← LEADERSHIP TERMINAL

UK PARLIAMENT · FORMER

Máirtín Ó Muilleoir

South Belfast · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland

IN THEIR OWN WORDS

Go raibh maith agat as an cheist sin. I think it must. I followed the Public Accounts Committee under my colleague Mr Swann, and I read the devastating October hearing when Ofgem appeared.

OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

While the areas it will investigate will be wide-ranging, it will necessarily include key areas in which there has been huge public interest, including the development and roll-out of the RHI scheme by the then Department of Enterprise, Trade and Investment; the signing off of the scheme by the then Department of Finance and Personnel; th…

OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

I thank Mr Clarke for that question. I know that Mr Clarke was at the PAC hearing that Robin Swann had the wonderful occasion to chair. I would have paid money to attend that because it was certainly a difficult session for the PAC.

OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

In relation to the question asked, I want to speak in particular of the seven months that I have been in the Department of Finance. I have been deeply impressed by the commitment, diligence and alertness of my officials to the RHI scandal. I mentioned previously alerting the Comptroller and Auditor General.

OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

Ba mhaith liom buíochas a thabhairt don Chomhalta as an cheist sin. I think that any inquiry will ask what went wrong, where it went wrong, who was accountable and what happened. In that context, I am totally convinced that the decision to involve Ofgem in the RHI scheme was a major mistake. Ofgem has failed.

OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

Therefore, I wish to reassure the public by setting out the steps that I think must be taken to ensure absolute openness and transparency. The arrangements I have detailed in this statement are intended to ensure this.

OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

The complete record

Every one of 1,305 lines we hold for Máirtín Ó Muilleoir, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 2 of 27.

