Robbie Butler
Lagan Valley · Ulster Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“Officials highlighted that alignment was provided through existing EU-derived arrangements and that coherence with existing regulatory frameworks was identified as a main consideration.”
“I note that the Member for Strangford agrees: she understands the value of our fisheries in those areas. There are other complexities. The Isle of Man Government have now done a bit of a circle around that island, which makes it difficult for our fishers from Portavogie, Kilkeel and Portaferry to craft and graft a living from some of the…”
“The Committee took the opportunity to question officials on several issues and highlight matters warranting scrutiny at Committee Stage but was not limited to those areas.”
“As the Minister said, they have possibly been viewed as competing demands, but they are not competing demands, because clean water is part of sustainable food production.”
“<BR /> <BR />I am glad to see language in the Bill on the sustainability of the aquaculture sector, and I want to lean in a bit on that. Aquaculture pastimes have, perhaps, been underutilised, whether they relate to the angling fraternity or other river and water users.”
“Today, I want to talk about a very talented young girl from Lisburn called Freya Terris. Freya, who is 17 years old, attends Friends' School and studies the piano under former Lisburn resident Rory Dowse. Freya is an incredibly accomplished young pianist and has performed in the Ulster Hall.”
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“That was only a number of years ago. Do normal, everyday civil servants face that same threat? No. Absolutely not. <BR /> <BR />So, you get to work, and what are you thinking about your day? I will tell you what you are thinking about your day. You are wondering what is coming next. I can tell you that working in a prison is to be in a state of hyper-vigilance. It is not a normal routine. I worked in the Fire Service. I have worked in situations where you have to make life or death decisions for yourself, your crew, your teams and the people you are trying to rescue. I can tell you that that stress is not the same as the stress faced by prison officers.”
“There was talk of talks and much was going on, but at that time, when I signed up, I signed up knowing that my life was probably going to be under threat. In 2020, is it any different? <BR /> <BR />What does the daily routine of a prison officer look like? I will tell you what it looks and feels like. You wake up and go to work, concerned about your day. One of the first things that you have to do is check under your car. If you are taking a member of your family or putting a child in the car — in my day, I took my one-year-old daughter to a childminder — you understand that your family also carries the burden of risk that you took when you decided that you were going to serve. You journey to work. Unfortunately, as we have heard, officer Black, after checking under his car, did not make it to his place of employment.”
“It was not put into action because, do you know what, it recognised the very things that we are talking about today as problems from years ago. These problems have existed for decades in this country. I do not want to rehearse the old politics of blame and who was at fault for the stress that prison officers face. <BR /> <BR />Much has been made of the inequality that this policy might create. That does not stand, because prison officers are not civil servants. No matter what it says on the paper, they are not civil servants. They cannot be treated like ordinary civil servants. Civil servants give a great service to this country, but the threats, trouble and pain that operational prison officers go through is absolutely unique. <BR /> <BR />I joined the Prison Service in 1996, which was pre-ceasefire.”
“Thank you Mr Principal Deputy Speaker. Thank you for your words, Mr Catney. I am sure the family will be warmed by those words at this very difficult time. <BR /> <BR />I listened to the debate. I have no notes; I do not need notes for this, guys, because this will be one from the heart. There will probably be some stories, but they will not be told out of school because they pertain to the people whom I served with for a number of years. <BR /> <BR />I listened to some Members give reasons why, in essence, they might support this but, today, they cannot. Let us look at the report commissioned by the Prison Service a number of years ago, produced by Jackie Bates-Gaston, a Northern Ireland Prison Service psychologist. That report was shelved and hidden in the Library.”
“How could you follow that? I will try my best. I want to be the third Member to welcome our newest Member and her speech. I thought that she did exceptionally well. <BR /> <BR />I would also like to make the House aware, at the earliest point, of the passing of Billy Bell, a former Assembly Member. He passed away earlier this day. On behalf of my party, I pass on my condolences, and I look forward to the moment when we can pay our respects to his family.”
“— the wider abortion debate, and insist that this legislation is challenged and changed. I say to Heidi, and others who have Down's syndrome and other non-fatal disabilities that, even as an unborn baby, you are equal, you are valued and you are seen.”
