Paul Givan
Lagan Valley · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“The EA's enhanced support model has been out for consultation. The Member's party is the largest political grouping on the Education Authority, so his party supported the model's being consulted on.”
“Protections around strike action and action short of strike are firmly established in statute for all workers, including teachers. If the Member is referring to the Education Inspections Bill, let me be clear: nothing in that legislation removes or undermines that right.”
“The issue was covered at length at the Education Committee. The position is still not where it ought to be. When I came into office, the position that I inherited was much worse than it is today.”
“It is an area that I have had to navigate, as have many previous Education Ministers. Industrial relations is an area that needs ongoing work. I have outlined how we can address it, but I come back to saying that, when workload was undefined, trade unions struggled to specify the challenge.”
“That is not a fair characterisation. In fact, I was with Justin McCamphill, the leader of NASUWT, at the launch of the curriculum reform, at which he commended me for it and said that he thought that it was good. I have sat in many a meeting with trade union representatives during which they have said, "This is a good initiative.”
“That is exactly why there is a 16-week consultation period, rather than the normal 12 weeks or the minimum eight weeks; to allow the public and teaching profession to very much engage in that curriculum, which I commend to all Members.”
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“The inability to fund those pressures could, in turn, lead to intensified industrial action and a return to action short of strike in the autumn, which has been crippling to our education system. However, given the quantum of the sector's need and the funds available for allocation, I anticipate that any additional allocations received in the June monitoring round will not meet all my Department's inescapable pressures, and many difficult decisions will need to be taken over coming months. I am working through, with my officials, what options are available and what difficult decisions can be taken, some of which will be cross-cutting. To that end, it will be important that my Executive colleagues understand the pressures that Education faces.”
“The Department's resource allocation for 2024-25 is significantly less than what is required and leaves a considerable shortfall across the education sector. Education will require substantially more funding during this Budget period if we are to avoid a significant and detrimental impact on our children and young people. <BR /> <BR />My Department has submitted resource bids totalling £293 million and capital bids totalling £113 million in the June monitoring round. Those pressures include, among other things, additional funding for our schools, including a much-needed school maintenance programme; investment in our children with special educational needs; the EA pay and grading review; and a teachers' pay award for September 2024.”
“I can confirm that that official confirmation will take place, but I have announced today that that is the case. Members will be aware of the significant financial challenges facing the Department of Education. We are on a projected overspend of £200 million this year. Difficult decisions will need to be taken, but I am determined that children with special educational needs should not bear the brunt of those difficult decisions. The scheme costs in the region of £655,000, and, this morning, I gave approval for that expenditure to be incurred.”
“I thank the Member for raising the question, because I am aware of the need to provide clarity. <BR /> <BR />I am pleased to announce today that I will support the enhanced summer provision programme for special schools this year. I understand the importance of that provision for children and young people and their families. I thank school leaders and staff for their commitment to the delivery of those activities across the summer. I have asked officials to continue working with colleagues across Departments, local government and the voluntary and community sector to ensure that summer provision and out-of-school-hours activities are accessible to every child with special educational needs and disability.”
“I want to provide the support that is needed, and, with the support of the House and Executive colleagues, I will be able to do more.”
“If there is any need to make sure that a building is safe, of course the Education Authority will provide the support to do that. The Member will know that the normal process for new builds and school enhancement programmes is that a call is put out by the Department and the managing authorities put forward schools -— the Council for Catholic Maintained Schools (CCMS) would put forward a list of schools in that sector -— and criteria are applied on the basis of need. <BR /> <BR />I recognise that there is a need to invest in the school estate. I was pleased to secure an additional £80 million this year. That has allowed me to announce 15 new projects: eight new schools and seven school enhancement programmes. Could I do more? Yes, I could. If more funding becomes available, I will seek to take forward more schemes.”
“I am always happy to consider new builds. I suspect that the Member has more leverage than I with the Finance Minister to help me to get the funding to do that. Where I can provide support, absolutely I will provide support. I am happy to engage with the Member, as I am, I think, with nearly every Member who corresponds with me about new schools and enhancing provisions. I always want to do more, and, with the right support, I will be able to.”
