Andrew Muir
North Down · Alliance Party · Northern Ireland
“Thank you very much, Mr Deputy Speaker. As Minister, I am grateful to the Chair of the Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs Committee and to Members from all sides of the Chamber for their consideration of the Bill and their contributions to the debate, which have been valuable and useful.”
“I will write to you with regard to your query. <BR /> <BR />The other issue, as I said, is reporting pollution incidents so that they can be effectively investigated. There is a duty on everyone to do that promptly.”
“Aquaculture provides real economic opportunities, and the Bill will help ensure that those opportunities are realised responsibly without compromising the environment. Importantly, the Bill includes transitional provisions so that existing licences can continue seamlessly as aquaculture licences, with their conditions unchanged.”
“That is not about being punitive for its own sake; it is about ensuring that the legal framework reflects the true value of our natural resources and the importance of protecting them for future generations.”
“<BR /> <BR />On strengthening the regulation of inland waters, the Bill modernises long-standing powers under the Fisheries Act (Northern Ireland) 1966, ensuring that they are fit for today's environmental and industry challenges. That matters because fisheries management today goes far beyond simply catching fish.”
“<BR /> <BR />A full regulatory impact assessment of the financial impact has been completed. It concluded that the Bill does not introduce significant new financial burdens and that any costs are outweighed by the long-term benefits.”
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“Therefore, I am keen to explore their views on what action they believe is needed as well as discussing my intention to introduce a version of Lucy’s law to Northern Ireland.”
“<BR /> <BR />To combat the illegal breeding and trafficking of low-welfare pups, my Department supports the councils and other statutory bodies under the Paws for Thought initiative. That initiative, chaired by my Department, comprises representatives from the Police Service of Northern Ireland, His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs, councils, Belfast Harbour Police, ferry companies and my Department’s animal welfare policy, enforcement and portal inspection teams. In addition, my Department continues to work with councils and the other relevant statutory bodies to promote messages and communications that urge the public to secure dogs from reputable and licensed breeders. <BR /> <BR />I am conscious that dog breeding is an area where stakeholders express concern and that more action will be required in the time ahead.”
“I would like to highlight the robust legislation that Northern Ireland already has in place to regulate commercial dog-breeding establishments. The Welfare of Animals (Dog Breeding Establishments and Miscellaneous Amendments) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2013 empower councils to license and inspect potential or current breeding establishments. The 2013 regulations also provide powers for council inspectors to act if a commercial breeder does not meet the standards required. That includes the power to suspend or revoke a licence. Unlicensed commercial breeders and licence holders who breach the conditions of those regulations can face prosecution, and a conviction carries a maximum penalty of six months imprisonment and/or a fine of £5,000.”
“I met Minister Humphreys and Secretary General Mary Hurley on 22 July 2024 and had productive discussions on current issues, including the banning of XL bully dogs. My officials have also met their Republic of Ireland counterparts to discuss implementation processes and any potential cross-border issues. That engagement is ongoing. I am committed to working with Minister Humphreys and our counterpart not only on XL bully safeguards but on wider dog control issues and the promotion of dog ownership across this island.”
“If Assembly colleagues or stakeholders advocating for further legislation to provide protection in a residential setting where an XL bully dog is kept can provide viable suggestions, my officials will consider any such detail received.”
“I am aware of the Member's ongoing concerns about potential attacks by XL bully dogs in residential settings. The safeguards that I introduced are aimed at protecting public safety. Placing legal restrictions on a dog in the home is neither feasible, practical nor enforceable and would severely impinge upon an owner's ability to look after and enjoy time with their dog in a private dwelling. The fact is that all dog owners are responsible for controlling their dog whether they are in public or private settings. My Department continues to promote responsible dog ownership, and I urge all dog owners to educate themselves about their dog's needs and to be aware of changes in behaviour or temperament.”
“In the Republic of Ireland, the certificates will be issued only to owners who can prove that their dog has a licence and is microchipped and neutered. That is broadly in line with the conditions for exemption that I introduced in Northern Ireland.”
“I have enacted legislation to restrict and control the ownership of XL bully dogs, and I am pleased that my ministerial colleague in the Republic of Ireland has moved to align legislation across the island. I understand that the rules there will broadly mirror the legal requirements that are already in place here and in the rest of the UK. For example, breeding, selling and rehoming XL bully dogs will be prohibited in the Republic of Ireland from 1 October 2024, matching the legal restrictions that I introduced here on 5 July. <BR /> <BR />It will be illegal to own an XL bully dog in the Republic of Ireland without a certificate of exemption from 1 February 2025, which is one month after it will become illegal here.”
