Carál Ní Chuilín
North Belfast · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland
“To continue the theme of undermining public confidence and public effectiveness, I ask you this, Minister: why do you and your DUP colleagues continue to block the 'good jobs' Bill, particularly the measures for parents whose babies require neonatal care and, indeed, other measures that will support workers who are struggling with the cos…”
“At the end of the day, guns were used to kill Catholics — Davy Payne; surface-to-air missiles in South Africa and Paris and then some. I will give the deputy First Minister another opportunity not to deflect but to condemn her party's involvement in Ulster Resistance and with the red berets that they wore.”
“I thank the Minister for that response. I have a close family relative who is in need of a SPiMS unit in an Irish-medium school but cannot access one in North Belfast at all. Apart from access in P4 and P5, they will have to go to an English-speaking school, even though Irish is their first language.”
“You mentioned some of the issues that are important: trade union representation, the banning of zero-hours contracts and employees being able to have their tips and service charges. Anyone who cannot get behind these proposals needs to be clear — concerns for some, and hiding behind the industry for others.”
“First Minister, I know that, recently, you were in Ardoyne for the sod cutting of the new £3·4 million purpose-built youth facility for Ardoyne Youth Enterprise. Further to your response to Brian Kingston, can you give us an update on that project and, indeed, any others?”
“I agree 100%, Linda. That is something that we all agree on. We met many people. The Bill was published and was based on the report of the truth recovery process.”
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“I thank the Member for his question. In 2014, Sport NI’s investment in Outdoor Recreation NI enabled the development and publication of a 10-year mountain bike strategy. That strategy is being further resourced in 2015 with a piece of live research on unmet demand for mountain biking and allied economic activity impact. Sport NI has invested over £70,000 in the provision of this mountain bike skills loop and provided an additional 1,600 metres of dedicated single-track trail, which is suitable for both recreational and competitive mountain bikers, as a training facility. In addition, DCAL, through Sport NI, has invested £150,000 towards mountain-bike skills and challenge trails.”
“The Member may appreciate that I do not have those details to hand. I am certainly aware of how many groups, but not where the groups were located. I know that in the Member's own constituency there is Sticky Fingers, for example, although it was not primarily an intercultural programme, but, through my work and my Department, there have certainly been interventions made in that area where there were not before, or where the award was not at the power that the organisation felt that it needed to be. I am certainly happy to provide the Member with all of those details.”
“Through the Arts Council and additional moneys that were received through monitoring rounds, that intercultural arts programme has been very successful, and it is that collaboration and distribution that has made it work.”
“The distribution of £300,000 was made available to the intercultural arts programme over three years. It was done in collaboration with many groups. There have been many successful outcomes from great collaborations. The Arts Council made 34 awards to community organisations. Three organisations did not take up their awards and four organisations received two awards each, so 31 projects and 27 organisations were funded through the Arts Council. In respect of the minority ethnic individual artist award scheme, the Arts Council also made 20 individual artist awards to 18 artists. It is that sort of collaboration with the Arts Council that has helped sustainability.”
“I am taking that report and preparing a final report, with a view to trying to make an additional bid to potential monitoring rounds and certainly trying to build it into any future funding strands.”
“I thank the Member for her supplementary question. She will certainly have a preliminary report on the evaluation report. Even though the intercultural programme had a certain lifespan, I continued to provide funding after that, not only to allow the evaluation to take place but to ensure that the work, some of which was contracted, was able to be honoured. In addition to that, the Member will be aware that funding, even through cultural partnerships, was awarded to groups like ArtsEkta, for example, and others to provide opportunities to give us the great spectacle of intercultural arts, but also to provide opportunities for building good and better relations, which, at times, come under extreme pressure, particularly within the city of Belfast. <BR /> <BR />In short, the interim report points to a very successful programme.”
“I thank the Member for her question. The impact of the intercultural arts programme is currently being evaluated, and early indications are that the programme was extremely successful. I expect to receive the final evaluation report in the coming weeks, after which I will be able to provide further comment on the social value of this programme. I hope to have this completed straight after the summer recess.”
“There has been and will continue to be a substantial lobby around ensuring that Tower Street is successful, because it was and remains successful, particularly to students travelling to the city of Belfast and those who live in the city of Belfast who have articulated that this will cause them hardship. I look forward to the Minister's replies to my correspondence to address exactly those questions and other questions.”