“Imagine having to have a face-to-face discussion with someone who was born with what, in England and Wales, is, for the purpose of abortion legislation, deemed, "a serious foetal impairment." <BR /> <BR />That same person, Heidi, will soon be 24, and, as we have heard, she is going to be married. She is a disability champion. She will soon marry her fiancé. Could any of you seriously sit face-to-face with Heidi and say, "You are not equal"? <BR /> <BR />Today, we have an opportunity to set aside —”
“— that is the word used in the regulation —”
“Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker, and thank you for the intervention. Indeed, as has been pointed out by Dolores Kelly, a moment spent talking to Heidi reaffirms the heart that there is. There are champions out there, working in really challenging circumstances. <BR /> <BR />As I said, Heidi has Down's syndrome, and she is talking about a regulation that speaks about her. Put simply, regulation 7(1)(b) allows abortion for serious foetal "impairment":”
“<BR /> <BR />The sad reality remains that Heidi has to speak on an issue of legislation and regulation which seeks to devalue the person she is.”
“<BR />However, to see the joy, concentration and effort, the professionalism — <BR />and often the mischievousness on their faces and of their actions — only reaffirms, if required, that every life is precious and that we must do all we can to empower, support and demonstrate to those children and pupils, that they are valued every bit as much as we value ourselves. <BR /> <BR />A number of disability champions are worthy of mention. However, for the purpose of this debate, there is only one that I will name, as many of you have done so far, and that is Heidi Crowter. I spent 40 minutes on a Zoom call on Saturday morning with Heidi, Paul, Joanne and myself, I can safely say that, if I needed any validation to support the motion, I got it in spades.”
“We love to get those invitations to carol and nativity services. In addition, the ones I look forward to most are the invites from Mencap and from Parkview Special School in Lisburn. To my great delight, two years ago, I got an invitation to the Glenveagh Special School nativity play. Even if you do not like Christmas, I suggest you seek out an opportunity to go to one of those nativity scenes. <BR /> <BR />There can be no suggestion but that, for many of these individuals and very special children, life can be a challenge and, for some, quite difficult.”
“In Lisburn, we are very proud of the work done by Stepping Stones. Since 1996, the team have striven with great passion and determination to offer support and value to people with learning difficulties and disabilities. All the trainees have a learning difficulty, many of them men and women with Down's syndrome. Recently, I called with their CEO at their new premises — Avenue 1 — for coffee and a snack. What struck me was the reception I got from the front-of-house waiter. I was shown to my seat, order taken and advice given on what was evidently a menu that he had contributed to. That young man with Down's syndrome showed me an attitude of hospitality and customer service sometimes missing in other settings. <BR /> <BR />At Christmas time, I look forward to getting an invitation. We all do.”
“A number of years ago, at an event with Mencap in the Long Gallery, I had the absolute privilege of holding and nursing a two-year-old boy. His mum handed him to me, and I do not exaggerate when I say that, as he smiled into my face, I absolutely fell in love with him. I will not use his name, because I do not have the permission from his mum, but I can tell you, that young man, who has Down's syndrome, left an indelible mark on my heart.”
“<BR /> <BR />I have enjoyed every moment of learning more about disability and learning disability, having to challenge my perceptions and the myths about what a normal life is, what a life of fulfilment is and what really matters.”
“Sometimes, depending on the setting of the story, that narrative becomes blurred, but not in this case. When elected to the Assembly in 2016, I established two new passions. One, as everyone in the House will know, is mental health. The other, born of my active membership of the relevant all-party groups (APGs), is learning disability and disability. I have learnt many things from participating in these forums. Perhaps the overriding theme common to these APGs is that of stigmatisation, discrimination and the ongoing battle for equality. I cannot overstate the conversations in which I have been involved with stakeholders of these groups. Those conversations demonstrated the real difficulties and barriers that people with a disability or learning disability still face here in Northern Ireland in 2020.”
