Stephen Farry
North Down · Alliance Party · Northern Ireland
“Speaking for a party that has a longer pedigree in advocating a public inquiry than both the DUP and Sinn Féin, I nonetheless welcome this announcement, despite the torturous path that we have had and, indeed, the missed opportunities.”
“The first was a reform of the petition of concern to take it back to the original intent when it was designed in 1998. It was clear at that stage that Arlene Foster banged the table and said, "No, never. We are not doing that. That is a way whereby we are going to have to fold on equal marriage: it's not happening".”
“<BR /> <BR />The main points that I make concern the substance of the order. There are probably three aspects that the Minister needs to address properly before the Assembly, and they really relate to what other options he has.”
“That raises the question of why they want to go as far as 2022, especially when I am not sure — I would welcome any clarification to the contrary on it — that there has been formal Executive approval of this.”
“<BR /> <BR />There are three major substantive issues that I do not believe have been properly aired on this: VAT; European Commission infraction proceedings; and, most important, the opportunity foregone to revisit the classification of Northern Ireland Water and the ability, through a separate water charge, to allow it to borrow commerc…”
“While my party was supportive of the Good Friday Agreement back in 1998, at that time, we expressed some reservations around the very detailed nature of the proposals and how those could, in due course, destabilise Northern Ireland and prevent us from realising our full potential. We have been very much vindicated in that analysis.”
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“Likewise, there is a need to recognise that vouching is not a simple process that can be completed overnight. Due to the exacting audit standards required, vouching can be highly involved and often time-consuming. However, as the programme evolves and all parties become more familiar with the new processes, it should be possible to issue payments more promptly. <BR /> <BR />I can also assure Members that, when organisations raise problems about cash flow, we respond. As a result, I have directed my Department to implement an interim measure whereby 50% of the ESF and DEL contribution in unpaid claims is paid when the claim is received and vouched later.”
“Members have raised a number of issues, and we are aware of and have addressed, or are in the process of addressing, those where possible. <BR /> <BR />A clear difficulty was the tension created between the documentation required to meet the audit demands of the European Commission and the impact of that on the Department’s ability to process and pay claims quickly. ESF projects are understandably anxious to have their claims paid as soon as possible, and I accept that a number had concerns about their cash flow due to the delay in the verification process. However, Members should also recognise that there is an onus on the project to provide the correct documentation, just as there is an onus on the Department to complete the vouching visits and release payments.”
“<BR /> <BR />The European social fund programme is not a financial vehicle specifically designed to sustain the community and voluntary sector. It is designed to help the individual participants on the programme, in line with the programme’s thematic objectives. Voluntary and community organisations are undeniably well placed to assist participants, but there was, I believe, an unrealistic expectation among certain providers that funding would continue into the new programme by virtue of the fact that they had been funded under the old one. The unfortunate reality of any competitive tendering process is that no single organisation has an automatic right to funding. <BR /> <BR />My officials and I are fully alert to the challenges faced by the voluntary and community sector in adjusting to the new programme.”
“Although we had our operational programme agreed by the European Commission early, that still left only a narrow window to commence the programme by 1 April 2015. We are well ahead of many other parts of the European Union, and other UK regions, in having our programme up and running. Only now is the Skills Funding Agency in England, for example, commencing a call for applications to the new programme — for an 18-month period only and starting as late as September 2016 — whereas Northern Ireland projects have been offered a full three years of funding from April 2015. That follows a summer in which providers receiving ESF money in England were forced to lay off staff due to the delays in issuing the 2014-2020 contracts.”
“<BR /> <BR />The current ESF round of funding amounts to more than £205 million over the six-year period of the programme. That support is manifested in the fact that we have not made cuts to the new ESF programme. In fact, the programme that we unveiled for 2014-2020 is bigger than the outgoing one, with some £112 million worth of projects being supported during its first three years. The Department is adding a further £5·5 million through its role as a match funder. That is also an increase. <BR /> <BR />It is also important to recognise that the new European social fund for 2014-2020 is up and running and that we managed that without any break in coverage. This was, nevertheless, a challenging task.”
