Stephen Farry
North Down · Alliance Party · Northern Ireland
“Speaking for a party that has a longer pedigree in advocating a public inquiry than both the DUP and Sinn Féin, I nonetheless welcome this announcement, despite the torturous path that we have had and, indeed, the missed opportunities.”
“The first was a reform of the petition of concern to take it back to the original intent when it was designed in 1998. It was clear at that stage that Arlene Foster banged the table and said, "No, never. We are not doing that. That is a way whereby we are going to have to fold on equal marriage: it's not happening".”
“<BR /> <BR />The main points that I make concern the substance of the order. There are probably three aspects that the Minister needs to address properly before the Assembly, and they really relate to what other options he has.”
“That raises the question of why they want to go as far as 2022, especially when I am not sure — I would welcome any clarification to the contrary on it — that there has been formal Executive approval of this.”
“<BR /> <BR />There are three major substantive issues that I do not believe have been properly aired on this: VAT; European Commission infraction proceedings; and, most important, the opportunity foregone to revisit the classification of Northern Ireland Water and the ability, through a separate water charge, to allow it to borrow commerc…”
“While my party was supportive of the Good Friday Agreement back in 1998, at that time, we expressed some reservations around the very detailed nature of the proposals and how those could, in due course, destabilise Northern Ireland and prevent us from realising our full potential. We have been very much vindicated in that analysis.”
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“That ensured that clients from Lurgan, Portadown and surrounding areas could participate. <BR /> <BR />I am pleased that there has been a steady rise in the attendance at job fairs due to the measures put in place.”
“They are also advertised through local media, press releases, social media sites, my Department’s website, JobCentre Online and through sending leaflets to local community groups, libraries and colleges. <BR /> <BR />My officials also take local geographical considerations into account and organise a community bus facility for rural areas, if required, to afford clients in those areas an opportunity to participate. In the lead-up to job fair events, my officials work with clients locally to remove any barriers to attendance and to ensure that every possible effort is made to allow clients to attend. That approach was successfully used during the recent job fair in Ballymoney, where community buses transported clients from Ballycastle and the surrounding areas to Ballymoney. The same practice was used for last week’s job fair in Craigavon.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Department has also held a number of local community events where attendees have been offered full-time employment, while others progressed into a work placement opportunity. After the recent event in Kilcooley in Bangor, eight clients progressed into work, 45 were offered a work placement opportunity and three commenced the skills development programme. <BR /> <BR />Importantly, following on from those events, many employers have requested my Department’s assistance with bespoke recruitment events, therefore providing further opportunities for local clients and communities. <BR /> <BR />Job fairs are promoted actively to unemployed clients visiting local jobs and benefits offices and job centres.”
“Mr Principal Deputy Speaker, with your permission, I wish to group questions 2 and 10 together and to request an additional minute for the answer. <BR /> <BR />Bringing job fairs and information days into the heart of local communities has proven to be a very successful way of helping people into employment. In 2014, job fairs were held in Belfast, Derry, Ballymoney and Newry, and one was recently held in Craigavon. I am pleased that feedback from employers, support organisations and local clients has been encouraging. <BR /> <BR />Those who attend can be interviewed for a job. Additional services are available on those days, including online job searches and participation in a job club workshop, where those who attend create their own CV. They also get tips and techniques about interviews.”
“The Member makes a very valid point. To that end, as we have sought to design our different apprenticeship and youth training programmes looking to the future, as well as our provision under Pathways to Success for our NEETs strategy, we have been very mindful of ensuring that those involved in the provision of training are alert to the risks of bullying, including homophobic bullying, and on how to ensure that there is proper pastoral support. Indeed, one of the key design features of the new youth training system, the public consultation of which is closing, is a much stronger focus on pastoral care than has been the case up until now.”
“Colleges should also look at how, in general, they can ensure that they have good, efficient practices in place that will robustly challenge in those situations where there is a clear breach of equality duties, including intimidation and bullying.”
