Emma Pengelly
South Belfast · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“This week, I will travel to France to pay my respects to all those who fought and the many who fell at the Battle of the Somme as we mark its 110th anniversary. <BR /> <BR />From across Northern Ireland, generations have served their country.”
“One of the men who fought was James Sandford, my great-grandfather. He fought, he survived, he went on to fight again, and he was seriously injured in another battle. I am deeply proud of him, and I am proud of all those who stepped forward with such honour in the face of the horror of that war.”
“When I stand there this week, looking at the gravestones of so many who made the ultimate sacrifice to defend our freedom, I will also remember — we must always remember — the responsibility that we carry forward. Remembrance is not only about honouring the past; it is about shaping the future.”
“Last night, people in north Belfast witnessed horrific scenes that have absolutely sickened and appalled people across Northern Ireland. It was a shocking and barbaric act of violence that has left a victim fighting the consequences of a truly savage attack.”
“Every person has the right to walk their streets, live in their community and feel safe in their own neighbourhood. This type of brutality has no place in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />This morning, I spoke with the Chief Constable and the Justice Minister.”
“<BR /> <BR />I have also been in contact with the Prime Minister, because the PSNI has confirmed that the 30-year-old male who has been arrested is believed to be of Somalian heritage.”
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“I emphasised at the summit the importance of ensuring that we bring the people with us on this in terms of pace, cost and the impact on public services. Whatever we do in trying to achieve that worthy objective must be done in collaboration with farmers, businesses, the economic generators that are so important to our economy and, indeed, our public services and infrastructure to make sure that we can still do what we need to do in an affordable way.”
“I thank the Member for her question. The Member will be aware that this work is led by the Department of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs; indeed, the AERA Minister has brought forward a number of key documents. Many are cross-cutting and significant, which is why they are matters for Executive consideration and agreement. It is important that all Ministers are involved in that process. <BR /> <BR />The focus of this summit was on a just transition. That is incredibly important, because I think that, at times, people out there feel that that is an agenda that does not necessarily connect to them and will, potentially, increase costs for businesses and consumers. The key thing about the summit was the focus on what is just and balanced.”
“I thank the Member for his question. The Member will be more than aware that these institutions, the mechanisms within them and the key principles of consensus and cross-community consensus were all in the Belfast/Good Friday Agreement, an agreement signed up to by a number of parties and endorsed by the people of Northern Ireland and the people of the Republic of Ireland. It has been said repeatedly that the Alliance Party seeks to change the mechanisms that were so consulted on, endorsed and signed up to: that is a matter for a different place. In this statement today, we are focusing on one of the institutions of those agreements — the British-Irish Council — and on the important issues of transformation of public services and green growth.”
“Yes, reform is absolutely key. We cannot continue to do things as we are doing them, or we will get the same outcomes. We know that, throughout Northern Ireland and across the Chamber, there is a desire to improve outcomes and the things that we do to ensure that we meet the needs of the people of Northern Ireland through better rolled-out and transformed public services. Transformation is key. I think that every jurisdiction is looking at the issue. We must do things better in order to achieve the outcomes that we want to achieve.”
“Collaboration, as opposed to everybody trying to do the same thing and competing in the same space, makes sense. It is a huge emerging area. There are, undoubtedly, opportunities for businesses in green growth, but we should do it in a collaborative, complementary and supplementary way with our closest neighbours.”
“Absolutely, and I thank the Member for that question. Collaboration is always of benefit, as is building those robust and resilient relationships, including with other jurisdictions. Not just in relation to this area but on many of the challenges that we face, it makes sense to have those discussions and hear about what is happening and what is working elsewhere. If it is convenient and appropriate to do so, we should take some of that learning and apply it in Northern Ireland. That is the quickest way to get solutions that actually work. In relation to this particular issue, we emphasised in our contributions that it is important that we do not get into the space of competition in some of the areas in which we are developing and investing.”
