Kevin Hollinrake
MP for Thirsk and Malton · Conservative · United Kingdom
“That issue is one of the many things that the people who signed the petition are concerned about, Dr Huq. One of the big things that the Government promised, which I agree with them about, is the need to encourage faster growth in our economy. Of course that is right, but look at where that growth is.”
“The UK economy went through many challenges, of course, some of them caused by Brexit; the reality is that a change like that was bound to have a short-term effect—but only a short-term effect. The country grew faster than Germany and France during that period of time.”
“As I said before, governing is not easy; we had many challenges ourselves, and we did not get everything right, but what we did during that difficult period of time—those 14 years—was get 1.2 million more people employed in our economy. Unemployment was halved during our time in office.”
“Of course, many Government Members supported his leadership challenge. We are here now, looking forward to a general election coming down the track. We are ready for a general election when the Government are, because, unlike them, we have a strong leader—against their weak leader.”
“I was, absolutely. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk (John Lamont) for his excellent opening speech. He made so many good points, not least about the level of support for this petition.”
“Members on the Government side of the House also feel betrayed and angry with their own leadership, for marching them up to the top of the hill and marching them back down again on many of these issues, but they do not feel as betrayed as the businesspeople in this country in particular.”
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“Local authorities are a subset of public authorities. Question put and agreed to. Clause 90 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill. Schedule 3 Disclosure of information: consequential amendments Amendment made: 49, in schedule 3, page 162, line 5, leave out paragraphs 5 to 7.— (Kevin Hollinrake.) This amendment is consequential on NC17 and NC18. Schedule 3, as amended, agreed to. Clauses 91 to 93 ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 94 General false statement Offences Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.”
“The Government listened to the concerns expressed about such exceptions and exemptions during the expedited passage of the 2022 Act; the clause is therefore carefully constructed so as to be as narrow as possible.”
“The Secretary of State must be satisfied about the reason why a certificate has been sought and may issue one only if to do so is in the interest of national security or for the prevention or detection of serious crime. The certificate can be revoked at any time. To further limit the circumstances in which a certificate can be issued, serious crime is defined in the clause, providing further assurance about the need for such a certificate. The definition of serious crime aligns with that used in section 18 of the 2022 Act, which allows the Secretary of State to exempt a person from the requirements of the register of overseas entities for the same reasons.”
“In exceptional circumstances, it may be necessary for the Secretary of State to allow material that would otherwise be treated as false, misleading or deceptive to be deliberately provided to the registrar to protect our nation’s interests or to assist in the prevention or detection of serious crime. The clause ensures that when such action is taken, the Secretary of State can issue a certificate that ensures that the person to whom it is issued is not liable for the commission of acts that might otherwise amount to a false filing offence. Clearly, the work of our law enforcement and intelligence agencies must be able to be carried out without fear of prosecution when they are acting in our interests. The certificate that may be issued provides an exemption for those purposes.”
“It is worth noting that that refines the amendments made by the Government during the passage of the 2022 Act in response to parliamentary scrutiny. When either offence is committed by a firm, every officer of the firm that is in default also commits the offence. The structure of the new sections maintains consistency with amendments to the 2022 Act, the Limited Partnerships Act 1907 and the Reports on Payments to Governments Regulations 2014, as amended by the Bill. On clause 95, we have already discussed many of the new powers that we are providing to the registrar and how they are intended to work.”
“Clause 94 amends the general false statement offence in section 1112 of the Companies Act 2006 to create two separate offences: a basic offence and an aggravated offence. The Bill also amends section 32 of the Economic Crime (Transparency and Enforcement) Act 2022 to make a mirror-image, two-tier approach. The existing false statement offence under the Companies Act requires a document or a false, misleading or deceptive statement to have been delivered or caused to be delivered knowingly or recklessly to the registrar. Clause 94 substitutes that existing offence for two new offences with commensurate penalties. The basic offence is committed when the false statement is made without reasonable excuse. The aggravated offence is committed when the false statement is knowingly made.”