“I do not have the precise details. What I will say to the Member is that, where a consultation process is carried out and where we are able to provide support and it comes to me for a decision, I will not be found wanting in trying to expedite that as soon as possible. We recognise that there is a need to provide additional capacity across Northern Ireland, but there is a higher need in some areas than in others. Where I can support meeting that need, I will not be found wanting in providing the support that is necessary. However, I will happily provide more details to the Member in a more precise update.”
“I am aware of the issue that the Member raises about additional capacity. I am happy to provide a written update. I do not have the exact details on where the position sits, but I am more than happy to engage with the Member and to provide more information.”
“That will create seven additional classes for up to 60 children with social and communication needs and learning difficulties who otherwise may not have had access to a suitable school place for September 2024. I thank those schools for their proactive approach.”
“I will happily join the Member in thanking the schools in his constituency that responded positively, as well as all the other schools that expressed a willingness to provide additional capacity for this year and, indeed, for future years. It was a very positive response. <BR /> <BR />In response to the survey that my Department issued, 400 schools indicated a willingness to establish specialist provision classes. Officials engaged with schools that said that they could establish provision this year, and we are following up with the remainder for the new school term to ensure that provision can be put in place in line with projected need. <BR /> <BR />Six schools have agreed to establish new specialist provision this year in the Ards and North Down Borough Council area.”
“<BR /> <BR />I met the chief executive of the EA, and he told me that the target was to make sure that every child has a place by September. I do not want to be here next year in the same position, because the anxiety and stress for families who still do not know where their child is going to be placed is unacceptable, for them and for me. We need to make sure that, when we get through this year, we are not faced with the same scenario next year.”
“I thank the Member for his comments. He recognises the efforts that are being made to try to meet the need. That work continues, because we have to make sure that, by September, every child has a place. My Department is supporting the Education Authority in doing that. <BR /> <BR />We have taken steps, including seeking schools to identify their willingness to provide spaces. We are mapping all of that out. We have surveyed a lot of schools on what the need would be in order to provide any change or to put in specialist provision. All of that work has been taken forward by my Department along with the EA. That work will continue, because I am determined that, by September, every child will have a place.”
“That figure is expected to rise significantly by the end of June. The situation for September remains challenging, however, with particular pressures on special school places. Focused work continues on securing additional special education places across the entire school estate.”
“<BR /> <BR />There has been a significant increase in the number of children requiring a specialist education place in recent years, and details of the struggle to keep pace with demand are well rehearsed. Almost 4,500 children with a statement of SEN require a new placement or change of placement for September 2024. In February, the Education Authority advised that around 1,000 additional special education places were required to meet that demand, and significant progress has been made through the creation of additional capacity. The requirement now stands at around 400 places to be established. <BR /> <BR />Significant progress has also been made on securing appropriate placements for all children with special educational needs for September. As of 24 June, 83% of children with a statement of SEN have a confirmed place.”
“Ensuring that all children with special educational needs have a school placement that is appropriate to meet their needs is, and will continue to be, a primary focus for my Department and the Education Authority (EA). <BR /> <BR />Around 60% of children with SEN do not require a statement of special educational needs. Those children apply for a school place through the general school admissions process. Some 40% of children with SEN have a statement of SEN, and those children follow a different process, whereby their school placement is named on their statement, based on their individually assessed needs and in consultation with parents and schools. Although parental preference is considered, responsibility for the naming of a place rests with the Education Authority.”
“<BR /> <BR />I am keen to take best practice from wherever it exists, whether that is within the United Kingdom, the Republic of Ireland or, indeed, from international best practice. I recently met the Education Minister for New Zealand at the Education World Forum in London. We were able to engage and talk about what New Zealand, having seen its performance levels decline, is doing to change that and its approach. Wherever best practice exists, we should learn from it.”
“Obviously, each jurisdiction will measure outcomes in the way that it does. I have highlighted how, even in the most recent PISA findings, Northern Ireland is performing, within the United Kingdom, at a higher level than Wales and at a similar level to Scotland. However, the trajectory for Scotland is in decline, and it is looking at how it can review its curriculum. I want to make sure that our curriculum is based on a specific approach that makes sure that Northern Ireland can proceed. It is not necessarily a case of comparing Northern Ireland with the Republic of Ireland. Where we can learn from each other about best practice, we should do that. Where we can learn east-west, again, we should do that.”
“The Shared Island Fund investment to raise achievement and reduce educational disadvantage is, of course, very welcome and will enable a significant programme of work. I am also keen to pursue opportunities for shared working and shared learning from an east-west perspective.”
