Steve Aiken
South Antrim · Ulster Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“I thank the Minister for his statement. Minister, as well as the move to reduce the cost to the Assembly of vacant non-domestic properties and to increase liability so that we will not have so many vacant properties, you will be aware of the Dilapidation Bill and of the conversations that have been taking place in Wales and Scotland about…”
“Instead, that most dysfunctional Department, under the most inept Sinn Féin Minister in the Northern Ireland Assembly and a series of grossly over-superannuated permanent secretaries, gave the money back.”
“We know that her Department spends more on legal cases, fighting judicial reviews and being chastised by judges for legal ineptitude and on vesting land and ripping out hedges and fencing and then trying to unvest it and paying even more money to put back the fences and hedges that it took out.”
“We can hardly blame the current permanent secretary, as she has just taken up her post, but, surely, her predecessors must bear some accountability or responsibility, especially considering the senior civil servants' salary scale of between £146,000 and £163,000, with, of course, their taxpayer-funded pension contribution of 34·2% — £218,…”
“It must be said that £181·3 million is a lot of taxpayers' hard-earned money. It is money that is raised from local commuters, vehicle owners, farmers, local businesses, logistics companies and, above all, our constituents — those vital people whom we are elected to represent.”
“The Minister will be aware that, under the public appointments guide published by the Executive Office, it is clear that she is supposed to take independent advice before appointing board members. What independent advice did she receive, particularly about the board members selected?”
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“The failure to address the issue head-on has shown that, whether on the streets of Belfast or in our very cemeteries and crematoriums, there are different sets of rules, rules in which you believe that even the rules of mathematics do not apply and when the numbers of 10 or 30 are magically transposed to hundreds and 61. However, somehow in the Orwellian Adams world, your interpretation of the rules means that, somehow, you are more equal than the others”
“Demonstrably, you did not do that. Instead you have come to the House, in a degree of arrogance unmatched except by special advisers needing eye tests, in the twisting of truth, a truth that is self-evident to everyone bar the Ministers.”
“It is you who made the rules, sold those rules and now have indisputably broken those rules. In any other democracy, both of you would have done the decent thing and resigned, but this is Northern Ireland: we do not have a normal democracy. We do, however, have a Pledge of Office. In affirming the Pledge of Office, you both stated that you will:”
“Members of the Assembly, I rise in regret to bring the motion to the Assembly and to the people of Northern Ireland. As I said directly to the deputy First Minister, this is not a matter of orange and green. This is a matter that goes to the core of how we deal with this crisis. It is a regret that, despite the biggest health challenge that our citizens have faced in decades, two Ministers who purport to show leadership in the Executive have flagrantly chosen to flout the rules and guidelines that they themselves set and imposed. <BR /> <BR />Until last Tuesday, our Executive's decisions had the hard-won acceptance and support of the people of Northern Ireland. Thanks to the abject failure of the deputy First Minister, the Finance Minister and some MLAs to abide by the very rules that we set, that support is now gone.”
“The deputy First Minister reads fairly widely and has taken a lot of advice and guidance, particularly on COVID. She has looked quite closely at the World Health Organization, which recently revised its guidance on gatherings and crowds. Would she care to reflect on that and give us some answers on what she did last week?”
“<BR /> <BR />The Committee for Finance welcomes the statutory rule to reinstate the previously applied rates exemption for ATMs in rural areas. The Committee considered the SL1 at its meeting on 10 June 2020 and was content with the policy proposal. The Committee formally considered the statutory rule at its meeting on 1 July 2020 and agreed, subject to the SR's report, that the rule be affirmed by the Assembly.”
“I apologise to the Deputy Speaker, the Minister and to the rest of the MLAs in the House for not being present. I also pass on my apologies to my Deputy Chairperson and other members of the Committee. Our business seems to be moving ahead smoothly, so I apologise. <BR /> <BR />I rise as the Chairperson of the Committee for Finance. At present, businesses, not least those that are operating in rural areas, need all the support that they can get to help them survive. Rural businesses have many barriers to overcome at the best of times. Therefore, we should consider all options to support them and help them to survive and continue to serve the customers on whom they rely, and who also rely on those businesses.”
