Máirtín Ó Muilleoir
South Belfast · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland
“Go raibh maith agat as an cheist sin. I think it must. I followed the Public Accounts Committee under my colleague Mr Swann, and I read the devastating October hearing when Ofgem appeared.”
“While the areas it will investigate will be wide-ranging, it will necessarily include key areas in which there has been huge public interest, including the development and roll-out of the RHI scheme by the then Department of Enterprise, Trade and Investment; the signing off of the scheme by the then Department of Finance and Personnel; th…”
“I thank Mr Clarke for that question. I know that Mr Clarke was at the PAC hearing that Robin Swann had the wonderful occasion to chair. I would have paid money to attend that because it was certainly a difficult session for the PAC.”
“In relation to the question asked, I want to speak in particular of the seven months that I have been in the Department of Finance. I have been deeply impressed by the commitment, diligence and alertness of my officials to the RHI scandal. I mentioned previously alerting the Comptroller and Auditor General.”
“Ba mhaith liom buíochas a thabhairt don Chomhalta as an cheist sin. I think that any inquiry will ask what went wrong, where it went wrong, who was accountable and what happened. In that context, I am totally convinced that the decision to involve Ofgem in the RHI scheme was a major mistake. Ofgem has failed.”
“Therefore, I wish to reassure the public by setting out the steps that I think must be taken to ensure absolute openness and transparency. The arrangements I have detailed in this statement are intended to ensure this.”
The complete record
Every one of 1,305 lines we hold for Máirtín Ó Muilleoir, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 26 of 27.
“That surely is an area in which, if we had the fiscal lever, we could decide whether to pull the metaphorical trigger. <BR /> <BR />Do you think that we need more transparency? Having the fiscal levers and using them are two different things, but surely we need to have the choice.”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. I thought that he was starting to lose a bit of pace there anyway. <BR /> <BR />I have two points to make on trying to find some common ground. First, the Minister will accept that we need more transparency. We talk about trust and transparency from the Treasury. I take it that he accepts that we would like more transparency in Treasury figures. I had a little debate with it recently when trying to get an exact figure for VAT. <BR /> <BR />The second point is that we can have the fiscal levers and then decide when to use them. In fact, that is exactly what we will be doing with corporation tax. A week does not go by in the Chamber without someone's voice being raised in support of the tourism industry. We know that it is suffering under a 20% VAT rate and is asking for some flexibility.”
“I make a plea to all the parties here: in the next Programme for Government, we really need to get our act together on the north-west; we need to expand Magee College and create the infrastructure. The potential with corporation tax powers is limitless. We could move into a new era of job creation, and, as part of that new era, there needs to be a new peace dividend and a new era for the north-west. Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle.”
“The Calvert Foundation model could be used around our peace lines. People who want to support the peace and build the economy could make small donations to our social innovation fund, have them matched by the Minister and see their money contribute to building peace. <BR /> <BR />Lastly, I want to echo the comments of Mr Eastwood. It always stops you talking when your name is mentioned. I echo his calls. I made it up to the city that I call "Derry", the Minister calls "Londonderry" and my esteemed colleague Ms Boyle refers to as "Greater Strabane". I was in Derry city last week, where I met representatives of the chamber of commerce and Ilex and the new CEO of Derry City and Strabane District Council.”
“<BR /> <BR />We know of the great work that the Community Foundation here does in making sure that funds that are donated by philanthropists are distributed to those in need and agencies that are tackling poverty and building the social economy. That may be something that we should do as well. There are other bodies and agencies that lend to voluntary and charitable groups, enterprise agencies and so on, but at this stage we do not, to my knowledge, have a scheme whereby if someone wished to contribute, perhaps to their local area, they could come forward with funds and we would match them. Through the social innovation fund, the Minister might look at that. <BR /> <BR />There is an organisation in the US called the Calvert Foundation. It asks individuals to lend it funds and it distributes those, usually to inner cities.”
“Again, I ask the Minister to look beyond making that a fund from which voluntary, charitable or faith group bodies can borrow. Is there a way to match funds that are contributed by philanthropists? I am thinking particularly of the Community First programme in England, which runs until the end of March this year. The Treasury set aside £50 million and said that, if those with wealth came forward and wished to establish a fund, it would match it. If a generous individual came forward in Bristol, Manchester or London and said, "I wish to have a new fund with £1 million", the Government came forward with their kitty and matched that.”