“The recently announced RAISE programme provides a significant opportunity to improve education outcomes for children and young people. It will adopt a whole-community approach to supporting those at risk of exclusion, marginalisation and underachievement. The investment will provide funding to some of the most disadvantaged areas in Northern Ireland to ensure that children and young people are happy, learning and succeeding. The programme will also enable the creation of strong collaborative partnerships across schools, community organisations and Departments, working across those eligible areas, supporting area-based partnership approaches over the next two years and potentially extending further, subject to evaluation. <BR /> <BR />Of course, I am happy to consider other funding opportunities as and when they arise.”
“This Minister and this Executive recognise the challenge. We are looking to the longer term in having a strategic approach and dealing with the real challenge today for the children who need to be placed in September and their families.”
“I recently announced a bespoke capital programme for schools that cater for special educational needs. This term, I am addressing the short-term challenge around school placements for September, and we are working through that process. While it is of no comfort to the children and families who still need a place, we are in a better position than last year. Last year was an appalling place, but we are in a better place now compared with then. <BR /> <BR />I announced a capital programme with a 10-year plan. I announced that we would assess all 39 special schools, and those that need enhancement should be prioritised for those enhancement programmes. We announced new builds in Knockevin and Ardnashee and have recognised that there needs to be eight new special schools: four in Belfast and four in other parts of Northern Ireland.”
“The Member outlines the importance of the voluntary and community sector. I know from my constituency the important role that it can play. Therefore, it is important that we harness the support that it can provide. Often, schools independently link in with the community and gain that support. I want to be there to help and facilitate all that, and, where there is best practice, I want to take that and share it across the education system.”
“I understand the challenges that the Department of Health is facing, but withdrawing health professionals from educational establishments is a retrograde step.”
“I agree with the Member and understand that nervousness; I hear it at first hand from parents when I meet them. It is about how we provide that overall support, not just educationally but when it comes to health needs. The requirement to have speech and language therapists available is one example of where children need support. There also needs to be support for behavioural issues. I am not satisfied with the current provision that exists as a result of the Department of Education and the Department of Health working in collaboration. We need to address that issue. There are local integrated teams that are meant to be there to help to work through those issues with children who have special educational needs, but the situation has to improve.”
“That is just a sample of some of the short-term measures that I intend to outline in due course to help allay some of the concerns that the Member raised.”
“I have indicated that I intend to set out a number of early year 1 actions in the coming months. I appreciate the sentiment that the Member articulated about wanting to see real and tangible action in that area. We have the reviews and the evidence to show that change needs to happen. I will set out how we can take forward those changes and what we can do within a short time frame, and I will look to the longer-term systemic change that is needed. That includes actions in the areas of early intervention, pupil support, professional support in the classroom, and communication. It is envisaged that, in the first term of the new academic year, the Department will have a suite of alternative approaches for the deployment of classroom assistants, which will be available for schools if they wish to use them.”
“Those early actions will be embedded in a clear plan for the implementation of system-wide reform and will form part of the wider departmental bid to the newly established Northern Ireland Executive interim public-sector transformation board. The plan will focus on a framework that will ensure that children and young people with SEN and/or a disability get the right support from the right people at the right time and in the right place. <BR /> <BR />It is important that I emphasise the need for sustained investment to deliver the fundamental reforms that are emerging from the end-to-end review of SEN and to deliver a high-quality, efficient, effective and sustainable SEN system for the future.”
“The end-to-end review of special educational needs was initiated in February 2023 and is being taken forward in four phases. Phase 1 is complete. It involved the establishment of governance structures and the scoping of the review and the 12 associated work streams. Phase 2 involves stakeholder engagement to shape the way forward. Phase 3 is the development of options, and phase 4 is the development of an implementation plan. <BR /> <BR />Phase 2 of the review is nearing completion and has focused on the development of potential solutions to the known issues. The findings from stakeholder engagement are being considered as part of a more detailed implementation plan. In the coming months, I intend to set out some early year 1 actions, with a view to rebuilding confidence and capability across the system.”
“That sits across different Departments, and we should not need legislation to make us work together. As I gave a commitment in that meeting that I would work collaboratively with ministerial colleagues, I will do so, because we need to make sure that we act together. Legislation should not be required to force Ministers to do that, and I am glad that we in the Executive are able to get on with the job and try to do our best for people.”
