Roy Beggs
East Antrim · Ulster Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“I declare an interest as owner of 25 acres of agricultural land; also, my parents run a small agricultural business. <BR /> <BR />There is a shortage of fertiliser, and the Minister has referred to the present difficulties in Ukraine that are contributing to that. That shortage exists even at the exorbitant cost of £1,000 per ton.”
“of public bodies in Northern Ireland. That is vital in order to reassure the public that money is being spent appropriately. That is to be done independently.”
“There has been a very close working relationship and a close partnership. Where issues needed highlighted and where the Assembly, through its scrutiny mechanisms, needed to dig deeper to get better value and better accountability, that occurred.”
“<BR /> <BR />I also want to reflect on the close working relationship that there has been between the Comptroller and Auditor General and the Northern Ireland Audit Office, which the C&AG oversees and manages, and the Assembly, particularly the Public Accounts Committee.”
“As we consider this motion to nominate a new Comptroller and Auditor General for Northern Ireland, it is important that we reflect on the importance that the role has in any democracy. The C&AG in Northern Ireland is the head of the Northern Ireland Audit Office.”
“P&O has brutally cast its workforce aside in a Dickensian fashion. There was no consultation or notice, and the company delivered a live message by video link. Will the Minister clarify whether the P&O redundancy announcement is covered by maritime law, Northern Ireland employment law or GB employment law?”
The complete record
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“All of the amendments in my name, with the exception of amendment No 44, and the opposition to clauses 1 to 6 stand part, were originally drafted by Department of the Environment officials with assistance from a drafting expert who had worked on the Westminster Scrap Metal Dealers Bill. Several sections of the debate can stand alone, enabling regulations to be consulted on and, eventually, brought back for consideration by the Assembly. They are enabling amendments. <BR /> <BR />The Committee called for evidence from the Department on 19 October, and the Committee Stage commenced on 16 November. Following a constructive meeting on 27 January 2016 between key departmental officials who were covering the area and myself, a draft way forward was agreed that resulted in the many amendments that have been tabled in my name.”
“I rise to indicate my opposition, first, to clauses 1 to 6 standing part of the Bill. This is unusual; I accept that. However, I will give some background. One of the difficulties in progressing the Bill was its very cross-cutting nature, with some aspects involving the Department of the Environment and others the Department of Justice. Both Departments saw merit in improving legislation, but each thought that the other should take the lead. Thus, it was difficult to engage at an early point. <BR /> <BR />To understand the majority of the amendments to my Bill, it is important to understand how the amendments emerged and, indeed, the consideration that was given to them from the outset by the experts in the Department of the Environment and the Northern Ireland Environment Agency.”
“I understand, as a result of conversations, that that is feasible and that the Act could come into being as of 1 September 2016. Having a firm date is much better than not defining a date. I indicate my support for that. <BR /> <BR />Like others, I view many of the amendments as minor or technical, and I support them. During the Committee Stage, Ulster Rugby agreed to set up a committee to improve communication with residents. I hope that other outdoor stadiums will follow that initiative to enable them to be aware of and address any issues that might arise with the communities in which they are located.”
“I, too, pass on my congratulations to Carl Frampton. There is a relevance with this legislation in that, at some point, an outdoor stadium may be required for a world title fight. It is important that we update our legislation. <BR /> <BR />I would like to indicate my continuing general support for the Bill. I am pleased with amendment No 2, which would change the definition of "outdoor stadium", as it removes a degree of ambiguity and enables the Department to produce regulations on the issue. It is an important way to deal with the issue because who knows what may come in the future? By doing it in this fashion, we will future-proof the regulations and allow them to be adjusted if there is a need. <BR /> <BR />In amendment No 11 the Member has sought to bring forward the commencement date.”
“Again, I will highlight the fact that we are following the provisions that have been utilised in Scotland. As the Minister said, no issues have arisen to date; therefore, accepting the proposals seems to be a reasonable way forward. I would like to indicate my support.”