  1. <BR /> <BR />Mr Speaker, I am aware that the RHI issue goes way beyond financial matters to questions of governance and probity. By getting to the truth of the RHI scandal, this inquiry team, led by the distinguished Sir Patrick Coghlin, will, I believe, address those wider issues and, therefore, go some way to rebuilding the shattered public confidence in these institutions.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  2. <BR /> <BR />The inquiry will be impartial and objective. It will be tasked with getting to the truth of the RHI scheme. I will not interfere in its work. It will be entirely independent. There is an urgent need to get to the facts of the RHI scheme, to identify negligence, incompetence, alleged corruption and abuse, and to hold those responsible to account. <BR /> <BR />Tá mé feasach go dtéann an cheist RHI thar chúrsaí airgeadais chuig ceisteanna rialachais agus ionracais. Trí aimsiú na fírinne faoin scannal RHI, creidim go rachaidh an fhoireann fiosrúcháin seo, faoi stiúir Sir Patrick Coghlin oirirc, i ngleic leis na saincheisteanna sin agus dá bhrí sin, rachaidh sé bealach éigin le hatógáil a dhéanamh ar mhuinín scriosta an phobail sna hinstitiúidí.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  3. Therefore, I wish to reassure the public by setting out the steps that I think must be taken to ensure absolute openness and transparency. The arrangements I have detailed in this statement are intended to ensure this. It is also important to stress the following: having been established, the inquiry will now progress entirely in the hands of the chairman. Sir Patrick Coghlin will, within the terms of reference I have set out, have absolute control over the scope and execution of the inquiry. The chair has indicated that it would not be appropriate to issue an interim report. Likewise, the chair informs me of his obligation to deliver the report to the Finance Minister. I call on all Members from all parties to join me in pledging that any future Finance Minister will immediately publish the report as received.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  4. These will only be amended at the request of the chair. I repeat, the terms of reference will only be amended at the request of the chair. That is a power that I have under the Inquiries Act which I will not be using. <BR /> <BR />The inquiry team will begin its work on 1 February 2017 and will report as expeditiously as possible. Openness and transparency will be key touchstones for Sir Patrick Coghlin and his team. Earlier, I pointed to two key requirements, and the investigation will have the power to compel witnesses and evidence. Rest assured, every stone will be turned. There will be no dark corners where the light will not be shone. <BR /> <BR />There are shortcomings in the Inquiries Act around the potential for political or ministerial interference.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  5. While the areas it will investigate will be wide-ranging, it will necessarily include key areas in which there has been huge public interest, including the development and roll-out of the RHI scheme by the then Department of Enterprise, Trade and Investment; the signing off of the scheme by the then Department of Finance and Personnel; the issue of cost controls and tariffs; the delay in implementing cost control measures before November 2015, which led to the spike of autumn 2015; and the closure of the scheme in February 2016. <BR /> <BR />I want to thank the Assembly parties who met me yesterday for their input to the terms of reference, which has, along with Sir Patrick Coghlin's expert opinion, helped to shape a robust and balanced framework for the inquiry. I have laid a copy of the terms of reference in the Assembly Library.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  6. If the panel considers it appropriate, assessors may be appointed to assist them. These individuals, to be appointed, will have relevant expertise and be from outside the North. <BR /> <BR />I turn to the terms of reference for the inquiry, which I have made as broad as possible in order to give latitude to the inquiry chair in his work. It sets the framework under which the inquiry will investigate, inquire into and report on the RHI scheme. This includes its design, governance, implementation and operation, as well as measures to control the cost of the scheme from its conception in 2011 to the conclusion of the inquiry.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  7. <BR /> <BR />In that context, the only way in which to respond to the public interest now is for me to launch an inquiry, to be held under the Inquiries Act 2005, reflecting the scale of public concern on the matter. I am pleased, therefore, to inform Members on the shape that that inquiry will take. <BR /> <BR />I now have in place an independent inquiry chair, distinguished retired Lord Justice of Appeal, Sir Patrick Coghlin, who was nominated to chair the inquiry by the Lord Chief Justice. I am very pleased that Sir Patrick Coghlin has agreed to lead this inquiry. I know that he will be unflinching in his pursuit of the truth and scrupulous in his analysis of the evidence. I have agreed with Sir Patrick Coghlin that he will be supported by two panel members to get to the truth of this affair.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  8. Members know my preference — it is on public record — for a time-bound, independent, judge-led investigation under new legislation. That was underpinned by two key requirements to ensure that the public could have confidence that it would get to the truth and that this would come out for all to see. <BR /> <BR />First, it is absolutely vital that any investigation has the powers to compel witnesses and evidence. Secondly, the investigation needs to be free from ministerial control or interference. The need for agreement on new legislation and the pending dissolution of the Assembly meant that it was not possible to pursue that preferred approach. But there cannot be obstacles placed in the way of truth. That would be wholly unacceptable to the public.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  9. weaknesses that have resulted in overcompensation, abuse and significant financial risk to our Budget and the public services it supports. <BR /> <BR />According to the Comptroller and Auditor General, the RHI scheme has the potential to cost the public purse up to £490 million over 20 years. That is money that, as Finance Minister, I would much rather see being directed towards vital public services; strengthening the health and social care system, building an infrastructure that is fit for the 21st century, and educating and training people. <BR /> <BR />In recent weeks, we have had a drip feed of serious allegations of corruption, mismanagement, incompetence and political interference surrounding the scheme.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  10. Additionally, given the position of my Department at the nexus of government, I am ideally placed to initiate this inquiry. <BR /> <BR />The case for an independent investigation into the RHI scheme is clear-cut. In his June 2016 report, the Comptroller and Auditor General concluded that:

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  11. <BR /> <BR />It is important to acknowledge that although this inquiry will examine allegations of wrongdoing, many people did act appropriately in relation to the RHI scheme. In particular, I would like to recognise the work of my officials who, working with the Comptroller and Auditor General, have diligently and fulsomely applied the principles of financial governance and probity as set out in the 'Managing Public Money' requirements. It was my officials who unearthed this financial calamity and formally notified the Comptroller and Auditor General, who then reported to the Public Accounts Committee. It is worth noting that that happened under the tenure of Minister Mervyn Storey on 19 January 2016. My officials have thus played a crucial role in bringing transparency and scrutiny to this scandal.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  12. Before doing so, it is important that we remain focused on the circumstances that have brought us to this point and which now make a public inquiry the only credible way forward. <BR /> <BR />The non-domestic renewable heat incentive (RHI) scheme was introduced in November 2012 to support the then Executive's Programme for Government commitment to renewable energy. It was conceived with laudable ambitions, and optimism, to achieve 10% of our energy consumption from renewable sources by 2020. We must focus on why the botched RHI scheme went wrong and the circumstances surrounding it rather than the environmental principles underpinning it, which remain right and proper.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  13. Ar an 19 Eanáir, d'fhógair mé go bhfuil sé i gceist agam fiosrúchán poiblí a thionscnamh ar an scéim neamhtheaghlach in-athnuaite dreasachta teasa (SDT) — inniu, tagaim os comhair an Tionóil le sonraí an fhiosrúcháin sin a dhearbhú, lena n-áirítear ballraíocht an fhiosrúcháin agus a théarmaí tagartha. Mar sin féin, sula dtugaim faoi seo, tá sé tábhachtach go bhfanaimid dírithe ar na cúinsí a thug chun an phointe seo muid agus a chiallaíonn anois gur fiosrúchán poiblí an t-aon bhealach inchreidte chun tosaigh. <BR /> <BR />On 19 January, I announced my intention to institute a public inquiry into the non-domestic renewable heat incentive scheme. Today, I come to the Assembly to confirm the details of the inquiry.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  14. On my way in, my dear friend Chris Lyttle from East Belfast asked whether this will be an hour-long statement, and I said that I could do a summary at the top of the statement, which is that the type of inquiry that I would like to see — I think that it is an inquiry that he and members of the public would like to see — is a no-hiding-place public inquiry into the RHI scandal that asks, in public session, hopefully on TV, "What did you know and when did you know it?" Additionally, it would be an inquiry that follows the money, and, after all that, it would hold to account, no matter how high or low a position someone holds, anyone responsible for wrongdoing. The inquiry and its conduct will be a matter for the chair. I will move now to the formal statement.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-24 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  15. Someone has to start the conversation about what the compensation will look like and what the overall quantum will be. Someone also has to start a conversation with the Churches and institutions that also have to make a very significant contribution.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-23 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  16. I am the first person to say that budgets are very tight, but does he agree that we will and must, as a Government, and whatever way this comes back, fulfil our obligations. Certainly, it is our intention today. I have said previously and publicly that we will fulfil our obligations to those who suffered. They are entitled now, to complement the truth that they have received, to get the justice that is redress. Does the Member agree that, despite straitened budgets, there has to be a significant contribution from a future Government — if there is to be a future Government here — to meet their needs? I hope to meet SAVIA next week — some of our colleagues are here from SAVIA — to start that discussion. Someone should start the discussion that has to take place about the quantum involved in the overall compensation. Also —

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-23 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  17. Since you have met many of the survivors and victims, do you agree that we are all in awe of the inspirational heroism of the survivors of that abuse? I have had meetings — I am sure that the Member has had likewise — with many of the survivors and victims. Their thirst for life, their redemptive qualities, their lack of interest in revenge, their commitment to community, their often strong faith and all those things are great examples for all of us as we work on the many healing projects that we are involved in.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-23 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  18. I think that it is like a horse and carriage; both go together. I am confident that I am applying myself today, tomorrow and the day after that, if necessary. Without repeating what I have said previously, the assessment, as the Minister said, will not only be politics-free but will be accurate and will stand up. When I sign off on the business plan, I will be able to say not only to Members but to the public that it stacks up financially and legally and that I can have confidence that it will be implemented. In that regard, those two stumbling blocks remain. I hope that we can make progress on the lack of clarity around state aid and, of course, on the fact that I still do not have in my possession or on my desk a business plan to approve the inspection regime.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-23 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  19. I would like to be more helpful tonight, but we are not there just yet. The area of concern remains that we do not have state aid approval. I know that the European Commission has been contacted, and I have some concerns in that regard. The scheme cannot kick off on 1 April without the state aid approval. That is an added difficulty for us, and we need to do more work in that regard. I am committed to speak to Colette Fitzgerald again tomorrow, and I hope that we can make some progress there. <BR /> <BR />As the Minister knows, there are also major concerns around the inspection regime. He will accept — I am sure it will be in his narrative later — that without rigorous, robust, 100% inspections, this interim solution will fall. I do not have a business plan for the inspections regime.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-23 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  20. If the Minister wants to take an intervention —

