Dame Chi Onwurah
MP for Newcastle upon Tyne Central and West · Labour · United Kingdom
“An extraordinary debate is going on right now inside and outside AI companies about whether the possibility of AI destroying humanity is more or less than 10%. The European Union is moving ahead with a comprehensive AI regulatory framework, but the UK continues to rely on existing regulation.”
“The Pope also highlighted how the billions of online digital twins constitute an unprecedented concentration of power in the hands of a small number of men. Among the many consequences of the 40 years of neoliberalism repeatedly called out by the Prime Minister is a libertarian attitude to technology.”
“But this stealth digital twinning violates the integrity, uniqueness and very personhood of our constituents and of all of us. Digital twins can take many forms, from content creation algorithms and deepfakes to chatbots that reflect aspects of our personalities back at us. It is particularly worrying when children are the target.”
“The automated version of our kids will grow with them, using the power of AI to target advertising and products at them, and worse. The Science, Innovation and Technology Committee has heard about some of the tragic consequences of online grooming by algorithms and chatbots—a vulnerable boy persuaded to kill himself; a vulnerable girl fed…”
“In the arts, entertainment and tech industries, many performers are agreeing to the creation and use of digital replicas as part of their work—think of ABBA Voyage. But performers increasingly encounter unauthorised digital replicas of themselves, which pose a threat to their career, livelihood and reputation.”
“Since then, deepfakes have proliferated. The hon. Member for Mid Norfolk (George Freeman) was shown crossing the Floor in Parliament to join Reform, to his constituents’ consternation and his own—it was a fake. Then there were the horrendous photos of naked women and girls that Elon Musk’s AI created on demand.”
The complete record
Every one of 5,139 lines we hold for Dame Chi Onwurah, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 73 of 103.
“Like many colleagues, I have pledged to “pass on plastic”. For too many of my constituents, doing so is impossible because their streets and their lives are inundated with a flood of plastic bottles, bags, food trays and crisp packets, turning their environment into a dumping ground. Will the Minister take action urgently and stop denying local authorities such as Newcastle City Council the powers and the resources to tackle the problem? Frankly, right now on the environment, this Government are rubbish.”
“The serious case review of the appalling sexual abuse of girls and vulnerable adults in Newcastle was published last month. Although it generally praised the actions of local authorities, the police and so on, it also raised significant concerns about how the victims of these appalling crimes were supported and the way they were made to relive harrowing experiences. Will the Minister be responding directly to the Spicer review’s recommendations?”
“Why has the mechanised infantry vehicle programme not got an acquisitions strategy—never mind that the contract has only three years to go—when it could bring mechanised vehicles back to Newcastle?”
“I am grateful to the Secretary of State for his opening remarks about the importance of the House supporting technology. He will know that data drives our economy and society in ways that people can find difficult to follow. The internet of things will increase exponentially the data trail we all leave, but the digital charter suggests only that private companies follow best practice. Does he not recognise the importance of data rights? Why is he not bringing forward a Bill of data rights?”
“Newcastle has national centres of excellence in data, health and energy—key drivers of our future economy. On Saturday, I held a business summit with Sadiq Khan, the Mayor of London, at which start-ups identified attracting investment as a key barrier to their growth. What are the Government doing to attract investment to businesses in Newcastle? Does that include a regional business bank, as supported by Labour?”
“Businesses that I speak to in the north-east tell me of international investments that have been put on hold while companies try to work out what kind of Brexit this Government are actually going for. They do not want to make that public, so will the Minister tell me how she is engaging with international business to assess the impact of that on our economy, and indeed—because I forget what the story is today—whether such an assessment is going on?”
“I shall try to be pithy, Mr Speaker. GKN is a great British engineering company, forged in the first industrial revolution with strengths in defence, aerospace, automotive, batteries and the internet of things, which should place it at the heart of our future economy—high skills, high productivity and high wage—but the debt-driven hostile takeover threatens 6,000 UK workers, pension funds and the supply chain. The Secretary of State has said that he will not comment on individual cases, so may I ask him a general question? Does he believe that it is in the national interest for City investment houses to use debt to dismantle our industrial base?”
