Clive Efford
MP for Eltham and Chislehurst · Labour · United Kingdom
“Thank you for allowing me to take part in this statement, Madam Deputy Speaker, given that I was not here at the beginning—I was carrying out my duties elsewhere in the House. I welcome the Secretary of State’s statement. What is she likely to do in my part of south-east London for technical and vocational places?”
“I rise to speak to amendment 97 in my name, which would remove clause 10 from the Bill. Clause 10 gives powers to the Secretary of State to vary the proportion of public and private provision of health services if they consider that to do so is in the interests of the health service.”
“Labour’s 2024 plan to make work pay set out a welcome desire to bring more essential services back into public control—something that is welcomed by health workers across the country, because so far the “biggest wave of insourcing in a generation”, as was promised, has felt more like a trickle when it comes to the NHS.”
“The explanatory notes for the Bill say that this new flexibility is necessary “where there may otherwise be a breakdown in provision of a health service.” Can we imagine a situation where the Secretary of State has concerns about a health service and that an approach to assist a local provider would be rebuffed?”
“There are ample powers to enable the Secretary of State to intervene and resolve breakdowns in the provision of a health service. On clause 10, we must balance what it adds in those situations against its potential misuse by an ideologically driven Government that are determined to privatise our NHS.”
“It was a pleasure to join my right hon. Friend at Greenwich council’s development of 435 council properties in my constituency for the launch of the social and affordable housing programme. Some 70,000 homes are planned, and that is welcome and overdue.”
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“There is a great deal that the Government have done and not received enough credit for. For example, delivering on the decent homes initiative, which will improve the quality of life of millions when it is finally completed, was long overdue and is very welcome. The Government have made it clear that they also want to tackle the problem of social and affordable housing, but I believe that one area is being left behind: the affordable rented sector, particularly in council housing. I am sure that I am no different from any other Member in that every week my surgeries are full of young people with young children who are living at home with their parents. They are looking for the start in family life that their parents were given by their local authority, which provided decent quality housing where they could bring up their family.”
“First, I congratulate you, Mr. Cummings; this is the first meeting that I have attended with you in the Chair. I congratulate the Minister on his appointment. This is my first opportunity to do that, and I am pleased to see him in that position, particularly in today's debate, as I know that he will have a lot of relevant experience from his constituency just across the water from my borough. I also congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Hampstead and Highgate (Glenda Jackson) on her success in securing the debate. I know that my hon. Friends the Members for Islington, North (Jeremy Corbyn) and for Edmonton (Mr. Love) have been applying for a similar debate, and we are pleased to have this opportunity. During the last general election the issue of housing was, remarkably, overlooked.”
“2. While I welcome everything the Government are doing to increase the supply of affordable homes, I draw my right hon. Friend's attention to the shortage of affordable rented accommodation, particularly in London. My surgery every week is full of young families who are forced to live with parents because they cannot find affordable homes, and even with the assistance that the Government are planning to provide, they cannot afford to buy. Does my right hon. Friend agree that we need to do more to increase the supply of rented accommodation at affordable rates so that those families can have hope for the future? [4191]”
“May I take my hon. Friend back to the intervention made by my hon. Friend the Member for Luton, North (Mr. Hopkins) on diet and school meals? Schools in my constituency are currently subjected to the Jamie Oliver treatment, because Greenwich schools feature in his Channel 4 programme. He has been able to demonstrate clearly that the standard of school meals has declined considerably over time under compulsory competitive tendering. He was also able to demonstrate that the diets of children at home are crucial, so we should not forget that. I encourage Jamie Oliver to take on supermarkets about the foods that they encourage parents to buy for children as well, because the problem does not begin and end at the school gate.”
“I am grateful to my hon. Friend for indicating that he is prepared to listen to representations on the outcome of the consultation, which was rendered entirely false when the recent document was published. I was consulted directly by the former chair of the SRA on six off-peak trains per hour, two of which would have gone to Victoria. At that time, there was no suggestion that the Victoria service would be cut, yet that is exactly what has happened. During the consultation, my constituents and I had no opportunity to comment on that service being cut, so I am pleased to hear that my hon. Friend is prepared to listen. Will my hon. Friend also consult disabled people, who will find it difficult to use those services?”
“10. The single regeneration budget money that has been invested in my constituency has allowed a flexibility in funding to meet the needs and aspirations of my local community. Sadly, however, many of the initiatives that have come from the local community face an uncertain future because SRB funding will come to an end in the next two years. Will my right hon. Friend investigate how we can provide some sustainability for those initiatives in the future? [214862]”
“Will my right hon. Friend reaffirm his commitment to building schools for the future, to decent homes for tenants and providing state of the art facilities for sports in our communities? In my borough over the next 10 years my local authority will transform every secondary school by investing £325 million, which was opposed by the local Tories. It is spending more than £200 million providing decent homes for tenants, which was opposed by the Tories, and building a £20 million leisure centre in my town centre, which was opposed by the Tories. Apart from admiring their kamikaze-style manifesto— [Interruption.]”
