Stephen Farry
North Down · Alliance Party · Northern Ireland
“Speaking for a party that has a longer pedigree in advocating a public inquiry than both the DUP and Sinn Féin, I nonetheless welcome this announcement, despite the torturous path that we have had and, indeed, the missed opportunities.”
“The first was a reform of the petition of concern to take it back to the original intent when it was designed in 1998. It was clear at that stage that Arlene Foster banged the table and said, "No, never. We are not doing that. That is a way whereby we are going to have to fold on equal marriage: it's not happening".”
“<BR /> <BR />The main points that I make concern the substance of the order. There are probably three aspects that the Minister needs to address properly before the Assembly, and they really relate to what other options he has.”
“That raises the question of why they want to go as far as 2022, especially when I am not sure — I would welcome any clarification to the contrary on it — that there has been formal Executive approval of this.”
“<BR /> <BR />There are three major substantive issues that I do not believe have been properly aired on this: VAT; European Commission infraction proceedings; and, most important, the opportunity foregone to revisit the classification of Northern Ireland Water and the ability, through a separate water charge, to allow it to borrow commerc…”
“While my party was supportive of the Good Friday Agreement back in 1998, at that time, we expressed some reservations around the very detailed nature of the proposals and how those could, in due course, destabilise Northern Ireland and prevent us from realising our full potential. We have been very much vindicated in that analysis.”
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“Furthermore, even the maximum fee grants are often not enough to cover the full cost of tuition fees. <BR /> <BR />Last June, I launched a consultation on options to improve the part-time support package. Following that consultation, I announced a decision to introduce a top-up tuition fee loan for part-time students. That solution will protect grant-based support for those who need it most while allowing students to top up those grants with loans, should they need to, to the equivalent value of full-time tuition fee loans, depending on a student's intensity of study. That combination of grants and loans for part-time tuition fee support is unique in the UK. It will vastly improve access to financial support for part-time students and ensure closer parity with their full-time counterparts.”
“I was recently pleased to announce changes to how part-time undergraduate students will receive financial support. Under present arrangements, they can access grants of up to £1,230 for their tuition fees. Those are called fee grants. They can also access smaller grants of up to £265 to support them with course-related costs such as books and equipment. Both of those grants are income-assessed, however, and, to be eligible for the maximum fee grant, the student's income must be below £16,843. Although those grants can be really important sources of support for students from lower-income backgrounds, about three quarters of our part-time students are not eligible to receive them.”
“There is no doubt that having a single Department for the Economy will bring a much sharper focus to that, but it is important that we invest in the key growth sectors in technology to make sure that we remain not just competitive but to the forefront of future developments.”
“There are probably two aspects to that. I certainly took the opportunity to drop in at a number of different events, as I know the Member did. I thank him for his support in that regard, as it is important that we support the festival directly. <BR /> <BR />There is also the ongoing challenge of ensuring that we are investing in science more generally. In some respects, I have a responsibility for skills, and we have been investing very heavily in STEM. It has been a feature of not just my Department but, to be fair, the Department of Education, DCAL and others. We also have to look to the infrastructure around science. As a Department, we can work with the universities directly, but there may well be other investments that fall elsewhere.”
“It has to be a partnership between government and the private sector, which will benefit from the STEM skills. I have no doubt that that will help to ensure that the festival becomes a self-sustaining feature on the calendar for many decades to come.”
“The festival is really capturing the imagination of a whole cross-section of the population of Northern Ireland, and it is done for the very important reasons of investing in the future of our economy and making sure that we are enthusing young people about science and the exciting opportunities that flow from that into the future. I have no doubt that any future Minister for the Economy will wish to support it, but I have given a commitment to the festival organisers of at least a further three years of government support for the endeavour. That is not just about managing the risk but about allowing them to go out with a solid foundation and to attract more and more commercial sponsors, in the knowledge that there is a solid commitment from government.”
“I thank the Member for his comments, which I assure you, Mr Deputy Speaker, were not scripted in the least. They were spontaneous and from the heart, even though I am going slightly red. <BR /> <BR />In response to Mr McCarthy's question, let me stress that, when the proposal was initially brought to the attention of the Department, it was hoped that the festival would attract 10,000 visitors. That target was very quickly exceeded. This year, we are set to break through the very successful figures from last year.”