“As a member of the Ulster Unionist Party, this is for me, a matter of conscience, and I will speak personally. <BR /> <BR />For me, today's motion is not about the rights and wrongs of abortion. If it were, I fear that we would simply be rehearsing the very old and long-held positions that, in many ways, paved the way for the Westminster Government and the NIO to dream up such extreme and discriminatory measures, disregarding the vast majority of responses to the consultation on the proposed legislation and regulations. <BR /> <BR />In my mind, the motion and amendment are about our attitudes to equality and disability. I will go much further: almost all of us in the Chamber are engaged in politics because we are fuelled by the desire for justice, equality and humanity.”
“Thank you, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker — Mr Deputy Speaker, sorry. I elevated you there. I thank the Minister for his statement, and there is much to be grateful for — in particular, the sub teacher payments. However, there does seem to be an omission, Minister. You may be aware that it is Mental Health Awareness Week, and in 'New Decade, New Approach' there was a commitment by the Executive and the Assembly to deliver a mental health action plan by the end of April. Can the Minister detail any amounts of money that he has allocated to the Department of Health to action this, and, if not, can he make a commitment today? I think the money that is needed is in and around £2·5 million.”
“I thank the Minister for her statement today. The Minister mentioned that the PIP and ESA period had been suspended for medical assessments. Will she give us an update on that today and indicate whether there is any backlog or problem with that system?”
“I thank the Minister for his statement; there was welcome news for many schools. As you will know, Minister, it is well documented that to improve pupil and teachers' mental health, the environment needs to be therapeutic. Whilst there is some good news for many schools, do you have any worries about any schools that have missed out in this trance? Do you have any idea, as another Member mentioned, about the programme moving forward after this tranche?”
“<BR /> <BR />Amendment No 13 deals with regulations under subsection 1. As drafted, they would be subject to negative resolution. However, we would be prepared to support the amendment and that would require a draft of any proposed regulation to be led before, and approved by, the resolution of the Assembly, allowing for democratic scrutiny and accountability. <BR /> <BR />Like Mr Durkan, we are glad to see that amendment No 14 was taken off.”
“<BR /> <BR />Amendment No 3 would change the ending with date of the Bill from 30 September 2020 to one year after the Royal Assent date. However, subsection 3 of the Bill provides for the Department to amend by regulation, as required, the ending with date. That is sufficient, we believe, should it be required. Therefore, we do not support amendments Nos 4, 5 and 6 as they are mutually exclusive with amendment No 3. <BR /> <BR />Amendments No 9, 10 and 11 deal with the power to alter the notice period. Under the Bill, the Department can, by regulation, alter the notice to quit period from 12 weeks to six months, or any other specific periods that are less than six months. We feel that that is reasonable and proportionate and, therefore, we do not support the amendment.”
“Research indicates that the majority of private sector landlords are not large companies, but individual landlords with one or two properties. Therefore, as I previously mentioned, it is imperative that the Bill is proportionate. The burden cannot simply be passed over to the landlord alone, there is a collective responsibility. Amendment Nos 1, 8 and 12 would alter the notice to quit period from 12 weeks to one year, which we would not support. <BR /> <BR />Amendment Nos 2 and 7 deal with the date on which the Bill has an effect. The Bill, as drafted, would take effect the day after Royal Assent. With Mr Carroll's amendment, the Bill would take effect from 21 April 2020. However, as we understand from the Minister, that would be problematic. Therefore, further clarity from the Minister would be required.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Department's Make the Call service is a useful resource that can assist with navigating the social security system and eligibility criteria. We call upon landlords to work with tenants, where they can, to support and assist each other during this difficult period. Where a tenant is struggling, it is absolutely essential that they engage with their landlord to try to find a workable solution. That is already happening, and it is imperative that dialogue continues. <BR /> <BR />We feel that the amendments go beyond proportionality. There is no doubt that we should do all that we can to protect and support private tenants. However, that cannot be achieved through the alteration of the notice to quit period alone, and financial support packages are crucial.”