“I certainly see this in the context of whether the state should be able to take that decision automatically. Like our local Churches, I would prefer that, as is the case in Scotland, where there is an appropriate body in a religious organisation and that has been accepted, the decision should be left with it.”
“First, I declare an interest as a committee member of Raloo Presbyterian Church. One of the aspects of our discussions here today is the role of Church and state in regulating internal affairs. My understanding of what is proposed is that it is an argument not about whether someone who is in an inappropriate position should or should not be removed but, essentially, about who should, ultimately, take that decision. When I look at the submission of the Church leaders' group, I see that they have indicated that they would prefer that it be the Church that would take the necessary steps if it identified a problem. Of course, if that does not occur, there is the ability for the Charity Commission to step in and carry out a detailed investigation and ensure that, ultimately, appropriate action is taken.”
“Therefore, I ask the Minister to ensure that this issue is kept under consideration. <BR /> <BR />The Bill also enables the registration as a statutory charge of certain loans. This is a new mechanism to enable public support to be advanced to allow those in need to bring about improvements. The statutory charge would be made against the property. I suspect that it is very early days, and lessons may well need to be learnt. Nevertheless, it is an important option to have available. <BR /> <BR />In conclusion, we wish to indicate our continuing support for the Housing (Amendment) Bill and thank all who have been involved in getting it to where it is.”
“<BR /> <BR />I would like to highlight, once again, the Committee's recommendations on information sharing in its report. There is a need to continue to look at how the Department and central government can engage with local government, and there is a recommendation that such consideration be taken forward in the new Department to help address the issue of vacant property, but also with particular reference to where fraud may be occurring. If there were protocols to take forward the issue of information sharing with utility companies, that would be an important area of work going forward. If someone has a social house inappropriately, someone else is homeless because they are misusing the system. We all need to try to ensure that what resources we have are used appropriately and go to those in genuine need.”
“Both I and my colleagues in the Ulster Unionist Party wish to indicate our continuing support for the Bill in its final form. <BR /> <BR />The sharing of information is important, and not only between the Departments of Finance and Personnel and Social Development and the Northern Ireland Housing Executive, which has been authorised with regard to empty properties, but also with regard to antisocial behaviour, which, it has been authorised, can also be shared with registered housing associations. There was a discussion in Committee about wider sharing, but as with everything, there needs to be a balance, and concerns were raised about how to ensure that that information did not get into inappropriate hands. On balance, then, we have got it right on antisocial behaviour information.”
“It is a good balance. The information will be available to those who need it, and a degree of privacy will be afforded to landlords. <BR /> <BR />With regard to the new clause proposed in amendment No 33, I support sharing information between councils. It is a simple thing, but relevant information may be held by one council that would be useful to another. This seems to be starting, in a small way, to do joined-up government. I welcome the amendment and support the other technical and consequential amendments in the group.”
“As others have said with regard to amendment Nos 27 to 29, it is difficult to get the balance right in providing information about a house in multiple occupation, such as who manages it and who owns it etc. The original wording was that it would simply be publicly available, but, as indicated by others, representations made to us indicated that there was genuine concern from some about their security. As a result, I am in agreement with the amendments, which will ensure that all residents have straight access to it without any difficulty and others who can show that they are sufficiently concerned with the information in the entry will have access too.”
“I am content with the technical and drafting amendments in this group.”
“On behalf of the Ulster Unionist Party, I want to put on record my support for the general technical and drafting amendments and briefly comment on amendment No 37. Whilst it is a very minor change of the word "the" to "any", it can be quite significant. The change will enable a council to apply to a lay magistrate to issue a warrant. A significant amount of information will have to be provided to convince a magistrate that it warrants such an investigation, but we have to recall that the difficulty or the evidence may not just be in one premises, and widening that to any living accommodation will allow evidence to be collected that may be beneficial to tenants. Therefore, I support that amendment, which would widen court access. Again, it is with a suitable warrant should evidence be available to justify it.”