“<BR /> <BR />The European social fund has been of enormous benefit in supporting our people and economy by giving unemployed and disadvantaged people the training and support that they need to access work. It is a positive reflection on our membership of the European Union and allows us to do things that we might not otherwise be in a position to achieve. By focusing on those most in need of help, ESF assistance is vital in contributing to policies to reduce inequality and build a fairer society. The voluntary and community sector is especially crucial in helping to deliver this provision locally. The sector is often much better placed than government and its statutory bodies to understand, support and offer meaningful progress to disadvantaged sections of society.”
“In responding, I want to acknowledge the important role that the European social fund plays in supporting skills and employability across society. I recognise the sterling efforts made by my officials in ensuring the overall successful delivery of the 2007-2013 ESF programme and the timely commencement of the 2014-2020 one. That is not to say that there have not been problems with implementation in aspects of the delivery of the 2007-2013 programme and the start of the 2014-2020 one. However, my officials and I have been proactive in addressing all of those issues, and, indeed, I directed changes in approach on a number of occasions. Furthermore, for accountability, my officials and I regularly presented ourselves to the Committee, and we continue to engage with a wide range of stakeholders.”
“Ultimately, we recognise that it is about good governance and that, most importantly, we have sound public finances and as much money available to invest in our public services as possible. For us not to proceed with the LCM today — or next week, if we had had that option — would mean that we had an ever deeper black hole in our public finances, and that is not in our interests. It is not in the interests of our constituents or of Northern Ireland, so it is important that we do our duty, difficult as it is this evening, by backing the LCM.”
“That is grand. I will take your guidance, Mr Deputy Speaker, and bring it very quickly back to the issue of welfare. <BR /> <BR />Clearly, there are two sides to the coin: supporting people on welfare and ensuring that we create opportunities. There are plenty of ways, through our public finances, in which we can do that. <BR /> <BR />It is with great sadness that we find ourselves with little option but to support the legislative consent motion. It is too late in the day for us to take through legislation in the Assembly from first principles. Sadly, we lost that with the petition of concern back in the springtime. We have to get on with the issue; it has been debated ad nauseam for several years. We all know the issues,and we know what it is our duty to do.”
“That is not sustainable, so we need to see a realistic plan for how we reconfigure our health service. <BR /> <BR />Those are all big-ticket issues that go way beyond the efficiencies that have been listed to date in the deal that was announced yesterday. We need to address the issue of progressive forms of revenue-raising as a means of bringing in additional resource. We can do all those things. We can be smart around how we use incentives to encourage businesses to invest in Northern Ireland and grow. At the same time —”
“First, we need to have a sense of balance and proportion about how much money we are setting aside for further welfare support above and beyond the default GB position. I am happy that we are doing some things in that regard. <BR /> <BR />We need to reflect on the fact that we have massive inefficiencies in the way that we are spending money in our society. We are squandering hundred of millions of pounds, for example, on managing a divided society. We have a very segregated education system, which is hugely costly. We also have a health service that, left to its own devices, is set to have a financial pressure in the region of 5% to 6% per annum due to costs as a result of our population getting older, demographics changing and drug treatments getting more expensive.”
“Just one second. <BR /> <BR />In doing that, not only do we address those who are on welfare, but we invest in growing our economy.”
“All of that is very important in giving people, particularly those who come from marginalised and disadvantaged backgrounds, the opportunity to be stakeholders within our economy.”
“<BR /> <BR />However, it is important that we reflect on the fact that we have to ensure that we not only support people who are on welfare but invest in them and see how we can move them into a situation where they have fresh opportunities. That means looking in a more general sense around areas like early years education and public health, which are reflective of intergenerational poverty and lack of opportunity. Then there are the very specific interventions that will allow people to move up and off the skills ladder into employment, such as investment in our schools, colleges and universities; investment in employability programmes that the employment service can offer; and building new apprenticeships and new systems of youth training.”