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-23 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  21. I will finish with this: the proposal in front of us slows the runaway train that is RHI, but it does not stop the RHI debacle.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  22. I say this with respect because we are moving into a turbulent period for our community over the next five to six weeks. It is my hope that, when and if we come back — I have said that we cannot come back to the status quo — respect for the public purse and respect for ordinary people will be paramount.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  23. In July, there was a key meeting at which a demand was made for a business case to close this down. With the Comptroller and Auditor General's report being out, it was thought then that moves would be made. That was July 2016. At the Budget meeting between the two Departments on 23 August, RHI was again discussed and pledges were made about resolution, but there was no action. On 4 October, another memo was sent from Finance to Economy asking for action on RHI. On 17 October, there was another meeting asking for action on RHI. That was the point at which my officials reported to me that PwC's report was out, the Department had taken a new response to this and we would get action. The record speaks for itself. <BR /> <BR />You have been very indulgent, Mr Deputy Speaker, and I appreciate that.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  24. It is my belief that this Government, if they come back, or whatever government structure follows must fulfil our obligations to the victims of historical institutional abuse. <BR /> <BR />I want to put this on record because, sadly, as we go low, the SDLP has tried to pretend that Sinn Féin is somehow complicit in the RHI debacle, even though Arlene Foster has acknowledged that she was the architect and it was DUP Finance Ministers and a DUP Economy Minister who have been in control since then. Here is some of the context that should go on record. In June, the Finance Department contacted the Economy Department asking for a solution to RHI. At a stocktaking meeting in July, it again asked for a solution. At that point, the overspend looked like £32 million.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  25. I sat and listened to harrowing accounts of rape, abuse and torture, and I gave a commitment that we would get justice and then compensation for those who were affected by that. I remember in particular one well-known young man — when I say "young", he was young in his time — a great pillar of the SAVIA organisation, recounting that, at the age of eight, when he was in the care of the De La Salle brothers, he wet the bed, and they brought him downstairs naked, put him in an industrial dryer and said, "The next time you wet the bed, we will turn that on". So, let us not go low. This is not a day for going low; this is a day for going high. Let us leave for another day the abuse, horror and indignity that the victims of institutional abuse suffered. Let us all make the commitment that I made at a public forum here.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  26. Earlier today, the Survivors and Victims of Institutional Abuse (SAVIA) organisation and those who suffered abuse in institutions — mainly but not only Church institutions — when they were in the care of the state and the Churches were contracted to provide that care were used to score political points. I have seen disrespect and shameful discussions in the Chamber, but people need to be careful today about where we drag what is left of the credibility of this institution. I have spent the last three to four years working with the victims of historical institutional abuse, SAVIA, Mags McGuckin and others. I met them around the Lord Mayor's table at City Hall. I was the first Lord Mayor to bring the victims and survivors of institutional abuse into the chamber there.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  27. That is why we arrive at this juncture with an interim solution. When the Comptroller and Auditor General reported in July and PwC reported in October, we really could have taken the steps then so that at this juncture we had the full and comprehensive solution. That did not happen. <BR /> <BR />I will read into the record some of the efforts made to get a solution on RHI since I was appointed, but I want to mention one other point. There have been many lows here over recent days and months because of the behaviour of certain people who do not respect the public.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  28. Gabh mo leithscéal, Patsy, níl mé ag glacadh le hionchuir. <BR /> <BR />The key issue, of course, where the disrespect reached stratospheric levels, was the refusal then of the DUP to have an investigation, while acknowledging, as the outgoing First Minister — the former First Minister — did, that she was the architect of the mess. When the opportunity came to build confidence by having an investigation — a no-hiding-place investigation to get to the truth, to deal with people honestly and to tell them what had happened — she set her face against that. One of the DUP spokespersons was insisting that, really, this was a storm in a teacup and it would all be settled. They took the public for granted. They presumed that people would continue to put up with behaviour that was shameful and disrespectful.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  29. I hope that, when the people give their verdict, they remember those who insisted that we should treat the public purse and the public with respect, those who came to the defence of the public purse, those who insisted that this be remedied, those who said that they would not accept any type of cover-up and those who insisted that we treat the public with respect. There has been talk in here today of treating each other with respect, but, when you do not treat the public with respect, then indeed you are certainly doomed.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  30. He has alleged that that was because of political interference. The reality is that, because of the disrespectful way the public purse was treated and because of the arrogance in dealing with protecting the public purse, a spike was allowed to occur. The Comptroller and Auditor General says that there were as many applications in seven weeks as there were in the preceding 34 months from the opening of the scheme. The cost of the spike is £24 million a year for 20 years. Shameful, shameful treatment of the public purse and the public. <BR /> <BR />The election will be a referendum on RHI and how it was handled.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  31. The people were let down. They were disrespected and treated in a shameful manner. The reality is that that came from one quarter and one quarter only. Arlene Foster concedes that she was the architect of the RHI scheme. She was the Minister in charge when the tariffs were stripped out. She was the Minister in charge when she refused to heed warnings that this would be an excessive spend, a waste, a blot on our budgets and a hole in our financial projections. That was ignored. It was ignored because the public were disrespected and the public purse was disrespected, and it was done in a shameful fashion. <BR /> <BR />When the opportunity came to close down the scheme, again a DUP Minister — at that time, Mr Bell — did not act in the swift and expeditious fashion that he should have.