“I thank the Member for his comment. I join him in paying tribute to the leadership across the third-level education sector in ensuring that we have a welcoming environment. <BR /> <BR />My specific points in response to his question relate to how colleges can engage with the wider community through, for example, local policing and community safety structures and how they can engage with the community and voluntary sector, particularly the organisations that lobby, campaign and provide welfare in relation to different section 75 categories, including, for example, the LGBT sector.”
“Our colleges and universities are very mindful to ensure that we have a neutral environment where people can learn together. A neutral environment does not need to be a homogenised environment where expression of culture is removed from that situation. Clearly, where complaints are made in that regard, whether to student unions or the authorities, you need to take those comments extremely seriously.”
“In that context, I am somewhat surprised that the Member is challenging the good practice that happens in the FE and HE sectors, compared with what has not happened in our schools.”
“Obviously, colleges and universities are taking measures forward, and those measures are constantly reviewed. Indeed, we seek updates from the colleges to that end. I am stunned — indeed, I am shocked — that the Member, given that she is a former Education Minister, is challenging what happens in the FE and HE sector, where good practice is in place. In the wider community, there have been demands for successive Education Ministers, including the Member, to ensure that we have proper effective measures in our school setting to deal with, specifically, homophobic bullying and not just bullying in general. That has been a major gap in provision over the past number of years.”
“Those policies and procedures continue to be monitored, reviewed and updated when necessary.”
“In the FE sector, all colleges have in place a range of pastoral care arrangements aimed at promoting the health and well-being of students by providing them with access to appropriate guidance and support, including personal safety and protection, anti-bullying, harassment, self-harm and suicide. Initiatives in place include running awareness and promotional events, training staff in combating bullying, providing support to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) groups in college campuses, engaging with the Rainbow Project and working with college student unions. In the higher education sector, institutions engage in a range of positive practices. All higher education institutions have anti-bullying policies and procedures in place that cover homophobic bullying.”
“Each further education (FE) college and higher education (HE) institution is required, as a public authority, to have in place an equality scheme and to report to the Equality Commission on steps taken to promote equality of opportunity for categories listed in section 75 of the Northern Ireland Act 1998. <BR /> <BR />During 2013, I asked my officials to conduct an audit of how our colleges and universities were taking forward policies to combat homophobia. The results of the audit confirmed that all our institutions engaged in a range of positive practices in that area.”
“— but it is vital that, in achieving that, we rise above the narrow interests of institutions and focus on the interests of future students.”
“<BR /> <BR />Let me be very clear: what we have with the amendment is a call to support institutions. It is not an amendment to support access to education and training opportunities, nor is it an amendment designed to create a system of teacher training in Northern Ireland that has long-term financial sustainability. I am clear that providing a system of teacher training that is high-class, sustainable and reflects the needs of our society is achievable —”
“However, you see a wider international picture emerging, with examples very close to our own shores. That raises this question: if it is good enough for Dublin and Glasgow, what is so different about Northern Ireland? Are we simply prepared to say that Northern Ireland is the way it is and always will be, so we have to continue to train our teachers in the same way? What signal are we sending out about the society that we want to build in Northern Ireland? What signal are we sending out about the importance that we place on developing shared and inclusive education across a range of models, from integrated schools to shared campuses? How can we expect our children to learn together if we are not prepared to face up to the opportunity for our teachers to learn together?”
“It is very important that we understand that point. In recent years, Catholic teacher training colleges have amalgamated with universities — for example, in Glasgow. In Dublin, the Catholic and Church of Ireland sectors have come together, with specific provisions agreed and introduced to ensure that training for the specific requirements of faith-based schools is addressed. The Ulster University at Coleraine already prepares teachers for all sectors, with requirements for working in faith schools integrated into the curriculum. No doubt, people will want to ascribe all those changes to the Alliance Party policy on teacher training, but of course they all happened either before my time as Minister or entirely independently of the situation in Northern Ireland.”