“I thank the deputy First Minister for her comments so far. She mentioned the word leadership quite a few times. One of the most important things about leadership is the ability to make difficult decisions, and to abide by the rules and guidelines that are then set. <BR /> <BR />I would like to ask the deputy First Minister, and, indeed, many people from Sinn Féin, that if there is a regrettable increase in COVID cases from the areas of west Belfast or any areas linked to those who attended the funeral, will the deputy First Minister then consider her position and look to what is really important, which is restoring trust in government here in Northern Ireland?”
“I thank the Member very much for giving way. Does he agree that one thing that might ease that burden would be to bring in proper broadband across Northern Ireland? Maybe some of the excess profits that BT has been making from the Land and Property Services contract could be used to provide all pupils across Northern Ireland with excellent broadband facilities.”
“I will then ask one particular question of the Minister of Finance. It is the question that we have all been waiting for. We are now close to three and half months on and we still have not heard of a fiscal council being set up, of the appropriateness of looking at proper management or of what we will do to ensure that all Committees are given appropriate financial information on time. <BR /> <BR />That question, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker, probably deserves the extra minute to speak. Thank you.”
“I know. There is, indeed, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker. You normally give the Chair of the Finance Committee a degree of latitude to respond.”
“That, coupled with the existing COVID recovery and support mechanisms is —.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Minister mentioned the top-line figures of £140 million in resource DEL, £66 million in capital DEL and £200 million in financial transactions capital, which I will refer to later.”
“I think that Caoimhe looks much better than I do, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker, but, as Chair of the Finance Committee, thank you very much indeed. <BR /> <BR />The Finance Committee will take detailed evidence on the June monitoring round over the forthcoming weeks. Therefore, I will make these comments as the Ulster Unionist Party's finance spokesperson. <BR /> <BR />I thank the Finance Minister for meeting me earlier today and, at last, getting the much-delayed June monitoring round through to us. I wish to highlight some of the issues that have become apparent and are worthy of the Assembly's consideration. We welcome that, with the addition of £1·3 billion from our national Exchequer, we have managed to achieve an underspend of £25 million resource DEL and £103 million in respect of capital DEL — a total of £128 million.”
“At 10.45 am, I, as Chair of the Finance Committee, and other members of the Committee were given information about the Minister's statement. However, the news media, at 6.00 am, were reporting items of the statement verbatim. There seems now to be a habit among members of the Executive of leaking information to the press before the Assembly has had it. I would like you to ask the Speaker to make a ruling to inform Ministers of the correct procedures in following Standing Orders.”
“The first point of order is, welcome back. Thank you for coming back, as well. <BR /> <BR />Standing Order 18A(3), states:”
“On a point of order, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker.”
“You will be aware, Minister, that I, as Chairman of the Finance Committee, have been asked to talk with other regional Finance Committees about getting to a point at which we are looking to deal with some specific issues as part of the future financial settlement. One such issue is the importance of a reduction in VAT. To get some support for businesses, I ask the Minister whether he will join us and say directly to the Chancellor that we wish to see VAT reduced to 15%, or lower if we can.”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. I declare an interest as a member of a board of governors who spent three hours on a Zoom meeting last night trying to look at some of those issues. <BR /> <BR />The drip-feed of information on social media, which seems to have been put out merely to test the water, has been demoralising for many teachers and boards of governors and has created confusion. Will the Minister commit to the schools and parents of Northern Ireland that his Department will only give out guidance that is complete, coherent and gives some certainty and planning?”
“I thank the Minister for his response so far and for his swift response in setting up the independent investigation into the RQIA. However, can the Minister ensure that the terms of reference cover why the recent board of the RQIA did not action the many recommendations from previous investigatory reports and, particularly, those from the Care Inspectorate and the Commissioner for Older People?”
“Yes. My point of order is that, much as enjoy hearing the junior Minister — Declan is a fellow MLA from my constituency — the degree of disrespect that he showed to you after you made your ruling is something that I would like the junior Minister to address. It is not just an issue of turning round and whatever it happens to be; for some of us of a certain age it is quite difficult to hear the junior Minister speak sometimes. I think that, on this occasion, the junior Minister might like to apologise to the Deputy Speaker. Thank you.”