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  32. Again, £85,000 would employ two teachers for a year in Sure Start.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  33. I spoke last week to the Somme Association. In a quirk of departmental responsibilities, the Department of Finance is responsible for the Ulster Tower at Thiepval, at the Somme. Their entire budget for the year is usually £85,000 — £50,000 for caretakers and £25,000 for expenses, around that sort of money. They could institute an entire programme of cross-community peace-building with one day's money from RHI. I visited the Nerve Centre, in Derry. Again, one day's money would enable the Nerve Centre to carry out a cross-community programme with young people to build confidence and creativity and to exploit the potential that our young people have. I visited the Markets Sure Start nursery school that opened earlier this year. I sat down afterwards with those who run the Sure Start initiative right across working-class areas of Belfast.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  34. <BR /> <BR />Last Friday, I sat in Carryduff GAC in south Belfast with the chief executive and the heads of Lisburn and Castlereagh City Council, and the Carryduff GAC representatives were talking about a dramatic plan to build a community and sports campus in outer south Belfast. Eighty-five thousand pounds would absolutely transform the potential to draw up that master plan. Ten days of that would build the 3G pitch that they desire; it would certainly be a contribution towards it.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  35. I am going to take the same approach that Naomi Long took earlier. I am not going to take any points of information, nor will I give way. Later on, perhaps, people will have an opportunity to have their say. <BR /> <BR />Between now and 1 April, this interim solution will cost the public purse £6 million. After that, the cost to the public purse will be, we estimate, £5 million — £2 million-plus for a new inspection regime which is absolutely essential to drive out those who have been abusing the scheme. It will also have a cost overrun, even under the plan that is being proposed. Why does that dismay us? We know that, when we go out into our constituencies, people feel that they have been duped and treated in a way which undermines their confidence in the Assembly and in any honest ability to deal with the problems.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  36. It is not a full and comprehensive plan, and it is not a zero-cost plan. <BR /> <BR />The lack of honesty in dealing with the public has also been disrespectful and shameful. The public should know that, every day from now until 1 April, the RHI debacle will continue to cost us £85,000 a day.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  37. <BR /> <BR />There have been a number of missteps here. Arlene Foster should not have come out and said that this would be a solution to the RHI situation. She should not have said that this would be a zero-cost solution. That compounds the disrespect. I do not speak as a member of Sinn Féin, because that is the business that we are in; we are in the business of trading political blows. I speak for the public and for those who are losing money because of the RHI scandal. We added to and compounded the disrespect by claiming that there would be a magic solution. In fact, what we have today is a partial, interim, stopgap plan which kicks the can down the road for one more year, after which we face into 18 years of potential losses in the hope and expectation that there may be a way through.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  38. <BR /> <BR />It is also with sadness that I have to note that we do not have a full and comprehensive plan today which would stop the bleeding and staunch the haemorrhaging from the public purse. We could have had that plan if the warnings and the red flags and the advice that had been given since December 2014 and February 2015 from a whole range of bodies, including the Ulster Farmers' Union, had been heeded. In particular, when I met the officials in the Department of Finance when I came into post, they outlined all the efforts that they had made to seek urgent remedy to this debacle. Unfortunately, because actions were not taken when they could have been taken, we are now coming forward with a partial stopgap solution rather than the full and comprehensive plan that people deserve.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  39. I want to go high today by referring to the disrespect which was shown to the public, the lack of respect for the public purse, the dereliction of duty and the shameful way in which this entire debacle has been handled. <BR /> <BR />I want first to make some quick points. First, the names of the beneficiaries should be published and published now. It is way past the time for excuses or foot-dragging. There are major questions hanging over this scheme in relation to malfeasance and corruption and in relation to people milking and scamming the system. If we want to build confidence in a solution, we should, without prejudice, agree to publish the names of the beneficiaries.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  40. I speak as an MLA rather than as the Finance Minister. I am precluded from speaking as the Finance Minister, but I beg your indulgence, Mr Deputy Speaker, to thank the staff at the Finance Department who worked over the weekend and who continue to give advice and work hard to try to assess the proposals that have been brought forward by the Minister for the Economy. Anyone who deals with constituency issues rises on this issue with more sadness than anger, because the reality is that we all deal with people every day for whom £85,000 would absolutely transform the projects in which they are involved. <BR /> <BR />Earlier today, sadly, we saw that, in trying to defend the indefensible, the DUP went low. As the woman said, when they go low, we go high.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  41. That commitment remains; our commitment is to a shared and prosperous society. If we cannot have that through these institutions, they are not worth the candle. We cannot go back to the status quo. We called time on intolerance and arrogance and on those who will not commit to respecting all our people.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  42. I think that you get a supplementary, Mr Nesbitt. If you want to ask it now, you can, or you can wait for your supplementary. <BR /> <BR />The reality is that the situation that we are in was caused by the DUP, but I am content that I did my work. We met all the DUP Ministers in relation to budgets. The budgets were ready to go. It was the DUP that became consumed by RHI, former Ministers kneeling in studios and the First Minister being taken to task for her role in the RHI debacle. <BR /> <BR />I stand over my record in this office. I stand over what we have done, the culture of change and the momentum that we brought to it, and the efforts that I made to stretch out the hand of friendship and go that extra mile in dealing with all my colleagues in the DUP and the independent Member over the last six or seven months.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  43. I used the word "pathetic" earlier. I do not want to repeat myself, but the reality is —

