complaint about the operation of the complaints procedure itself. Does that not need addressing?”
“He probably believes that that is the right approach, so why can he not convince his Government colleagues of it?”
“May we have a reality check? The extra money for the Sheffield city region—£30 million over a number of years—needs to be put in the context of the £60 million of cuts to Sheffield city council in the next year alone. The Minister is recognised as one of the most committed devolutionists in the Government. We can accept and welcome extra money and extra powers going to our city regions and combined authorities—more money where the decision on how it will be spent is made at the local level not the national level. Will he explain, however, why we cannot have a package of devolution measures that transfers responsibility for raising taxation at a local level in England—this is done in Scotland—and therefore give more powers to local councils in that way?”
“Does the Secretary of State really feel that it is sufficient for people to have to work in this country for only three months before they can claim out-of-work benefits?”
“David Higgins has described the transport links between Sheffield and Manchester as a matter of national concern. Under his proposals for an HS3 line, it merely goes from Manchester to Leeds, and to get from Manchester centre to Sheffield centre, one will have to go on HS3 to north of Wakefield, down on HS2 to Meadowhall, and then back to Sheffield centre. It will take longer than the current trundle through Hope valley. If improving connectivity is an important issue for the Government, should not this whole project get a complete rethink?”
“Two weeks ago, along with other Members of Parliament, I met executives of the Sheffield Teaching Hospitals NHS Foundation Trust, which, as I am sure the Secretary of State agrees, is an outstanding trust that invariably meets its care and financial targets. However, we were told that even that trust was not meeting its A and E targets. Would the Secretary of State care to reflect on the fact that if a trust as good as the Sheffield Teaching Hospitals trust is experiencing those problems now, there is a real prospect of crisis in the NHS this winter?”
“The Minister said in his statement that no council will face a loss of more than 6.4% in its spending power next year, the lowest level in this Parliament. Why does he think that that is a matter for self-congratulation? Will he confirm that the percentage cut that local councils will face in the next year will be bigger than the cut faced by all central Government Departments throughout the whole of this Parliament?”
“It has consolidated planning policy and made it more accessible to professionals and the public alike. The Government should be proud of their achievement, but they should not be defensive about the changes we say are needed. With a major reform, there will always be issues that have to be addressed. Three years ago, the Government and the then Minister embraced our report on the draft NPPF and acted on our recommendations. I very much hope that the current Minister will be equally positive in his response to this report. We must build on the success of the NPPF to give communities the protections they seek, to deliver development that is truly sustainable, and to ensure that the NPPF becomes a document in which everyone can have confidence.”
“Steps must be taken to ensure that equal weight is given to environmental and social factors as well as the economic ones. Development must be accompanied by the infrastructure necessary to support it. Those are some of the steps that the Government should take. They should also carefully monitor the impact of the NPPF. Regrettably, it stopped collecting important data about what is being built, and so we no longer know how many homes are being built on brownfield land or what percentage of retail development is built on out-of-town sites. Ministers should not be making policy decisions in the dark. The Government need to establish a set of data to monitor the impact of the NPPF against a small number of key aims. In summary, the NPPF has, overall, been a success.”
“The Welsh Government are producing a new 21st-century town centre planning policy, and we must do the same in England. Councils must look to reduce the size of their retail areas, which are often too large for modern needs. To do this effectively, we need to manage and plan the change. Our evidence was strongly opposed to the new permitted development rights that allow shops and banks to become homes without the need for planning permission. It is too random, and risks hollowing out the commercial heart of our town centres in an unplanned way. Councils have to be able to plan strategically for the future of their communities through their local plans. These permitted development rights must be revoked. Finally, the Government must ensure that the NPPF delivers the sustainable development that it promised.”
“Developers should be required to open their books and account must be taken of future projections of viability. We must make better use of previously used land. The NPPF is clear that brownfield land should be developed first, but a lack of resources means that this often does not happen in practice. The Government have launched some eye-catching initiatives, but they do not address the costs of making the land fit for building. In order to deliver their own policy, we call on the Government to establish a brownfield remediation fund. Next, we must update the NPPF to ensure that it gives greater protection to town centres. Planning policy must face up to the fact that changing shopping habits, particularly with online shopping, mean that town centre uses are also changing.”