“If we are to look ahead to lower levels of corporation tax, we need to be investing much more in skills and we need to have a proper economic plan. <BR /> <BR />I draw attention to the point that Mr Agnew was making about there somehow being a polarised choice between a lower level of corporation tax and pumping more money into the welfare system. We have to acknowledge that the purpose of having a lower level of corporation is not to give breaks to companies; it is about creating jobs and employment in Northern Ireland, and creating greater prosperity. There may well be genuine issues with ensuring that that prosperity is evenly distributed across society, and I am more than happy to have that debate and look at how we can ensure that that takes place.”
“We want to protect the integrity of these institutions, but, above all, they are only a means to an end. That end is the good of the people of Northern Ireland, and it is important that we stop the bleeding in our public finances. We have a duty to ensure good governance, but good governance is there to ensure that we have properly funded public services and that we are investing in the key drivers of change in our economy. <BR /> <BR />Quite frankly, through the problems around welfare and other issues with financial management, or lack thereof, by the Executive over the past number of years, we are not doing our best in that regard by any stretch of the imagination. We need to turn that situation around.”
“I am massively uncomfortable with the entire situation, whether we are talking about the 2012 legislation or the 2015 legislation. Of course, an LCM can apply in a situation where legislation is still moving through Westminster, so that is not an uncommon situation for us to find ourselves in. Obviously, given the sensitivity around this legislation, people will naturally be very concerned in that regard. Far be it from me to seek to defend the deal that was passed yesterday, but the LCM applies to the status of the Bill as it stands, so we will need to return to it if that Bill changes in any significant way. That is the last you will hear of me defending the deal from yesterday. We are fair and balanced in the Alliance Party, and we reflect the facts as we find them. <BR /> <BR />We find ourselves with conflicting objectives.”
“This is a situation where we are asking Westminster to dig us out of a hole because we have left things too late in the cycle to efficiently address the Budget gaps that have emerged. This is an entirely different context for LCMs than has previously been understood.”
“<BR /> <BR />There are massive issues with our Budget, which we will come to during a different debate, as it probably stretches beyond the scope of this occasion. We find ourselves in the situation where we have conflicting problems, in that we should, ideally, be fulfilling our duty and taking legislation through all the different stages. Like my colleague, I recognise that a range of constitutional and institutional implications arise from the fact that we are doing an LCM. This is a different type of LCM, where legislation is happening on a UK-wide basis, and, for the sake of convenience, we perhaps buy in to that legislation rather than replicate the legislation here in Northern Ireland.”
“Quite clearly, we should have addressed this ourselves through legislation and the follow through in all of the regulations that have to follow. <BR /> <BR />We are in a mess. We have wasted time and we have messed around. We have been on a twisted, convoluted journey, and some parties are on a more convoluted journey than others. We are in-year, we are bleeding money in welfare adjustments, commonly known as welfare fines or welfare penalties, going back to Treasury. That has to stop. We are in an unsustainable situation with our Budget. The Finance Minister has balanced the Budget for the remainder of this year, but that is balanced on the premise that we follow through on what we have to do around welfare reform.”
“It may well be a technical devolution where we have the responsibility without the effective power, but, nonetheless, we have that responsibility, and that responsibility has been with us since well before the current round of devolution in 1998. <BR /> <BR />Obviously, we have to work within the parity principle, and that has been accepted by successive Administrations, whether post-1998 or under the previous forms of administration in Northern Ireland. That is the context in which we are operating, but it is our duty to follow through and ensure that we are balancing our budgets and working within the context of the parity principle, albeit with the scope that we have for local modifications and flexibilities.”
“Nonetheless, it is important to show leadership, and that is what we have been seeking to do. <BR /> <BR />When we look at the issue of the LCM, we come to the conclusion that it is the only responsible thing to do at this time or, maybe, to turn it on its head, it is the least irresponsible thing to do at this time. Perhaps the latter way is the best way to frame it. Make no mistake about it: the fact that we are potentially voting on an LCM today is a reflection of the failure of our political institutions. It is not a cause for celebration. This is a recognition of failure and about getting ourselves out of that failure as cleanly and as efficiently as possible. Nonetheless, failure it is. These are matters that are devolved to the Assembly.”