“I thank the junior Minister for his statement. It is interesting to see that, in this New Decade, New Approach era of openness and transparency, appointments have been made to significant boards in the North/South process. Will the Minister outline the recruitment process, the remuneration package and the approach that was taken to make sure that they had the best people for the job, and will he explain, bearing in mind that the discussions on New Decade, New Approach agreed that a D'Hondt process should be brought into appointments to boards, how it is that that seems to have been completely ignored?”
“how he can be, in his own words, so positive that:”
“Can the Minister explain, in the absence of any detail on costs, an explanation of the declarations or any other information on article 5(2) of the protocol, which is, as he is well aware, about deciding and establishing the criteria under which goods moving into Northern Ireland from GB or from outside the EU would be considered:”
“I thank the Minister for her comments so far. Minister, you will, of course, be aware that one of the key strategic partners for Magee is Ulster University. It has been involved in some very significant cost overruns on another one of its campuses. Indeed, I think that there are investigations ongoing into whether it is capable of managing projects. Therefore, what confidence does the Minister have in Ulster University being a suitable partner for delivering this vital project for Londonderry?”
“<BR /> <BR />Rather than debating and raising expectations on a highly improbable outcome, we should wait until we see the shape of the outcome of the talks and, then, dependent on those talks, decide what our approach should be. Today was, unfortunately, a wasted opportunity. We will not support the motion or amendment.”
“<BR /> <BR />Rather than debating those issues today, we are talking about a motion that, if passed, means all parties in the Executive will have decided to look at this again when some actual detail is known. We should instead be asking our Executive and, in particular, the Executive Office and Agriculture, Finance and Economy Departments to tell us in detail what the likely mitigation factors are, what we will need and how we will pay for them; the cost of bespoke customs and declaration systems; the compensation and regulation costs for consumers; recruitment and training costs; and all the excess regulations that we have. In short, we need a comprehensive plan, delivered by all the Executive parties, on preparing for the oncoming end of the transition period.”
“Thank you very much indeed. <BR /> <BR />So much for taking back control. The costs of all of these will be significant. The reality of attacks on goods coming into Northern Ireland from the rest of our own country — a Tesco-Asda tax, if you will — whereby like-for-like goods will be more expensive here will be a permanent reminder to some parties of the folly of supporting both Brexit and Boris Johnson's totally worthless reassurances. That no paperwork can be translated into electronic declarations definitely belies some recent assertions that the end of the transition period will result in a cost- and regulation-free option. I do not think that that is ever going to happen.”
“Yes indeed, and thank you very much indeed for —.”
“It will bring a very real threat of a Northern Ireland business that is trading exclusively within our UK market having goods described by an EU official as "at risk" and being hauled in front of the European Court of Justice without any recourse to appeal to our United Kingdom Supreme Court. <BR /> <BR />This also raises the issue of when we will debate these issues. When will we be briefed on differential VAT requirements, the implications of state aid rules or the impact of the so-called level playing-field, when any EU country will be able to challenge our Northern Ireland Executive's decision on, for instance, reduced VAT on tourism or air passenger duty without any recourse outside an unelected and unaccountable joint committee?”
“<BR /> <BR />Indeed, with the lack of detail on the derogation of what is deemed an at-risk good, the overriding and primary jurisdiction of the Court of Justice of the European Union, our having to remain part of the union customs code and all that that entails, the technical and environmental regulations, VAT and excise, the single electricity market and state aid, all coupled with the primacy of EU executive agencies within Northern Ireland, it has been admitted by the UK Government that the European Court still has more jurisdiction over the UK with respect to Northern Ireland than it has over the member states, which is to say on infringement proceedings and the ability to fine. That will give unelected EU officials considerable power that we, as an Assembly, will have no say over.”
“Regrettably, this is a form of code speak that disguises the more realistic assessment that, compared to the level playing field, financial passports, modified movements, security and fisheries, Northern Ireland is unfortunately but a mere bargaining chip in these discussions. That is as regrettable as it is inevitable. Indeed, if the Assembly votes to pass this motion with cross-community consent, it is certain that that position would be utilised as another part of that discussion. Regardless of what some Members may think, compared to EU members' national priorities, the interests of Northern Ireland will not be put to the fore.”