“I am aware, as I am sure every Member is, of the imminent closure of Tower Street. I understand that performing arts courses at the Tower Street campus will cease. That will affect new students, who, upon taking those courses, will be accommodated at the South Eastern Regional College in Bangor. To that end, I wrote to Minister Farry in May and again in June because, given my responses to Pat Ramsey and Judith Cochrane, it is really important that we have a joined-up approach. <BR /> <BR />Big concerns are raised by this issue. I am the lead Minister for creative industries, and I was not informed of it.”
“First, I totally agree with Pat Ramsey about the work that the arts provide and the work that arts and creative people, even in the business community, provide. It will help towards our sustainability. Currently, an advisory group is looking at a new arts and cultural strategy. Unlike sports, for example, the arts did not have an overarching arts and cultural strategy. Sport has Sport Matters, which is supported by the entire Executive. I think that it is important to do this because we have a great cultural fabric in our community. We have a good partnership between arts and business and arts and the cultural sector. I think that we need to look at what the needs are and to try to agree the best possible way forward. Not only will that help to address need, it will help towards long-term sustainability.”
“I thank the Member for her question. She mentioned a few, and, through the ministerial action group, there is a coming together of groups that are involved in creative industries, particularly around animation or work for children and that. I mentioned Dog Ears, but there is also the work of Coder Dojo and others. DCAL, DE, DETI and DEL are involved in this; I think that it is a fairly high-level group. It is not only to build on what we have done up to now but to take in the work of performing arts and artists to help to inform children and young people around the STEM subjects. I thank the Member for her question and her supplementary question because that leads on to what this work is trying to inform, particularly for the next CSR, which is really important.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. I thank the Member for her question. My Department supports creativity and innovation in line with the Executive’s innovation strategy. This includes the delivery of the creative industries innovation fund from 2009 to 2015 and my Department’s ongoing support for our creative learning centres. A ministerial action group on the creative industries has been established to consider how best to build on this investment. My Department’s support has led to success stories such as Dog Ears, whose 'Puffin Rock' series is now shown to a global audience through the Nickelodeon channel.”
“While that is important, there are many others out there who have learned their craft and their skill through marching bands and who want to get involved in other music genres, and I think that they need to be included in some way. I welcome the debate.”
“I have said throughout that access equals participation: if you cannot have those two fundamental elements, people will feel that they are and have been excluded because they cannot get involved. <BR /> <BR />I think that this has been a good-tempered and very useful debate, despite some differences, caveats and, indeed, warnings. I will read Hansard to see what we can do along with officials, the Arts Council and others. I am committed to trying to get some funding for this for the here and now, but I want to look long term. It will need a consultation to find out exactly what is needed, but, let me tell you, I have been in the Department for just four years, and I know that this is not just about the marching bands culture alone.”
“We should always try to be more inclusive, particularly when we are looking at getting this bedded down further in any new funding opportunities. We also need to bring in other Departments, particularly to look at aspects of social inclusion and economic and community regeneration, as well as education and rural development. <BR /> <BR />There are huge opportunities here, but I think that there is and has been a pattern here where a small group of people has been very successful in availing itself of the funding streams, while others have looked on, not quite knowing how to go about availing themselves of them or maybe just not having the wherewithal. In the review, we need to look at how we can make it easier for people to get access.”
“I think that we have an opportunity to be inclusive, involving Comhaltas, for example, or even kids who just come together to form bands and who are not necessarily involved in marching bands culture. They need to have the opportunity to do that and to get that social inclusion. <BR /> <BR />That needs to be sustained from one generation to another, particularly in areas where young people face challenges to try to find their way. For many of those young people, music is how they make sense of things, and I think that that needs to be supported. However, if it gets reviewed, and I am arguing that it should, people should not be jumping up and down saying, "This is an erosion of our culture". It is not. It is about being more inclusive.”
“If it is not successful, I will look to other sources of funding within the DCAL family and give my best possible attention to getting funding for musical instruments, because I value the work of bands and people involved in music. <BR /> <BR />When we look at the next CSR, I am minded, after the summer, to look at having a review of this scheme. I am saying that up front: I am looking at having a review of what I think we need to do. While this is about the purchasing of instruments, which is very important, we also need to look at the added value that bands, regardless of their complexion, bring to community cohesion, economic regeneration and social inclusion. I do not think that that has happened properly. The reason why it has not happened properly is because people automatically assume an association with parades.”