“Engineering is a fantastic career, as I know very well, but because there are so few women engineers—just 8%—it is much harder for girls in particular to see engineering role models. Will the Minister tell me who specifically is responsible for getting more engineers into schools to share their experience and more schools into engineering companies, and how is their success being measured?”
“Q13. Over Christmas, Toon Aid and Newcastle United football fans raised more than £50,000 for the West End food bank in my constituency—which you are soon to visit, Mr Speaker—helping to feed people like John, who, despite having chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, arthritis, dyspepsia, prostatism, type 2 diabetes and anxiety and depression, was sanctioned for not trying hard enough to find work. Will the Prime Minister congratulate the people of Newcastle on their generosity, and will she explain why it was necessary?”
“The Secretary of State talks about the unnecessary vilification of her policies, but her Government were responsible for the vilification of so many mentally disabled people by presenting them as applying for benefits to which they were not entitled. I have seen the misery that such decisions caused many of my constituents, including those suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder as a consequence of sexual abuse. Will the Secretary of State now confirm the maximum amount of time that they will have to wait to have their cases reviewed?”
“In Newcastle, Carillion bought Eaga, a successful, local and partly employee-owned energy company, which was then forced to shed thousands of jobs due to the Government’s U-turn on renewable subsidies. Will the Minister agree that the people of Newcastle have been twice betrayed by his Government with regard to Carillion and commit absolutely to ensuring that jobs, pensions and our local economy do not suffer further? Let me be clear: a helpline will not cut it.”
“I would be grateful if he reaffirmed that the charity loophole is in the scope of the Government’s reforms and will not be left for the Law Commission’s review of leasehold law. I wish him, everyone else present and everyone in the House a very merry Christmas. Can he offer my constituents some Christmas relief so that they can enjoy their turkey or whatever in their homes, content that they will be able to realise the benefits of their property?”
“Listening to the debate, I found it hard to believe that we are in the United Kingdom in 2017 and yet have such confusion about property rights in property. This morning during Digital, Culture, Media and Sport questions I raised the issue of property rights in data, such as the data Facebook shares, uses and takes from us. That is confusing, but property rights in property—in a property-owning democracy with a well-established legal system—should not be. One would hope that property rights in property were clear for my constituents at least, so that they did not have to spend their time worrying about how or whether they will be able to remain in their home. I look forward to the Minister’s response.”
“The life’s work of those people is tied up in their property, and control of it is being withheld from them by impersonal, bureaucratic forces beyond their control. Since the Adjournment debate there has been some progress. The Minister has offered to meet me and, as we have heard, today the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government announced measures to curb abuse of leasehold. That is welcome and a relief to my constituents. Phyll told me today that her first reaction to the Government’s proposals was “relief that an end to our nightmare might be in sight”. She also requests that the Minister “finds solutions to help those of us currently trapped in unsellable homes”, including “a transparent and affordable way of buying our freeholds”. That is a wish that many in the Chamber would echo.”
“In Mr Philips’s words, “we are devastated to find that our house is unsalable and our nest-egg is worthless because the charity”— this is a charity, a benevolent charity— “that owns the freehold is refusing to extend our lease.” As we know, under this Government social housing tenants have a right to buy after only two years, but my constituents are not even allowed to extend their lease. How can that be acceptable? As Mr Philips says: “Every day we have to face this nightmare and it is taking a toll on our health.” Some might argue that the houses should never have been sold to their tenants, given the complexities of the charitable leasehold system and the need for social housing in Newcastle and elsewhere, but the houses were sold and bought—what faces us now is an issue of social justice.”
“Due to the fact that we cannot extend our leasehold, or buy the freehold from MMT, we are basically trapped in a very worrying and insecure situation and face the real possibility of losing our family home.” As time is short, I will not discuss all the many different examples, but I will touch on the complex combination of circumstances that has caused the situation. The specific legal issues relate to the 1967 legislation as modified by section 172 of the Housing Act 1985, which states that if a charity owns a freehold, it is not obliged to sell or extend the lease of houses on its land. My constituents cannot extend their lease and they cannot buy the freehold.”