“<BR /> <BR />A reformed system could conceivably include a Catholic or other faith-based institution that is more tightly tied to a stronger, overarching framework. Equally, there are no compelling reasons why teachers cannot be trained in a shared and integrated environment, either with distinct strands that can cater for the needs of particular sectors or through all teachers being provided with the skills and knowledge to work across all types of school in our education system. I stress that all the points that I have made in relation to faith-based education can also be applied to the Irish-medium sector. <BR /> <BR />In essence, we do not necessarily have to have a Catholic — or otherwise — institution to ensure that we cater for all faith-based schools, including those in the Catholic maintained sector.”
“We have had meetings with all the providers over the past week, building on previous engagement with the stakeholders. I regret that, for various reasons, there are not ongoing discussions between the two university colleges at this time. We are considering how best to take forward the next phase, and it may well involve round-table discussions with all the providers. The precise format is still to be determined. <BR /> <BR />One of the other key considerations is to ensure that a reformed teacher training system can provide for a diverse and pluralist education system and society, including provision for faith-based education. Northern Ireland will clearly continue to have faith-based primary and secondary schools. I want to make it very clear that any potential reforms to teacher training will not pose a threat to that.”
“I am open-minded on any alternatives that may carry consensus, are financially sustainable, increase sharing and integration in training and deliver a greater relationship with research in line with international best practice.”
“In effect, we pay more than is necessary for a divided and fragmented system without reaching our full potential in terms of quality. While I recognise that the removal of the premia will be very challenging for the teacher training university colleges and will involve major reassessments of future delivery, there is no immediate prospect of either institution closing, whether we are speaking of April or September of this year. I want to put to bed the myth that either is on the brink of closure: both are sitting with significant reserves. <BR /> <BR />A report by an international panel of experts that I commissioned produced a range of alternative configurations for our teacher education system.”
“It costs considerably more to train a teacher in Northern Ireland than in the rest of the UK, and it costs almost one third more to train a teacher in the two teacher training university colleges — Stranmillis and St. Mary’s — than a teacher or other higher education student in Queen’s University and Ulster University. Our current system is good, but we are not keeping pace with international developments and, in particular, the trend that teacher training is best located in a university setting to take best advantage of the research interface. <BR /> <BR />While all our institutions are technically open to all, there is in practice considerable religious separation in the settings in which we train our teachers. The premia payments are subsidies that go to the university colleges.”
“My officials and I plan to engage with stakeholders over the coming months to discuss the future resourcing of higher and further education. In doing so, we need to be mindful of the next Budget period and the opportunities and challenges that come from a lower corporation tax regime and ensure that we can meet increased demand for skills. <BR /> <BR />Returning to the amendment, I want to make it clear that I am working to achieve a world-class system of teacher training that is financially sustainable and consistent with the development of a shared and integrated Northern Ireland. Our current system of teacher training is fragmented.”
“Northern Ireland has fallen between those two approaches, and we must now reflect on what we can do to refresh our local approach. <BR /> <BR />The funding situation has now been made worse by the Budget outcome. While I welcome the reallocation of £20 million to my Department and the £13 million from the change fund between the draft and final Budgets, we are still in a very difficult situation. I am discussing the implications further with the Employment and Learning Committee tomorrow. While we have been able to mitigate to some extent the impact of the revised Budget cuts on the front line, we are nevertheless going to have some major reductions in provision. This sends out a very negative message about the importance of the skills agenda.”
“<BR /> <BR />The greatest challenges relate to funding. It is important to note that there has not been any meaningful increase in FE funding for the best part of a decade. There have been emerging pressures in the higher education funding regime for the universities that predate the current year's and next year’s Budget situation. There is a structural gap of between £1,000 and £2,500 per place when Northern Ireland is compared with the GB average. We must ensure that quality in Northern Ireland is not compromised. In different parts of the UK, different approaches have been taken to higher education funding, with a higher fees regime in England and, on the other hand, increased direct investment in universities in Scotland.”