“Many of the bands involved in parades across the North, throughout this island and, indeed, as some Members mentioned, have participated in competitions that have world titles do not want to be associated at all with what goes on in our constituency. In fact, it is quite clear when you talk to members of the bands forums — certainly the Confederation of Ulster Bands — that there are differences of opinion between urban and rural, and even within urban and urban. There are lots of challenges, but if there is the political will and people are prepared to take risks and to give leadership and support, we can sort it out. However, we need to set our faces to sorting it out. <BR /> <BR />I guarantee that I will make a bid in June, and, hopefully, it will be successful.”
“You did not mention any geographical area; I thought you were talking in general. Now that you have mentioned an area, you need to use your influence to get people talking regardless. Do not set preconditions for those discussions because that dooms them to failure. I note that the Member did not mention St Patrick's or Carrick Hill, which are also in our constituency and need to be resolved. The best that we can do, and should definitely do, is ensure that where there are opportunities, we take them, and where there are not, we create them. That is our job as political leaders in a constituency that has a small number of parades and protests still to be resolved. <BR /> <BR />I raise that only because the Member raised it and it is something that we can do.”
“I hope that William and other representatives from north Belfast will use their influence to ensure that dialogue is not only initiated but sustained. That is something that we need to do.”
“<BR /> <BR />I have given recognition to the bands forums and individuals I met representing them. To be honest, at some meetings I had within the past month or so, people did not want to be involved in point-scoring or for their names to be associated with some of the debates in this Chamber, which they do not think are helpful. However, they do want investment and to be respected. They want that investment to come primarily from my Department but to be across other Departments, and I am willing to do that. It is much easier for us all collectively to do that when we just keep party politics out of it as much as possible. <BR /> <BR />In an intervention, William Humphrey raised a challenge about parades and protests. All of us, particularly people in north Belfast, have a lot to learn from the city of Derry.”
“I accept at face value what they say. <BR /> <BR />There is a need to see this as an opportunity. The Londonderry Bands Forum gave me good examples, as did Comhaltas, of what this fund has allowed young people to attain musically. The intergenerational aspect was also mentioned, with people learning different instruments being involved not just with a band but with a structure that passes skills from one generation to another. That is very important. <BR /> <BR />When we are having debates, regardless of what they are about, I wish that people would not bring in the Irish language when there is no need. The only person to do that was Nelson McCausland. You end up just looking petty. I have never been petty or political about this scheme and never will. I try to give full expression and respect where they are due.”
“<BR /> <BR />There is a big difference in the funding that has been spent on musical instruments for some of the marching bands and indeed Comhaltas thus far, but it should not be just about purchasing equipment; it is also about where we take these opportunities in the future. David Hilditch spoke about his experience in his constituency and indeed pointed out the whole notion of social inclusion and ending isolation. That affects many people, particularly but not exclusively in rural communities. I have spoken to young Protestant men in working-class areas who do not want to be associated with some of the displays of sectarianism but value the role that marching bands have played for them.”
“Some have actually spoken about the need to have a robust code of conduct and indeed to amend it to be inclusive of opportunities for other types of bands and people purchasing musical instruments for uses other than to be involved in marching bands. That is something that we need to review. I have met young musicians who are not part of a marching band culture but are maybe in a small traditional group or jazz group. They want opportunities. They have had opportunities, even under the Arts Council's small grants lottery scheme, to purchase instruments, but it is important that they are reflected in this as well.”
“I have told the Arts Council, the Ulster-Scots Agency and indeed any other funder within my remit that, where that behaviour has been proven — not suspected, but proven — funding eligibility will be different to what it was before the incident took place. I think that people can fully understand that. It applies across the board. It is not just for people who have behaved in a sectarian way outside St Patrick's chapel or indeed, allegedly, outside St Anne's. It is the first that I have heard of that incident, I have to say. I am not saying that it did not happen, but that it is the first I have heard of it. Wherever that behaviour occurs, it needs to stop. It needs to stop. <BR /> <BR />I would also like to point out that everybody has spoken about the merits of musical instruments.”
“They are an exemplar, unlike others — they and Comhaltas are exemplars — and they show how, if you look at a few Departments and work across them, you can show what can be done if you do it the right way. <BR /> <BR />Rosie McCorley and others mentioned the need, where there have been isolated incidents — I do not think that anybody is in any denial about those incidents — of behaviour on Facebook, social media or the streets that could be described as sectarian, antisocial, abusive, threatening or intimidating, that nobody should be seen to support it. I am not hearing it being defended at all.”