“Is the hon. Gentleman aware that there are 131 existing casinos in Great Britain, and 24 across London alone? By suggesting that we should suck it and see, as it were, is not he promoting a proliferation of those machines all over the country?”
“I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for his answer, but disappointed that he did not say that he is willing to meet my hon. Friend the Member for Hayes and Harlington (John McDonnell) to discuss the future of South Eastern Trains. If we are to get value for money for taxpayers' investment in our railways, it surely follows that we must have a public sector comparator, and not just the dogma of privatisation of our railways. If South Eastern Trains has shown an improvement in certain areas in the short time in which it has run rail services in the south-east, particularly on main line services, we must surely consider the future of the railways under that management. May I urge my right hon. Friend to consider a meeting to discuss that further?”
“In his submission on the bridge, Professor Whitelegg said that there was little evidence about the types of jobs that would be created by the bridge. The assertion that it would create 48,000 jobs has now been omitted from the Mayor of London's transport strategy. The figures of Halcrow, the consultants, show little evidence of the role that the Thames gateway bridge will play in the creation of jobs. The economic case is thin. There are environmental issues that need to be addressed and that can only be done by means of a public inquiry. That is essential if the bridge project is to go ahead. In terms of transport infrastructure development, it is so important that we place an emphasis on public transport. That is what will bring about access to jobs and opportunities for local people.”
“The people concerned will experience what everyone else experiences when they live near a bridge. When the bridges in west London were closed for repair, people argued that they should remain closed. They and their communities cherished the relief that the closures brought to them as a result of reduced traffic congestion. That will result in people saying, "We want relief from the traffic", and I believe that that will lead to them saying that they want a relief road. That will lead to the resurrection of the east London river crossing route, which has been the subject of so much controversy in south-east London. The issue should be taken before a public inquiry. There is no evidence to support the economic contribution that it is claimed that the Thames gateway bridge will bring about through the creation of jobs.”
“It was said that people who did not have access to a car could not be disfranchised by the congestion charge. It is not possible to have it both ways. Either these people are in need of public transport links or they are not. We are planning to put an enormous amount of investment into the road. We are talking of the largest bridge to span the Thames in the London area. It will have two lanes for traffic and one lane for buses. Those of us who are more cynical than others could point to the fact that with bus lanes it is necessary only to change the colour of the tarmac to produce a three-lane motorway in each direction. We shall see an increase in the amount of traffic on already congested roads on the south side of the river. In my opinion, the community in this part of south-east London will be divided in the long term.”
“Friend the Minister will say that the problems cannot be solved simply by diverting funds from the bridge—a road link—to Crossrail, but it is important to emphasise the importance of public-transport links. For more than two decades Greenwich council undertook some surveys into poverty in south-east London, particularly in Greenwich. The results of the surveys highlighted that those who were socially excluded did not have access to a car. The argument that the regeneration of the Thames gateway and the opportunities for people who do not have a car are predicated on the development of a road does not stack up given the evidence that we have found in the past. The argument was turned on its head when the congestion charge was introduced.”
“It benefits from several bus services and from rail services, but—in the medium term, at least—it will have the DLR as well. According to the current plans to take Crossrail south of the river, it will bypass Woolwich. That will deprive people south of Greenwich and beyond of an essential link. The ability to use other forms of transport to reach a hub in the north of the borough could transform the way in which people reach their jobs each day, and could play a major part in relieving pressure on roads that are already much too congested. The lack of a Crossrail station will make it virtually impossible for large chunks of the population of south-east London to benefit from easy access to services. An enormous amount of money is being invested in the Thames gateway bridge. My hon.”
“Friend the Minister will probably say that all those issues have been taken on board, but I fear that they are lost in talk of health centres, schools and the like. They slipped off the shopping list when we are telling private developers what we want. Much has been said about transport, but I want to say more about it. There is a plan to bring the docklands light railway to Woolwich in the north of my borough. As I have told my hon. Friend the Minister on several occasions, a swathe of south-east London is not served by the underground. We rely heavily on trains, as buses are still not considered an option for long-distance travel to and from central London. Bringing the DLR to Woolwich will enhance a major hub in south-east London.”
“We need much more affordable housing than I fear we will get if we are to accommodate existing residents who want to rent property that they can afford, and those who will make the gateway regeneration a success if they move into the area. Several Members have mentioned the obvious public services, such as health services and schools. Even the fire service was mentioned. A number of other public services do not spring to mind in the context of planning gain, however. I am thinking of supported housing units for people with learning disabilities, and further-education colleges. FE colleges need a great deal of capital. There will be an enormous demand for training in the area, and I think the negotiations should take that into account. My hon.”
“I know from my discussions with housing associations that they would like to take on the management role for the development of some sites, so that they manage the whole project from beginning to end. They will sell some of the housing, so that we get mixed tenure: we are not talking about building huge council estates as we did in the past. We want to create balanced communities, achieving more from the value of the land to allow us to build more social housing. We need partnership with social landlords to maximise social housing. I am not advocating social housing exclusively for local people. That has been a disaster in the past and would not help the regeneration of the Thames gateway and bring in the diversity of people that we need to participate in the local economy and industry and to provide public services.”