“I thank the Member for his question. He will be aware that there are a number of legal requirements and obligations on Ministers, and Ministers will endeavour to meet all those legal obligations. Of course, when any policy proposal is brought to the Executive Committee for discussion and agreement, it is right and proper that we scrutinise the detail of that proposal. We will have that discussion, and the desire is to get agreement and consensus on that.”
“We also welcomed the resetting of intergovernmental relations, following the Westminster election, and commended the contribution of the British-Irish Council in promoting positive relations across our islands. <BR /> <BR />Finally, the Council noted that the next British-Irish Council summit will be hosted by the Northern Ireland Executive in June 2025.”
“<BR /> <BR />Council members also briefed colleagues on significant developments in their own Administrations and reflected on a number of important domestic topics, including economic growth. The Council also discussed international topics of mutual interest. We took the opportunity to update the Council on the Executive's progress as we near the 1st anniversary of their restoration. We updated members on the development of our Programme for Government and highlighted the important work that is being taken forward under the Executive's ending violence against women and girls strategic framework. We expressed concern about our challenging fiscal situation and spoke of the vital need to transform our public services.”
“<BR /> <BR />We highlighted the importance of working closely with the business and farming communities in ensuring the success of the transition and the pivotal role that those communities will play in realising its full potential. We also reflected that fairness is at the core of a process and that we must provide confidence and clarity around how we will move to net zero in a fair and balanced way. While the scale of the challenge may seem a daunting prospect for some, there is no doubt that it can present opportunities for our people, our businesses and communities. It also places a great responsibility on us in government to deliver a just energy transition, where the benefits are shared by all.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Council discussed the importance of working in collaboration with the private sector to encourage inward investment and increase employment opportunities in the renewable energy industry in order to stimulate economic growth and prosperity across our islands. The discussion provided us with the opportunity to highlight several initiatives that are taking place in our own Departments as we move to meet our net zero target and transition to becoming a clean, sustainable and affordable society. Those include work within Northern Ireland's Climate Change Act, our energy strategy, our green skills action plan, our renewable electricity support scheme, our net zero accelerator fund and the establishment of a just transition commission.”
“Angus Macpherson, former Co-Chair of the former First Minister's Investor Panel, provided an overview of the characteristics of investor-friendly destinations. That was followed by Deputy First Minister, Kate Forbes, who set out the Scottish Government's approach to attracting global capital investment. <BR /> <BR />The plenary meeting commenced with a discussion about the initiatives that member Administrations are pursuing in order to ensure that communities are supported in the journey towards decarbonisation and net zero. The plenary meeting also considered efforts to reduce greenhouse gases in various sectors in a manner that is compatible with a just transition.”
“<BR /> <BR />The UK Government delegation was led by the Prime Minister, Sir Keir Starmer; the Irish Government delegation was led by the Taoiseach, Simon Harris; and the Welsh Government delegation was led by the First Minister, Eluned Morgan. The Government of Guernsey were represented by the Chief Minister, Deputy Lyndon Trott; the Government of Jersey by the Chief Minister, Deputy Lyndon Farnham; and the Isle of Man Government by the Chief Minister, Deputy Alfred Cannan. A full list of the principal delegates who attended is attached to the statement, which has been provided to Members. <BR /> <BR />The theme of the summit was financing a just transition, and prior to the plenary meeting, the Scottish Government delivered a presentation on the subject.”
“I wish to make a statement on the 42nd summit of the British-Irish Council (BIC), which took place on 6 December 2024. Hosted by the Scottish Government at the Dalmahoy Hotel in Edinburgh, the summit marked the 25th anniversary of the Council's first meeting, which took place in London in December 1999. <BR /> <BR />Heads of delegation were welcomed by the Scottish Government's First Minister, John Swinney. The First Minister and I attended the summit along with the Minister for the Economy and the Minister of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs. The Ministers have agreed that I make the statement on their behalf.”
“It is not the case that they go to the end of the list. Hospitals have been working away and contacting people. For anybody who has had an appointment cancelled and not heard about being rebooked, please let your local MLA or the system know, and we will get on to that. However, the trusts have advised us that they have been reaching out over the past few days and rescheduling those appointments.”