“Up and down the country, in places as diverse as Leeds and Forest of Dean, problems have been caused by developers claiming that sites are unviable in order to obtain planning permission on more lucrative sites, against the wishes of the council and its communities and also delaying the local plan process. To address this, the NPPF should be amended to make it clear that all sites with planning permission should be counted towards a five-year supply. Moreover, developers are taking a pessimistic view about the future viability of sites. They refuse to accept that brownfield sites that are unviable now may well be viable in five years’ time, and therefore look to add more greenfield sites to the five-year supply. We call for a much more transparent approach to the assessment of viability.”
“The assessment of housing need has emerged as a particular bone of contention. There is a clear need for an agreed methodology against which inspectors can test strategic housing market assessments. Another sticking point for local plans is a duty to co-operate. The Government should consult on appropriate incentives and penalties to encourage councils to co-operate better. Councils such as Cheltenham, Gloucester and Tewkesbury, which we visited, should be rewarded for choosing to group together. Where combined authorities exist, a duty should be placed on them to produce a joint core strategy for the area they cover. Problems identifying a five-year supply of housing land have left many areas without an adopted local plan.”
“The process of producing a plan has been likened to a game of snakes and ladders: councils can spend years drawing up a plan only for the inspector, on examination, to find it unsound and send the council right back to square one. This is frustrating and wasteful, especially if the plan comes unstuck on just one particular issue. We call for the Government to allow plans to be partially adopted when the bulk of the work has been done. When an inspector is happy with the bulk of a plan, he should consider finding it sound, subject to an early review. Such an approach was taken in Dacorum, to widespread acclaim. We could not understand why the Planning Inspectorate did not see that as a model for others to follow. Inspectors should also give more support to councils throughout the plan production process.”
“The NPPF has a presumption in favour of sustainable development, but that golden thread running through the framework is linked to the development of local plans. One cannot have a plan-led system without plans. Councils that fail to adopt a plan surrender their ability to influence the future development of their local area and leave their communities exposed to speculative development. We therefore call for a statutory requirement for every council to put a local plan in place within three years. Some councils may not have shown the political will or made available the necessary resources to develop local plans, but we received evidence of a number of other issues that have delayed their production. The planning inspector’s approach can be a barrier to councils getting plans in place.”
“We do not need to tear it up and start again. There are, however, a number of emerging concerns that people have raised with us about inappropriate development in their communities. Much of this arises as a result of speculative planning applications by developers. Although the NPPF is clear about the importance of sustainable development, for many people, sadly, the absence of a local plan has created an easy route to unsustainable development. In our report, we set out a number of steps that should be taken to address these concerns. The key to preventing undesirable development is for councils to get their local plans in place. Local plans were first introduced in 2004, but two fifths of authorities have still not adopted one. This is not a problem with the NPPF, but the NPPF envisages and is based on a plan-led system.”
“No Government could have carried out such a wide-ranging reform and expected it to work perfectly from the off. This was the motivation for our inquiry, which led to our report. Our aim was to take a comprehensive look at the NPPF as it was operating in practice, to identify any sticking points or unintended consequences and to make recommendations on how they should be addressed. Our approach was thorough: 300 submissions were made to the Committee, we called 45 witnesses, we had discussions with 60 representatives from parish and town councils and community groups, and we made visits to the Planning Inspectorate and to councils in Gloucestershire. We based our recommendations on the evidence we found. We found overall that there is still strong support for the principles of the NPPF and the simplification that it has brought.”
“By listening to and acting upon the concerns that we raised, the Government were able to make big improvements so that when the final version of the NPPF was published in March 2012, it was well received for the simplification that it brought to the planning system. The NPPF, in the words of the then Minister, now the Minister for Universities, Science and Cities, the right hon. Member for Tunbridge Wells (Greg Clark), reduced “over a thousand pages of often impenetrable jargon into around 50 pages of clearly written guidance”. The NPPF was a bold, radical and much needed change. Given that it was such a big change, it was inevitable that there would be unforeseen problems and that a couple of years down the line some changes would be needed to it.”