“<BR /> <BR />As others have said, we have reached a high level of consensus and a balanced viewpoint. That should bring about improvement in the standards of houses in multiple occupation. Also, it should bring about benefits for neighbours, because responsibility will fall to be managed within the property, very clearly, with regulations there. As others have rightly said, landlords cannot be expected to manage behaviour outside of the property that they own, and it is a reasonable balance that that was not included. <BR /> <BR />All in all, this is a good piece of legislation, and I hope and expect that it will improve the lot of tenants, bring about a greater degree of clarity and bring about improvement in the lives of tenants and their neighbours.”
“In the past, the tenant might have assumed that the letting agent was also responsible for reporting ongoing maintenance issues to the landlord. This gives clarification that there is such a thing as a letting agent who simply lets the property, with all the maintenance and ongoing responsibility for managing that house still lying with the landlord or his managing agent, who may be a different person. That information will be available to the tenant so that there is clarity and no confusion. That will allow those who have engaged in the letting of properties to continue, but there will be clarity for tenants so that, if they have issues with their property, they must go either to the landlord or to those who have been appointed as his letting agent.”
“Were that not the case, we might have found that some buildings had to be emptied before they were sold, or there might have been very limited interest in purchasing such buildings, given that there was a great deal of insecurity about what might follow the sale. Again, the new owner will have to pass a fit-and-proper-person test like everyone else. <BR /> <BR />Amendment No 43 in particular is worthwhile. There is often confusion as to who is responsible for managing an agent, and the Bill helps to clarify that. Amendment No 43 followed a representation being made by some of the letting agents who highlighted the fact — and this is something I was not fully aware of — that frequently a letting agent may just be responsible for the letting.”
“We have to remember that if it is not able to be transferred smoothly, there will not be permission for the house to remain as a house of multiple occupation. Potentially, some of the tenants would then lose their homes. It is important that, where change does occur for whatever reason — for example, as a result of financial changes with the landlord, or the landlord becoming deceased — there is a smooth mechanism of transferring ownership so that, ultimately, the tenants do not suffer. <BR /> <BR />Representation was also made to us that, should someone decide to sell the property, it was important that there was a degree of security and that the licence would transfer with that ownership. It is right that we have built that provision in through the amendments.”
“Again, that could have been an area that would have been overlooked. Risks would have existed to seasonal workers from poor, or even unsafe, accommodation. It is right that we include them in order that they have that degree of protection. <BR /> <BR />I note the Minister's comment about the Attorney General, and that he intends to leave one of the amendments to a latter stage because of some concerns. Hopefully, that issue can be resolved. <BR /> <BR />There are several amendments on the transfer of the licence — I am looking at amendment Nos 17 and 20 — which is an important aspect. I certainly view the changes that have been made regarding the transfer of the licence as being beneficial to everyone. It is not in the interests of the tenant or the landlord if a licence cannot be transferred.”
“There has been a useful engagement between the Committee and the current and preceding Ministers. That has been beneficial in trying to improve our legislation. <BR /> <BR />Bearing in mind that the legislation is designed to improve the lot of tenants and to recognise the additional risk that occurs with those living in houses of multiple occupation, it is important that there is licensing, which is the main aspect of the group 1 amendments. I agree with others that it is good that there is a fit-and-proper-person measurement to ensure that we have responsible landlords looking after their tenants. I will not comment on every amendment and clause but will just try to pick out some of the key changes. <BR /> <BR />I notice that amendment No 2 includes:”
“I, too, put on record my appreciation of the work of our Committee in helping to coordinate our scrutiny; the departmental officials, who were frequently there to answer many questions; and the range of people who came to give oral evidence and those who provided written evidence. There was a good balance to enable us to take account of all points of view. <BR /> <BR />Having considered the Bill in detail during the Committee's scrutiny and having received wide-ranging evidence, I continue to support it, its general thrust and the amendments that have been tabled by the Minister. They are largely a result of discussions with the Committee. Many of them are technical amendments that are consequential to some of the changes that have been agreed.”