“I thank the Member for his question. It is an important one, because many of those people will have waited for some considerable time — too long. We know that it is too long, and we have tackling waiting lists as a priority in the draft Programme for Government. You can only imagine how disappointing it is for somebody who has waited for months, possibly even years, only to have their appointment cancelled. I can give you only the information that we are advised about, because this is, rightly, a matter for the Department of Health and the relevant Minister. However, we are advised that hospitals have been working hard to reschedule those appointments by using every available appointment. You can understand that it may not be this week, but they are endeavouring to get people rebooked appointments as soon as possible.”
“Some of that has come through, and there are people who are in their 80s and 90s, who are isolated, cold and without electricity and the ability even to make themselves a cup of tea. We are appealing to neighbours and friends in local communities, as well as the local churches, to identify those people. If you have not seen your neighbour or heard from them, please check in on them and signpost them to the support and help that is there. We will try our best to get those people food, blankets and help and support until we can get those reconnections made.”
“Much of that equipment runs on battery packs as opposed to mains electricity, but the battery packs require to be recharged using electricity. There is a lot of concern about that, which is why the situation is being monitored by the trusts. There was a multi-agency approach to that, in order to make sure that as many of those people as possible were supported. <BR /> <BR />We are very aware, however, that there will be many people who are not on a formal vulnerable list but who are, nevertheless, vulnerable. That could include older people who are sitting in a cold home with no electricity and no way of contacting people, or people with a variety of illnesses who may not be able to get into a car to go and get help and support. That is why we are asking for local information.”
“I thank the Member for her important question. As I indicated earlier, there is a vulnerable persons' cell, which is coordinating work as part of the civil contingencies approach. That is carried out by way of a number of different measures. In particular, NIE has been dealing with what it calls its "vulnerable list". It has been contacting those people by phone and has visited some of them with hot water and food and to check their welfare. Many of NIE's meter readers have been doing that, which has been important, and I thank them for it. That is not something that has had a lot of visibility, but I have no doubt that it means a lot to those vulnerable people. <BR /> <BR />In addition, the trusts have been dealing with about 800 vulnerable people. Initially, there was huge concern for those with medical equipment, for example.”
“I suspect that that did not happen because people were trying to get out to do the same thing in so many areas. We also had a lot of cables come down. As indicated, those are particularly dangerous. If anybody were to touch those trees or cables or try to remove them, there would be a serious risk to life, so those were triaged and prioritised. <BR /> <BR />I suggest that the Member write to or contact the Infrastructure Minister about the particular circumstances of that case. We want to ensure that obstructions do not cause risk to life, and we will continue to work on that over the next number of hours.”
“I thank the Member for his question. Some of the detail of that question might best be directed at the Infrastructure Minister. There was an unprecedented level of, I believe, some 2,800 reported obstructions across the network. Some of those involved multiple trees and other things that had been felled. I understand from our briefings that a triaging system was in place for the removal of those obstructions, which were mainly trees, from the main routes and for trying to get out to assess the damage. <BR /> <BR />We do not have a huge amount of capacity sitting there waiting for a big event such as this to happen. Therefore, when such things do happen, capacity is stretched. You need to ensure the safety of citizens first, and that is why those roads ought to have been closed and why signs ought to have been put out.”
“In answer to the Member's question, it is important to remember — I know this only because of Barra Best — that the systems, North and South, measure very different things. In Northern Ireland, we are part of the UK-wide system, and there is a different metric in the Republic of Ireland. Red does not mean the same thing in different areas. However, that does not mean that we do not take those things seriously. There was a red alert here, and the response, therefore, was from the PSNI. As I said, I am satisfied that we have been working hard, including with internal communications and coordination between all the agencies. There will always be certain differences, given that there is an international border between the two jurisdictions, but cooperation is key to making sure that, whatever happens, citizens are kept as safe as possible.”