“Lady that there will be many more cases of false filing than those that have been identified, but to be fair to Companies House, without the resources to do it, which it has never been given before, that is a pretty difficult job for it to do. Companies House does publicly report annually, and I would very much like to see that kind of accountability in future reports, in terms of its efficacy in this area. Question put and agreed to . Clause 94 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill . Clause 95 ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 96 Financial penalties”
“That is why we are in this Committee Room: it is about not just legislation but implementation. There have to be the proper resources for Companies House to do that job and I absolutely want to make sure that it has not just the powers but the resources to interrogate the database, make sure it is accurate and share the data information, because it is critical to look at the context. A number of things align in this respect: it is about the powers, the resources, the data-sharing capability and, for the first time, the sanctions of up to two years in prison on individuals who file falsely. We absolutely want to ensure that the figures improve. I absolutely agree with the hon.”
“I think the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Aberavon, had two main queries. On the type of circumstance in which a certificate would be issued, it is impossible to predict other than to say that it would be when it is in the interests of national security or in the case of a serious crime, which is defined in the clause. The actual circumstances around that are incredibly difficult to predict. It is fair to say that we expect such a certificate to be issued on extremely rare occasions, but we cannot rule out the possibility of our needing to do so. Ultimately, it has to be a judgment for the Secretary of State. On false filing, I well remember responding to the written question from the hon. Member for Glasgow Central. It was a very fair question.”
“If the right hon. Lady includes what we resource—the SFO, NCA and other enforcement agencies—it is not entirely clear, but we give about £825 million a year to our enforcement agencies.”
“She can determine whether to impose a civil penalty or refer the matter to a law enforcement agency if it is serious enough. We felt that £10,000 was a reasonable compromise. On that basis, I hope that the right hon. Member for Barking will withdraw the amendment.”
“It is interesting to look at the examples she quotes, but I think that two of them concern reimbursement of victims rather than further resourcing of the relevant agencies. I also slightly worry about the unintended consequences of allowing the regulator to simply issue fines and keep them. Many of those fines may be issued not because of transgressions related to economic crime; they may be related to other offences and other things. The shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Aberavon, raised the issue of whether the level of £10,000 was appropriate. It is quite a lot of money, of course. The vast majority of businesses registered with Companies House are smaller companies. For a smaller company, £10,000 is an awful lot of money. It is, of course, an option. It is not that the registrar cannot refer this to law enforcement agencies.”
“The figures that she quotes are interesting, because according to my note here, the receipts paid should be split 50:50 between the Home Office and the Treasury and operational partners, which should be the enforcement agencies. It should be an equal split. I do not know about the numbers that she gives regarding the situation in the US, but I am happy to look at that in further detail. I am very keen to make sure that resources are made available. There is probably a difference here in relation to fines. The right hon. Lady acknowledges that POCA offences have been subject to the oversight of our courts. In terms of fines and civil penalties, however, there are strict guidelines on how that money can be spent.”
“The combination of last year’s spending review settlement and private sector contributions through the new economic crime levy will provide funding of £400 million over the spending review period. That applies to the AML regulated sector and will fund new or uplifted activity to tackle money laundering, starting from 2023-24. There will be a wide-ranging review three years later to provide transparency on how the levy is performing against its original purpose, including how the money is being spent. In addition, as the right hon. Member for Barking set out, a proportion of assets recovered under the Proceeds of Crime Act 2002 are already reinvested in economic crime capability under the asset recovery incentivisation scheme.”
“I am very sympathetic to the points raised by contributors to this debate, and I am fully signed up to making sure that our law enforcement agencies have a long-term funding solution. As the right hon. Member for Barking knows, I am very sympathetic to the need to properly resource enforcement agencies, and, indeed, to the need for clarity on what funding is in place, right across the piece. We could have various different debates about what level that should be and on whether it should be £30 million a year. It is an awful lot more than that, but I accept that there should be more clarity. Wherever we can, we should seek to raise the moneys that the enforcement agencies need to do their job properly. We are developing a new funding model for Companies House, which demonstrates our commitment to tackling economic crime.”