“As Minister, I will always be guided by the evidence and science, particularly on ammonia. If the evidence and science were to change, it would be negligent of me not to respond to that. I cannot say that nothing will change in the future, but it is important that we are guided by the evidence and science. That is why we are having discussions at the ministerial round-table about the situation as it presents itself to me.”
“First, I congratulate Lord Elliott on his elevation to the other place. Congratulations on that. The Northern Ireland Environment Agency is doing what it can on planning applications, but we have to act in accordance with the law and ensure that our advice is given appropriately and reflects the law. There are also resource constraints. It is important that we recognise that statutory consultees act within the resources that are available to them. We have done what we can in the Northern Ireland Environment Agency, but the budget for the next financial year will be important in allowing us provide those resources to the environment agency so that it can respond to the planning applications.”
“We need to have the same focus on air quality issues that we have on water in our responsibility for dealing with those issues. We have seen water quality issues playing out in our rivers, lakes and loughs in Northern Ireland, but air quality is also a serious concern. Just because it is not as visible, it does not mean that we should not take heed of the legal obligations to act.”
“The Member asked two questions. One was about engagement. As I outlined to Michelle McIlveen, that is something that I have prioritised. I have convened a ministerial round-table on the issue of ammonia to engage with stakeholders. The other one was about the Office for Environmental Protection's report last week on river basin management plans. I have put it clearly on the record that I accept the recommendations that were set out in that report. It is important that, whatever we do on ammonia or other matters that are in my portfolio, we act in accordance with the law. That is the space that I am in. <BR /> <BR />Last week, I talked an awful lot about water quality. Today, we are talking about ammonia and air quality.”
“I thank the Member for her supplementary question. Reductions in ammonia emissions in existing facilities will be taken into account in the new operational protocol to assess the impacts of air pollution on the natural environment, but the remaining level of ammonia pollution is the key factor that must be used by DAERA to provide advice to planning authorities. Further to my response, I understand the issue that you are outlining, which is otherwise known as betterment. I will be engaging with stakeholders about that in the days ahead as part of a ministerial round-table that I have convened on the issue. It is important that we have dialogue and engage on the matter and the general issue of ammonia.”
“I thank the Member for her question. She touches on an important issue, because we need to incentivise uptake of the technology that is being outlined. I wrote to the DEFRA Secretary of State in London about future agriculture funding for Northern Ireland and made the case for us having separate and additional funding, which I consider to be the just transition fund for agriculture. That would be capital funding to enable the uptake of the technology. Further to that letter, I will engage with the Secretary of State when I am in London next Monday.”
“<BR /> <BR />I am aware that although agriculture makes a significant contribution to Northern Ireland's economy, it produces 97% of current ammonia emissions. Action on ammonia is urgently required to support our local farm businesses and rural communities to thrive and be sustainable while, at the same time, protecting our environment and meeting our legislative requirements. It is essential that the ammonia strategy is science-led and can deliver measures that protect nature, meet Northern Ireland's legal obligations and ensure a sustainable agriculture sector.”
“I thank the Member for her question. It is important that the ammonia strategy delivers the most effective measures to protect our environment. To do that, I need to consider all the relevant information available to me. Following a consultation in 2023, my Department considered the responses and used the information to inform a reworked draft ammonia strategy. However, I wish to seek additional views on proposed mandatory ammonia reduction measures, which will be included as part of the consultation process during the 2024 nutrients action programme review. To allow time for that process to take place, I anticipate that it will be 2025 before the ammonia strategy is finalised and ready for me to take to the Executive for approval and publication.”
“I have engaged with a range of stakeholders and will engage with them going forward, and I am aware of the concerns that you have raised. I have also been invited to a Lough Neagh eel supper, and I look forward to taking up that invitation. I have been told that it is something to be enjoyed, and I look forward to attending that.”
“A wide mix of suggestions has come through, and officials will work through those suggestions. It is important that we allow that process to be undertaken. The Committee will be aware of some that have come through. Some may have more merit than others, and it is important that we evaluate those. It is also important to put it on the record that there are no quick fixes. We need to go to the fundamental causes of this rather than the initiatives that are about dealing with the outcome of the problem.”