“The road maintenance budget allocated by the Executive has been inadequate and has relied on in-year monitoring for many years, but the Quarry Products Association and, indeed, the Northern Ireland Audit Office have highlighted how important it is to carry out timely repairs and resurfacing or we will end up patching the patches and wasting money endlessly. Has the Minister recognised the strategic importance of road maintenance? What assessment has been made so that we get the balance right between new build and road maintenance? Can we afford to maintain our existing roads? It appears not. What does the Minister say?”
“As well as reporting the decisions of courts, I think it is important that the public is aware of the cases themselves. With the centralisation of courts, there will of course be no courtroom within the Mid and East Antrim Borough Council area. That will make it more difficult for local journalists to report on cases. Does the Minister accept that, whilst the reports may be online, it will be more difficult for local journalists and people to access that information if it is not near to them? Has consideration been given to putting courts online, so that the public can follow what is said in a courtroom, just like the Assembly Committees or local councils?”
“It was of course as a result of the actions of the Ulster Unionist Party that paramilitarism made its way to the highest point of the agenda. Following the paramilitary murders last autumn — and just last week in Dublin, there were murders involving paramilitaries from this part of the world — does the First Minister agree that the community wants more concerted and concrete action to show how paramilitarism is being undermined and removed from our society?”
“One issue that I have heard referred to has been discontinuity of supply. Are the Minister and her Department talking with the farming industry and food processors so that there is a better supply chain to enable them to reach UK mainland prices, which have generally been the highest of this region, and that we do not just look South but where there is the highest return for local farmers?”
“The Minister was unapologetic about increased administrative costs. With a reducing budget and the efficiency savings that we are hearing about, one would expect the administrative burden to go down. Does she accept that farmers expect to get a higher percentage of the funding, rather than it being absorbed by administrative burdens?”
“The Minister will be aware that childcare provides an essential service to enable many to move from welfare into employment. In many areas, there may be under-provision of childcare facilities. Does the Minister acknowledge that the staff involved, and the parents currently being supported, will get little comfort from the thought that there is a strategy to be implemented in 2017? What is going to happen before then?”
“The registration as statutory charge of certain loans is new to Northern Ireland and may enable further innovative forms of support that might not otherwise be available. I am supportive of the rest of the Bill and the clauses.”
“I seek an assurance from the Minister that if he moves amendment Nos 2 and 3, resulting in the removal of this area of information that can be transmitted, he is satisfied that adequate powers will remain to ensure that those who damage public property will be identified, and that that warning signal will be transmitted to the new landlord so that more regular inspections can, perhaps, occur to allow a new tenant to get off to a positive start in their new property, not be carrying any legacy from the past and making sure that previous difficulties will not be repeated. <BR /> <BR />Other than that, I am generally satisfied with the Bill; it has brought about improvements elsewhere.”
“I turn now to amendment Nos 2 and 3, which refer to clause 2(8). Again, if those amendments go through, it will remove the ground 1 and ground 3 aspect of transferring relevant information. That is another area on which the Housing Rights Service expressed concern. If you wanted to put it under a heading of "antisocial behaviour", I can see how it may not be seen as antisocial behaviour that is affecting others, but it is certainly antisocial behaviour affecting a publicly owned property.”
“I think that if a tenant is moving to a different landlord, it would be appropriate, where there has been a difficulty, to pass that information on with a constructive mode in mind so that the new social landlord will know that they will need to take particular care of the tenant to ensure that no further acts of waste might occur in the new social housing property. I seek an explanation from the Minister as to why he thinks that it should be removed. He and his officials have not made much of a defence of that area when questions have been posed. It would be helpful if we could have that.”
“Having reflected further on this area and on clause 2(4), I ask the Minister what is wrong with sharing key information if someone has carried out an act of waste or has damaged public property, whether it is a Housing Executive property or a housing association property.”
“In principle, it should be widely shared so that private landlords are aware of what they might be taking on. However, it was pointed out to us that there were issues regarding data protection and data security, because information falling into the wrong hands could endanger individuals. That being the case, I am content with the general wording of clause 2. <BR /> <BR />Amendment No 1 would take out clause 2(4). The Housing Rights Service expressed concerns and asked whether it was necessary or went beyond what was necessary to address antisocial behaviour. We are dealing with a Bill that is trying to address empty homes and antisocial behaviour. The Committee relayed the concerns of the Housing Rights Service to the Minister, who has, ultimately, tabled the amendment.”