“It is also worth remembering that there are good and bad landlords, as the honourable Member said. Likewise, there are good and challenging tenants. However, across the board, the majority of landlords and tenants are good and enjoy good relationships. I am aware of landlords who are working to support their tenants where they can during the pandemic, and I am engaged in dialogue in more complex examples. <BR /> <BR />The Government have announced a number of support packages that should help to support those who have been affected by the pandemic. As has been highlighted, there is the job retention scheme, discretionary housing payments and other avenues of support that I encourage tenants to explore should they experience financial hardship.”
“Like the honourable Member across the Benches from up in the north of Northern Ireland, we believe that Mr Carroll tabled the amendments not for political purposes but because he has a heart for putting a roof over people's heads. However, that is not to say that we will support the amendments. <BR /> <BR />The Bill was drafted by the Department, and, whilst not perfect, under the circumstances, we feel that it is proportionate. It is essential that, as a Government, we strike a balance and ensure that we provide the best possible support for all our citizens across the country.”
“I thank the Minister for his indulgence today. Can he give any update or information on asking either electricity or gas providers to freeze bills for up to six months?”
“If you choose to abort a child because of Down's syndrome, a club foot or a cleft palate, the regulations will facilitate that. What about the staff? What about their conscientious objection? What about those who could give a loving home to a child like that? What value do we put on that life? <BR /> <BR />I look forward to the day when I get to say my piece in here and we can legislate like adults and discuss this in an empathetic and sympathetic manner and represent everybody who should have a voice in this country.”
“We talk about fatal foetal abnormality, and we talk about rape and incest: all those things are important, and the Assembly should have had the ability and the maturity to deal with them sympathetically and appropriately, not through the draconian measures that have been taken by the NIO and the UK Government. As Mr Frew pointed out, there was a lack of adherence to the consultation, which had high levels of response. Probably and, I would say, uniquely, there has never been any other issue that has been responded to by the public of Northern Ireland from all sides of the community. <BR /> <BR />What really galls me is how we will deal with pregnancies where there are unborn children with disabilities or there are severe foetal impairments. There is no list — right up to birth.”
“My wife and I have fostered many children, and without disclosing the difficulties of the background that those children come from, many of them come from situations that people will use with regard to abortive rights. I understand the need for parents, women in particular, to have their views heard, especially, as the Member said, on health, but there are two lives that matter here and nothing will shake me from that. We need to be sympathetic in how we deal with the subject, but let me say again, I regret and was angry that, on 21 October 2019, for whatever reason and whoever held us back, the Assembly could not debate issues pertaining to life and death: saving life and protecting life.”
“I rise not as the Ulster Unionist Party Chief Whip and nor am I speaking on behalf of the party. I am speaking as a member of the Ulster Unionist Party who celebrates its position of conscience on the issue of abortion. <BR /> <BR />There have been many days when each of us, as MLAs, have maligned the day that we got involved in politics. Perhaps we have even regretted it and have had low days when we have been pained with what has happened and what has not happened. My most painful day as a politician of any hue was 21 October 2019. It was a day when I was unable to have my voice heard in the Chamber on something that is so important to me. Other Members have spoken well and given a good account of their positions, and I would like to give mine. <BR /> <BR />I am a son, a father, a dad and a foster parent.”
“As highlighted by the Committee Chair, the regulation before us will provide a short-term living grant to someone infected by COVID-19 or who has to self-isolate. I welcome the Minister's clarification for people who are affected and support for those people. All that is welcome. However, it is imperative to ensure that the process to avail of the grant is efficient and properly resourced. We look forward to that clarification today. We support the regulation.”
“The Ulster Unionist Party, therefore, supports the proactive approach of this Minister and other Ministers in their Departments looking to introduce support packages, one example being the SR before us today. However, there is no doubt that we can and should do more. The Ulster Unionist Party will support and work with the Minister for Communities and her Executive colleagues to ensure that every possible measure of support and assistance is introduced. <BR /> <BR />There is also no doubt that these are exceptional circumstances and, as such, will require an exceptional response with various pieces of new legislation and the amendment of existing legislation that, ultimately, provides the appropriate support for those in need.”