“The ultimate measure of achievement will be us being able to say at the end of the mandate that we were able not only to turn the environmental situation round but to give hope and confidence to the agricultural community in Northern Ireland. I think that we can do that, because I see that in the farming community in Northern Ireland. Let us put aside our particular views, focus on solutions and resolve the situation.”
“I will not respond to the comment about my party leader, for whom I have the greatest respect and who is acting entirely in line with her legal responsibilities on that issue. <BR /> <BR />It is important that we fund all interventions on Lough Neagh. It is disappointing that not everyone in the Executive was able to support the funding requirements for Lough Neagh as part of the Budget process. In this place, we are good at telling everyone what the problem is. We need to focus on coming together and turning the situation around. If people have found it difficult to support what is in the report, hopefully today will bring them a bit closer to being able to say that the report provides a balanced approach that works with people to turn the situation around.”
“I understand that the pace and scale of change is significant for people. I understand the nervousness and concern around that. Part of today's statement is to address that, so that people understand that I am on their side. <BR /> <BR />We are focused on change. None of us wants to see the scenes that we have seen in Lough Neagh reoccurring. Let us get it fixed. Let us work together on the issues and get the report and action plan agreed. It could not be agreed yesterday, but let us get it agreed next week and let us move on to deliver for the people of Northern Ireland.”
“Yes, 100%. I agree entirely with every word that the Member has said. We need to get funding to assist farmers to make changes. The overwhelming majority are doing a good job. We are talking about enforcement for those who contravene the law. We need to assist farmers in the journey ahead. I stand with them. That is why I am working with the Finance Minister on representations to the UK Government to get funding for technologies to achieve the transition. Earlier today, we talked to the Chair and Deputy Chair about the available technologies and the need to roll them out much faster because I have seen a real thirst for change. <BR /> <BR />A journey has already been undertaken in agriculture. I want to support people on that journey. We need to go fast, and we need to change.”
“That is what the editorial of the 'News Letter' said on Friday. <BR /> <BR />I value all opinions on the matter. It is clear that there is a strong public will to address the issues. That is what the 'News Letter' says about the enforcement piece, and that is an important contribution. However, my heart, soul and passion are about ensuring that such pollution incidents do not occur in the first place. How do we do that? We do it through education, engagement, incentivisation and regulation. Resorting to enforcement is a sign of failure. Let us get the report agreed and get a balanced approach. There is nothing to fear from the report and everything to gain.”
“I read the editorial of the 'News Letter' on Friday. It ended by stating:”
“I have had very productive discussions with the Finance Minister on that. We are on the same page and intend to make joint representations to the UK Government on that. There have been further developments in formulating our engagement. Obviously, there will be new Ministers on Friday, no matter what party is returned to government. It is important that we support our farmers and agriculture in Northern Ireland. A key element of that is enabling them to achieve a just transition, and part of that is the funding that we provide to assist with that. <BR /> <BR />I am on the side of farmers, and the Finance Minister and I are working together to ensure that they can be properly funded and assisted in the work that they do. That shows the benefit of Ministers working together to deliver for everyone in Northern Ireland.”
“Thank you very much. These issues have been discussed widely in the North/South Ministerial Council. There are great opportunities. As I have said, I will be going down South to see the ASSAP. I am really keen to step this up and get the report published, and then we can work with our colleagues in the South to see what more we can do. <BR /> <BR />To be fair, lots of reports have come out recently and there have been lots of initiatives in the South. They have made really good progress, so I want to garner that knowledge and see how we can use it. Good work is already being done on science and research, which is key. We need science and research to know where we are at the moment and to evaluate the progress that we need to achieve.”
“That is one of the cross-cutting actions that falls to the Department for Infrastructure. Hopefully, when we get the report agreed we can outline that in full. The key impediment is funding. The need to fund Northern Ireland Water was discussed yesterday at the Executive, and it is something on which I continue to engage with Minister O'Dowd.”
“I thank the Member for his question, and I will follow that up because it would be useful to know that. As I outlined to Deborah, we are actively looking at the governance of Northern Ireland Water and the SORPI. In the context of the report, it is important that I, as Minister, send out the message that we will focus on all sources of pollution. This is focused not just on agriculture but on waste water infrastructure, septic tanks and industry. Everything will be looked at, which is why we are working with the Northern Ireland Environment Agency on the SORPI and on how we regulate Northern Ireland Water. It is very important that we do that, so I will follow up on your point and thank you for raising it.”