“Of course, that would mean a loan that would have to be paid back, but I believe that the rates would be favourable and that it would give us that extra "za-za boom", I believe they call it; that extra push in our investment programme. <BR /> <BR />When the Minister was in kindergarten in 1995, there was talk of a peace bond. The Minister does not have the power to issue a bond, but we need to explore in an imaginative fashion how we could work towards a bond if we had the powers. However, it would certainly give our allies and friends across the globe, but particularly in north America, an opportunity to invest in building the peace and the economy. <BR /> <BR />The baby sister of the investment fund is the social innovation fund, which has only £5 million from dormant funds but hopefully will grow.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. That sounds like a tempting and generous offer, but I am hoping to finish by 2.00 pm. Deputy Speaker, many have congratulated you on your elevation, so I will do that as well. You have been here for quite a while now, like me, but congratulations on your appointment. <BR /> <BR />I want to touch on matters that would, perhaps, enhance the Budget on the basis that we have many pressing demands on our funds. When I last looked, the Minister had managed to put over £40 million into the new investment fund. Perhaps that has increased in the last seven days. I would ask him to explore, as part of the growth of the investment fund, the opportunity to attract funds from abroad. I am thinking in particular of pension funds, which would see an investment fund in this region as an attractive proposition.”
“<BR /> <BR />To finish, I know that the Minister met the students, and I think that he will find that they are progressive and ambitious and have high aspirations for themselves, their community and this society. I believe that, in the time ahead, they will continue to engage with him in this debate about saving the university colleges and ensuring that they prosper. My only word of advice for the Minister is to bring a bouquet to that discussion, rather than a metaphorical blunderbuss.”
“In this day and age, we often hear people say that our young people are not engaged enough in civic or political life, and, with their leadership of this campaign, I think that they showed exactly the opposite. They rose to the challenge, and we owe them a debt of gratitude. <BR /> <BR />I am aware that circumstances have changed since the petition was first circulated and won the support of people well beyond the confines of St Mary's University College. I will only say that, as we look to the future, I think that you will find in these students who led the campaign great allies as we start to discuss and continue discussing a shared and pluralist approach to further and higher education. Ba mhaith liom sin a bheith ráite, agus go ndéanaimid uilig comhghairdeas leis na mic léinn.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Tráthnóna maith. Ba mhaith liom misneach mhic léinn Choláiste Naomh Muire a mholadh agus mé ag cur achainí os do chomhair. I present to you, Mr Speaker, a petition from the students and community of west Belfast on, as it was at the time, the planned closure of St Mary's University College. The students asked a representative from South Belfast to present the petition to show solidarity and to send their best wishes to Stranmillis University College. Of course, as we know, both university colleges were threatened with closure at that time. <BR /> <BR />I am happy to present the petition, and I want to say some words of praise for the students.”
“Go raibh maith agat a Aire. Thank you, Minister. I recently spoke to the chief executive of Belfast International Airport. I also met the owners of the airport in Toronto and I met Massport, which owns Logan Airport in Boston. There is definitely interest in a transatlantic flight, but we are falling down at the minute because there are none out of Belfast. <BR /> <BR />Does the Minister agree that now is the time for a concerted and united push by the new owners of the airport, Tourism Ireland, Belfast International Airport and our many ambassadors to try to bring in the number of transatlantic visitors that we would like? That is especially the case given the success of Dublin Airport. As the Minister knows, the road is a big help, but it goes both ways.”
“We managed to work hard, I presume, around the Executive table, to negotiate a much better deal for tourism, and I think that that has to be at the heart of the economic recovery of which I spoke.”
“It is the opinion of Wolf, the opinion of Stiglitz, the opinion of Krugman and the opinion of Piketty that austerity, and the ideology of austerity, actually damages an economy. <BR /> <BR />To build confidence in the time ahead, we need to make sure that the moneys we have allocated in this 2015-16 Budget, in particular regarding the Committee that I am on, the Committee for Enterprise, Trade and Investment, gets down to our businesses and attracts investment as quickly as possible. I think we have done that. <BR /> <BR />My final point is that Minister Foster will brief the Finance Committee on Wednesday, but I think that there has been a real effort, within that, to give comfort to the tourism sector. Those of us who were briefed on it know that NI tourism, in particular, was very worried.”