“I have also been pleased to facilitate an increase in funding for core qualitative research (QR), the higher education innovation fund, Connected 3 and the employer support programme. <BR /> <BR />In terms of directly supporting inward investment, our Assured Skills programme, which works with the HE and FE sectors to provide bespoke skills solutions for companies and sectors, has increasingly been recognised as a game changer. Looking ahead, there are opportunities for universities and colleges to engage with our new apprenticeship strategy and the forthcoming new youth training system. In particular, further education colleges will be the provider of choice for off-the-job training, but I also want to develop hybrid apprenticeship degrees. There is also a more general requirement to better develop employability skills.”
“It is also worth noting that, in the context of the UK, Northern Ireland is punching well above its weight in knowledge transfer and business and community engagement. <BR /> <BR />I have been pleased to be able to build on the strong base in higher education and further education. The universities have also begun to rebalance their preexisting offer to place greater emphasis on subjects with economic relevance. This is a key aspect of the higher education strategy. <BR /> <BR />We also seek to double the number of publicly supported PhDs over this decade and are already more than halfway along that process. In 2010, for example, Northern Ireland ranked twelfth out of 12 regions for PhDs per capita under the knowledge index. In just five years we have risen to tenth, with the aim of reaching the top half by 2020.”
“While, of course, those can come from many different routes, including apprenticeships, for example, our universities and colleges each year produce 20,000 high-level qualifications and over 80,000 intermediate qualifications. <BR /> <BR />Traditionally, our universities have been major providers for research capacity locally and, in recent years, have further consolidated in that role. It is also worth noting the growing research and innovation capacity of our FE colleges. <BR /> <BR />I pay tribute to the achievements of the local universities in the recent Research Excellence Framework. Seventy per cent of research submitted was rated as world-leading or internationally excellent. That marks a significant improvement in Northern Ireland's relative position.”
“Our universities and colleges are also key agents of social change and the development of a vibrant and diverse civic culture. <BR /> <BR />Since 2012, Northern Ireland has had a higher education strategy, Graduating to Success. It has encapsulated that increased economic focus for all the higher education providers. In that regard, it is important to note that our FE colleges provide almost 20% of higher education qualifications in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />The further education sector has had an overarching strategy — FE Means Business — in place since 2004. A new FE strategy is now well advanced in its development and will shortly be issued for public consultation. <BR /> <BR />Our skills strategy is very clear on the need for higher-level skills in our economy.”
“I am always grateful for the opportunity to reiterate the key role that our further and higher education sectors play in growing our economy and supporting the priorities of the Programme for Government, but I believe this debate is even more important, given the financial difficulties that we now face. Our colleges and universities are key aspects of the economy and wider civic life in Northern Ireland. They are key delivery partners for the economic strategy, and the skills and research they provide are a key driver of economic change. They help local companies to grow and now, perhaps, provide the key aspect of the inward investment narrative. Universities and colleges also have a major direct impact in terms of spending power and a multiplier effect in supporting other jobs.”
“That would mean more of our young people having to leave Northern Ireland to study and probably never returning home or more young people having no chance to study at all: wasted opportunities, wasted lives, wasted economic potential. There is a very clear contradiction between the thrust of the motion and the implications of the amendment. I urge Members to reflect on that and the signal that is sent about how genuine or otherwise Members are about supporting the transformation of our economy and investing in our young people. <BR /> <BR />I turn now to the main substance of the motion.”
“Are we to slow down the potential expansion of Magee? Are we to forgo aspects of our strategy around dealing with those who are NEET? Those are questions that people need to reflect on very clearly, and they need to understand the implications of what they are saying if, indeed, they shortly walk through the Lobbies in favour of an amendment in support of the premia. They are asking for subsidies to go into certain institutions that others do not get. They are asking for certain subject areas to be more generously funded than many others, including the areas that are most relevant to the expansion of our economy. They are advocating a situation in which even deeper cuts will have to be made to our universities and colleges, which would be manifested in a reduction of places.”