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  44. Instead of that, unfortunately, it is just excuse-making, pandering and trying to cover up the corruption of others.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  45. <BR /> <BR />It is a bit rich for the DUP to show any concern about public finances when ye are the people who created the RHI debacle and scandal and that egregious waste of public funds. It would be much better for you, Mrs Hale, and your colleagues, when you come to address matters relating to the public purse, to ask what happened with RHI, whether the allegations of corruption and malfeasance are true and why we could not have had the investigation that people demanded. Will you now accept that there is a need for just a little touch of humility? Will you say to the public, "We got it wrong. We created the mess; we are the architects of the debacle. We will go after the wrongdoers, bring them to book and close this sorry chapter"?

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  46. Well, arís, thanks very much. We will repeat ourselves as need be. The DUP brought down these institutions by its arrogance, its commitment to opposing equality and its refusal to accord parity of esteem and respect to all sections of our community. I repeat what I have said: the moneys will continue to flow. I know that there will be some scaremongering about this, which is surprising since it is the DUP that put us in this position, but moneys will continue to flow to front-line services. I am convinced that that is the case. Afterwards, if we enter into a period of uncertainty, I am confident that the civil servants, particularly the permanent secretary of the Finance Department, will continue to ensure that moneys flow as appropriate to front-line services.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  47. We face an election. I am not sure when that will be, Mrs Hale; maybe at the end of February or the start of March. In the period after that, I have confidence that, as needs be and as appropriate, moneys will continue to flow to front-line services. <BR /> <BR />If there is blame to be meted out in relation to the situation that we are now in, in my view, and in the view, I think, of the majority of the public, it lies with not me, this side of the Chamber or any other party in the Chamber but your colleagues in the DUP.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  48. I suggest that the Member ask that question of her colleagues on the other side of the Chamber. This crisis was caused by your colleagues — by their total neglect and ignorance of the need to act in a manner that shows respect for their fellow Members and the public at all times. I am confident, since you asked the question, that moneys will continue to flow and that no moneys will be lost to our Budget. I followed that part of the Finance Committee this morning. You can be sure that, despite the political crisis which the DUP has caused by its response to and stance on RHI, its inability to accept the equality agenda and its breathtaking arrogance, moneys will continue to flow in the time ahead.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  49. As you know, Mr Givan excelled himself: he went above and beyond in terms of the daily provocations from the DUP before Christmas when he moved into a class of one by his action on the Líofa bursary.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD

  50. I am now very happy to answer Mr McCann's question, having got the other matters on the record. Eamonn, we entered into a Fresh Start with the DUP and did our level best. Martin McGuinness epitomised that effort in the weeks and months since Fresh Start. We deliberately stretched out the hand of friendship. Mr Givan and I visited Portrush, where I was very keen to support an initiative that he was involved in around the forthcoming Open. That was our approach, and it was the correct one. The community wanted a fresh start. However, that fresh start was undermined by the repeated actions of the DUP and by the fact that there was no reciprocity.

    OFFICIAL REPORT, 2017-01-16 · READ THE OFFICIAL RECORD