“I am of the opinion that we are in recovery. I see, this morning, that Ulster Bank economists are saying that the economy is stumbling, so it is clearly not a self-assured recovery; but I believe that we are in economic recovery. The big challenge for us, as a Chamber, an Executive and an Assembly, is to ensure that the steps we take in the time ahead push us farther into recovery, build the economy and create jobs. There is a danger, and I know that the Minister is aware of it, that when you introduce cuts in such an atmosphere you may damage confidence. I disagree with my colleague Mr Ó Brollacháin in that regard: these cuts are imposed on us by London. <BR /> <BR />That is the last point I wish to make, and it is well made by greater economic authorities than me.”
“I commend the Ministers on the efforts made in very challenging times when, as the Minister said, London has cut the Budget by £1·5 billion since 2011. Efforts were made by all Departments to focus our funding on growing the economy, creating jobs and trying to move the community confidently forward, and I think that we will see the rewards of that.”
“It is important to put on record that not all of us agree with that, because we do not think that it is a straight equation that that £100 million would have, in particular, gone to those in need, would have been spent on the economy and would have built up lives, families and communities. It is not a straight equation. I mention that because I hope that we are united in the Chamber against the ideology of austerity and that there is no hankering after that. We have decided to mitigate the worst effects of the so-called welfare reform that is coming down the tracks so that we can ensure that we eschew, rebut and refute the philosophy and ideology of austerity. <BR /> <BR />I want to focus on the Budget and the figures in front of us.”
“Mo bhuíochas as an deis cainte inniu. Tempting as it is to get between Mr Campbell and Mr Allister, I think that I will resist that and focus on the Budget, except to say that we are perhaps gilding the lily to refer to the Equality Commission as anti-Christian. The bits of the Bible that I read are very strong on equality. Of course, I could be reading the wrong parts, but, for now, I think that we can stand over the work that the Equality Commission is doing. <BR /> <BR />I have three quick points on the spring Supplementary Estimates that are before us today, as well as the 2015-16 Budget and Vote on Account. The Minister only referred to the past briefly. Sometimes the past gets us in trouble in here, but he referred to the so-called welfare reform fine from London of £100 million as a loss to public services.”
“Earlier, you mentioned employer engagement, and you are talking now of the benefits to wider society. Do you accept that one of the flaws in the Minister's approach is that he has not taken into consideration the economic impact of removing or closing down university colleges or, in fact, that the economic link and synergy between all the higher education establishments and their host communities is very important?”
“Will the Minister give way? Sorry, will the Member give way?”
“Will he give a continued commitment to make sure that we give as much help as possible to those who lost their homes?”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Go raibh maith agat, a Aire. Thank you, Minister. If I caught you right, you said that you acceded to the request for £15,000, and I welcome that. It is clear from the Minister's answer that our sympathies are with those who find themselves in negative equity or who lose their homes, sometimes through no fault of their own. We are talking about ordinary people, as the Minister understands. The people that we serve are all ordinary; we do not distinguish between Traveller or settled, black or white, or whatever religion people have. Will the Minister continue to push as hard as possible for those who have really lost out in the boom? As the Minister knows, we helped the banks that made the loans.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Go raibh agat, a LeasChéad Aire, as an fhreagra sin a thabhairt dúinn. Tá éigeandáil ar leith ag gabháil ar aghaidh sa tSiria, agus is gá freagra a thabhairt uirthi. It is appropriate to say that the racial equality unit in the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister has done great work in this regard. It would be great to get a breakthrough. Does the deputy First Minister agree that the benefits to Belfast, certainly to the North, of taking refugees would be considerable and that it would be a blessing to Belfast to be able to take in refugees from Syria? Of course, it would be a lifeline to those in greatest need in the refugee camps.”
“Do you accept that Stranmillis University College is also against the removal of the premia?”
“The focus tonight is on St Mary's University College. We have not heard as much from Stranmillis University College, not least because the Minister, who I am delighted to see here, appoints its board of governors. However, the principal of Stranmillis has spoken out strongly against the cuts, and I quote her:”
“There will be no compulsory redundancies on our watch and we will make sure that, as we start to grow this economy, we will emerge stronger in the time ahead. None of us got all we wanted in this Budget, but those who criticise it come up with no alternative of any type at all. <BR /> <BR />I wanted to finish by asking my friend Mr Raymond McCartney to sing us out with "Money can't buy me love", but Mr McCartney is not here. So, instead of that, I want to pay tribute to the small business owners who form the spine of our economy. I thank them for creating jobs and growing wealth, and I want to send out the message that, as we start our recovery, now is the time to invest, build and, in particular, employ.”