“Yes. I am not aware of any examples of where we have not. We will publish the report, and I would welcome feedback from the PAC, which carries out important work in looking across the Executive to identify where things can be improved. However, I repeat the earlier point: we should not require legislation to force Departments to work together. The Executive have been showing that, where we can work together, we are able to do so successfully. Can things be improved? Yes, they can. <BR /> <BR />Just this morning, I met Caleb's mother, Alma White. We talked about the campaign to do with Caleb, and I know that Conor Murphy, the Economy Minister, spoke about that yesterday. The Economy Minister, the Health Minister and I need to work in collaboration on how we can meet the needs of post-19 provision.”
“I am aware of health trusts withdrawing some of their staff from special schools, and that causes me concern. The children and young people are in those schools, and it makes sense for health professionals to come into those facilities. Again, while there is high-level collaboration, we are seeing an outworking that does not reflect the aspirations of the departmental senior team or at ministerial level. That causes me concern. We need to see engagement on it. There are examples of good practice in that area, but we could do so much more, working between the Department of Education and the Department of Health, to try to meet both educational needs and those related to the increasing medical complexities that many children in our school settings now have.”
“Legislation should not be needed for Departments to do that, and I have given examples of where we did not need it to work together, but it can be a useful tool to underpin some of the services that the public expect us to provide.”
“When we publish the report, I will certainly welcome feedback on its findings. There are examples of good practice where Departments are collaborating. There are also examples of where we should be doing things better. <BR /> <BR />Let us focus on the things that we have been able to do, because legislation should not be required for Departments to work collaboratively. We should be doing that, and we are. I can give some examples: the early learning and childcare strategy that was agreed by the Executive, which involves nearly all Departments and for which the Executive have approved £25 million; the RAISE programme, for which we again secured funding and which will have various Departments on its teams; and the THRiVE scheme, which involves voluntary, community and local government agencies. We work together in collaboration.”
“I circulated the first report on the operation of the Children's Services Co-operation Act (Northern Ireland) 2015 to my Executive colleagues on 17 June, asking that they provide their views by 21 June. It is my intention to seek formal Executive agreement to publish that report at the earliest opportunity.”
“I will build on my answer to the Member for West Belfast, Mr Baker. Mr O'Toole is right to want to make sure that we equip our children and young people with the best possible opportunity for career progression in our economy. That is why the Department of Education and the Department for the Economy between them have a framework approach for 14-to-19-year-olds. How do we make sure that they get the right skills to get on and progress economically? We are taking forward work such as the RAISE programme and early intervention that is vital for equipping our young people with the best possible opportunities.”
“We recently announced the RAISE programme for reducing educational disadvantage. That builds on the 'A Fair Start' report. We are identifying how to provide support through a whole-community approach. There are some really good examples of that. I was at one project this morning in East Belfast with Gavin Robinson, where we looked at how they work in partnership with schools and with all the community organisations and at how they can take that forward. We spoke about that in the House in a recent Adjournment debate about work that the West Belfast Partnership Board (WBPB) does. The RAISE programme that we are moving forward with will give us an opportunity to bring forward further improvements in areas of social disadvantage and educational underperformance.”
“Those systems, which were in Australia, Japan, Korea, Singapore and Switzerland, showed common features, including shorter school closures, fewer obstacles to remote learning and continuing teacher and parental support, and they can offer further insights and indications of broader best practices that can be addressed in the future. <BR /> <BR />We have performed well, but my ambition for the next 10 years is that Northern Ireland will be the best-performing country in the United Kingdom. I want to see that change to how we deliver our curriculum so that, 10 years from now, we will be the best-performing country in the UK. That is my ambition and, I trust, the ambition of the House.”
“In comparison with other jurisdictions in the United Kingdom, results in Northern Ireland were significantly above those of Wales and not so different from those of Scotland. However, Northern Ireland's scores fell significantly below the average scores in England. Scores in England have dropped across all subjects since 2018, but the differential was less than in other UK regions. <BR /> <BR />An OECD analysis of the PISA 2022 results across the 81 participating countries found that, in spite of challenging circumstances, 31 countries and economies managed to at least maintain their performance in mathematics since PISA 2018. Among those, five countries maintained or further raised already high levels of student performance.”