“It does not include ministerial priorities if they are not contractually committed to. I will look at the Hansard report of that Committee meeting and will take it up with my officials. Had that been the case, there would have been different bids submitted in previous monitoring rounds. To be fair, if these are the criteria that I have been working to, they are clear and transparent. <BR /> <BR />This has received high priority. Recently, when I was up for questions, I said that I would support a bid. I did; I have put that bid forward. Indeed, as recently as last month, I met the Londonderry Bands Forum, not just about this scheme but about other work that needs to be done in the future.”
“I will give way in a minute. This does not come under or meet the criterion. I have given it high priority, as two of my officials said last week when they went in front of the Committee for Culture, Arts and Leisure.”
“<BR /> <BR />I want to make one clarification of what Nelson McCausland said. Surely, having been Culture Minister and Social Development Minister, he should really know the difference between "inescapable", "desirable" and "high-priority" when it comes to the budget. "Inescapable" relates to the things that I am contractually obliged to do. This does not fit that criterion.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. I thank all the Members who have spoken in the debate thus far. I support the main essence behind the motion. To be generous about it, I think that most people, if not all, spoke about the role and the merits that musical instruments for bands has brought and can bring in the future. That is why I support it. <BR /> <BR />The Chair of the CAL Committee, although he spoke as a member of the DUP, not as Chair, moved the motion and spoke about the role of the band sector. He also spoke about the different reviews of marching bands and what they bring to the economy. I think that all Members have spoken about the benefits of the role that marching bands, in particular, and musical instruments for bands have had to play in their communities.”
“I am absolutely happy to visit Carryduff.”
“I am happy to recognise the contribution of Carryduff. I know it is a big club. Like many clubs across sport and physical activity, the work it does, particularly across generations, is actually keeping people well, fit and safe.”
“Certainly. I have met many angling clubs, and I am sure that I will continue to do so. If the Member has angling clubs in his constituency that he wants me to meet, I am happy to do that. Just find the office and we will get that sorted. It is absolutely no bother.”
“It is a valuable asset not just in West Tyrone, which obviously has some beautiful scenery, but right across this island. Angling clubs have worked very closely together for years and will continue to do so. Angling is very important, and not just for community participation; it is intergenerational and helps increase tourism, particularly along the waterways that have a good yield of trout. I am, have been and will continue to be very supportive of local angling clubs.”
“Absolutely. Not only are John O'Dowd and I sitting next to each other today, but our offices are close together. We have done so and will continue to do so. I have spoken to many principals and, indeed, boards of governors about not only music but art and physical activity in school. It is important that, within their current budgets, schools ensure that those subjects are not an afterthought but are built right into the criteria.”
“I am not sure what the Member was referring to. I have not made it political and would resist any attempt to do so. I understand that the Member is coming from the same position. Some time ago, I met the marching bands forum, which is one aspect of musical tuition. There are others: I have met people from Comhaltas and from the all-Ireland fleadh committee in Derry and so on. I went to the Ulster Fleadh and all the rest. I also met children and young people who are involved in jazz and contemporary music, and the fact that music is important to them is important to me. Music is my thing, and that is something that I fully appreciate, participate in and see the importance of. It is important that, where possible in these financial circumstances, we invest in opportunities for children and young people to get involved in music.”
“I wonder at the coincidence of his and Basil's question; maybe he is reading from the same script. Let me give the Member the same assurance as I gave to Basil McCrea and to anybody else listening: I will ensure that safety is paramount. I have done so and will continue to do so. Any new plans submitted as part of a new planning application will be subject to at least 12 weeks' consultation. I anticipate that the CAL Committee, of which Mr Dunne is a member, will not only see the plans but have an opportunity to contribute to the consultation. I am sure that he will look out for exiting, egress, access and, indeed, any other aspect of concern. I am delighted to see so many people supportive of the redevelopment of Casement Park.”
“The Member is on the Committee: he was there on 23 April when my officials were at the Committee; and he was there on 30 April when Mr Paul Scott made his allegations. He will know the answer because I told him when I was there. Perhaps he did not understand me when I said that I was not aware of the seriousness of the allegations that Mr Paul Scott made until I heard them when he gave evidence to the Committee on 30 April. Since then, I have initiated two very robust processes. His colleagues in DFP are involved in that investigation and review, certainly the review, anyway. It is not just DFP: the British Westminster Cabinet Office is also involved in the investigation.”