“Thank you, Minister, for being with us in the Chamber this afternoon and for bringing this before us. I want to put on record — I am sure that you will join me — my thanks to all your staff in the different branches who go above and beyond the call of duty at the moment to ensure that some of the most vulnerable people in our society have the support that they so badly need. <BR /> <BR />These are, indeed, uncertain times, as has been said by nearly every Member so far today. We face many pressures in Northern Ireland, and many people will be adversely affected. It is, therefore, imperative that we collectively in the House support our Ministers to do all that we can to ensure that the physical, emotional and financial support is there to mitigate any hardship that may be faced.”
“For that, Ivan, we say, "Thank you". <BR /> <BR />Finally, though — I did learn this from Google — when I was made Chief Whip a number of months ago, I felt a great sense of achievement and pride that that wee working-class guy from the Low Road was Chief Whip of the Ulster Unionist Party, but that self-satisfaction was short-lived. I merely follow in your footsteps, my friend, and pick up the baton as you did before me when you held that role. If I can carry even half the reputation that Ivan Davis had, I will be doing fine. For all that you did and all whom you served, Ivan, I say, "Thank you".”
“In 1987 and to my delight, he moved from the Democratic Unionist Party to the Ulster Unionist Party and quickly became a community champion who seemed to know everyone. He was able to fix any problem that was brought to him, and he gained great respect and admiration across the political field that will be shared by many, including you, Mr Speaker, today. For that, Ivan, we say, "Thank you". <BR /> <BR />At Ivan's funeral, a tribute was made by Lord Trimble. He and John Hume are known as the architects of the Good Friday Agreement, and it was with a sense of local, Low Road, Lisburn pride that I learnt of his role and the support that Ivan gave from the Benches of the Ulster Unionist Party in the design and delivery of what, we now know, brought an end to our Troubles and helped to pave the way for peace in Northern Ireland.”
“Some of us newbie politicians may think that the decisions that we make today and have had to make in recent months have been difficult: they have, but, when I cast my mind back and think about people like Ivan, who, when this country was imploding violently, stepped up to the podium and, at great risk to them and their families, sought to serve their community. For that, Ivan, we say, "Thank you". <BR /> <BR />Ivan was a proud unionist, a proud working-class guy and a devoted family man. Thankfully, I did not need to google any of that; I know that because I lived where Ivan lived. Ivan lived in the community that he served. He raised his family in the Roseville estate in the Low Road, Lisburn.”
“Thank you, Mr Speaker, for your kind words. It is an honour for me today, even briefly, to pay respect on behalf of the Ulster Unionist Party and the Assembly to the late Ivan Davis OBE. Along with the OBE, Ivan was a freeman of the city of Lisburn, something of which he was very proud. He sadly left us on 13 March 2020 — peacefully in hospital, and for that we are grateful. As you said, Mr Speaker, Ivan was the much-loved husband to Betty and father of Allyson, Hayden, Gareth and the late Alvin. He was also a devoted grandfather and great-grandfather, and our thoughts are very much with those people at this time. <BR /> <BR />Ivan was first elected to political office in 1973, one year after I was born.”
“Dealing with those key issues will require politics of trust, honesty, maturity and humility and politicians with a vision for a better future for all our communities in this country. The question is whether the findings and other facts pertaining to this sad debacle will be enough to change some of the attitudes, habits and failings of some in our near past and help rebuild trust and faith in elected politics, which should and could be the pinnacle of public service.”
“<BR /> <BR />It is noteworthy that project mismanagement or fiscal failure by senior departmental officials is highlighted repeatedly in the report, and we must ensure that systemic cultural change at the highest level is effected in the Civil Service. However, that cannot distract from the real cost to Northern Ireland and the role that RHI played in bringing these institutions, which mean so much to some of us, to a shuddering halt for three years. <BR /> <BR />The world is in crisis. The spread of the coronavirus, our growing mental health problems, economic inactivity, poverty and homelessness need to be our combined priorities in the near and distant future.”
“I hope that, in the near future, as we explore new Bills and rules, we can, once and for all, protect those who have operated in an honourable fashion whilst removing the ability of less conscientious, unelected officials from interfering in matters that are absolutely outside their jurisdiction. <BR /> <BR />With regard to unwelcome and unjustified interference by unelected sources, the sharing of RHI-related documents and other matters by the then Finance Minister to more sinister sources, further compounds the disdain and lack of trust felt by most of the voting population since that time.”