“I am delighted to present the Committee’s report and I thank in particular our Committee specialist, Kevin Maddison, and specialist adviser, Kelvin MacDonald, whose hard work and expertise have made a major contribution to the report. As has been customary with reports from the Committee, this report was agreed unanimously. Three years ago this week we published our report on the draft national planning policy framework which, at the request of the Government, we had closely scrutinised. We were encouraged that the Government paid close attention to our findings at that time and accepted 30 of our 35 recommendations.”
“The hon. Gentleman is right that local plans are at the heart of this. We set out a number of ways in which the process could be improved and simplified. At the Planning Inspectorate, we were shown boxes of documents just for one local plan in one area. It has all got a bit too complicated. He is right about neighbourhood plans. They are a success where they have been put in place, but there is an issue about the relationship between neighbourhood plans and local plans, particularly when the neighbourhood plan comes first and then has to be related to the local plan. His point about infrastructure is well made, and it is mentioned in our recommendations.”
“Assessment of housing need is problematic, and the evidence we received was that often local authorities would work for a long time on it, only for the Planning Inspectorate to arrive at the end of the process, decide that its methodology and conclusions were different and then send the local authorities back to the drawing board. We think that the Planning Inspectorate could work more closely with authorities during the process, but we also feel—I think local authorities generally agree with this—that if the Planning Inspectorate, right at the beginning of the process, laid down in guidance a consistent methodology, most councils would welcome that. Indeed, when Lord Matthew Taylor undertook his report on planning guidance, he suggested that that was an area on which further guidance would be welcome.”
“I would certainly be more than happy to meet the hon. Gentleman when I have had a chance to read his Bill, which is on my Christmas reading list and seems to address exactly the sorts of issues the Committee considered. I emphasise that this is a Committee report. The whole of the Committee worked extremely hard and went on the visits, and we agreed the recommendations unanimously.”
“The hon. Gentleman will recognise that I cannot comment on or have knowledge of every particular planning development throughout the country. Clearly, there are issues of contention where housing need in one area has to be met by putting housing in another area. The duty to co-operate, which should resolve that, has not been working in all circumstances. We went to Gloucestershire and found three councils working very well together, but even they said that they did not always have terribly good relationships with the councils next door that were not part of their process. A look needs to be taken at the whole issue of co-operation and how it can be improved.”
“The hon. Gentleman’s last point is a very good one. We did not take particular evidence on it, but it does aggravate councils up and down the country. We made a recommendation that a look should be taken at how the process could be simplified. We did not go into the specifics, but boxes of documents at the Planning Inspectorate for one local plan for a relatively small district showed how complicated the process has become. At a time of spending and resource constraints, many councils are struggling to finish that complicated process. We think that the Government, the Planning Inspectorate and local government should sit down together and revise and simplify the process.”
“That sentiment was expressed very strongly to us when we met the 60 representatives of community groups and parish groups. We consistently heard the message that people did not feel in control of what was happening in their own areas. If there was no local plan in place, they felt completely unprotected against individual applications for developments that they felt would be unsustainable. The right hon. Gentleman gave evidence to the Committee on precisely those points and we took that very much into account in our recommendations.”
“I thank the hon. Gentleman, who is also a member of the Committee, for his contribution to the report, particularly the way in which he focused on the problems with the five-year supply of housing and the definitions of viability. Indeed, sites where planning permission has actually been given are not necessarily automatically factored into the five-year supply, and our report calls for that to be addressed. The hon. Gentleman did not mention this, but he has also been a great champion of what more we can do to protect the high street and town and city centres.”
“The hon. Gentleman’s comments show that even when authorities make genuine attempts to co-operate, it does not always result in sweetness and light. We also identified a problem with the relationship between neighbourhood plans and local plans. That needs to be clarified because there is a lot of concern—particularly when a neighbourhood plan comes before a local plan—that there can be misunderstandings about the relative status of the two.”