“The Bill will, when it comes into effect, bring about some practical benefits. <BR /> <BR />Clause 2 deals with the disclosure of information relating to antisocial behaviour, particularly the sharing of information between the Housing Executive and social landlords. I would have thought that sharing that information should enable social landlords to be better aware of difficulties that have caused annoyance and a nuisance to neighbours, such as where a tenant had previously been involved in a dwelling that was being used for illegal purposes or had allowed or incited others to engage in antisocial activity. I welcome and support that aspect of clause 2. <BR /> <BR />As others have indicated, there was some discussion of how widely the information should be shared.”
“I and my Ulster Unionist colleagues also continue to support the Bill, recognising the benefits that it can bring in addressing community issues that arise as a result of empty homes and antisocial behaviour. Sharing information on vacant properties between the Department of Finance and Personnel, the Department for Social Development and the Housing Executive will, I hope, mean that antisocial behaviour can be headed off at an earlier stage and that concerns can, therefore, be addressed, minimising disruption to neighbours. <BR /> <BR />The sharing of specific information on antisocial behaviour will help to better manage such situations and hopefully address issues earlier. There was a situation in the Monkstown estate a few months ago that could have been addressed earlier if the information had been shared.”
“If additional work is required, improving the sea defences along the coast road could involve a range of agencies: the Department of the Environment in planning; the Northern Ireland Environment Agency (NIEA) in the environment; the Rivers Agency at river mouths; and the Department itself has responsibility for roads. Whether it involves protecting the public road or private property that is being endangered, how can all those groups be coordinated to allow speedy decisions to be made and speedy results to emerge so that the necessary work, by Roads Service or to a private property that needs additional defences, can occur?”
“Over the past three years for which figures are available, the number waiting for more than 18 weeks at Whiteabbey jumped from 151 to 2,159; the number at Antrim jumped from 372 to 3,741. Transforming Your Care was to empower GPs so that they could carry out more specialist work in their locality. Will the Minister advise how he has prioritised capital expenditure and encouraged GP specialism so that more treatment can occur locally to relieve the huge and unacceptable pressure and avoid the situation of patients not being treated within an appropriate time at hospitals?”
“We need to attract new foreign direct investment and encourage new investment from existing companies so that additional corporation tax is raised rather than costs being incurred in the block grant at the start date. Is the Minister satisfied that there is sufficient urgency, from his Department and other Departments, in promoting the advantages so that this additional corporation tax will be raised to benefit the community?”
“Does the Minister agree with me that, in order for justice to be administered and delivered, it is important that there is a police presence in a large town such as Carrickfergus, with a population of over 40,000 people, so that it does not suffer from having to be policed from neighbouring districts such as Larne or Ballymena, and that, particularly when others are trying to enforce a form of policing, it is important that the PSNI has a presence in Carrickfergus?”
“I too congratulate the Minister on his appointment. I am sure, however, that he did not relish his first task of reporting on a meeting that occurred two and a half months ago that he did not attend. That is not the best of starts, but I wish him well. <BR /> <BR />The report, 'Innovative Policy Interventions to Fund Housing Initiatives', covers an important area, with housing stress being a continuing problem for constituents. What practical examples that have been developed in Northern Ireland to assist in addressing housing stress were we able to promote? What practical methods, as opposed to innovative potential methods, have been delivered elsewhere that are being examined for introduction to Northern Ireland to improve the housing situation?”
“Does the Member agree that any proposal to reduce the number of full-time fire officers will increase response times and lead to more problems, injuries and deaths?”
“The small pockets of deprivation (SPOD) funding was created to avoid discrepancy and prevent inequalities under neighbourhood renewal guidance because of the minimum threshold. Will the Minister assure me that the small pockets of deprivation funding will continue to support the communities that would have qualified under neighbourhood renewal but for the threshold?”