“As I said, the first programme was a pilot scheme. The evaluation of that scheme stated that it was successful, that there was a need for it, and that there is a need for more like it. Some of the tweaks in the programme came from the young people who participated, which is very good. If anything, the lessons that we have learned are that we need to incorporate those young people's ideas into the design of the next programme. That is happening at the minute, and I have no doubt that, once the overall T:BUC programme is finished, OFMDFM will ask each Department to provide contributions to an overall evaluation report.”
“The Member has raised the topic of community relations before. The programme is developing very well. DCAL is one of a number of Departments working towards the overarching strategy of T:BUC. The pilot scheme that we had in the greater Village area and the Falls/Grosvenor area has worked very well. I knew that even before I got the results of the evaluation. We are talking to colleagues in OFMDFM about rolling it out, not only in deprived areas but in rural areas. I am very happy with the direction that it is taking.”
“First, I join the Member in congratulating his constituents. He manages to weave them in, but that is what topical questions are about. Congratulations to young Stuart on his appearance. <BR /> <BR />I am working through the processes for 13 June with the IFA at the minute. Everything that I have heard thus far has been in the right direction; it has been encouraging and positive. The IFA is working through the procedures and protocols to do what is needed, not only to have as much capacity as possible, but to have done that against the backdrop of a lot of challenges, particularly around the Kop stand. I am happy with developments thus far and content that everything is going in the right direction to ensure that maximum capacity is there to help to meet the rules.”
“The Member will appreciate that we are working that out, but I do not anticipate a very big delay. He is right that completion was due by November 2015. I imagine that the delay will be just a few months, because, to be fair to the IFA, it has a great team there. It is working very closely with the Department and has a very good working relationship with its contractors, which is not always the case with capital builds. I anticipate that the delay will be a matter of a few months rather than several months.”
“I resent that remark. I think that that is ridiculous, to be frank. I am surprised, because the Member is normally more sensible than that. I will certainly ensure that safety is paramount in the redevelopment of Casement Park, as it will be for the other facilities. Not only have I gone in front of the Committee but so have my officials. We will continue to do so if and when needed, and I will leave it at that.”
“Not only can I assure the Member that I will, but I have already been to the Committee, and I anticipate being back at the Committee. I will be fully cooperative.”
“The Member is aware that there was not political agreement for that, so it is kind of a moot question. I have absolutely no doubt that it is something that is in the past, and there is nothing that we can do about that now. The three governing bodies are getting on with developing their programmes. Let me assure the Member that the work and the relationships between those three governing bodies are really good, and I have no doubt that those relationships will endure well beyond the completion of these projects.”
“If the Member is referring to Casement Park, safety considerations are there at the start, the middle and the end. Safety considerations for any big capital programme are there throughout. However, what was different was the level at which the safety concerns were reported. The allegation that they were suppressed is something that I completely refute. I am looking forward to the outcome not only of the review but of the investigation to see what lessons can be learned.”
“The IFA is working that out with the contractor and its insurer, and I am led to believe that this is being done with a can-do attitude. I am very certain that the liability not only for the demolition but for the completion of a new west stand will not come from DCAL or, indeed, the public purse. That will be sorted out between the IFA, the contractor and its insurers.”
“The Member is talking about an exit plan for a previous application. He is on the Committee, and I have heard and seen some of the questions that he has asked. The Member will know that, as part of any new planning application, new plans will be brought forward. I assure the Member and other members of the CAL Committee that I will ensure that, as part of the consultation process, the Committee will see any new design, including exit plans, evacuation plans or anything else that comes with it.”
“<BR /> <BR />I am reluctant to get into anything else because there is a whistle-blowing allegation, and it is important that people have the confidence to come forward and make such allegations and that it is not subject to public consultation.”
“I thank the Member for his question. He is a member of the CAL Committee, so he will be aware that I went to the Committee. I want to ensure that safety is paramount: it has been, and always will be, paramount to me. <BR /> <BR />In line with good practice and programme management, in relation to the allegations that I heard on 30 April, I instantly initiated a project assessment review of the stadia programme, which will include a specific focus on the issues raised around the Casement Park project. The review has been commissioned through the CDP and will be undertaken by independent experts. Normally a report is published to the Department, but I will ensure that the Department publishes the report publicly so that people see that as much as can be done is being done.”