“Our criticism is not based on the fact that difficult decisions have to be taken and that we are, somehow, opting out; it is because the parties that are driving the process have ducked the difficult decisions, with all of the knock-on consequences that flow from that. <BR /> <BR />I will give one clear example. My party is more than happy to stick its head above the parapet and recognise that, as is the case in virtually every other mature democracy around the world, we have to engage in a degree of revenue raising when we are looking to balance our budgets, particularly when our budgets are under huge pressure. We are prepared to show leadership in that regard. That is clearly a risky position, given the attitudes and reluctance of the public in some respects.”
“We are concerned about gaps in the deal and a lack of clarity around public finances. Above all, Alliance is prepared to stand up for good governance and sound financial management. Often, when we have opposed or criticised budgets or expressed reservations around particular agreements etc, we have been accused of trying to duck out of our responsibilities. We have often criticised the so-called agreements, or have sometimes criticised or opposed budgets, not because we are trying to avoid difficult decisions but because we do not recognise that they are sufficiently strategic or comprehensive or that they have lived up to the billing that people set out when they started on processes. We often find that the other parties are ducking the difficult decisions.”
“People are raising quite legitimate issues today, not least about the timescale within which this debate is occurring. It is important to reference, in that regard, that even yesterday's agreement by the DUP and Sinn Féin, along with the Governments, makes provision for this LCM to be discussed on the week of the 23 November; it does not necessarily have to happen this week.”
“<BR /> <BR />I want to comment on how my party can support the LCM in the context of the deal that was announced yesterday and the deadlock that we have seen around welfare reform. At this stage, Alliance is not in a position to endorse the deal as a whole. We have said that we will look at individual aspects and assess what is in the best interests of Northern Ireland as a whole, and not the interests of our party or narrow party advantage. I want to make things very clear. There is a narrative here where the DUP and Sinn Féin are claiming that they are the ones prepared to take difficult decisions and other parties in the Chamber are not prepared to take their part in those. We are somehow getting the view that the DUP and Sinn Féin are the only grown-ups in the room and everyone else is acting like children and toddlers.”
“<BR /> <BR />We find ourselves in the extremely strange and very uncomfortable situation that we are now relying on an LCM for Westminster to legislate over our heads because, in essence, we have run out of road and options to ensure that our finances are sustainable. Sinn Féin in particular finds itself in the bizarre situation of being happy to ask the Westminster Parliament to legislate on these matters when, in turn, it does not recognise the legitimacy of that Parliament in the sense that its Members do not take their seats. That is a massive contradiction that is sort of hanging out there and has not really been fully explained to us all. Hopefully, at some stage, someone from Sinn Féin will explain how it can reconcile those two points.”
“Thank you very much, Mr Deputy Speaker. I do not think that we are at all in the situation of giving ourselves a pat on the back. Those who claim that they are exercising leadership on this issue need to reflect on the fact that we have been put through the mill on welfare reform over the past two years at least. Severe damage has been done to our budgets — self-inflicted, made-in-Northern Ireland damage — never mind that made by the Conservative Government. That damage has impacted on our public services, not least because we have been handing money back to Westminster that could otherwise have been put to good use locally. So, the fact that we now have a limited deal around how we take forward welfare reform cannot be a cause for celebration. Indeed, it is barely even a cause for relief.”
“The agreement itself refers to the week of 23 November being the decision-making week. In that respect, we believe that delaying a decision in the Assembly is consistent with the agreement, even though we have not yet, at this stage, endorsed that agreement. <BR /> <BR />A delay would allow Assembly Members to avoid the sense that they are being bounced or pressurised into making a very big decision over a very short time, less than 24 hours after the information, request or notice of an LCM came into the public domain. We think that that is the only fair way that the Assembly can have an open, fair and transparent debate, where no one can have any complaints, irrespective of parties' ultimate decisions on individual aspects of the deal, such as the LCM itself.”