“There is widespread support for the concept of neighbourhood plans, but there is some concern that poorer communities may not be able to adopt the process as easily as more affluent ones. That goes back to the issue of the relative status of neighbourhood and local plans if, for example, 14 neighbourhood plans are being developed but there is no local plan. We think that the definition of sustainable development in the NPPF is a good one—it draws on Brundtland and on the five principles—and we do not want to change it. The problem is that the definition goes on to say that sustainable development is defined by everything in the NPPF, and we thought that that rather circular argument was unnecessary.”
“If, on a pepper-potted basis, we allow a change of use from shops and banks to residential, we might well end up with less ability to reconfigure town centres or to change areas wholesale from retail to other uses. That was one of our big concerns. There should be a plan-led approach to changes in retailing, not pepper-potting by permitted development.”
“The specific regulations on permitted development rights were not about offices, but about shops and banks. However, we did receive some evidence on that. Concerns have been identified, particularly in London, about the loss of business and office space to residential use. I want to make two points about town centres. First, local authorities—I am a great localist—did not get the message that retailing was changing fundamentally with online shopping, and did not change their local plans quickly enough to respond to that, which is a big issue. Secondly, the Committee strongly made the point that the response to such rapid changes has to be properly planned for by making changes to local plans.”
“bill presented Lords Spiritual (Women) Bill Presentation and First Reading (Standing Order No. 57) The Deputy Prime Minister, supported by the Prime Minister, Secretary Nicky Morgan, Mr Oliver Letwin, Greg Clark, Mr Sam Gyimah, Jo Swinson and Tom Brake, presented a Bill to make time-limited provision for vacancies among the Lords Spiritual to be filled by bishops who are women. Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time on Monday 5 January 2015, and to be printed (Bill 143 ) with explanatory notes (Bill 143-EN).”
“Last time the Government agreed to 30 of our recommendations. It will be difficult to match that this time as we have given them only 29 recommendations, but I am sure that they will be grateful to receive one less. It is absolutely right that the Government should take away the report and consider it. We are saying that the NPPF has been a success in general, but we hope that the Government will recognise that there are some problems, particularly about issues—the development of local plans, the five-year supply of housing land and the relationship between neighbourhood and local plans—that need to be addressed to improve the system that they set up. I hope that the Government will respond positively, and we look forward to discussing their response to our recommendations when it is made.”
“The Leader of the House referred to the voting powers of Scottish and Welsh Members of Parliament, although not, I think, to those of Northern Ireland Members. As more powers are devolved to London and combined authorities in England, will MPs from those areas continue to have full voting rights on all matters, including devolved matters, in the House as well?”
“9. What assessment he has made of the implications for his policies of the report published by the National Audit Office entitled, “Financial Sustainability of Local Authorities 2014”, published in November 2014, HC 783; and if he will make a statement.”
“Given that this is a report by the independent NAO, should the Minister not be at least a little concerned about some of its findings? It states: “The Department has a limited understanding of the financial sustainability of local authorities and the extent to which they may be at risk of financial failure” and “does not monitor the impact of funding reductions on services in a coordinated way.” Is that not a damning indictment? If the Government continue with these policies, some councils will get into serious financial difficulties, and they will get there with the Government apparently unaware and seemingly uninterested.”
“As I understand it, we will get an announcement later this week about the local government financial settlement for next year, which could involve a 10% reduction in local authority spending. That is as big a cut in one year as central Government Departments have faced throughout the whole of this Parliament. Will the Secretary of State, in the interests of transparency, give an assurance that he will come to this House and make an oral statement, rather than hide behind a written statement as he did last year?”
“On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. Is it not a convention of the House that, when an intervention is taken, the speaker addresses that intervention and answers it before taking another intervention?”
“12. What estimate he has made of his Department’s expenditure on in-work housing benefit for migrant workers from the European economic area who have arrived in the UK within the last (a) six, (b) 12 and (c) 24 months.”