“It is very encouraging to see young people enthused by subjects that will form the basis of our future prosperity. I have no doubt that the festival has succeeded in enthusing and inspiring people here about STEM study and careers, and I am pleased to have committed to supporting the festival for another three years.”
“That is vital, as the skills barometer indicates that skills and jobs related to science, technology, engineering and maths will be central to our future economic success. We must ensure that a pipeline of suitably skilled people will be available to fill those roles. <BR /> <BR />The festival's events help to show how STEM skills form the backbone to a range of exciting careers and interests. The aim of the festival is to make science accessible and fun. So events such as exploding custard, the science of 'Star Wars', and life as an astronaut are designed to appeal to a young audience to encourage them to look at science and STEM in new ways. <BR /> <BR />This year also saw the first STEM quest challenge, which was a STEM-related quiz for school pupils, which attracted over 80 teams.”
“The science festival ran from 18 to 28 February. I am pleased to say that, once again, it has exceeded expectations. Over 120 events took place across Northern Ireland, attracting leading figures from the science world, such as Professor Robert Winston; a leading psychologist, Professor Richard Wiseman; and Robert Schukai from Thomson Reuters who delivered the Turing lecture. Last year's event attracted over 50,000 visitors, and, following discussion with the organisers, we anticipate that when the final numbers are confirmed, even more will have attended this year. <BR /> <BR />My Department is the principal sponsor of the festival, and I regard it as an excellent vehicle for promoting the STEM agenda.”
“However, when we talk about the cross-Executive approach, what can be done on the wider childcare policy and resourcing will also have an impact on economic inactivity, whether directly through the strategy or on a free-standing basis.”
“I do accept that, and that is the rationale for having a strategy. We do not accept this as a static situation that must for ever be a feature of the Northern Ireland economy or, indeed, our society. The strategy targets those groups for which there are potential barriers. That includes those with work-limiting disabilities, who tend to be male and older than the population average as a whole, and those with caring and family commitments, who tend to be female and younger on the whole, and childcare is one of several issues for them. We had hoped to do pilot testing involving the community and voluntary sector on some projects and, no doubt, that would have touched on childcare.”
“<BR /> <BR />One small light on the horizon, however, lies in the fact that, in the Fresh Start deal — people know the attitude of my party to that overall — there is a notion that there may well be savings to be found from tackling error and fraud in social security and that there is potential for that money to be, amongst other directions, aimed at resourcing an economic inactivity strategy. So I will urge those who follow in my footsteps to keep a close eye on that as one potential funding opportunity for the future.”
“<BR /> <BR />The economic inactivity strategy should be viewed very much in that regard where we are helping those who are most vulnerable by trying to give them assistance. So, in some ways, you can make a case that economic inactivity is a much more benign form of how we address the fact that we have a lot of people who are on welfare in Northern Ireland as opposed to the more punitive approach that has been forced upon us by the UK Government. The strategy should be viewed in a positive light.”
“I am not sure whether there was a question directed at me in that comment or whether it was a largely rhetorical statement. However, let me say this: we do not have a "so-called strategy" sitting on the shelf; we have a strategy and it is on the shelf. I accept that that is the case and that it is not where we should be. Indeed, I have shared, although I might have expressed it differently, some of the concerns voiced by Mr Allister and others about the relative priority that we make. We help those who are vulnerable through a host of spending interventions, of which welfare payments is only one. We also have to be mindful of ensuring that we are not simply keeping people on welfare but ensuring that we are providing a ladder to allow people to take advantage of other opportunities.”
“<BR /> <BR />It goes without saying, however, that this has to be something that is addressed on a cross-departmental basis so that, no matter what structures are put in place in the end, all of the Executive need to put their shoulders to the wheel to address this particular issue. I think it is in that light that we need to look to the future.”