“Mr Speaker, mindful of your ruling, I will keep my remarks, and my colleagues will keep theirs, on the substance of the LCM until later in the debate. However, just to put it in context, we are speaking today as a party that is minded to vote in favour of the LCM, notwithstanding that we have expressed scepticism around the deal, particularly the rush and the degree of transparency. That said, in our wider intentions, we believe that nothing would be lost by the Assembly having a week to consider the wider documentation around this. Many of those documents are already in the public domain. However, all of this is happening within a very rushed timescale. <BR /> <BR />In that context, Mr Durkan referred to the proposal that David Ford made at the Executive yesterday that consideration of the agreement be delayed until next week.”
“It is important that we try to help people out of unemployment. It is not a situation that they want to be in, and it is not a situation that is good for our society. I have met very few people who actively want to be unemployed. People are not moving into Steps 2 Success with any sense of compulsion. It is technically mandatory, but it is seen as an opportunity for people to try to transform their lives.”
“If we had not had devolution, we would have had in place in Northern Ireland the same Great Britain Work Programme that Scotland and Wales have, given that employment matters are not devolved in those contexts. In putting in place our own programme, we sought to be much more sympathetic to the direct needs of our own economy and to ensure that we treat everyone as an individual and understand their particular requirements in investing in skills and trying to avail themselves of employment opportunities.”
“The Member will be aware that there is a degree of conditionality with jobseeker's allowance. That is out of our hands, so it is important that we respond where people are in long-term unemployment. <BR /> <BR />If we do not have a programme in place, we have a vacuum in the offering made by my Department, or any successor Department, in addressing the long-term unemployed. We sought to ensure that what we put in place met the circumstances of Northern Ireland. That is one of the attractions and benefits of devolution.”
“<BR /> <BR />However, I am puzzled as to why the Member ever thought that participation in this programme was ever purely voluntary.”
“I am not sure at what stage the Member was under the impression that this would be a purely voluntary process; that was never the undertaking given by me or my officials at any stage in the development of Steps 2 Success. Steps 2 Success is a fresh programme that replaced Steps to Work. That process of referral to Steps to Work was in place long before Steps 2 Success was considered. <BR /> <BR />Steps 2 Success seeks to learn positive lessons from Steps to Work. It also took on board the implications of how work programmes were taken forward elsewhere in the UK. That allows us to have a very Northern Ireland-orientated system that meets our circumstances and has a more focused approach to the needs of the individual and ensures that everyone is assisted in their search for work.”
“The further education sector can respond to requirements from employers and where there are gaps. This week, we are launching Northern Ireland's first skills barometer, which takes down to a more granular level where we see pressure points emerging in our economy. That advice will be there to help policymakers, and those in charge of resources, so that they can use them more efficiently and effectively, as well as advising those making career decisions. <BR /> <BR />We invested in welding academies at Belfast Metropolitan College and the Northern Regional College, particularly to ensure that Harland and Wolff has a stream of people skilled in the welding required for oil rigs, which is a highly skilled and lucrative occupation.”
“Obviously, we have heard some very difficult and troubling announcements in recent weeks and, indeed, over the past couple of years, but it is important that we continue to talk about the underlying strength of manufacturing in Northern Ireland and the fact that we have a critical number of world-class businesses that really are making major contributions and are exporting beyond Northern Ireland to other markets.”
“I chair a working group for engineering and advanced manufacturing, which brings together business organisations, our colleges, our universities and a representative sample of employers. We have an action plan that examines the different skills requirements, and we seek to update that on a regular basis. There is a strong pipeline of skills. There is obviously more that we need to do in that regard, but opportunities also depend upon the underlying economic climate in Northern Ireland, and that, in turn, is affected by what is happening in the wider global economy. <BR /> <BR />It is a difficult and challenging time for manufacturing.”
“We also have an economic inactivity strategy, which was agreed by the Executive in April this year, and, again, that has not been commenced because of the absence of resources. We essentially have two strategies sitting on the shelf at present that we could activate if we had the resources. Those would directly benefit the Member's constituents in the circumstances that she mentions.”