“At the outset, I want to make clear the implications and consequences there will be if the call made by the amendment is followed through. The budget for my Department is fixed for 2015-16, so I have to make choices about how best to employ the scarce resources that are available to me. I have made a commitment to seek, as far as is possible in the circumstances, to protect the aspects of the work of my Department that most support the economy and to protect services to the most vulnerable in society. <BR /> <BR />I am disappointed that no one voicing support for the amendment has recommended what deeper cuts should be made to preserve the premia subsidy payments. Am I to cut front-line university places or college places, including teacher places? Am I to cut from services for the unemployed or those with disabilities?”
“I thank the Committee for Employment and Learning for tabling this important motion for debate today. In the main, I welcome the fact that most contributors have attempted to give the original motion due consideration, although, no doubt, people were tempted to focus some of their comments on the amendment.”
“There is a lot we can do to change the system.”
“We have examples in Glasgow and Dublin — they have been mentioned already — from which we should be learning lessons. <BR /> <BR />Northern Ireland is not a place apart. We do not want to condemn ourselves to be some place apart from the rest of the world. We want to be a society that is normalising. We also have the example of the University of Ulster at Coleraine, which has an interfaith forum. It has been training teachers in a shared environment, including for the Catholic-maintained sector, for many years, very successfully. <BR /> <BR />It is also worth putting on record that the sharing between Stranmillis and St Mary's at present is very minimal. In particular, at leadership level, they are not even talking to each other.”
“Unfortunately, I am running out of time. <BR /> <BR />Let me just address a couple of points and stress a couple of issues. First of all, we want to see the continuation of higher education in west Belfast. I understand the importance of that as a driver for the local economy, and there is a range of ways in which we can do that, either through a continued teacher training presence or some alternative higher education presence. Perhaps the more fundamental point is that, just because we have and may continue to have a Catholic-maintained sector at primary and secondary level, it does not follow that we must have a Catholic teacher training system on top of that. We can train all our teachers together in a shared environment in Northern Ireland, but, in doing that, we can provide for a diverse and pluralist education system.”
“We have a report that set out a number of options. Option A is for enhanced collaboration; B is for two centres, one in Belfast and one in the north-west; one for is a federation; and the final one is for a single provider for all Northern Ireland. Three of the four providers at present have given their endorsement to option D. We are open to discussions with all the providers, and we want to find a consensus on the way forward, but change has to happen. <BR /> <BR />I have my own views on where we should be going, but I want to listen to the stakeholders on that. It is not something on which I am on the same page as the DUP. The DUP will issue its own statements on the issue, just like any other party. What we are trying to do here is to get the best for Northern Ireland as a whole.”
“The first looked at financial issues. Anna Lo summarised some of its conclusions. We are spending more to train a teacher in Northern Ireland than is spent in England to the tune of 40%. It is also more expensive to train a teacher in the teacher training colleges than in the universities to the tune of 32%. Therefore, we do not have a level playing field. The system is fundamentally unfair because we are investing more in teacher training places than we are in places for engineers, historians, lawyers, architects and the whole host of other subjects. Is that a fair situation?”
“<BR /> <BR />It is also important to bear in mind that all our providers are open to the whole community. I should point out that while St Mary's is itself run by the Catholic Church, it is open to people from all backgrounds. It is not just for Catholics. It is important that people bear that in mind, given some of the language that has been used. While we have a segmented system in Northern Ireland, which has often included our teacher training colleges, we also have to bear in mind that we are moving more and more towards a shared and integrated society. That is, indeed, the Executive's policy. There are also equality issues about differential access to the certificate of religious education in the current system, which creates tensions in that system. <BR /> <BR />We have conducted a two-stage review.”
“What I have heard, particularly from the Sinn Féin Benches, is that, because we are a divided society and are somehow different to Glasgow and Dublin, we are not prepared to change and have to accept that as Northern Ireland's reality. I do not believe that the vast majority of people in Northern Ireland want to accept that we are divided. I think that people want to change in a different way. <BR /> <BR />We also have to focus on quality. In one respect, we could be doing considerably better on how we link in with the international trend of teacher training being done much more in a university context, where there is access to multidisciplinary opportunities and a very rich research infusion. Those simply do not exist in our current teacher college provision.”