“Much of the land to be regenerated is in public ownership, and that offers us an opportunity to achieve a great deal more social housing than is currently contemplated. Every week, my surgery is full of families who have three generations living in the same house. Young people, now with children of their own, have grown up in houses built by Labour Governments and Labour local authorities, and they look to Labour now to provide the opportunities for them and their families that their parents had before them. The process that we currently go through to develop social housing is invariably that we sell the local authority property to the private developer and then seek to negotiate back a proportion for social housing under section 106.”
“In the north of my borough, around Woolwich, 250,000 jobs disappeared in a generation from the Royal Arsenal—an incredible number of jobs to lose in one area. People who do not know the area may not realise that around Woolwich there are some of the most deprived communities to be found anywhere in the country. The regeneration of the Thames gateway will bring enormous change to their lives and to the vitality of the economy in east London, and it is well overdue. On the day on which we have formally submitted our bid to host the Olympics, let me mention in passing the enormous opportunities that that brings to the area. I wish it every success. When the regeneration is completed, it is intended to create about 180,000 jobs, as well as about 120,000 homes.”
“Let me say at the outset how much I welcome the regeneration of the Thames gateway area and the opportunities that it offers to my constituents. Those of us who value debate in the House as an opportunity to put our points across will inevitably focus on areas of concern or areas in which we seek change, and I appeal to Ministers to take our remarks in that context rather than thinking that we are being negative about the prospects that the development offers our communities. For too long, the east of London has been the poor relation in terms of economic development and opportunity. In the latter part of the last century we had enormous decline in the region, with the docks running down and a loss of industry.”
“We must bear it in mind that such a system might not have prevented this accident, but we might be able to identify a problem that can be resolved for the future.”
“This accident happened in the most extraordinary circumstances, and I am sure that we all join together in sending our sympathy to all those who have been affected. In answer to my hon. Friend the Member for Reading, West (Mr. Salter), the Secretary of State said that we did not know how long the vehicle had been on the tracks. We all understand that, but each occurrence such as this could bring to light loopholes in the safety systems that we need to close. Will my right hon. Friend give us an assurance that the HSE will investigate all the available forms of technology that could be used to identify blockages at unmanned level crossings, so that we can establish as early a warning system as possible?”
“7. What discussions she has had with the Deputy Prime Minister on the impact of the closure of sub-post offices on neighbourhood renewal areas; and if she will make a statement. [195866]”
“I appreciate that the closures are a matter for Post Office Ltd. The criterion it has set to identify deprivation uses ward-based statistics, which, the Government realise, are a blunt instrument. They have introduced neighbourhood renewal projects in some areas because they understand that the figures do not identify areas of deprivation in sufficient detail, but Post Office Ltd. has ignored that fact in its reinvention programme. Will my hon. Friend take that up with Post Office Ltd. and revisit some of its proposals? It should ensure that there is a good case for the closure of post offices in neighbourhood renewal areas. The sub-postmaster of the Mound post office in my constituency has changed his mind. He no longer wants to close it because he thinks that he can put a business together, but still the closure is going ahead.”
“It is outperforming its private sector predecessor, so is it not about time we had legislation to bring the railways back under public control?”
“May I ask my right hon. Friend for an urgent debate on Post Office Ltd.'s urban reinvention programme and its impact on our communities? In my constituency, Post Office Ltd. has proposed the closure of a post office in an urban neighbourhood renewal area. It makes no sense for one Department to oversee Post Office Ltd. and provide it with public money, while another, which is trying to reinvent local economies and save local shopping precincts, is being undermined by Post Office Ltd.'s closure programme. We need to assess the impact of that programme and have a debate on the matter here on the Floor of the House. While I have my right hon. Friend's ear, may I draw his attention to South Eastern Trains, which is the only publicly owned and run rail franchise in the country?”
“My right hon. Friend mentioned my borough, Greenwich. Several planning authorities in the Thames gateway area may be attracted to the idea of having a casino; what is the best way of deciding which should have planning permission? [Laughter.] I think we should treat the issue a bit more seriously. How do we decide whether regional planning priorities should determine where a casino goes, or whether it should be a matter for the local planning authority? Should there not be a national criterion enabling us to designate an area suitable? The local authority would have to demonstrate that it had consulted local people and referred to both its own unitary development plan and the regional development plan, and had received support, before it could proceed to the next phase and develop a casino?”
“I welcome my right hon. Friend's statement, but if the changes do not result in our being able to tackle the nuisance and harassment that takes places on inner-city estates, the action will not be worth taking. The police currently do not have the resources to target such incidents in our communities and the victims are often too fearful to come forward to give the necessary evidence so that appropriate action can be taken. Therefore, when my right hon. Friend sets up specialist detective units or street wardens, will the people involved be trained in gathering evidence? If they become expert witnesses, we can target a problem that causes so many difficulties in our communities and which is often raised in our surgeries at the weekend.”