“I thank the Member for his question. By the way, I had not noticed that the Education Minister was in the Chamber when I had the audacity to answer the question about education. He advises me that my answer was accurate and that, in fact, tomorrow, potentially only one school will be unable to open due to damage and that there will be a further update at 4.00 pm about the situation with electricity for schools.”
“If we get information from NIE about which schools may not be able to open tomorrow or Wednesday, we can try to secure additional generators and get them sent to the right places so that our pupils can get back into the classroom and get the education that they deserve.”
“We have stressed that parents need to watch out for local information from the school. Look at the school's page and its alerts. Ultimately, electricity will be coming on in various areas throughout the day, and, as it does, those schools will be able to open. The Education Minister considered putting out that list last night, but he was conscious that schools would be connected overnight, some of which would be able to open. That certainly seems to have been the case. <BR /> <BR />We understand that, in all likelihood, between 50 and 60 schools were unable to open today due to a lack of electricity. That was one of the issues that we raised this morning when asking about generators.”
“I thank the Member for his question. The Education Minister has put out a number of statements about the ongoing situation. Two categories of schools are impacted. Well in excess of, I think, 150 schools were damaged in some way by the storm. However, only a small number of those were at risk of not opening. The Education Authority did a huge amount of work over the weekend to address the issues in the schools that could not open. A small number of those schools could not open today. I think that it was around seven schools. <BR /> <BR />A significant number of schools are impacted by a lack of electricity. That number is higher. By yesterday evening, around 80 schools were without electricity. That number has come down, and a number of those schools were able to open this morning. We are waiting for final numbers to come through.”
“As a starter, we should look at the provision that they are giving to their customers — customers who have been impacted on by the same storm — and asking NIE Networks to step up, do the same and give that goodwill payment.”
“Earlier, I made the point that this is possibly the worst week of the year for financial stress on families — few people have many funds left in the last week of January — so we know that there is a huge burden on families who are having to eat out, for example, because they cannot cook a meal at home. <BR /> <BR />We believe that it is the right thing for NIE Networks to step up and give a goodwill payment to support the people throughout Northern Ireland who have been suffering hardship without electricity. We know that it can do that. It is important that we talk to the Utility Regulator, but our understanding is that NIE can do that. Indeed, the Scottish energy companies have stepped up in Scotland.”
“I thank the Member for his question. Many thousands of people will be keen to hear from NIE. We have made the proposal to NIE that it considers making a goodwill payment. I know that there had been talk of compensation, but, of course, there is a provision that energy companies do not have a legal requirement to pay out for something on this scale. That may or may not be the case when this is looked at. <BR /> <BR />The Member will understand that, over the weekend, our focus was very much on working with NIE, NI Water and other agencies to get reconnections and support for people. As we have moved through that, the issue of financial support has, of course, come up. Many people have lost the contents of their fridge or freezer, for example.”
“A COBRA 'O' meeting — an officials-level, UK-wide meeting — was scheduled for 11.00 am. We asked her to add to our ask and feed that request into the process to see whether we can get additional people who are able to support the roll-out of generators. That will be critical, particularly for the water issue but also in getting schools reopened and getting help and support to people.”
“That will be a help, but, from our discussions with NIE, it is clear that it wants to prioritise reconnections and deploy the engineers to do that. That means that we will need to source engineer hours elsewhere in order to support the safe installation of the generators. We tasked the head of the Civil Service with that this morning.”
“I thank the Member for his question. We have been very clear in putting across a message on safety with generators, particularly through the Health and Safety Executive. There are people using generators, and there is a danger associated with that if they are not used correctly. We advise everyone who is using a generator to make sure that they look up the advice that is available online from the Health and Safety Executive. <BR /> <BR />It requires some expertise to get the generators to the right place and set them up correctly. We have worked with NIE on that through COBRA and the UK Government. The UK Government can supply us with generators, and we understand that 30 additional generators will arrive today from Great Britain.”