“<BR /> <BR />A big result for all of us in the Budget was to have the devolution of corporation tax and that gives us great potential in the time ahead as well. The Minister has focused on growing the economy. There is no doubt that he realises the threat to the economy from the London Government's assault on our Budget and funds but, at the same time, I think that he has ensured that our friends in Invest NI have the firepower to continue to create jobs in the time ahead. <BR /> <BR />In relation to the efforts to rebalance our economy, we state again that a voluntary redundancy scheme should not diminish or damage the front-line public services. We will guarantee that and stand by it.”
“It solves the issue of dormant funds and releases money that we can use and faith-based groups, community groups and charities can borrow. I think that that is a little bit of a breakthrough for us. I hope that we can engage with others to increase that kitty. I know that the Minister talked about the £5 million growing to £10 million, and I hope that we can do that in the time ahead. <BR /> <BR />Tomorrow, I put on my snow boots and go to Boston, New York and Toronto. In those cities, I think we will find that those who support the peace process also want to support the growth of the economy here. I think that we will find a ready ear in the diaspora if we ask it to back, support and engage, especially with the social innovation fund, in the time ahead.”
“The major parties went to work. We managed to find £33 million extra, in the hope that the Minister would focus on those elements within further and higher education that would skill up our young people and secure jobs for them. Sadly, the Minister has instead spent most of his energy attacking St Mary's University College. Instead of talking about investment, he is talking about disinvestment and tearing the heart out of west Belfast. <BR /> <BR />I welcome the innovative efforts of the Minister of Finance to find or borrow money to ensure that we can set up new funds. I think, in particular, of the £500 million shared and integrated education kitty, which I think will be very important over the next 10 years, and I also give the thumbs up to the social innovation fund, which is in the small print. That, again, is £5 million.”
“I speak for those of us who are in favour of this motion and this Budget when I say that we take very seriously our duty to defend those on the margins. That is why, in this package and this Budget, we have agreed a considerable kitty of £565 million to mitigate the potential loss of benefits to individuals and families under the proposed welfare cuts. We have retained a series of anti-poverty measures and set up a supplementary payment fund to provide protection specifically for families with children, people with disabilities and those who are long-term sick. <BR /> <BR />In education, to the delight of teachers and parents — all of us were lobbied on this matter — we managed to secure a £63 million uplift for the Minister of Education, his Department and schools. <BR /> <BR />In relation to DEL, the draft Budget was unsatisfactory.”
“I want to see his JFK and Mandela and raise him a Pope Francis because Pope Francis is the leader in the world in speaking out against inequality and for fair play and equal treatment. Pope Francis asked the question:”
“<BR /> <BR />When Minister Hamilton addressed the Committee, the figure that he gave for cuts to the block grant since 2011 was £1·5 billion. That is an absolutely staggering amount to lose from the block grant. Make no mistake: this Budget is a great achievement against that type of savage assault. In the Budget, we managed to secure £204 million extra for the Department of Health. That, I think, shows our unwavering commitment to a free health service and front-line health services. <BR /> <BR />In relation to this blitz on welfare rights, condemned by the Churches in Britain and Ireland, we have stood firm in our intention, conviction and resolve to protect the vulnerable. In his Budget speech before Christmas, the Minister quoted JFK and Nelson Mandela, as my colleague an tUasal Ó Brollacháin mentioned.”
“The Minister, more than most, knows that that is true, but, with money, we can set out our priorities and spell out our values, and that is what we have done with the Budget. It is a Budget that, despite the assault on our block grant from London, protects the vulnerable, builds the economy and underpins the peace that we have come to value. <BR /> <BR />Particularly for us, making sure that welfare cuts were not implemented as proposed by Mr Cameron and his colleagues in London was an absolute priority. Looking after those in the margins, easing the burden on working families and making sure that those who have lost out in the economy are looked after is essential. In the face of the slash-and-burn approach of London, the Budget — looking after the vulnerable and making sure that we grow the economy — is quite a feat.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. I know that that is a warning to the Minister not to interrupt. I wanted to start, as we should when discussing matters of finance and budgets, by quoting Lennon, but, first, I want to congratulate our friends in Syriza. I congratulate the Greek people. It is a great blow against austerity. Those of us battling the austerity ideologues in London will take great heart from that, as will people across Europe. <BR /> <BR />On to Lennon — I know that the Minister snapped to attention, but I will quote not Vladimir but John, who said:”
“An dóigh leat gur dul chun cinn atá ann nuair a d'oscail siad Bunscoil Phobal Feirste in 1971, bagraíodh príosún ar na daoine a rinne sin? In 1971, when the first bunscoil was opened in Belfast, the promoters were threatened with prison. Do you think we are perhaps making progress in that that threat is not there today?”