“Again, it is worth stating that I have been on record on many occasions saying that all the employment service should be integrated within the Department for the Economy. That way, you have the full synergies that arise. Obviously, the case for going into the Department for Communities is based to an extent on ease in different compliance issues, but I think those can be worked across two Departments if necessary. There is a much greater prize of ensuring that what we are doing is fully linked to the needs of the economy, and it is within the setting of the Department for the Economy that you can do that. It involves, for example, working closely with employers proactively on not just economic inactivity but a host of other strategies to help people to enter and remain in the labour market.”
“It is something that we have to get to grips with one way or another for the lost lives of those who are affected and because of the impact on the economy of not fully utilising all the resources available to us.”
“I certainly share the Member's concern about the fact that there are no resources for it. I would not say that we have not been taking the issue seriously. The fact is that it has been a structural problem for Northern Ireland for the best part of three decades. It is only in the current mandate of the Assembly that we have had Northern Ireland's first strategy on this. It is also the first such strategy in any part of the UK. Obviously, there is no point having strategies if they sit on the shelf. It is certainly my concern — I share the Member's concerns on this — that it is not being implemented. This remains a major structural problem within the economy.”
“<BR /> <BR />On the proposal that economic inactivity will become the responsibility of the new Department for Communities, it is my personal view that it would better fit within the new Department for the Economy. However, to reiterate the key issue, the scope and scale of the strategy and the major challenges therein means that those issues can be addressed only through the total and combined commitment of all of the Executive and Departments, along with a host of other key stakeholders from every sector.”
“A research-mapping exercise of economic inactivity service provision in Northern Ireland, aimed at the strategy's key target groups, has been completed. <BR /> <BR />The Department for Social Development is leading on a pilot project in the new Derry City and Strabane District Council area. That project is based on early and more intensive engagement with new claimants of the employment and support allowance benefit, who are the biggest single group of clients categorised as economically inactive. <BR /> <BR />However, due to the ongoing pressure on budgets, the Executive have not allocated any significant funding to date, including for the 2016-17 financial year, for the more general implementation of the strategy. At this point in time, therefore, Enabling Success remains largely unresourced and its implementation severely hindered.”
“With your permission, Mr Deputy Speaker, I will group questions 1 and 6, and I would like an additional minute for the answer. <BR /> <BR />Enabling Success, the Executive's strategy aimed at reducing the level of economic inactivity in Northern Ireland, was officially launched on 20 April 2015 by my Department and the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Investment. However, the strategy has been developed in close partnership with other Departments, including DSD and the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety, and with Invest NI. <BR /> <BR />The implementation of the strategy over the proposed 15-year period is based on 11 key projects that are to be managed and resourced on a cross-departmental basis.”
“It is important that we have a spectrum — indeed, a hierarchy — of interventions to prevent disputes in the first place and to address them when they occur as early as possible. That is very much in the interests of employers, employees and the wider economy. The Bill puts us in a very strong position. Some major innovation has gone into the process. Again, I pass on my thanks to colleagues on the Committee, and, indeed, in the Assembly, for their support, particularly in relation to the Bill, over the past weeks and months.”
“As the Member outlined, that round table happens under the auspices of the Labour Relations Agency, which is an arm's-length body of my Department. It has the capacity to continue that, so I see no real prospect of it falling. If the goodwill is there, the process should continue. It is a very valuable resource. <BR /> <BR />I thank Mr Diver for his comments on the process before us. In conclusion, I put on record my personal thanks to my officials for their work, not just on this Bill over the past number of weeks but on the whole review of employment law over the years. I believe that it has put us in a much stronger position in Northern Ireland as regards employment relations.”
“Indeed, as we look ahead and in advance of drafting and launching a fresh consultation on zero-hours or something on the gender pay audit, there will be an opportunity for that engagement to occur between the different stakeholders in parallel with discussions with the incoming Committee. I think that spirit of collaboration has been so important in getting us where we are today. I certainly encourage any successor to continue that work because it produces very positive results. It certainly puts us in a much stronger position in how we deal with those matters than either of the other employment law jurisdictions in these islands. I think we are in a good place in that regard.”