“That is because in order to best support enforcement agencies in their fight against economic crime, there is likely to be a need to review and refine the enforcement procedures and processes.”
“At present, most obligations relating to the functions of the registrar are enforced through the criminal justice system. Clause 96 inserts new section 1132A into the Companies Act 2006, which gives the Secretary of State the power to make regulations to enable “the registrar to impose a financial penalty on a person if satisfied, beyond reasonable doubt, that the person has engaged in conduct amounting to a relevant offence under this Act.” The registrar will have the discretion to choose to either pursue a financial penalty or pass a case on to law enforcement to consider criminal prosecution. Clause 96 contains a delegated power regarding the level of financial penalty.”
“Section 3 of the CDDA will be amended so that the imposition of a financial penalty can count as a default. That will provide a greater deterrent to those who seek to circumvent legislative requirements. Not only will individuals face the risk of a financial penalty but the risk of being disqualified will become more likely when a financial penalty has been imposed. Clause 98 mirrors the provisions in clause 97 so that they apply in Northern Ireland, amending the current provision in article 6 of the Company Directors Disqualification (Northern Ireland) Order 2002.”
“Clause 97 will strengthen the link between civil sanctions and director disqualification by amending section 3 of the Company Directors Disqualification Act 1986, which states that the court may make “a disqualification order against a person where it appears to it that he has been persistently in default in relation to provisions of the companies legislation”, and that “the fact that a person has been persistently in default…may…be conclusively proved by showing that”, in the previous five years, “he has been adjudged guilty…of three or more defaults”. Under proposed new section 1132A of the Companies Act 2006, the registrar will be able to impose a financial penalty on a person, if she is satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that the person has engaged in conduct amounting to an offence.”
“I think that is a very sensible suggestion and I am happy to take that away. I would like to see a number of things in that report that are currently not there. If we look at the most recent report, we see a number of references to this particular legislation. It welcomes this legislation, and I think it is important that the body reports publicly and to Parliament, as would be the case with the measures that the right hon. Lady mentions. Similarly, there may be reason to review the appropriate financial penalty amount, and interest or late payment amount, to deter misconduct against the register as effectively as possible. The regulations will be subject to the affirmative procedure, which will provide the appropriate amount of parliamentary scrutiny of any proposed further changes.”
“Of course, there is a link in the average scheme. I think £1.3 billion has been raised from asset recovery for law enforcement agencies since 2007, so there is a link. The point that we disagree on is fines.”
“This is a very simple measure. The Government are seeking to tackle the misuse of limited partnerships while modernising the law governing them. The clause clarifies the meaning of the term “limited partnership”. The revised wording removes ambiguity and sets out that it is possible to be a limited partnership only by virtue of being registered as a limited partnership under the Limited Partnerships Act 1907. Furthermore, the Companies Act 2006 provision relating to the index of company names is amended to refer to limited partnerships registered under the Limited Partnerships Act. That allows the registrar to remove firms from the index of company names if they are dissolved, cease to be registered under the Limited Partnerships Act, or both.”
“My view on the suggestion that has been raised many times that people will simply go somewhere else is that if all we can do is ensure they do not carry on their nefarious activities here, that is at least something. However, we certainly must work internationally with others on what happens globally. Question put and agreed to. Clause 99 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 100 Required information about partners Question proposed , That the clause stand part of the Bill.”
“As the hon. Member for Glasgow Central knows, the new provisions apply to Scottish limited partnerships, as well as limited partnerships. She is absolutely right to say that it is about not just the powers but the resources. I fully concur with that, as we have said previously. I will not reiterate those points. The hon. Lady make her points on displacement—people will stop doing it here or in Scotland and go to Delaware, Ireland, or wherever else—well, of course. But we can do precious little about that, other than work on international co-operation through organisations such as the Financial Action Task Force, as we do internationally, to put pressure on all those jurisdictions.”