“Many of my constituents express a real sense of grievance when people come to this country and claim benefits to which they have not contributed. It is now the policy of the Government—and, indeed, of the Opposition—that before people can claim unemployment-related benefits, they should have to work in this country for a longer period. Should a similar principle apply to the claiming of housing benefit?”
“The other week, my hon. Friend the Member for Penistone and Stocksbridge (Angela Smith) and I drove the Under-Secretary of State for Transport, the hon. Member for Scarborough and Whitby (Mr Goodwill), across the Pennines from Sheffield towards Manchester. I did not think he could understand how bad the Woodhead pass was, and why people willingly drove over it, until we took him back over the Snake pass. A few crawler lanes on the Woodhead might be a short-term sticking-plaster, but in the end it is a tunnel under the Pennines—after all, they are only 2,000 feet high—that is the real long-term answer. When is the review of such a project likely to start, who is likely to conduct it, and when, realistically, could work actually start if the go-ahead is given?”
“I am thinking of the work of the catering staff, particularly over the past few years. They have made major alterations to their working arrangements—to accommodate the changes in sitting hours, among other things—while maintaining their professionalism and continuing to provide the excellent service that we have come to expect from them. I should put on record that we in the parliamentary football club will shortly be playing our annual game against the parliamentary chefs. This is one of the ways in which Parliament comes together. It shows that we have a genuine working relationship and that we can enjoy such activities together.”
“Some of us would say that the replacement of mountains of paper by our iPads has resulted in an improvement in our working conditions. We have achieved a lot of the reductions that we were aiming for through major cuts in our printing budget. Not every hon. Member shares the view that iPads represent an improvement, but for many they have certainly introduced a more efficient way of working. I also want to give credit to the Clerk who has just retired, and to the management team, for their efforts in advising the Finance and Services Committee by giving us all the options, alternatives and information to help us to make the right decisions and recommendations to the Commission. Our thanks should extend beyond the Officers of the House who give us advice directly.”
“Member for Saffron Walden (Sir Alan Haselhurst), I think we should give credit to the Administration Committee for its work on making this place even more welcoming to visitors, who now have more opportunities to buy when they come here and who also have a greater variety of things to do. That is certainly commendable. We are now working on the launch of the new education centre, which is welcome. It is important that visitors can come in here to see how Parliament operates and to look at this magnificent building even when we are not sitting, but it is even more important when those visitors are children who are coming here to get an educational experience and to see how Parliament operates and learn about the workings of our democracy. That is something that we have achieved despite the expenditure reductions.”
“I think we have managed this programme in a proper way. These expenditure reductions are larger than those being attempted in virtually any other central Government Department during the same period, although perhaps not so large as those that some local councils are having to deal with. In making the reductions, we have also tried to ensure that this building is no less welcoming to visitors, and in particular to our constituents when they come to see how Parliament operates. I think we have achieved that as well. Having listened to the speech from the right hon.”
“I join other Members in thanking the Chair of the Committee for his able and outstanding leadership over not only the last Session but the whole Parliament, as he has brought us together to make some often difficult decisions. As has rightly been said, the fact that there are so few Members here today with complaints to make—and certainly none who wants to suggest amendments—demonstrates that we have just about got the decisions right. The remit we were given at the beginning of the Parliament was challenging, in that we had to make 17% cuts in real terms over the course of this Parliament. Our first criterion was that we had to make those cuts without affecting the ability of Members to do their job, and I think that we have achieved our aim. I have not heard Members saying that their job is now more difficult to do because of the cuts.”
“May I apologise to you, Mr Deputy Speaker, to the House and to the Chair of the Finance and Services Committee, the right hon. Member for Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross (John Thurso), for not being here for the start of his speech? I was otherwise detained. I must also apologise as I will have to leave just before 4 o’clock to chair a Select Committee. As a member of the Finance and Services Committee, however, I want to say a few words to the House on this annual occasion when we explain what we have been doing with the House’s finances during the previous Session, and present the financial plan for the years ahead and the estimates for next year.”
“That in itself is a tribute to the work of the Chair, the right hon. Member for Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross, and I thank him and his Committee for the advice they have given to the Commission over the course of this Parliament.”