“They cannot extend their lease because the charity that owns the freehold, the St Mary Magdalene and Holy Jesus Trust, refuses to do so. The trust was formed for the benefit of the freemen of Newcastle, their wives and children, and is now a considerable property owner in Newcastle. It owns the freehold of the St Thomas area of Newcastle as well as numerous properties in that and other areas of the city. There is also an intermediate lessee and managing agent, Home Group, which is a housing association. In refusing to extend the leasehold, the trust is causing misery to leaseholders and forcing some into financial distress. For example, Michael Armstrong said: “We are a low income family with three children and had planned to pay off our mortgage by selling the house and downsizing once our children had grown up and left the family home.”
“Howard Philips and Phyll Buchanan purchased their leasehold house on the open market in 1998. No caveats were raised by the conveyancing solicitors at the time or by the solicitors who handled their remortgage in 2003. They are now in their late 70s and feel that the time has come to move on: “The house is not suitable for our old age. The cost of maintaining these Victorian Grade II listed houses is substantial and will be a burden for the remaining years on the lease. We cannot easily manage the six flights of stairs or afford to maintain the property”. I should add that the houses are beautiful and in one of the most desirable areas of Newcastle. They cannot downsize, however, because they cannot sell their property. Their lease has less than 70 years remaining and no mortgage company would advance a loan unless the lease was extended.”
“Member for Worthing West—it is what we should call the charity loophole. I have raised the subject in an Adjournment debate, but the situation is so grotesque that I feel it is incumbent on me to set it out again in this debate. The charity loophole under the 1967 housing legislation is causing huge financial and emotional distress for many of my constituents who own leasehold property in the St Thomas area of Newcastle. They have worked all their lives, invested in property, as they have been encouraged to do, and now face their greatest asset becoming their greatest liability. I should declare an interest. The landlord of my constituency home in Newcastle, which is funded by the taxpayer, is potentially affected by the situation I am about to outline.”
“Unforeseen service charges, ground rents increased and even doubled, leaseholders unable to make modifications or sell their homes—the common factor in such problems is the state of confusion, chaos and inconsistency in which the law leaves leaseholders. In my constituency, residents at The Rise, a development in the west end of Newcastle, have struggled to receive firm or consistent information about how they may purchase the freeholds of their homes. The cost, timeframe and process for doing so is not standardised and is left entirely at the whim of the freeholder. As in similar stories we have already heard, that has caused considerable anxiety, which I am sure everyone in the Chamber recognises. The area on which I wish to focus has not been mentioned, though it was alluded to by the hon.”
“Last but—least as well! It is a pleasure to serve last under your chairmanship, Mr Bone. The hon. Member for Worthing West (Sir Peter Bottomley) asked not to be thanked, but I do thank him for securing the debate, and I also thank my hon. Friend the Member for Poplar and Limehouse (Jim Fitzpatrick). I have always found the all-party parliamentary group to be a great help when I have tried to pursue the various leasehold issues that my constituents have raised with me. Many of those issues have already been raised by colleagues. The advantage of speaking late in the debate is that I will not need to rehearse them further.”
“With a few notable exceptions, I am sure we would all agree that technology has improved the productivity of this House, but the same is not true for our country: productivity has stagnated since 2010, and we produce 25% less in an hour than the Germans and French, crippling business and making us all poorer. Last week the Chancellor tried to blame disabled workers, but his own Budget fails to invest in science and productivity until 2021. Will the Secretary of State admit that the Chancellor’s ideological austerity, meaning we fail to invest in our engines of economic growth, is the real handicap here?”
“T10. You will know, Mr Speaker, that girls and vulnerable women were subject to horrendous abuse and rape by a sexual exploitation gang in Newcastle. Some of the perpetrators were recently convicted as part of Operation Sanctuary, but there are victims who feel that they have not had justice. I know of at least one who has been denied compensation for horrific abuse, because of time spent in juvenile detention as a consequence of that abuse. Does the Minister think that is just? If not, will he amend the criminal injuries compensation scheme to ensure justice?”
“I welcome the public funding for the Tyne and Wear Metro announced in the Budget, which will come through the northern powerhouse. But if the northern powerhouse is to be anything more than a marketing gimmick, such funding must be part of an overall commitment to redress the dire imbalance in transport funding between the north and the south of England. Will the Secretary of State make that commitment here and now?”