“We can offer some limited support through transport to further education, depending upon people's personal situation, through application to their local college, which will be South West College in the case of the areas that the Member mentioned. Ultimately, this requires resources, and the more resources that we have, the more we are able to invest in those types of interventions. For example, we have a NEETs strategy, Pathways to Success, for which there is no effective budget. That budget essentially expired at the end of March 2015. I had hoped that it would have been renewed in different circumstances, but it was one of the first things that was dropped when the Executive were trying to wrestle with balancing their budget.”
“It is important that we have a joined-up strategy that bridges the two Departments; seamless progression between school and training opportunities, including the new system of youth training and apprenticeships, and through to further education and higher education; and early warning of those who are likely to leave school without any formal qualifications so that we are able to put in place measures to try to capture them and to see what other techniques we can deploy to try to ensure that they get on the first rung of the ladder of skills and qualifications.”
“I agree with the Member that those figures are alarming, but I regret to say that they will be reflected in many other parts of Northern Ireland as well. We do have some major issues with underachievement in our education system, and we have historic problems with those who have low or no qualifications. That is why it is so important that we are investing across a very broad front of educational opportunities and training opportunities. There is a role for the Department of Education, for which the Member's colleague is the Minister, and my Department obviously has a role to play.”
“In some ways, that is exemplified by the stunning success that Northern Ireland has had in skill competitions and, most recently, WorldSkills. To put that in context, Northern Ireland managed to achieve 40% of the entire UK medals in WorldSkills in São Paulo in Brazil in August this year. Gary Doyle, who was a former student of the Southern Regional College, won the gold medal and is essentially now the world's best plumber. That is a great accolade, and it really shows the real effort that colleges are making in investing in construction skills that we are achieving that level of success.”
“The Member will be aware that we are moving from the outgoing system of Training for Success and previously programme-led apprenticeships, which may be at the heart of the tensions that have existed in finding placements because that has not always gone as smoothly as has been the hope in the past. Under the new systems, that situation should be improved because we are going to see a much stronger focus on employer-led advice on where particular training is required rather than the sector guessing where it is. <BR /> <BR />I am conscious, however, that our situation in Northern Ireland is turning around, and we are now seeing that with people expressing concerns about the future pipeline of talent. We are committed to working very closely with the FE colleges. We have a very strong track record of what they do to support construction.”
“First of all, we work very closely with the construction employers, and the Construction Industry Training Board is a non-departmental public body of my Department. The Member will also be aware that we are taking forward new strategies for apprenticeships and youth training. We are working towards a sectoral partnership for the construction sector, whereby it can identify its very particular training requirements and work in partnership with the colleges and other training providers around the creation of a refreshed curriculum for what is required to ensure that the sector can continue to flourish in Northern Ireland.”
“We are privileged to have support from a whole range of community and voluntary sectors, particularly those that are funded through the European social fund, who will be our partners in the delivery of that strategy once it is formally agreed in the new year.”
“We have sought to protect those places in the cuts that have been made to the further education sector this year. That is my intention as we look to further years as well, because I recognise the importance of the provision and how families rely on that. <BR /> <BR />It is also important to recognise that, during my term in office, we have had a 50% increase in resources available through the additional support fund for students in further education. That commitment also remains very much in place. <BR /> <BR />We are also taking forward the public consultation on a new employment strategy for people with disabilities. Again, that is a fresh commitment that we are making.”
“I have not personally had a discussion with the schools that the Member refers to. It is the Department of Education's responsibility to engage with them and to reflect their experiences and concerns to the Civil Service group and the ministerial group as we try to take forward the action plan. Proper signposting to the available services and identifying and trying to overcome the gaps will be critical aspects of the work that we take forward.”
“First of all, I identify with the sentiment that the Member outlined — the real difficulties and fears that families experience in the transition from special school to adult services. Going from that certainty to a very uncertain situation has often been described to me as feeling like you are walking off a cliff. It is in that context that we have this action plan in place to better advise on the services available across a range of provision, whether in the Department of Health or in my Department through the further education sector and employment opportunities. There are often gaps between what Departments can offer. It is important that we use the strategy and the action plan to try to close those gaps. Obviously, the Department of Education is an important partner in that regard.”
“My Department will be responsible for collating the necessary information and updates from relevant lead Departments in order to assess progress.”