“The UUP recognises that today marks the start of a critical phase of the negotiations between the UK and the EU. Those are discussions where the future economic and social well-being of Northern Ireland are purportedly central to the outcome of any agreement that may or may not be made. We note that in the ensuing debate over the last four years, although regrettably not in the Assembly, a common theme has always placed the Belfast Agreement as the main feature of all discussions. Indeed, the interpretation of the principles of that agreement are what all actors have said is the driving force of their deliberations with respect to maintaining as minimalist an impact as possible on Northern Ireland and its economy.”
“While we understand the desire of the SDLP and the Green Party to raise these issues, after the Executive's discussions yesterday, when it was unanimously decided to wait until this current phase of negotiations has played out, we feel that, at this stage, rather than debating this, we should be debating the reality of the Irish Sea border. That was the basis of our amendment, which was, regrettably, not taken by the Speaker. Today's discussions will only be seized on and utilised by those who wish to seek bargaining advantage between Mr Frost and Mr Barnier and those who seek to maintain further material advantage at the expense of everyone in Northern Ireland.”
“We in the Ulster Unionist Party cannot support the motion or the amendment.”
“Where you are sitting is normally the Ulster Unionist Party's position, not the naughty corner, but thank you.”
“<BR /> <BR />I have asked the Department of Finance's officials to attend tomorrow's meeting of the Finance Committee to outline the process being undertaken in the reprioritising exercise and to explain why they cannot provide oral evidence on June monitoring at this stage. I also want to ask the Minister to clarify whether he intends to put back the deadline for submission of departmental monitoring returns so as to provide Committees with the opportunity to consider them in advance. In view of the latitude with which the Assembly has facilitated the Minister and other Departments, that should be the very least that we all expect. <BR /> <BR />On behalf of the Committee for Finance, I support the Bill.”
“Unfortunately, the Department of Finance has informed the Committee that, due to an exercise to look at reprioritising measures to fund pressures arising from COVID-19, it will not be able to provide the Committee with details of its June monitoring position at this week's meeting. While the Minister and his officials may think that that is appropriate, the deadline for Departments to provide information to PSD has not been moved. That suggests that Departments are being asked to bypass Committees and submit their monitoring returns to PSD in advance of any Committee scrutiny.”
“It was my intention from this platform to urge all scrutiny Committees to take the opportunity of the June monitoring round to explore in depth with their Departments exactly what pressures are being faced, the details of bids, the rationale of any movement of resource and the rationale for retention of resources when spend to date has been less than anticipated. <BR /> <BR />The in-year monitoring process is a critical opportunity for Departments to identify any reduced requirements to support the Executive in reallocating resources in-year. It is also an important opportunity for Committees to ensure that that happens. That, in turn, will maximise the resources available and minimise the risk of money being lost to the Treasury at the end of the financial year.”
“Assuming that the Bill receives Royal Assent, it will become the Budget (No. 2) Act (Northern Ireland) 2020. Of course, Minister, that is not the end of the Committee's scrutiny role. Monitoring rounds are an integral part of the role of Committees in scrutinising how the legislation is implemented through the scrutiny of public expenditure by Departments in the course of the financial year. This week, Committees should be considering their Department's position for the June monitoring round in advance of monitoring returns being submitted to the Department of Finance's public spending directorate (PSD).”
“They include options that will aim to support and promote economic activity at a strategic level, using levers such as procurement, borrowing and the use of financial transactions capital (FTC) and how we can make use of those levers in the future through continued Committee and Assembly scrutiny. From a departmental perspective, the Committee will also be interested in the targeted rates support for those most adversely by the pandemic and in identifying where further efficiencies can be made through public sector reform to enable us to pull ourselves out of the COVID pandemic.”
“<BR /> <BR />As I have previously acknowledged, the Committee welcomes the engagement from the Department on the Bill. After reviewing the Hansard report of last week's Supply resolution and Second Stage debates, I was pleased to see some healthy debate and the validity of points that were raised during that business. <BR /> <BR />We are now entering a pivotal phase that requires us to design and deliver a credible plan over the short-to-medium term to help us to cope, as best as we can, with the challenges that, we all recognise, we will face; indeed, that should be our collective aim. At its meeting tomorrow, the Committee will consider important matters and options to support ongoing and effective scrutiny at a departmental and cross-cutting strategic level.”