“I, too, support the regulations. As the Minister said, it is quite a complex area. The regulations seek to protect members of certain occupational pension schemes by imposing obligations on trusts and managers in relation to the charges imposed on certain members of those schemes and how they are governed. The Minister also made reference to the Pensions Regulator, and I think it is important that we continue to benefit from the United Kingdom pensions regulation regime and maintain parity for the benefit of our citizens. I am content with the regulations.”
“The public could not understand why so many high-powered and highly paid individuals were employed in the Department and the Health and Social Care Board, so I welcome the review that is happening. Does the Minister have a target for savings that will come out of the review, as well as other organisational advantages, and does he accept that the board employs far too many people and that it grew far too large over the past number of years?”
“Let us be clear: the Ulster Unionists fully support the reduction in the number of Departments from 12 to nine, but we do not support the rushed job that is being driven through by the Sinn Féin and DUP coalition, which appears to be afraid of scrutiny and seems to be obsessed with retaining its control and its fingerprints. It is about not what is best for the community but whatever Sinn Féin and the DUP decide.”
“They have not delivered much, apart from stumbling from one false start to another. <BR /> <BR />It is more important than ever that the next steps that the House takes are the right steps, with a clear direction and sense of purpose. They should be about delivery for the people in Larne, in Carrickfergus, in Newtownabbey and, indeed, right across the Province, not just about what suits some parties here in the Stormont bubble. Why can the House and, indeed, the community not be presented with all the facts on all the proposals, instead of a Bill being railroaded through under accelerated passage? If the Assembly is going to legislate, let us make sure that it does it right. The Bill should get the attention that it deserves.”
“The changes that are being proposed to reduce the number of Departments from 12 to nine can allow that to happen, and I hope that they will. There is an indication that that is the direction of travel, but why are we taking so long? Why are we not publishing the changes in a draft format, thus allowing the public to have an input? Someone might spot another area for improvement that the experts have overlooked and make a suggestion to the Committee that will be scrutinising it. Again, that would have widespread support. And guess what? It would deliver for the people of Northern Ireland. After all, as the First Minister once said, this Assembly term was to be about delivery, not about survival. We all know what has happened. Where has the delivery been? The current Executive have let the people down. They have failed them.”
“Several years ago, recognising that difficulty, Danny Kennedy, the former Minister for Regional Development — bravely to my mind — suggested that he would be willing to take all this on in one single Department so that there could be single responsibility, better coordination and better delivery for the public. What happened? It was not agreed. Why do we have to wait until there is some big deal and a stitch-up? Why can we not be mature as an Assembly and, when we see areas for improvement, move forward, improving things as we go along? We are meant to be serving the people of Northern Ireland. We are meant to be legislating for improvements and meeting their needs, not the needs of the political bubble that may exist here at Stormont.”
“We have learned that there is potential for road grilles to be blocked, and they have to be maintained to avoid flooding. The Rivers Agency, under the Department of Agriculture and Rural Development, has responsibility for the flow of rivers and ensuring, for example, that ditches do not become clogged and result in flooding. It is also responsible for producing flood maps and determining new development. <BR /> <BR />The flood helpline service was located in the Department of Finance and Personnel — someone may put me right if I have got that wrong. When there is flooding, the public can contact the Department of Finance and Personnel or go straight to Rivers Agency, to Northern Ireland Water or Transport NI. Frequently, they do not know whom to contact — they just want help — and, in other instances, councils frequently assist.”
“I thank the Member for his contribution. If it was a real partnership Executive, with everyone valued and treated with respect, the Member's assertion would have some merit, but that is not my understanding of how his party and the DUP run the Executive. They made their side deals and treated everyone else like fodder. We have to move on to improve things for everyone in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />I want to pick up on the earlier intervention on the issue of flooding. The Department for Regional Development is responsible for Northern Ireland Water and, when storm water enters our sewerage systems, it has a role, under the responsibilities that it has, to react during floods. Similarly, Roads Service, which is now Transport NI, has a responsibility for culverts and grilles etc.”