“I have no doubt that the Member, if he is back in the Assembly, will be very keen to hold to account any future Minister, including one from his own party, for any foot-dragging on that. For my part, I certainly recognise the importance of proceeding with some proportionate regulation of zero-hours contracts. I think that sentiment is reflected on all sides of the House, but where there is a difference is probably in the scale of the regulation. That is something that needs to be bottomed out in the engagement with stakeholders. <BR /> <BR />That gives me the opportunity to reference that we have a very strong working relationship between the employer side and employee representatives, including trade unions. We have discussed many aspects of the legislation.”
“I think what the Member suggests is a very wise approach. It would unfold through officials doing the work now to commence a paper that could go to the incoming Committee for the Economy once the next mandate proceeds. Being realistic, we will not see any pre-consultative approach with the Committee this side of the elections; it will be afterwards. I would like to think that the new Department and the relevant officials will be in a position to move fairly quickly to engage with the new Committee before going out to a consultation on those regulations. <BR /> <BR />I certainly take it from the Member and others that there will be a desire to see the new Department moving quickly.”
“I am sure that will be a piece of work that any incoming Minister for the Economy will want to pick up and proceed with, and, indeed, it could —”
“With the benefit of hindsight, this may prove to be the right way to go, albeit that it is a situation that we found ourselves in through the force of circumstance, rather than through any wider debate on that point. It is fair to say that, in some ways, it creates certainty in some aspects of what we are doing. For example, it is very clear how we are changing the law on how we approach changes in unfair dismissal. Other aspects will need to be commenced. I assure Mr Flanagan that there is no reason to hold back the commencement of these things. Once they are ready to be implemented, we will proceed on that basis. That is certainly my commitment, and I am sure that will go for any future Minister for the Economy. I hope that we will commence work in the very near future on drafting a fresh consultation on zero-hours contracts.”
“It will be much easier to do that through regulations, rather than needing to constantly have fresh primary legislation to address situations. We could have a situation where some unscrupulous employers are able to get around what we have put in place or where what is before us in terms of case law does not reflect the original intent of the Assembly through the original draft regulations or, indeed, primary legislation.”
“<BR /> <BR />The situation with zero-hours contracts and the regulation thereof is a very new area of law. Not much case law has been developed so far. We may need to return to that and to tinker and fine-tune as we go.”
“<BR /> <BR />Other comments were made by Mr Flanagan and Mr Diver around, in particular, the situation of zero-hours contracts. That ties in with the comments of the Deputy Chair around the fact that we have the platform of the enabling provisions. I think that it is fair to reflect that the balance to be found between putting things in the Bill and in regulations is often a fine one. Obviously, our hands were somewhat forced in this context by the lack of available time at the end of a mandate to do otherwise. Nonetheless, all things being equal, there is still a balance to be found between what you put in a Bill and what you put in regulations. It may well be, in a couple of years, with the benefit of hindsight, that proceeding on the basis of regulations will be proven to be the right way to go.”
“The Deputy Chair of the Committee said that the Bill is not perfect and spoke of things we may wished to have done differently had time allowed for wider scrutiny. Obviously, we find ourselves in the circumstances where we are. I believe — I am sure that the Deputy Chair concurs — that this is the best product that we have in the context of the opportunity that was available to us and in the circumstances that we found ourselves in. <BR /> <BR />I very much concur with his remark that this is simultaneously good for employers and employees. This is not about some sort of zero-sum game where a win for one is a loss for the other, or vice versa; this is about creating a situation that works in the interests of both, and, indeed, all stakeholders in our society and, more directly, in the workplace.”
“I thank all the Members who spoke for their universally positive comments. I put on record my thanks to the Chair and his colleagues for all their work on the Bill; it has been a marathon process over the past number of years, and, indeed, there will be a lot of work to undertake in the new mandate. In many ways, the Bill is platform on which we can build for the future. <BR /> <BR />It is appropriate, particularly in this process, that the Bill before us at Final Stage is a shared product not just of the Department but of the Committee and, indeed, the wider Assembly, not least given the number of amendments that came in at the eleventh hour. <BR /> <BR />Members have mentioned the fact that we now have that platform.”
“<BR /> <BR />The measures in the Bill will contribute to Northern Ireland’s economic prospects by strengthening employment protections, providing more options for resolving workplace disputes and supporting our young people to develop their full potential. It is a Bill that is forward-looking and strengthens the framework for employment rights and skills development in Northern Ireland, and I commend it to the Assembly.”