“Will the Member take a very short intervention?”
“They want to build for the future. They want to create a shared future, so maybe you will take that on board.”
“We need to make sure that we do not send out a message to young people and children in particular that this is an attack on them, and I say that especially to my colleague Mr Kinahan. These young children have so much to offer this society —”
“Go raibh maith agat. Ba mhaith liom aird ar leith a dhíriú ar rud atá in easnamh anseo: comhghairdeas leis na tuismitheoirí agus leis an daltaí atá bainteach le Coláiste Dhoire. I thank the Member for giving way. One of the things missing is congratulating the parents and the organising committee, and I know that the author of the report is here today as well, for their courage and boldness in continuing to build for the future of their area and community. Again, the negativity in this motion is in contrast with what I see in Irish schools. I was in Bunscoil Bheann Mhadagáin in north Belfast on Friday, and I met young twins, Nathan and Brendan May, who just started Coláiste Feirste before Christmas. I saw ebullience, a positivity, a joy, a desire and an ambition to learn.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle, Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as a ráiteas. Thank you, Minister, for the statement. I look forward to seeing more detail around the brand. The new organisation, Tourism Northern Ireland — Turasóireacht Thuaisceart Éireann — is a good move. You talk about a closer alignment between Invest NI and the new organisation. Can we get a guarantee that it will really be a partnership and that Invest NI will not smother the smaller organisation, that they will work together and Invest NI will help to grow it? We see the common interest in, for example, transatlantic routes into Belfast. That seems to be an area of common purpose for the new organisation and Invest NI. Can we get that guarantee that one will not take over the other?”
“— let me know what economic impact assessments he has carried out?”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. The Minister was very frank in his answer. I wonder whether he accepts that the removal of the premium will lead to the closure of St Mary's University College. Does he accept that if St Mary's closes, it will be the biggest body blow in a generation to the area of highest unemployment in Belfast? Would he —”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas fosta leis an Aire as an fhreagra sin. Will the Minister continue to monitor that? There are really positive things happening. I suppose that we would call that outer south Belfast or Carryduff. It is a beacon, I think, for the way in which we would like communities to develop, and it is really important that there are enough primary-school places to let that community prosper.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Ba mhaith liom ceist a chur ar an Aire maidir le cúrsaí oideachais i nDeisceart Bhéal Feirste.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Go raibh maith agat, a Aire. The Minister plugged the hotline. Will she tell us how many calls have been made to the emergency hotline in that regard?”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as an fhreagra chuimsitheach sin a thug sé. Thank you, Minister, for a comprehensive answer. I want to probe a related area, which, of course, you are concerned about, and that is the air quality and pollution levels at the interchange. It has been known as a hot spot for nitrogen dioxide for some time. Is it your assessment that we will eliminate the pollution problem at the interchange through the work at York Street?”
“Míle buíochas. Thank you, Minister. I know that Tennent's NI has voiced support for the minimum pricing of alcohol, and I know that many event organisers are very circumspect about how they organise events at this time of year. Will you take the opportunity to join me in commending our front-line staff in accident and emergency departments who are put through hell at this time of year, which is a time of celebration, by having to deal with people who present drunk at A&E?”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. Will the Commission set out clearly the rules relating to the rental of constituency offices and the requirements placed on elected Members so that the public can get a full understanding of the precise nature of those rules?”
“Thank you, Minister. When you spoke earlier in that regard, the terminology that you used was almost that of a new era of job creation. In that new era, do you think that it may be possible to start targeting jobs at certain locations, not only Fermanagh but west of the Bann and west and north Belfast?”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. I thank the Minister for her answers so far. Will she join me in welcoming the ambition shown by the new managing director of Belfast International Airport, Graham Keddie, who has spoken about new transatlantic links, in the first instance to our cousins in Canada?”