“When I think of Muslim children in Newcastle waking up to find themselves being attacked by the President of the most powerful nation on earth, because that is how it will appear to them, my heart bleeds. The 45th President is not accountable to the children of Newcastle—it is hard to see to whom he does hold himself accountable—but the social media giants are accountable, through the Home Secretary, so what is she going to do today to demonstrate that accountability?”
“Does the Minister agree and appreciate that there will be no fracking in Scotland as a result of the legislation, and does she have any views on the implications for England as a consequence? Specifically, has she had any discussions with companies that are looking to frack in England and Wales and that may have wished to expand their operations to Scotland? That would change the size of the fracking market in the United Kingdom. Those questions aside, I have no opposition to the statutory instrument.”
“The statutory instrument makes minor amendments to existing tax legislation, such that the wording reflects the new powers over licensing granted to Scottish Ministers through the 2016 Act. I will not go into those amendments now; suffice it to say, they are minor, technical and uncontroversial changes. The statutory instrument, once it becomes law, will devolve licensing power for petroleum exploration and development to Scottish Ministers. Will the Minister confirm that that includes fracking, in addition to other more conventional forms of drilling? If, as I believe, it does, the statutory instrument means that there will be no fracking in future in Scotland—at least as long as the present devolved SNP Administration remains in place—because the First Minister has said that her Government are opposed to it.”
“It is a great pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs Moon. I thank the Minister for introducing the draft order. She, and your, Mrs Moon, have set out the title of the statutory instrument so clearly that I do not feel the need to repeat it. For the benefit of the Whips, and those Members with pressing engagements, I shall start by saying that the Labour party does not oppose the statutory instrument. As set out, the Scotland Act 2016 provides for a range of devolved powers to Scotland. As recommended by the Smith commission, it was agreed that powers related to onshore oil and gas licensing would be devolved to Scotland. That was set out in sections 47 to 49 of the 2016 Act. At the same time, as the Minister has already set out, all aspects of taxation of oil and gas receipts remain reserved.”
“The Minister accuses Labour of politicising the forensic service, yet it was his Government who chose to privatise it out of the mistaken and ideologically bankrupt view that everything is better when it is done in the private sector for the profit motive. Will he now distance himself from that ideology and recognise that public confidence in the justice system requires public servants?”
“It replaces a scheme set up in 2015 that provided for a rebate to go to companies operating in energy-intensive industries. That scheme was suspended in the summer of this year for reasons that the Government have still, even after the Minister’s speech, not made entirely clear. I would appreciate it if the Minister provided some more clarity on that point. The new regime that will be established by the statutory instrument differs substantially from the scheme that was previously in operation, chiefly in so far as it exempts energy-intensive industries from renewables obligation costs, and places the cost of exemption on to other non-exempted energy users. It is quite literally robbing Peter to pay Paul.”
“As the Minister hinted, it would also effectively export our carbon emissions: we would continue to use the same or greater amounts of steel, ceramics and other materials, but would have to import them from countries where environmental regulations are weaker. It is worth noting that even before the effect of the renewables levies, UK energy prices are high by global standards. UK prices were equal to industrialised country averages in 2010, but 40% higher than the average by 2015. The order intends to address the continuing cost of the renewables obligation on energy-intensive industries. As the Minister set out, it will set up a regime whereby energy-intensive industries are exempt from 85% of the cost that would otherwise accrue to them as a consequence of the renewables obligation regime.”
“This policy necessarily exposes companies in energy-intensive industries to higher electricity bills, to which they are more vulnerable than other electricity consumers. The costs are significant. For a business using 10 GW of electricity a year, we are talking about £215,000. As most energy-intensive industries operate in international markets, those costs place them at a competitive disadvantage, and increase the risk of investment leakage through businesses choosing instead to make investments in countries with less ambitious climate policies. That would be disastrous for UK industry and for the security of our supply of foundation materials, as I have indicated.”