“That will make it easier to collate and sort information about a limited partnership’s activities and it aligns with the position for companies. I thank the right hon. Member for Barking for her new clause 56. Perhaps she should speak about that now, and I will respond to her points.”
“The general partners of limited partnerships will be required to provide the registrar with the required information of each person who is a partner in the limited partnership, or who became a partner on registration within a six-month transitional period. Failure to comply with those requirements may give the registrar reasonable cause to consider that the limited partnership is no longer operating and is dissolved. That will mean that the registrar may exercise her confirmation of dissolution power, which we will debate later on. If the registrar goes through the confirmation of dissolution process, she may deregister the dissolved firm. Clause 102 provides that the Secretary of State may, by regulations, designate a standard system for classifying the business of a limited partnership.”
“Clause 100 and schedule 4 significantly increase the amount of information that must be provided about a new limited partnership and its prospective partners, and, subsequently, when they make their annual confirmation statements or deliver notifications that report changes. Schedule 4 sets out what information must be provided, including date of birth, nationality and the usual residential address when the partner is an individual. Clause 101 is intended to ensure that existing limited partnerships registered prior to the commencement of the Bill are equally required to deliver the relevant information set out in schedule 4.”
“That is why the clauses that we are debating will increase the amount of information that is available concerning the partners of a limited partnership, and place a legal duty on partners to update those details with the registrar. In addition, the identities of all general partners must now be verified, and any corporate general partner must name an individual who may be contacted in relation to the limited partnership and whose identity must also be verified. Although the right hon. Lady admits that her new clause is not a perfect solution, she has raised a good point. In consultation with her and officials, I will give further consideration to this matter, to ensure that there are no other means by which somebody may have undue control over a limited partnership. I am keen to work with her and discuss how we might do that.”
“It would be possible to draft legislation for a different regime applying a different definition of beneficial ownership, but given that the partnership only exists as a business relationship between partners and its body exists in the person of the partners, it is not apparent who, beyond the partners, should be registered. A likely outcome would therefore be all limited partnerships reporting that no person met the requirements, other than those already registered as partners. Nevertheless, I understand that the intention of the right hon. Member for Barking is to increase transparency about who is managing and controlling a limited partnership.”
“I will return to that point in a second. Not having legal personality means that limited partnerships cannot own property or assets in their own name; any assets are held in the name of the partners themselves. They are a registrable legal relationship, and can be thought of a bit like a marriage: the act of registering gives the relationship legal force and bestows rights and duties on the partners, but it does not create something separate that can be owned. Like a marriage, a partnership ends on the death of a partner. It is therefore not legally possible to apply the persons of significant control requirements currently applied to Scottish LPs to English, Welsh and Northern Irish LPs.”
“Scottish limited partnerships have legal personality, meaning that in the eyes of the law they are a separate legal entity and have distinct duties and liabilities to those of their partners. It is therefore possible to apply persons of significant control requirements to those entities. As the right hon. Lady said, the same is not true of English, Welsh or Northern Irish limited partnerships, which do not have legal personality. Unlike SLPs, those forms of limited partnership register with Companies House but are not a separate legal entity from their partners. The partners are the embodiment of the partnership; as such, legislating for the registration of people who have significant influence or control over an English, Welsh or Northern Irish LP is legislating for the registration of people who control other people.”
“I am very pleased to respond to the right hon. Lady’s speech. In relation to some of the issues we have with limited partnerships, she has set out her case very well and fairly. Through the Bill, we are trying to make it easier for Companies House to spot exactly the kinds of red flags the right hon. Lady has referred to. She mentioned people such as Alexandru Terna. Under this legislation, for the first time, significant penalties will accrue to somebody who does not declare their partners accurately. As I have said on a number of occasions in recent days, I am sympathetic to a number of the right hon. Lady’s amendments, including new clause 56. I understand the reasons why she has tabled it. The new clause would partially duplicate the Scottish Partnerships (Register of People with Significant Control) Regulations 2017.”