“Having developed templates to support scrutiny by Committees, we found it disappointing to hear from the Deputy Chairperson of the Finance Committee and the Chair of the Justice Committee that the Committee for Justice did not receive the completed template form from the Department of Justice but had to rely on papers sent to the Committee for Finance to understand what was going on in the Department of Justice. I want to make it clear that, in future, the Committee for Finance will work to ensure that all Committees receive the information that they need to undertake appropriate financial scrutiny, and I ask the Minister to make it clear to his Executive colleagues that he supports me in doing so and, indeed, all the Committees in the Assembly.”
“While the Committee for Finance has arrived at a position with the Department of Finance where it is being afforded, mostly, the opportunity for consultation and scrutiny at departmental and Executive level, that has not been the experience of all Committees and Departments. <BR /> <BR />Openness and transparency are necessary to afford Committees the opportunity to effectively scrutinise departmental spending proposals and understand the rationale for their intended approach. They also afford the Committee for Finance the opportunity to understand the position of each Committee on the priorities of their Department.”
“<BR /> <BR />As Members know, Budget Bills typically pass under the accelerated passage procedure to expedite the process and provide the necessary authority for Departmental spending. However, as I indicated at Second Stage, the Committee has a specific scrutiny and consultation role on Budget Bills. It is only when that happens that the Committee can satisfy itself that there has been appropriate consultation with it on the public expenditure proposals in the Bill. That is a fundamental requirement on the basis of which the Committee considers whether it is content to grant accelerated passage. Just as important, there is a responsibility on Departments to provide timely, relevant and accurate information to their Committees with transparency and openness.”
“I thank the Minister for his remarks. As Members will be aware, the Budget Bill that is before the House provides the statutory authority to allow public expenditure to continue until the Assembly votes on the Main Estimates for 2020-21. As the Minister mentioned, we fully anticipate that occurring by early September. We are acutely aware that the need for an earlier than anticipated Budget Bill is necessary as a result of the increased spending from the current COVID pandemic. The Committee for Finance took evidence on the Budget (No. 2) Bill from Department of Finance officials on 23 May. As I mentioned at Second Stage, the absence of the Bill would have had significant consequences for the ability of Departments to respond to the challenges that are being faced across our society.”
“As you have already stated, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker, I have written to you on behalf of the Committee to confirm its decision. I say on behalf of the Committee and the Ulster Unionist Party that we support the Bill.”
“Of course, that all has to be done within a constrained window. It is less than 10 weeks until 31 July. It is therefore critical that businesses be given sufficient time to understand whether they will be affected and, if so, how they will be affected and whether they will fall within the targeted approach. <BR /> <BR />As the House is aware, the Committee for Finance has a specific function to perform when considering whether a Budget Bill should proceed under the accelerated passage procedure. Engagement by the Department with the Committee has been instrumental in ensuring that the Committee is satisfied that it has been consulted appropriately. It was on that basis that the Committee agreed at its meeting last week that it was content to grant accelerated passage, as provided for in Standing Order 42(2).”
“I also encourage the Minister to encourage the Northern Ireland Executive to expedite the economic recovery plan that we have been promised for at least the past two weeks and that the First Minister stated two weeks ago that we would have presently. <BR /> <BR />We will also need to take account of the costs associated with such targeted support, because they will be significant. During oral evidence last week, the Committee noted that there was an overcommitment arising from non-domestic rates. While officials were confident that that could be met in-year, we need to ensure that any future support is fully costed and is underpinned by a robust rationale to maximise its impact. We ask the Minister to clarify the extent of the overcommitment. Is he in a position to outline how he intends to meet it in-year?”
“<BR /> <BR />I welcome the Minister's announcement that there will be support on a phased basis, targeted at the sectors that have been hardest hit. To provide certainty, however, we need to understand what proposals are being considered, so that we, as an Assembly, can contribute to and influence how that phased approach will operate. Minister, it would be helpful if, later today in your winding-up speech, you could set out the types of issues being considered as part of the targeted scheme; that is, the level of support and over what period. I ask you to explain the rationale for how the levels of support for the hardest-hit sectors have been prioritised and to provide a commitment to the House that the Committee for Finance will be consulted on the proposals during their formative stages.”