“That builds up the hopes of our young people who want to be teachers, only for them to be dashed down the line. <BR /> <BR />We also have to focus on quality.”
“Let me be very clear on this, because a number of points have been made about employment figures etc: the employment figures that people are talking about are for jobs, not necessarily for teachers. We pay more to train teachers than we do for training other people through our colleges and universities. That creates a certain distortion in the system. It is also worth saying that the Sinn Féin Education Minister is adding places over and above what the teacher demand model suggests our future education system requires because of a view that we have to somehow focus on the sustainability of our teacher training colleges.”
“Indeed, we had a motion last week to the Assembly about the importance of protecting the front line. We are not prepared to do that tonight. <BR /> <BR />We have a fragmented system in Northern Ireland and a costly system in Northern Ireland. We train too many teachers. At present, we have about 1,500 unemployed teachers, according to the GTCNI. Future trends are not favourable. We have still 70,000 empty desks in our schools.”
“I want to make it very clear to every person who advocates the retention of the premia that, on a fixed budget for my Department that is declining, I have given a commitment to do my best to protect the front line in terms of opportunities for our young people in universities and colleges. If we retain the premia, that means that deeper cuts will be experienced by our universities and colleges. That will mean fewer places for our young people, who will either leave Northern Ireland to study elsewhere and probably not come back or not have the opportunity at all to go to college. That would be a huge shame because we were not prepared to contemplate change. Hopefully, people will reflect on what they say about the importance of the economy and the importance of the future of our society in that regard.”
“I want to say very clearly that I am not interested in talking about institutions; what we are talking about here is the quality of the training of our teachers for the benefit of our current students in the schools of Northern Ireland and, indeed, the future students in the schools of Northern Ireland. I want to see the very best in that regard, and, where we have the capacity to do better, that is what I am committed to doing. That is why the second of our reports that we commissioned was entitled 'Aspiring to Excellence'. That gives us the clear sense of direction that we can do better in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />Let me also be clear at the outset around the distinct issue of the premia. I am not willing to divert resources into what I believe is an unwarranted subsidy at the expense of places in universities and colleges.”
“Mr Deputy Speaker, this is the first occasion that I have had to formally congratulate you on your election to your post. I also welcome the opportunity to respond to the Adjournment debate. I note that, given that this is an Adjournment debate, the debate is naturally based on one institution in a particular constituency, but ultimately this is an issue about the full spectrum of how our teacher training infrastructure should and must be reformed in Northern Ireland. Already, I have made three statements to the Assembly on teacher training over the past number of years. <BR /> <BR />We have had a focus on institutions — mostly St Mary's, with the occasional reference to Stranmillis. We have had conspiratorial references to Queen's and the University of Ulster.”
“The points on the atmosphere, skills and connectivity have been well made, and the Regional Development Minister will no doubt pick those up.”
“It is important that we recognise Invest NI's activity as a glass half-full rather than a glass-half empty situation. It is important to bear in mind that we cannot micromanage how companies invest in Northern Ireland. We do well to get companies to come here without overly dictating to them, but I am certainly convinced that there is a commitment to ensuring that we showcase the north-west alongside other regions. The solution lies not just in terms of what Invest NI can do but what we do in terms of skills and around infrastructure and connectivity. Investment decisions are made through a whole range of variables, not just the support that comes from an economically developed organisation.”
“We have a spectrum. Mr Byrne made reference to some companies in Strabane, where Allstate is a major employer. We should not forget that, in the city of Derry itself, we have First Source and Seagate, which are major employers and major contributors to the local economy. <BR /> <BR />Invest NI has made a significant contribution to job creation in the north-west. Since 2009, it has provided £44·5 million of assistance in the Derry and Strabane district council areas. This has contributed towards over £200 million of investment.”