“<BR /> <BR />In agreeing to the passage of the Bill today, we will be reaching the end of the beginning. The Bill establishes a positive framework for action, much of which will happen within the next year to 18 months. The hard work of redefining policy and developing regulations starts now. The Bill sets challenges for the future Administration in a number of areas, not least those of zero-hours contracts and gender pay. It is clearly the will of the House that steps be taken on those important issues, and I expect that the new Assembly will want to monitor closely the action that has been taken.”
“The new arrangements will help to deliver highly skilled employees in areas of importance for the economy of today and tomorrow. The regulations will underpin that work. <BR /> <BR />Those are the key features of what I hope Members agree is a positive and progressive Bill. I have not detailed every provision, but I am happy to deal with any questions that Members may have. In closing, I want to highlight the importance of the Bill in the wider economic context. It is a Bill that has taken lessons from developments elsewhere; for example, on early conciliation and public interest disclosure. However, in a number of cases, such as neutral assessment and zero-hours contracts, we have, quite rightly, accepted that devolution can deliver solutions that are better suited to the people of Northern Ireland. That is the correct approach.”
“Clause 21, which deals with apprenticeships and traineeships, empowers the Department in regulations to set out the components of and conditions under which traineeships and apprenticeships will operate in Northern Ireland. That will ensure that the vision articulated in the new strategies for apprenticeships and youth training is appropriately defined. The strategies set out an ambitious programme that is designed to radically and positively reform the training and skills landscape in Northern Ireland for learners and employers. An important feature of the new model is that apprenticeships will start at level 3 — the equivalent of A level — and will allow for progression to higher professional, technical or academic pathways up to level 8, which is equivalent to a PhD.”
“It will require the Department to make arrangements to ensure that everyone can receive impartial careers guidance that is in their best interests. Members of the Committee wanted assurance that action would be taken, and I am content that the clause now requires, rather than empowers, the Department to act. <BR /> <BR />A refreshed careers strategy, published today by my Department and, coincidentally, by the Department of Education, sets out a coherent and forward-thinking strategic vision for the careers system in Northern Ireland. The clause supports that vision, which balances the twin goals of supporting individuals to realise their full potential and contributing to our economic prosperity, by raising awareness of employment growth sectors.”
“I stand open to correction in this case, but this might be the first legislative equality matter passed under devolution rather than under direct rule. I would have preferred for this to have been taken forward in the context of the full process of consultation and scrutiny by OFMDFM, but I recognise that there was a consensus in the House that this was a desirable way forward, given, in particular, that we are leaving considerable aspects to regulations that will themselves be subject to consultation. So the House can be satisfied that we have a structured way forward, around which we will address this important issue. <BR /> <BR />Clause 20 relates to careers guidance and stems from a key recommendation in the Employment and Learning Committee report following its extensive inquiry into careers in 2013.”
“I regret that it was not possible to develop and properly scrutinise the detailed measures on the basis of Executive agreement on this issue, as that was not forthcoming, but an enabling power represents a reasonable way forward. That approach allows regulations to be developed that, following consultation, will meet the specific needs of Northern Ireland. I hope that the process of devising regulations can commence shortly, but obviously final regulations cannot be set in place without the prior agreement of the Executive and the Assembly. <BR /> <BR />The Bill also contains a clause to set a framework that will require employers to publish information showing whether gender pay disparities exist between employees and, where they do, to publish an action plan to eliminate them.”
“Taken together with enabling powers to deliver neutral assessment to help people to better appreciate where they stand in their case, and the strengthening of confidentiality protections for LRA services, the Bill presents a positive package of measures that will assist in broadening options to resolve workplace disputes, which can be stressful, costly, and time-consuming. None of these changes will compromise any individual’s absolute right to apply to a tribunal. <BR /> <BR />The Bill also deals with employment protections. It contains changes that deal with public interest disclosure protections to strengthen people’s confidence in reporting negligent, improper or illegal practices in an organisation. <BR /> <BR />The Bill makes enabling provision to deal with the abuse of zero-hours contracts.”
