Joanne Bunting
East Belfast · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“Their input was instrumental in shaping the Bill that the Assembly will shortly be invited to pass. <BR /> <BR />For those affected by the mother-and-baby institutions, Magdalene laundries and related pathways and practices, the process has taken too long, but we can be pleased that we got there, for the victims' sakes.”
“It is still cruel, disheartening and difficult to fully comprehend. I hope that the experiences of the many women who were affected by those institutions and practices will serve as a challenge to us all.”
“We thank all who participated in the Victims and Survivors Consultation Forum. We know that that has not always been an easy space, but we hope that, today, they can reflect on all their efforts with pride.”
“<BR /> <BR />To victims and survivors considering whether to engage with the redress service, I send an unequivocal message: the scheme exists because your experiences matter, and you need not face the process alone.”
“<BR /> <BR />Of course, the experience did not end with the institution itself; rather, for the victims and survivors — those women and children — the period has been a thread of pain that has woven its way through their entire lives.”
“It is not an exaggeration to say that today is a momentous day. It is an honour and a privilege for me to move the Final Stage of this important legislation on behalf of the First Minister and the deputy first Minister, junior Minister Reilly and, indeed, the Executive.”
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“I am grateful to the Minister for his answer. The Minister will be aware that numerous people have underlying conditions that will prevent them from taking the vaccine, but they will remain vulnerable until an alternative is found. When does he envisage something being available to protect people who have underlying conditions and who remain vulnerable in these circumstances?”
“I am grateful to the Minister for her answer, and I noted her earlier answer. At this stage, I am asking particularly about food banks and the people who use them. In East Belfast, we have Manna and the Larder, which are both run by churches and are doing sterling work, but, regrettably, they provide a vital service. The Minister will know that, as more people struggle, there are more desperate people in need and fewer people who can give, and the food banks are running short of supplies. Is there anything that her Department can do directly with food banks, or can she advise how food banks can tie in with FareShare?”
“The deputy First Minister mentioned the importance of relationships during this crucial period. In light of that, does she concur that recent tweets from Sinn Féin TDs about a terrorist campaign have been immensely hurtful and damaging to relationships at home?”
“Was her Department's report taken into account by any —?”
“We have heard a lot in the Chamber today about need and the delays in grants getting out. Unquestionably, it is imperative that people get the money that they so desperately need. Will the Minister confirm the ratio of the delays in grants between her Department and the Department of Finance? Will she also outline what support she receives from Executive colleagues when, in their discussions on restrictions and lockdown, she makes the case for the survival of businesses? Was her Department's report —?”
“I am grateful to the Minister for her answer. She will know that the ducts were installed a couple of years ago, I think. She will also know that the place is pitch-black. We now know about the benefits of walking to all of society, particularly for people's mental health in these uncertain times. People using that greenway might be in the middle of it at dusk. Then, all of a sudden, there is pure darkness, and you cannot see your hand in front of your face. At the same time, there are cyclists, joggers and pedestrians. There are rabbits and dogs, and, most importantly, there is dog fouling. People need to be able to see, not just for their safety but for the practical use of the greenway. I appreciate what the Minister said about a public consultation, but can she indicate the time frame for that?”
“I am grateful to the Minister for that answer. In response to a question for written answer, he advised me that, as of June 2020, for which he had the most up-to-date figures, data showed that, in Northern Ireland, 754 of the 830 people who had COVID mentioned on their death certificate were subsequently coded by the Office for National Statistics (ONS) as having died from it. Given the different treatment of the remains of those who are cited as having died as a result of COVID, the lack of dignity and the considerable distress that it causes to their loved ones, what is being done to ensure much greater accuracy on death certificates?”
“I will bundle them together. Thank you, Mr Speaker.”
“Will the Minister confirm whether employees who have had a dual role, as driving examiner and vehicle tester, will now move back to vehicle testing to help with the number of MOTs being conducted?”
“The World Health Organization states that it does not support draconian restrictions or lockdowns, and that they should be used only to buy time to prepare. It also says that poverty will double, as will mental ill health cases, in the next year if this continues. <BR /> <BR />As the First Minister said, the debt is rising, and there are going to be fewer and fewer people in work to repay it. So, what is being done to protect jobs? More specifically, will the First Minister clarify whether the Executive is looking at help for those who have received none to date, and what is meant by "essential health needs"?”
“If no further money is forthcoming from London, how will the Executive Office decide which projects should be prioritised?”