“It is clear from the number of different things that we have discussed over recent days that we need to work on a number of points to improve the legislation. There is no question about that, and I am grateful to hon. Members for their contributions to that end. The shadow Minister raised the six-month transitional period. Clearly, we are trying to strike a balance between rooting out wrongdoing and ensuring that legitimate organisations have time to provide the information. I think it is a reasonable time period. It may be that something happens as she described, and some nefarious activities are—”
“Question put and agreed to. Clause 100 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill. Schedule 4 Required information Amendment made: 50, in schedule 4, page 164, line 1, leave out “registered or”.— (Kevin Hollinrake.) This amendment would mean that, in relation to the registration of limited partnerships, the required information that must be provided about a partner that is a legal entity includes its principal office in all cases, rather than there being an option to provide its registered or principal office. Schedule 4, as amended, agreed to. Clauses 101 and 102 ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 103 A limited partnership’s registered office Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.”
“I was going on to say that I think the period is fair. As the hon. Lady knows from the debate that we have had over recent days, the way the legislation works is that a number of different pressure points are applied to those who are potentially guilty of wrongdoing. The dissolution of a partnership may well be a red flag for Companies House in certain circumstances, together with other information that it may glean, including from the confirmation statements that general partners have to submit—those are combined with criminal sanctions, of course—and information sharing. All those things come together in this holy alliance to clamp down on the opportunities created by limited partnerships and other vehicles that we have discussed. I think it is a fair balance, but I am always happy to continue to debate these things.”
“Clause 104 extends the requirement to have a registered office address to limited partnerships that were registered before commencement of the Bill. It gives them a period of six months to comply with the new requirements. The end of the transition period will provide the registrar with a point at which to assess which limited partnerships have failed to comply and may therefore be inactive. The registrar can then treat the limited partnership as dissolved and update the register accordingly, which will assist enforcement and compliance activities.”
“The address must be either the limited partnership’s principal place of business, the usual residential or office address of a general partner, or the address of an authorised corporate service provider that is acting for the limited partnership. The general partners of limited partnerships can change the registered office address, but they must inform the registrar of the change and confirm that the new registered office address is an appropriate address. This is a critical part of limited partnership reform. Failure to meet the address requirements will be an offence and may result in a substantial fine. The clause mirrors changes made by part 1 of the Bill to powers for the registrar to move registered office addresses, either on application or on the registrar’s own motion, where the address fails the “appropriate address” test.”
“This means where the principal place of business changes, including by moving abroad, the registrar still has a UK registered office address on record for the limited partnership. An important attraction of limited partnerships for legitimate businesses is the flexibility to move their principal place of business abroad. The clause therefore retains that flexibility while also ensuring the registrar has an appropriate address in the United Kingdom for contact and potential enforcement purposes. The clause also sets certain conditions for the address to shore up the limited partnership’s connection to the UK and allow scrutiny of the limited partnership. For example, the address must be able to be used for communication purposes and it must be possible for the delivery of documents there to be recorded by an acknowledgement of delivery.”
“Currently, limited partnerships must provide a proposed principal place of business only on registration. There is a requirement to notify the registrar if the principal place of business changes, but the penalty is just a fine of £1 per day, which does not effectively deter non-compliance. There are many cases where limited partnerships have not informed the registrar that their principal place of business has changed, meaning that she is unable to notify them of any changes or serve documents on them. Clause 103 therefore introduces a requirement for general partners to maintain a registered office address that is in the original jurisdiction of registration in the United Kingdom and keep this up to date.”
“The downside she mentioned is the impact on legitimate businesses, for which the time period may not be sufficient. Clearly, there is a link to the UK in terms of how the entity is established. The limited partnership is established and has to maintain its registered address. I do not think that any of these measures contain a requirement to have an economic link to the UK, but I will discuss that with officials.”