“However, as we work towards a greener future and fulfil our international obligations to reduce carbon emissions, we need to develop manufacturing methods that are sustainable, including in their use of energy. That was what the renewables obligation, which was brought in by the last Labour Government in 2002, sought to achieve, by providing support drawn from energy bills for the development of renewable energy, and thus contributing to meeting the UK’s EU target to produce 15% of our energy from renewable sources by 2020 and our low-carbon goals. As the Minister set out, that system was superseded by a combination of the feed-in tariff for small-scale generators and contracts for difference for large-scale generators, but existing projects benefited from the renewables obligation and will continue to do so for a number of years.”
“Let me emphasise again that those are high-quality, highly skilled jobs, which we wish to see retained and expanded in a productive economy. The value that those industries bring to the UK economy in terms of jobs and economic output is therefore considerable. They are an important part of our manufacturing base and have a crucial role to play as part of any successful future industrial strategy. Energy-intensive industries are frequently foundation industries, producing materials that are an important part of supply chains for other industries in the UK. In an increasingly volatile world, we need strong foundation industries in Britain to ensure security in the supply of the materials on which our economy depends.”
“Although energy costs account for 3% of UK business expenditure on average, there are sectors where that figure reaches 10%, including steel, cement, paper, ceramics, glass, chemical industries and others. They are referred to, as the Minister set out, as energy-intensive industries. Those industries play a crucial role in our economy, contributing more than £52 billion to our GDP and supporting 600,000 high-quality, skilled jobs. That is an important point, because our economy lacks high-quality, skilled, well-paid jobs. Steel in particular has being crying out for support. It produces an economic output of £1.2 billion and employs 31,000 people, contributing 0.1% of the UK economy and 0.7% of manufacturing output.”
“It is a great pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Ms McDonagh. I start by thanking the Minister for bringing the draft order forward, and the Government for devoting attention to this important area—though not in as timely, transparent or logical a fashion as we would have desired. For the benefit of the Whips and those Members with pressing engagements, I shall start by saying that the Labour party does not oppose this statutory instrument. We support the ends: the aim of lowering the cost of electricity for industries that use electricity intensively, where that cost is increased by green and social obligations. However, we have serious concerns about the means that the statutory instrument uses to lower those costs and regret that the Government are incapable of providing the support that energy-intensive industries merit.”
“We believe that the Government and the public sector can make positive interventions in an entrepreneurial and innovative way to fulfil the ambitions and the potential of our industries and citizens.”
“I thank the Minister for that intervention—it is always good to have a debate—but I disagree with her strongly. It should be difficult to get money out of the Government; that could be called accountability. The reason we have a Government is that they take decisions on behalf of the population—the citizens as a whole—that support the Government’s values and objectives. The Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy should set out those objectives, including greater renewable energy and support for our foundation industries, in its industrial strategy, and be prepared to support them financially. Perhaps that is a key difference between my, and Labour’s, vision of Government and that of the hon. Lady.”
“Will the Minister also say how, where and whether the money that has been saved—as she set out—from the BEIS budget is being spent, or whether it is returning to the Exchequer? The Minister mentioned that the timing of the new scheme is falling behind. The explanatory note published with the order states a firm intention that the exemptions should come in on 1 January. The Minister set out that that date will now be missed, with a four-month delay until 1 April, as I understand it. Why has that delay been allowed to happen, and what effect will that have on the finances of energy-intensive industries? It gets worse, because the Government intend to make the changes set out in the instrument alongside another statutory instrument, the Electricity Supplier Obligations (Amendment and Excluded Electricity) (Amendment) Regulations 2017.”
“Are the Government happy that this exemption scheme will put costs up for small businesses—the backbone of our economy? Have they considered any other methods of ensuring that non-exempted customers do not have to bear the costs of the scheme in the way that has been set out? It is worth noting that the effect of the statutory instrument is to replace an energy-intensive industries compensation scheme for the effects of the renewables obligation with an exemption scheme. That means that the Government will save the money that previously went out in compensation and require the equivalent of what they have saved to go on to customers’ bills instead. The additional costs on bills undoubtedly will need to be shown. Is it the Government’s intention simply to lump them in with green and social costs, or to account for them separately?”