“That issue is important. Those reports were concerning not just for me but for many people. We are looking at the issue of cumulative breaches. It was stated to me that that is among the issues that we should address. We are actively looking at that.”
“I recommend that he speak to his party leader.”
“I thank the Member for her question. I met the Earl of Shaftesbury, contrary to reports from others, on 21 February this year, and I will meet him later this month. I look forward to that engagement. It is important that we engage on the issue, particularly further to his comments. <BR /> <BR />Frankly, folks, I am in the dark about what is holding up the action plan. I received an email from a DUP Westminster election candidate that states:”
“I thank the Member for her question. I will have to check my diary to see when that meeting is. If we need to move it forward, we will see whether we can do that. Hopefully, it will be in the near future, because I understand the importance of it. <BR /> <BR />We are limited in relation to grant support schemes within the current vires of my Department. I will continue to engage with people, because many people are affected. I am also limited by the budget that we have and the other challenges that we have around the issues. Let us have that meeting and engage on the issues to see whether we can find a way forward.”
“It is important that people do not misrepresent all farmers with their comments.”
“That is a false assertion, and I reject it. That is not what I am about; I am about working with farmers and everyone here to turn the situation around. <BR /> <BR />It is important that we have resources around enforcement. It is key that the Northern Ireland Environment Agency has the ability to investigate alleged breaches. We are also investing in education, incentivisation and regulation. The Finance Minister and I are doing significant work on the future agriculture budget. We need to assist farmers in the just transition that we are heading towards. That is what we are doing. <BR /> <BR />It is not fair to categorise the task force as the Member did. It does great injustice to the overwhelming majority of farmers, who do a good job, abide by the law and are good custodians of the countryside. It is important that I say that.”
“An independent review of the issues is a constructive way forward. That review will deal with the relationship between fines and penalties through the criminal justice system and with cross-compliance penalties. We will consider that. I understand the issue. We need to carry out an independent review of the issue. We need to consult on it and consider it. Many people, including me, are not content with the current situation, so let us try to address it.”
“One of the key actions in the report for which I seek Executive approval is an independent review, including consultation, on the sentencing framework for environmental crime and the fines and penalties associated with it. Why is that in the report? It is because I hear that concern day and daily. It is important that we look at it, have an independent review and do a consultation. One of the concerns that I hear regularly comes from angling groups. We have had far too many fish kills in Northern Ireland, not just in recent weeks but in recent months and years, so it is important that we look at the issue and take it forward. A report that does not deal with that issue does not have credibility with me or the public.”
“It is not my or DAERA's role to, essentially, fund DFI and, in turn, Northern Ireland Water for event duration monitors. That is for Northern Ireland Water to take forward with its Minister. The roll-out of event duration monitors would be beneficial, and I will follow up on that with John O'Dowd.”
“The RePhoKUs report that I mentioned in my statement details the background to the apportionment data that we have. The report is on the AFBI website, and I encourage Members to look at it to see where the figures came from. I am happy for Members to meet the Chief Scientific Adviser in my Department, who can outline the evidence base behind it, but I am confident of the figures that I provided to the House on the sources of pollution. The key issue is that we need to address pollution. That is about investment in Northern Ireland Water and about the interventions by my Department that I have talked about. <BR /> <BR />SORPI is under review. I have been engaging with officials on that, and we will work through it over the time ahead, because it is not fit for purpose.”
“I thank the Member for his question. I hope to make awards for that initiative very soon. There are key benefits associated with it, because, as I outlined in the statement, we have a problem with slurry. We have too much of it, so I want to move it towards being viewed as a resource. It is the second stage of that SBRI. I regularly speak to farmers about the issue, and there is a real desire to scale up the project, so we will move at pace on that. Hopefully, we in Northern Ireland can be leaders in delivering solutions to problems. I am keen to scale up that project, and, hopefully, in the days ahead, we will be able to make more announcements about it.”
“I am passionately committed to the issue, and I will not rest until we get the report and action plan fully agreed by the Executive so that we can make progress in turning the situation around. We owe that to the people of Northern Ireland.”