“<BR /> <BR />In conclusion, I hope that all Members will support the motion and make clear our condemnation of the crime of human trafficking and our strong desire to support victims who find themselves in Northern Ireland.”
“The Bill refers to immigration powers that are reserved to Westminster. The Bill would mandate the Home Office to provide immigration leave to victims getting discretionary support under section 18(9) of our Human Trafficking Act. It would also allow at least 12 months' leave to remain for identified victims of trafficking who meet certain criteria. That Bill would make a difference to Northern Ireland's victims. There is no right to such support at the moment. However, providing statutory immigration stability and security for confirmed victims would help to prevent re-trafficking and provide an environment in which victims are willing to assist police investigations into the perpetrators. I hope that, after hearing this debate, the Minister will use her good offices to push for this Bill to be taken up by the Government at Westminster.”
“Many organisations that work with trafficking victims argue that they need longer-term support for their recovery. These individuals have been exploited here, and providing further support may help both to provide a sounder footing for victims of trafficking as they rebuild their lives and to improve evidence collection against the perpetrators of these dreadful crimes. I urge the Minister to commit to exploring with her Department and the relevant civil society organisations whether further support could be provided to confirmed victims who have left the NRM. <BR /> <BR />I want to speak about the Bill in Westminster which is mentioned in the motion. The Modern Slavery (Victim Support) Bill has been sponsored by Lord McColl, who, for over a decade, has been raising the issue of the need to support victims of trafficking.”
“In other cases, however, victims need more long-term assistance due to the trauma that they have been through. <BR /> <BR />A wonderful charity in my constituency called Flourish NI provides support to victims of trafficking who have exited the NRM. As the charity says on its website:”
“While there are positive aspects to our response to human trafficking, the motion raises ways in which we can do even better. I thank the Minister for the recent consultation on extending statutory support for victims of slavery as well as those trafficked. That has been happening in practice, but those victims deserve the full support of the law. However, the Human Trafficking Act mandates the Department to provide support only when victims are going through the NRM process. The Department does have discretion to provide support beyond the point at which a conclusive grounds decision is made. To the Department's credit, that has been utilised on a number of occasions. For some confirmed victims, that system works well, as they may wish to return to their home country, or their circumstances do not require long-term support.”
“<BR /> <BR />As a member of the Policing Board, I am fully aware of how seriously the PSNI takes this crime and of the dedication of officers in identifying potential victims. Moreover, we are blessed to have an active civil society that seeks to respond to the crime here. I also know that the Minister and her Department take the crime seriously. I am grateful to her for meeting me and Lord Morrow earlier this year to discuss the subject. I am glad to see the Minister here for the debate, and I look forward to her response.”
“The Human Trafficking and Exploitation (Criminal Justice and Support for Victims) Act (Northern Ireland) 2015, which was introduced by my friend and party colleague Lord Morrow when he was an MLA, was the first comprehensive piece of legislation to be passed on the issue in the United Kingdom. It was the product of significant cross-party working, for which the Minister of Justice's predecessor, David Ford, deserves credit, as do Members from other parties and Department of Justice officials. The requirement for support for victims of trafficking who have been identified here and the provision of independent guardians for unaccompanied migrant and trafficked children are particularly noteworthy elements that go beyond what is available in England and Wales.”
“Victims of trafficking have been identified right across this jurisdiction, in urban and rural areas, but there may be many more who are trafficked in Northern Ireland, since it is widely recognised and accepted by the Department of Justice, statutory agencies, the PSNI and the civil society sector that that figure in no way marks the full number of victims of trafficking in our society. <BR /> <BR />It is important that I acknowledge that Northern Ireland has a positive record in responding to this horrendous crime. We have a world-leading legislative framework, which was passed by the House before I became a Member.”
“In 2020, the Centre for Social Justice (CSJ) produced a new estimate, suggesting that around 100,000 people across the United Kingdom are potential victims of the crime each year. Again, it is important to stress that that is an estimate, as, in practice, because of the very nature of the crime and the variable quality of available data, it is very challenging to be certain of the numbers of individuals who are trafficked at any one time. <BR /> <BR />Over the past three years in Northern Ireland, 171 potential victims of human trafficking have entered the National Referral Mechanism, which is the formal government process that was set up to identify and support victims of human trafficking in the United Kingdom. Each of those 171 men, women and children has a personal story.”