“Those people will probably also be the most vulnerable, so we need to ensure that we use all the mechanisms and local information available to target that support, particularly for people who are isolated, older and do not have a network of family and friends to rely on. We have been urging neighbours and family members to reach out to those older and more vulnerable people. We must use our network of local community organisations and local council support teams to provide warm and safe spaces that provide food, hot showers and electricity to charge devices etc. That will be critical as we move beyond day 4.”
“I thank the Member for her important question. I will, absolutely. The easiest electricity connections to restore are those in urban areas. Those are prioritised due to the number of affected "customers", as NIE would describe them, or households that they serve. There will be a number of homes, particularly in rural areas, that will be very difficult to get to to fix their connection. We have been made aware of that. Those are the people who are most likely to have their power restored towards the end of the time frame. <BR /> <BR />This Friday will mark seven days from the beginning of last Friday's storm, and it looks as though those who will not be reconnected until after that will be in the more rural and isolated areas.”
“<BR /> <BR />I have made it clear that NI Water and NIE need to tell us what machinery and people they need in order to move the time frames for reconnection forward and to get the vast majority of premises' electricity back on within the next 24 to 48 hours and the remaining water issues resolved today. Those are urgent issues, but people have been working very well. Hundreds of people were out over the weekend reconnecting supply and working hard to clear roads. There was a huge effort involved, and it is right that we thank all those who have worked so hard.”
“I thank the Member for his question. Over the past number of years, we have faced a significant number of events and crises. As a result, our civil contingency structures were examined in detail, and a number of recommendations were made and actioned. The First Minister and I feel that the structures that are in place have worked very well. They were stood up very quickly. We have had clear lines of internal communication. Of course, we always want to go faster and speed things up. We want to get connections restored as quickly as possible. Through those structures, we have spent the weekend pushing agencies to ensure that we get the right information.”
“It is not just electricity that is off but water. That is also to do with the lack of electricity connection. We proposed getting generators out there in order to get the water back on. For me, the priority issue of the day is to make sure that people can access water again.”
“It is connected to the lack of electricity connection. If that cannot be resolved today, we need urgent alternatives to get that mobile connection up and going. Likewise, it is entirely unacceptable that people are without water. We are on day 4, and that is creating significant hardship.”
“I thank the Member for her question. Councils have played a critical role in supporting the roll-out of support to communities. That has included the opening of centres, and the Minister for Communities has been working with councils on funding support for that. I am also aware that others — sporting clubs, churches, Orange halls and community centres — have stepped up. It has been really good to see that collective community effort of people stepping up to support others who are in need. For many of the areas without electricity and water in particular, there has been coordination on water collection. <BR /> <BR />Of course, if people are without a phone signal, it is difficult to make sure that that message gets through. I absolutely concur with the Member. We are urgently asking for solutions on mobile coverage.”
“They have been triaged, with key routes being cleared first, but, of course, there is that connection with NIE. I cannot stress this enough: if a cable comes down, it is hugely dangerous for anybody to try to clear that. It requires NIE to be called to go on to sites and ensure that they are safe through disconnection. NIE has been clear in its messaging about that over the weekend: if there are cables, including cables that are on a tree or elsewhere, do not touch them. Call the authorities, and they will come out. That has added a bit of complication. I understand that 50 to 60 of the 100 roads require NIE assistance. That is the number that we are down to, however, and I thank all the agencies and staff in particular who have been working hard to make progress over the weekend.”
“I thank the Member for his question. There were a significant number of obstructions. Well in excess of 2,000 were reported across Northern Ireland, with, according to the latest figures, 100 roads still closed. Trying to clear all of that has required significant work. As with the vulnerable persons cell, an infrastructure cell has been the focus, as the First Minister said, over the weekend. The two big issues — clearing the roads and reconnecting electricity and addressing the impacts of the lack of connection on mobile telephone service and water supply — are being coordinated through the civil contingencies structure, working with councils, Forest Service and others. <BR /> <BR />Everybody who is available has been pulled in to support the clearing of the roads.”
“Of course, throughout the weekend, the First Minister and I were in constant contact, particularly through the head of the Civil Service and our civil contingencies team sitting in the Executive Office. There is a vulnerable persons cell as part of those structures, and its absolute purpose is to coordinate that response and ensure that support gets to the right people and where it needs to get to.”