“We also need to deal with cross-cutting issues, so, on waste water infrastructure, I am working closely with John O'Dowd, and I will take every opportunity, including today, to call for more funding for John O'Dowd for Northern Ireland Water and waste water infrastructure. I also need to work with the Justice Minister on the review of the sentencing framework for fines and penalties. <BR /> <BR />I believe that we can get the report agreed. It was important that I came here today to set out what we are doing on the issue, because people are despairing. They want hope that there is a plan to turn the situation around. Hopefully, I have given people a good idea of the actions that my Department has taken and my commitment to the issue. I have put my shoulder to the wheel.”
“I thank the Member for his question. I circulated the Lough Neagh report and action plan, I received comments, I updated the report to reflect those comments, and I have heard nothing since then. I continue to engage with Executive colleagues on the report and action plan. I hope that we can agree it, because it is important that, as an Executive, we work together and deliver those actions collaboratively. A key thing that stakeholders say to me is that they want a joined-up approach. That is what I want to achieve, and that we is what we need to be able to do as part of the report and action plan.”
“We have run out of time: each day that passes without the plan's being agreed by the Executive is another day lost in fixing the problems that are being beamed onto TV screens across the world. <BR /> <BR />Although it is important that we learn lessons from the past, my Lough Neagh report and action plan focuses on the future. It will enable targeted, proportionate and sustainable actions through partnership working. I am determined that it will make a difference for the better.”
“The elements of the Lough Neagh action plan that I am sharing with Members today are instrumental to delivering my vision for a healthy, resilient environment, with high water-quality status and environmental standards that support biodiversity and nature recovery in a living and productive landscape that is also crucial to enhancing the health and well-being of our citizens. <BR /> <BR />I look forward to updating the Assembly when the report and action plan in its entirety receives Executive approval. I will do all that I can as Minister, but I urgently need Executive approval for key actions to deliver a cross-cutting, combined approach and interventions that are already agreed between my Department and the Infrastructure and Justice Ministers but await Executive sign-off.”
“Addressing those issues will require changes in our behaviours and practices, and I am determined to build and sustain a culture of environmental responsibility by fostering an attitude of zero tolerance to pollution. Successful delivery and oversight of the actions to address the problems at Lough Neagh and to more generally improve water quality across Northern Ireland will depend on engagement, consensus-building and the creation of strong partnerships across government, the public and private sectors, including local government, and the community.”
“<BR /> <BR />Partnership working across government, stakeholders and beyond is critical, be that on implementing a conservation management plan for Lough Neagh, reinvigorating the catchment stakeholder group, a grant scheme to support organisations working to improve water quality and conservation of Lough Neagh, or commissioning the Innovation Lab to generate solutions and a long-term vision to improve water quality using a Forever Mournes partnership model. Those are the items on which I await Executive approval. <BR /> <BR />As I have said many times, sadly, there is no quick fix for Lough Neagh. The issues surrounding the lough and the wider water environment are complex and challenging.”
“<BR /> <BR />There are many other items in the report and action plan, such as the environmental crime sentencing framework review, that I have not referenced today, as they await Executive approval alongside important Department for Infrastructure-related matters relating to waste water infrastructure. Whether it be establishing the Lough Neagh science platform, scoping what makes the most effective septic tanks and considering a grant scheme to encourage replacement of old ones, or different tree-planting interventions, there is lots that can be done to improve water quality in Lough Neagh.”
“That is why I have put more resources into the Northern Ireland Environment Agency. We are working to set up an enforcement task force for the Lough Neagh catchment area that is focused on addressing areas of highest risk, including the issue of cumulative breaches regardless of source, whether that be agriculture, waste water treatment works, domestic septic tanks, industry or otherwise. An independent review, including consultation, of the environmental crime sentencing framework for fines and penalties in conjunction with the Department of Justice is also key and something that I will continue to seek Executive agreement on.”
“It is much better to ensure that pollution and environmental harm does not occur in the first place, but having a robust, fair, proportionate and targeted enforcement regime is essential, as it will act as a deterrent and champion the "polluter pays principle".”
“<BR /> <BR />I will now turn to environmental governance. As I have said before, I believe in having an independent environmental protection agency. It was a commitment in the New Decade, New Approach agreement, and I am working with officials on the next steps, which I intend to announce over the summer, further to the environmental governance scoping review that I commissioned on taking up office. <BR /> <BR />A plan that talks a lot about education, investment and incentivisation but says nothing serious about regulation and enforcement will not cut the mustard. We need a balanced evidence- and science-based approach that is capable of turning the situation around, through our working together. Enforcement is important, but, as we all know, the need to resort to enforcement action is ultimately a sign of failure.”