“I also want to thank those who gave up their time to lay the foundations of the measures in the Bill: stakeholders have engaged very positively throughout the employment law review. <BR /> <BR />The Bill establishes a framework for strengthening employment protections and supporting the earlier resolution of workplace disputes. It also seeks to strengthen the delivery of impartial careers guidance and to upskill our workforce through apprenticeships and traineeships. <BR /> <BR />A key measure widely supported by stakeholders is the establishment of a new early conciliation service to be delivered by the Labour Relations Agency (LRA).”
“I thank the House for its agreement to suspend the Standing Order to allow Final Stage to proceed now. I am pleased that this important Bill has reached its Final Stage today. Given that it was introduced on 7 December, it is remarkable, and a credit to all concerned, that we have been able to reach Final Stage on this first day of March. This is possibly a record for a Bill in Northern Ireland that has not been subject to the procedure for accelerated passage. That swift progress has been in no small part due to the work of the Employment and Learning Committee in facilitating a demanding timetable. I want again to express my appreciation to the Committee Chair as well as the members and staff for the detailed scrutiny that has been properly provided in spite of the short time available.”
“<BR /> <BR />I appreciate, of course, that, under Standing Orders, the Speaker has, in any case, to be satisfied that the Bill may properly proceed to Final Stage. I understand that he is so satisfied. I would be grateful, therefore, for the Assembly’s support for the motion to suspend Standing Order 42(1) for the passage of the Employment Bill. That will in no way diminish the Assembly’s scrutiny role but would allow me, subject to the Assembly’s approval, to move the Final Stage of the Bill today as previously planned. I commend the motion to the House.”
“In the absence of action in the meantime, the Final Stage will not now be able to take place today as expected. <BR /> <BR />While, with the Business Committee’s agreement, the Final Stage could be put back to next week or the following week, I was conscious that that would increase further the pressure on the Assembly’s time as we approach the end of the mandate. My preference, therefore, was to ask the Assembly to agree that Standing Order 42(1) be suspended for the passage of the Bill so that the minimum interval between stages no longer applies and the Final Stage can proceed today as planned. I am grateful to the Business Committee for agreeing that the necessary item of business could be added to today’s Order Paper to ensure that the Assembly can consider the issue.”
“Members will be aware from the Order Paper that the Final Stage of the Employment Bill is due to take place today. The scheduling was in anticipation of the Further Consideration Stage being completed last Monday, 22 February, so that the requirement of Standing Order 42(1), which is that there be a minimum interval of five working days between stages, would be complied with. <BR /> <BR />Most of the debate at Further Consideration Stage did, indeed, take place on 22 February. However, because of the presentation of a valid petition of concern on two amendments that day, the remainder of the stage was not completed until 23 February. That means that there is no longer the minimum interval required between the completion of Further Consideration Stage and the scheduling of Final Stage.”
“I thank the Member for giving way. I appreciate his point that we are all being consistent on being inconsistent today, but can the Member have a go at trying to reconcile his approach where his colleague proposed an amendment earlier today to this legislation that modified equality legislation, which is the responsibility of OFMDFM, without any public consultation or discussion in any format whatever, while he is perfectly content to oppose that being done with another matter on which there has been quite a bit of debate?”
“<BR /> <BR />We have already accepted the principle that my Bill today is a bit of a free-for-all and does not have to refer to matters that extend directly to my Department or the Department for the Economy, but we are drawing an artificial line around this issue for some bizarre reason that I cannot understand and virtually no other Member seems to understand.”
“The arguments that those who propose it are using are the selfsame arguments as have been used to justify them doing something in OFMDFM on equality matters today — on a matter on which there has not been any debate in the Assembly, certainly not in my time as an MLA over the past nine years. At least you can say that the teacher exemption to fair employment legislation has been discussed and voted on in the Assembly. Until we had the discussion and vote today, there had not been a single vote in the Assembly on gender pay. Members from Sinn Féin saw fit to proceed with that and to set out prescription on the way forward, but they are not prepared to do that on an issue that is well established and on which everyone seems to agree we want to see change.”