“I thank the Member for his important question. Coordination is key to many of the issues, because we are dealing with a number of Departments and agencies, all with different responsibilities. The key thing in all of that is to ensure that the communication and coordination are working, and that is why we have set up those civil contingency structures. Over the weekend, there were, I understand, about nine strategic coordinating groups (SCGs). Many agencies and Departments are represented on those groups to do precisely what you said: to get real-time information as quickly as possible and feed it through to whoever needs to target and direct help to the places where it is needed. Those groups met a number of times. There were also official COBRA-level meetings to coordinate the UK-wide response.”
“I thank the Member for giving way, because it saves me having to make a point of order. I am sure that the Alliance Member for South Belfast would not want to mislead the House, but earlier she responded to the allegation of rigorous implementing by saying that that was specifically in reference to the Internal Market Act. I refreshed my mind by looking again at that letter, and I am happy to put it in the Library so that everybody can see exactly what she wanted to be rigorously implemented. However, does she agree that that letter went much wider than that specific point on the Internal Market Act and that it was calling for the rigorous implementation of the entire protocol?”
“I thank the Member for giving way. 'Safeguarding the Union' included a promise and a commitment on the establishment of Intertrade UK. That body was to be established not only to address real and practical issues but some of the misinformation that may lie with companies in Great Britain that believe that they cannot send goods here or may be confused about what the law is and, ergo, withdraw voluntarily. Does he agree that the UK Government need to get on with establishing that body in full and ensuring that that work can be carried out?”
“However, by participating and by voting against it, we ensure that no one, whether in Westminster or in the European Union, can claim that we are uninterested or absent. Today, we make it clear that we oppose the ongoing application of the framework, which causes so much difficulty for businesses. Today provides an opportunity for unionism to unite and send a clear message to London and the EU. We will vote against the continued application of the current arrangements, and we encourage all Members of the Assembly who value democratic decision-making in this place to join us.”
“You made a promise to the people of Northern Ireland and, indeed, to the people of the United Kingdom that there would be a free flow of trade across our United Kingdom. The integrity of our single market matters. It matters to us, but it should always matter to businesses, and to you, regardless of your ideological and constitutional background. <BR /> <BR />The Northern Ireland protocol has been imposed on us without any support from unionist representatives. It is doing harm, and we stand here today, even though the process has been delegitimised, because we are not willing to complete the disenfranchisement of our constituents by not participating in today's debate and vote.”
“I took the opportunity to raise that directly with the Prime Minister, with the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster and with the Ministers responsible for EU relationships. Make no mistake: it is an excellent example of something that emerges despite the fact that in February 2023 the UK extended agreement to alignment with EU standards. EU standards continue, and, despite that, this coming in under regulations agreed prior to the protocol and Windsor framework arrangements will have a real impact on the UK internal market, particularly for Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />The reality is that SPS negotiations will take years. Negotiations will not produce the answers to any of the issues in the next number of months. Therefore, we should send a clear message from this place: do better. Go back and try to achieve more.”
“Let us make it clear: we would not have moved forward only that those were supported and voted on by Labour, because it was inevitable that there was going to be an election. Therefore, it was going to be a Labour Government that had to stand by those agreements in terms of what needed to be done. It was to be implemented by October of this year, but they have delayed it. They have promised that they will do it, but those promises need to be fulfilled. UK-wide labelling has been ditched, and, again, there was a good reason for that. It was to prevent the withdrawal of suppliers from the NI market. It would not have brought with it any significant cost, but it would have helped to protect the UK internal market. More must be done. <BR /> <BR />We also need urgent action and response when things emerge. I mentioned the GPSR.”
“I am being contacted all the time by people who will have issues with supplies. The Labour Government promised, along with the then Government, that they would ensure the free flow of internal UK goods across the United Kingdom without checks. Let us see that happen. On parcels and customs, another commitment was made in February and supported by Labour.”