“A few minor points have been made additional to the ones that have been discussed before. The shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Feltham and Heston, asked about the corporate general partner. Clearly, there is still a person behind a corporate general partner—an officer has to register their identity behind the corporate general partner, so there is an actual person behind it. The shadow Minister also referred to the six months. As I said, I think that is a reasonable period, but she might think differently and seek to amend it on that basis. To me, it is not just about the time period, but about the other points—the foundations of the Bill, which are the sanctions, the red flags and the sharing of information. Those are the important things.”
“Absolutely, although I will clarify that with my officials. We discussed this issue before. I will confirm it later today, if I can, but I am sure that that is the case. There is no requirement to have an economic link. The link is with the person, the general partner and the limited partners, and the UK-based address. That is the link to the UK that these measures seek to ensure. Question put and agreed to. Clause 103 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 104 ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 105 A limited partnership’s registered email address Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.”
“That will mean that the confirmation of dissolution process, which we will debate later, is open to the registrar, who may consequently move to deregister the limited partnership.”
“The two clauses mirror the provisions in clauses 30 and 31, which we debated previously. They apply to limited partnerships the registered email requirements introduced for companies. Clause 105 requires limited partnerships to have a registered email address. The email address must be “appropriate”, which means that “in the ordinary course of events, emails sent to it by the registrar would be expected to come to the attention of a person acting on behalf of the limited partnership.” Clause 106 provides for a transition period of six months for existing limited partnerships to provide an appropriate email address to the registrar. If, at the end of six months, a limited partnership has failed to supply an appropriate email address, the registrar will have reasonable cause to believe that the limited partnership is dissolved.”
“Clause 107 Restrictions on general partners Question proposed, That the clause stand part of the Bill.”
“The hon. Lady asked about the definition of an appropriate email address. As I said, it is an appropriate email address if emails sent to it would be “expected to come to the attention of a person acting on behalf” of a limited partnership. I think that is pretty clear—it has to be an address that can receive emails and to which somebody can respond. On the question asked by the right hon. Member for Barking, where the partner is not an individual but a firm or body corporate, information is also required on the individuals involved in the management of those firms. That includes making sure that there is a named contact. Question put and agreed to. Clause 105 accordingly ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 106 ordered to stand part of the Bill.”
“The clause is needed to ensure that disqualified individuals are prevented from being general partners of a new limited partnership set up after the Bill and to ensure that existing general partners of extant firms who become disqualified, or already are when the Bill comes into force, cease to be a general partner. New clause 49 would require the Secretary of State to make regulations under section 87 of the Small Business, Enterprise and Employment Act 2015, which amended the Companies Act 2006 to require all company directors to be natural persons, with the power to make exceptions in regulation. I have every sympathy with the intention of the amendment, which challenges the Government to act on something they have long promised. I am happy to commit to the Committee that such regulations will be made soon.”
“Clause 107 requires a limited partnership to confirm on application for registration that none of its general partners are disqualified under directors disqualification legislation. It also introduces a duty on all general partners of a limited partnership to take any steps necessary to remove a disqualified general partner on pain of criminal sanction for failure to take those steps. General partners are responsible for the management of limited partnerships, including the movement of funds. There is currently nothing in place to remove a general partner from a limited partnership once they become disqualified.”
“Very similar. It is sooner than shortly. The ban on the appointment of corporate directors will not and should not be absolute. That is why the Companies Act provides for a delegated power to create exemptions by regulations. Those regulations will address the limited circumstances under which a company will be permitted to have a corporate director. It is important that those regulations are in force before we ban the appointment of any corporate directors and are aligned with the new reforms proposed in the Bill.”
“It might be an investment fund. It might be an insurance company or a collective around investment funds that derive returns for our pensions for millions of people up and down the country. It may well be that a corporate body is part of that limited partnership. I think that is perfectly reasonable, and I imagine we would expect that to be the case.”