“I place on record my thanks to the 80 participating schools for making that possible in very challenging circumstances. While the score for science in Northern Ireland had not changed significantly since 2018, the scores for both mathematics and reading had declined significantly. It is notable but unsurprising, given the impact of the pandemic, that that was also the case, on average, across OECD countries. While those results show our post-primary system to be a strong performer on the international stage, they also demonstrate that we have more to do.”
“International studies such as the programme for international student assessment (PISA) provide essential insights into our system’s strengths and highlight opportunities to learn from approaches used in other high-performing countries. The 2022 study, published in December 2023, showed that Northern Ireland pupils continued to significantly outperform the majority of education systems in each subject, as they did in the previous study in 2018. In the most recent study, our pupils significantly outperformed 48 education systems in mathematics, 57 in reading and 49 in science. <BR /> <BR />The PISA 2022 study was especially important in providing the first results for a comparative international study of academic assessment collected during the pandemic for that cohort of 15-year-old pupils.”
“Again, the original question related to Enniskillen. I understand that Members want to draw in every other school, but I will provide the Member with a written update. When it comes to decisions around financing and capital, I ask Members, please, when it comes around the Executive table and to voting through the Budget, to make the case for increasing the allocations to the Department of Education. Then I will be able to take forward more projects. I will provide a written update to the Member in answer to her question.”
“There are still issues to progress until Enniskillen Royal Grammar School can get to the construction stage. It is not there for bidding for capital, because it has not got to a shovel-ready state. We need to get the processes concluded: the planning permission is still working through the system. Once that is all completed, the school can sit along with other schools in making the application for capital funding. Where capital becomes available, I will be able to announce more new builds. At this stage, the announcements are for this year, but we need to get other schools to the point at which they can commence, subject to the availability of capital.”
“I will come back to the Member in writing on Lisnaskea. I had prepared to deal with Enniskillen Royal Grammar School in response to the original question.”
“There is no ring-fenced funding for any school in that respect. I was able to announce 15 projects that could advance to construction in the current financial year, but this school is still not ready to go to the construction phase. It is important that it can get to that point. Then, of course, where finance can become available, it will allow me to move more schools into that construction stage process. That is why I appeal to Members to support me as I make the case to my Executive colleagues for capital funding that will allow me to take forward not just this project but many of the others that I would like to see developed in the school estate.”
“The plans for a new build for Enniskillen Royal Grammar School on the former Portora Royal School site are well advanced, with final technical design, pre-tender construction estimates and decant plans for the former Devenish College being prepared by the appointed integrated consultant team. A planning application for the new build was submitted in March 2023. However, no decision on the application has been taken at this time. Any decision to progress the project beyond the current design stage will be dependent on available capital funding.”
“That has been through all the parties representing that constituency and different political parties. Each of us in the Chamber is personally invested in education. I sat on the boards of governors of three schools for nearly 20 years, so I do not just do policy; I put it into practice. Brian Kingston said that he currently sits as a governor of two schools. The Member may or may not have sat on a board in the past, but we do get engaged at a grassroots level, and I am sure that he does too. However, there are occasions for me to gently say to the Member that you do not always need to politicise something such as this when we are trying to speak to issues that we have made progress on. <BR /> <BR />I appreciate that time is against me and that I have already exhausted your good grace, Mr Deputy Speaker.”
“Apologies for that. Very briefly, a couple of Members raised a few points. <BR /> <BR />Mr Baker, I will follow up in more detail the project that you mentioned, and officials will engage with you on that. <BR /> <BR />Mr Carroll raised a number of issues around the 'A Fair Start' recommendations being underfunded. I point him to the announcement last week of £20 million, very much building on 'A Fair Start' — evidence of what can be changed and what the Executive are doing. Yes, we would like to do more, but I gently say to the Member — he will probably not listen to me — that you do not always have to have a pop at political parties. I think that everyone in the Chamber has tried to represent their constituencies, and I have demonstrated how West Belfast has made considerable progress over the years.”
“This approach means that our most vulnerable learners are supported through development from preschool to key transition points at primary and post-primary level. <BR /> <BR />I assume that I have 15 minutes, Mr Deputy Speaker, or is it 10?”
“The example of West Belfast shows the value of place-based approaches to tackling educational disadvantage, ensuring that schools, families and community partners all work together to improve outcomes from the cradle to the career.”