“A favourite put-down by those Ministers then — still being used as recently as the past few weeks — is to remind the new MLA, boy or girl, in the Chamber that they are clearly new and inexperienced, that, perhaps, they are not over the detail of the question or, perhaps, they should get their facts checked. Even then, I remember wincing and thinking, "How obnoxious", "How superior", and now, with all that we know, "How hypocritical". <BR /> <BR />Much has rightly been made of the influence and opportunism of spads and the lack of accountability and the blurring of roles and responsibility.”
“Time will never tell us whether the PAC would have delivered the same analysis as Sir Patrick Coghlin's report, but, at a cost of some £15 million, I sincerely hope that the findings do not go up in a puff of smoke, to which the "Cash for ash" strapline lends itself. <BR /> <BR />As Mr Nolan cornered the air waves and Sam McBride captured the story in script, the reputations of politics and politicians and Northern Ireland plc were left in absolute tatters. I clearly remember that, at Question Time on a number of occasions in late 2016, I was spoken to by a couple of the Ministers referenced heavily in the text of the report in the most condescending of ways.”
“I must be candid and declare that it was the lack of credible, noteworthy, inspiring and visionary voices leading Northern Ireland politics that convinced me to get elected to this place. The scandalous findings in the report vindicate that decision. <BR /> <BR />In 2016, I was a member of the Public Accounts Committee, which, under the chairmanship of Robin Swann MLA, was making good headway. If not, at times, in the party-partisan, fractious manner of some, we tried to uncover the allegations of mismanagement, gaming, useful heat and other serious allegations suggested by the whistle-blower.”
“The RHI inquiry report, unveiled on Friday afternoon, at long last brings some closure to the latest chapter in the discovery of systemic cultural dysfunction and political failure at the very heart of Northern Irish politics. Sadly, what seems to have gone relatively unnoticed and unmentioned over the weekend is the ongoing pain and suffering, loss and humiliation of the many legitimate users of the RHI scheme. At this point, they look to be the most significant losers of all. I sincerely hope, though, that that will not be the case. <BR /> <BR />For some of us in this room — I do not speak for all — the reputation of Northern Ireland politics and our attitude to our place in the Union are very important. That extends not merely to our behaviour in the Chamber but, perhaps more importantly, to the wider nation and, indeed, the world.”
“I thank the Minister for taking the time to come here and speak on this important issue. As has been covered already by a number of Members, the high street is under immense pressure, irrespective of the further pressures through the coronavirus. We are in that intervention stage, and the pressures are there. Has the Minister given any thought to a package that may be available to businesses on the other side that may have had to close down due to financial pressures and who are indicating to all of us, I am sure, almost daily that, if they have to close the door, they may not open again?”
“How difficult might a start-up be after a gap of 14 to 16 weeks?”
“I thank the Minister for coming to us at such short notice and thank him for behaving in the manner in which he has, along with the Health Minister, and being so stoical in the face of such pressure. I speak as one with 16 years of emergency planning experience. I know that there are lots of experts in here on virology and viruses, but I just want to commend the Minister on his approach to emergency planning. <BR /> <BR />Has the Minister given any thought to what a start-up might look like or how difficult it might be, given that there are likely to be closures in the region of 14 to 16 weeks?”
“I will not be moving the motion at this time. With the indulgence of other Members, I will return to it when we have a Minister to respond.”
“<BR /> <BR />I appreciate that there will be a cost associated with any implementation of the proposal, especially at this time of budget tightening, and it is our duty as custodians and stewards of public money to ensure that it is spent in the most cost-effective manner. I welcome the calls for the implementation of a full childcare strategy across Northern Ireland, a strategy that ensures, in the first instance, that childcare is available to everyone who needs it across every region of Northern Ireland and delivers high-quality childcare. The strategy should also support our children's early years development, encourage a more diverse workplace and promote the opportunities of economic freedom and prosperity for all of Northern Ireland's hard-working parents.”