“Human trafficking involves the recruitment, transportation, transfer and harbouring or receipt of individuals for the purposes of exploitation in the sex trade or for forced labour in, for example, car washes. It can happen within territories or between them. People smuggling is not the same as human trafficking, for the key reason that the former is not for the purposes of exploitation. The International Labour Organization (ILO) estimated that over 40 million individuals were victims of trafficking around the world in 2016. Of course, because of the clandestine nature of the crime, it is impossible to know the exact figure. If that number is in any way accurate, however, it illustrates that it is a major global problem. <BR /> <BR />Members will know that human trafficking happens here in Northern Ireland and right across these islands.”
“I am grateful for the opportunity to open the debate on the subject of human trafficking. This Sunday, 18 October, marks Anti-Slavery Day, which is a day set aside to highlight the tragic reality that men, women and children continue to be trafficked for the purposes of exploitation in our world today. As an aside, that is why are aiming to have the inaugural meeting of our all-party group (APG) on modern slavery next week: to highlight the issue and raise awareness. Some Members have indicated their support and interest in the matter, and I am grateful to them for that. I encourage them to come along so that we can continue to work on the subject together. <BR /> <BR />It is important to be clear what we mean when we talk about human trafficking.”
“Everybody wants safer streets. Now let us get on with delivering on the NDNA. Additional police officers would be a good starting point.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Executive have made commitments to the people of Northern Ireland, and it is up to those Ministers to ensure that they cut their cloth accordingly and fulfil the promises that they made in that agreement with one another and with the people, prioritising the things that affect everyone. <BR /> <BR />Let us be realistic: we all have our pet projects in the NDNA agreement, but the bottom line is that, in circumstances in which money is limited, the things that affect everybody must be taken forward first. It is the things that benefit the whole of society that should and must be prioritised above all else in ministerial budgets. Crime and the fear of crime is one of those things. Everybody signed up to the commitment to additional officers. Feeling safe and being safe is not tribal. It is not a partisan ask.”
“At a time when other obligations are being met in an accelerated fashion, including a medical school at Magee, and I am sure that I have seen a couple of announcements to date about Casement, we need to ensure that the NDNA provisions are implemented in a fair and even-handed way. <BR /> <BR />Look, I know that the issues are complex and that having additional officers is not a panacea, and I am sure that no one would object to an injection of capital from London — we have pressed for that as much as any other party — but, with all that is going on, it is not coming, so we have to aim to do as much as we can on our own. That is why we will not accept the Sinn Féin amendment, which passes the buck and puts the issue on the long finger.”
“Add to that the fact that funding to the PSNI, year on year, has been decreasing in both cash and real terms and the absence, as has been mentioned, of a multi-year budget cycle, which denies the PSNI the opportunity for meaningful longer term strategic planning including on workforce issues. and we wonder why crime outcomes are low. <BR /> <BR />In May, the Minister informed Mervyn Storey by letter that the 7,500 commitment was not a priority for her because other inescapable pressures needed to be met at that time. In fairness to the Minister, if she will bear with me, she indicated that the money that she was allocated just about allowed her to stand still. It is important that she continues to press the issue with the Finance Minister.”
“According to the 2017 HMICFRS inspection, we have an ageing workforce. At the time of that inspection, around 20% of police officers were eligible to retire within three years. That is an enormous body of experience that we are about to lose. <BR /> <BR />The terrorist threat level is at severe. My colleague referred to the demands on policing in Northern Ireland and how they are much different from those that confront most forces in England and Wales. The PSNI faces the ongoing threat from dissident activity. I reiterate that that threat alone accounts for 20% of MI5's budget. <BR /> <BR />Now we have the pandemic, with the PSNI expected to check and enforce increasing numbers of frequently changing regulations and restrictions on top of all its other usual responsibilities.”
“The July report by Her Majesty's Inspectorate of Constabulary and Fire and Rescue Services (HMICFRS) expressed alarm at a likely gap in serious crime investigators in the PSNI. Despite existing recruitment, several specialist departments struggle with workload and capacity, as has been mentioned, namely the rape crime unit and the child abuse and cybercrime teams. We fare badly in comparison with the numbers in other forces. West Yorkshire Police, for example, serve a similar size of population with fewer challenges, yet it has a workforce that numbers more than 400 more officers and staff than the PSNI. As has been mentioned, comparable substantive increases in officer numbers in forces on the back of the PM's July 2019 statement have not been met by equivalent investment in NI.”