“From a party that styles itself as the party of enterprise and the entrepreneur, this is alarming to say the least. How did the Government arrive at such a drastically unfair solution to what should have been a reasonably simple exercise of updating or replacing the rebate system? In spring 2016, the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills consulted on a new scheme to replace the rebate scheme. The consultation ran for eight weeks and looked in detail at the plans to implement an exemption scheme, receiving 69 responses. I am unclear as to how, after consulting on the proposals, the Government arrived at this solution, which will hit the bills of ordinary energy customers, and particularly small and medium-sized enterprises.”
“The Minister made reference to consumers, and the increase that they will see. According to the explanatory memorandum, for small business energy users the increase is likely to be £160 per year, but for a medium-sized business energy user it is likely to be about £6,700 per year. To put that in context, the Business Energy monitor sets out that the average small business spends just over £2,000 per year on electricity, and the average medium-sized business spends £3,146 per year on electricity. The increase necessitated by the statutory instrument is huge—seemingly a tripling of electricity bills for medium-sized businesses. I hope that the Minister will say what the actual impact on businesses will be in percentage terms, and what discussions she has had with the Federation of Small Businesses, for example, to assess that impact.”
“Thank you, Ms McDonagh. I am glad to have inspired such passion in the Minister. You must allow me a brief response on the difference between taxation and energy bills. Taxation is decided by the Government, comes generally from the people—hopefully in a progressive way, where the greatest shoulders bear the greatest burden; not as it is under this Government—and is then redistributed. When it comes to energy bills, however, the people who are the poorest and coldest may bear the greatest burden. Ms McDonagh is looking at me as if I may be exhausting her patience, so let me move swiftly on. The explanatory memorandum suggests that the legislation will cause real problems, specifically for small and medium-sized companies, which will see their bills increase substantially.”
“However, we recognise the urgent need to reinstate some form of cost-reduction scheme for the renewables obligation costs of energy-intensive industries. As such, although we have put on the record strongly and at some length our disagreement with several aspects of the statutory instrument, we will not oppose it.”
“In the updated levy control framework that was released yesterday, the Government committed to “no new low carbon electricity levies until 2025.” If I am not wrong, this statutory instrument seeks to implement just that—a new low carbon electricity levy. Will the Minister confirm that this is yet another example of the Government tying themselves in knots and U-turning on a policy before it is even brought into law? In conclusion, our party does not support this system for the long term. If a Labour Government had been elected in June, we would not have done it in this way. We call on the Government to review the system with a view to returning to a rebate system, provided that we establish continuity of rebate and a stable environment for energy-intensive industries to work in.”
“Does the Minister accept that and does she think that that will affect the timetable for implementation further, with a possible delay beyond 1 April? Why were the draft regulations not laid simultaneously with the order we are debating, so that we could have enjoyed debating them both and so that the uncertainty could have been cleared up straightaway? Yesterday’s Budget has thrown up a new flaw in the Government’s policy in this area, which I would argue demonstrates the lack of seriousness with which they are treating the task in hand of supporting our energy-intensive and foundation industries.”
“I could, but I will not. That legislation was laid in draft in March 2017 and was subject to a continuation motion in June, but I understand that it has not yet been formally debated and agreed. That statutory instrument contains a number of amendments to the 2015 legislation, in addition to those proposed in the order we are discussing. In particular, it includes a schedule specifying which industries are to be exempt, which the Minister mentioned. It looks, on the face of it, as though the regime that is due to come into place as a result of the order will be uncertain in its extent, and hence difficult for companies to plan for, since there will remain unfinished business in terms of definition and other matters.”
“I thank the Minister for that clarification; it is an important point. SMEs can apply for the exemption but they would need to be in energy-intensive industries, as set out in the schedules to the 2015 order, which I understand will be updated. They may not know, as yet, whether they can apply for it. They may have a large bill without necessarily being in an energy-intensive industry.”
“As well as fibre and base stations, data is a key part of digital infrastructure. The Minister claims that his Data Protection Bill will put people in control of their own data, but it systematically strips various groups, including immigrants, of any control. What is he doing to ensure that people can actually control their own data?”
“Seven people per day in my constituency are going into A&E because of toothache, and the poorest among us are twice as likely to be hospitalised for dental care. Yet there is no mention of dental care in the “Five Year Forward View”, and funding has fallen by 15% since 2010. Why is the Minister leaving my constituents in pain and overburdening A&E by neglecting dental care?”