“She also said that we had achieved something, which is right: we can look back and say that we have achieved something in how we have learned from each other. <BR /> <BR />I thank Mr Chambers for his service during dark days in Northern Ireland. He made a valid point about reduced numbers but an increased population. <BR /> <BR />Mrs Kelly mentioned resources, and the Minister outlined the progress that she had made, to some extent, with the business case and her support for the PSNI. <BR /> <BR />I will sum up where we are with an overview of the current position, although it is by no means an exhaustive list. Police officer numbers have been reducing consistently year-on-year. On average, the service loses approximately 5% of police officers each year, mostly through retirement or resignation. We have low numbers of detectives.”
“In the course of that speech, he made the point that the budget must be strategic and sustainable. <BR /> <BR />Mr Lynch referred to under-representation and the fact that the turnover in neighbourhood officers — this is a reasonable point — detracts from building the necessary relationships to get proper intelligence and to build on what is going on in those communities. I am glad that the Chief Constable has taken steps to ensure that, in neighbourhood policing, there is a valid and viable career path. <BR /> <BR />Mr Givan, as I said, referred to the business case being given the prioritisation that it deserves. He also expressed his views on the barriers to recruitment. <BR /> <BR />Almost lastly, Ms Bradley discussed the increase in domestic violence.”
“He also raised mental health provision and how, so often, the police — we have discussed this in the House — end up filling the gaps when no one else is there and highlighted the hours that are spent doing that. <BR /> <BR />Mr Buchanan conducted his speech to music”
“The Member's point is noted. <BR /> <BR />Mr Nesbitt referred to the transition of the police from a force to a service that is engaged in community policing. That is an important transition, and the police are still trying to transition to what policing with the community means. It means different things to different people, and they struggle, as do we on the board, with what it means in practice. He also mentioned paramilitaries and organised crime and the constant fight that there is over the coercion and control that still exists in communities in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />Mr Blair made relevant points on the challenges that face the PSNI due to COVID and the fact that 999 and 101 calls are back to normal levels.”
“If it is brief. I have a lot to get through.”
“We will not tolerate this kind of behaviour in our communities any more", and we have to say that being a police officer is a viable career choice.”
“We will slightly disagree on that, because, to our mind, 50:50, as the Minister reiterated, builds in discrimination rather than focusing on merit and could exclude people unnecessarily from the process. I am glad that the Member mentioned how much the police have done to address under-representation. There comes a point where the police can do only so much. <BR /> <BR />A Member opposite — I think that it was Mr Lynch — made reference to under-representation. As Mr Givan said, the issue with that is that there are barriers to recruitment. Some of those barriers are the threat that is represented in the communities. People have to make a sacrifice by leaving their home and their family and are unable to visit those they love. Those things have to be addressed, and we have to take a political stand and say, "Enough.”
“He also highlighted the fact that the Chief Constable had reiterated the potential to lose a third of the workforce in various waves of COVID. <BR /> <BR />Ms Dillon proposed the amendment. I am glad that she agrees with the numbers, but the issue is with how we get there. I disagree with her reference to the victims and survivors' pension. We on this side of the House certainly disagree that it is hierarchical. We think that it is not right that victim-makers are treated in the same way as those who suffered at their hands. <BR /> <BR />Ms Kelly made important points about the business case and said that the Patten numbers mentioned were effective for peacetime. She referred to neighbourhood policing and under-representation.”
“I am grateful to Members and the Minister for their participation in the debate and for the tenor in which it was conducted. I, too, declare my membership of the Northern Ireland Policing Board. The Member opposite has done some of my work for me, but there were important elements in the debate that should be borne out and reiterated. I think that we are all in agreement and united in the Assembly about the numbers, under-representation and the focus on neighbourhood policing. However, within those, we have some disagreements, and I will come to those. <BR /> <BR />My colleague opened the debate on the need for a neighbourhood policy in the fight against paramilitarism. He referred to the policing of Brexit, and it is important to remember that we have the UK's only land border with Europe.”
“As long as the six-month rule is enshrined in law, healthcare professionals will stick to it and dying claimants will continue to miss out.”
“Thank you, Mr Speaker. I fundamentally agree with the Member. <BR /> <BR />The other point is this: aside from the moral arguments, there are other potential benefits to changing the special rules system. First, money will be saved by cutting down on the number of unnecessary face-to-face assessments for dying people, and, secondly, by helping terminally ill people to access the financial support that they need when they need it, we can ensure that more patients are supported to stay at home comfortably, potentially reducing the avoidable use of public services. <BR /> <BR />Legislative reform is required to deliver this much-needed change. Attempting to widen access to special rules through changes to guidance, the DFC/Capita application or assessment processes will not fix the fundamental issue.”
“The issue is one of time, ensuring that terminally ill people get the financial support that they are entitled to quickly and with as little distress and bureaucratic interference as possible.”
“Adopting that approach in Northern Ireland would allow more dying people to access welfare payments quickly. It would support people to have a better quality of life during the time that they have left and to avoid the long delays, intrusive assessments and work requirements that are associated with many benefits. <BR /> <BR />It is important to note that this policy change is not about widening the basic eligibility criteria for welfare payments. The overwhelming majority of dying claimants who are excluded from applying for benefits under the special rules for terminal illness will still be eligible for payments through the normal rules and, in many cases, these payments will be backdated to the beginning of their claim.”
“That would follow the approach in the Social Security (Scotland) Act 2018 wherein:”
“In this context, the financial support provided by the social security system can be a godsend, but long delays to accessing welfare payments are compounding the financial difficulties. Time is a luxury that terminally ill people do not have. We have heard that evidence in GB shows that people are dying while waiting for their benefit payments because of the delays associated with the standard application process. It is bound to be a similar situation here in Northern Ireland, and we should do all that we can to rectify it. <BR /> <BR />Clinicians, Marie Curie in my constituency, with which I work closely, and other charities that assist the terminally ill are calling for a fairer definition of terminal illness that is based on clinical judgement, not a time-restricted estimation of life expectancy.”
“Those who are excluded from the special rules have to apply for welfare support under the normal process, with all the bureaucracy and assessment that that entails, causing significant distress and robbing them of time that they should be spending making memories with their loved ones, getting their affairs in order and doing the things that they want to do before they die. <BR /> <BR />The significant delays associated with standard welfare applications may also mean terminally ill people spending the end of their life facing severe financial pressures. Two thirds of households affected by terminal illness experience financial strain, and, as Ms Armstrong pointed out, the extra costs have been calculated at around £3,300 per patient per year.”
“While cancer counts for less than a third of deaths every year in Northern Ireland, it represents 90% of the local PIP claims awarded under the special rules, and other condition types are significantly under-represented in special rules awards relative to the number of deaths that they account for. <BR /> <BR />It follows then that many people with these conditions are being turned away from the special rules system because of the unpredictable nature of their illnesses.”
“We can all put ourselves and those we love in those shoes and think of the impact. <BR /> <BR />By using a definition of terminal illness that is tied to a life expectancy of six months or less, many legitimate claimants are excluded from applying for welfare support under the special rules for terminal illness. For many terminal illnesses, particularly non-cancer conditions like motor neurone disease, chronic heart failure and COPD, accurate prognoses can be difficult because of the unpredictable trajectories of those conditions. Ms Armstrong and Mr Butler have outlined the difficulties of variance in accuracy of life-expectancy estimates. The current system is only really working for patients with a predictable disease trajectory, such as some types of cancer.”
“I am grateful to Ms Armstrong and Ms Bradley — Ms Bradshaw — for tabling the motion, and I declare that I am the chair of the APG on terminal illness. Ms Bradshaw, that is a common mistake. <BR /> <BR />On 8 July 2020, the High Court in Belfast ruled that the difference in treatment for terminally ill welfare claimants who cannot reasonably meet the six-month life expectancy criterion under the special rules is discriminatory. Mr Justice McAlinden described the difference in treatment as "manifestly without reasonable foundation". All right-thinking people concur, certainly on an emotional and common sense level, even if they have not studied the legal arguments. If the question is about why things have to change, the answers are because of exclusion, time left to live and the best use of that time.”
“I thank the Minister for her answer, but the truth is that a few additional slots are not going to sort out the problem. There is a backlog of around 23,000 cases. People wait for hours to get to the front of the queue only to be told that all the slots are gone. Will the Minister tell us why the system went online prior to the published date? Why were some people able to get test dates through their instructor in advance of the system opening? It all seems a bit 'Animal Farm'.”
“The Minister knows that time is of the essence with stroke care. On that basis, will he confirm that stroke services in the Ulster Hospital are being protected for people in the east of the Province, including east Belfast, north Down, Ards and Comber? The extra distance to the other side of Belfast could prove detrimental to their prognosis.”
“I am referring, of course, to circumstances in which the immediate family are normally called in. The Minister will know just how important it is that individual family members get the opportunity to say their final farewells. In some places, that has been reduced to one person, and, in others, it has been reduced to none at all. Given that it is the ward manager who decides, the position is not consistent in individual hospitals, never mind across trusts. Will the Minister urgently move to rectify that most cruel practice, because it is leaving families further scarred? No one should die alone.”