John O'Dowd
Upper Bann · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland
“As I set out in response to the previous question, we have in place the vacant property rate relief scheme and the small business rate relief scheme, which are very successful. I set aside £10 million in the draft Budget for small business rate relief to be invested.”
“I am particularly keen to hear from those impacted by vacant commercial units and especially about how any phased increase can be implemented in a sustainable way that is fair, proportionate and sustainable within the tax system.”
“I outlined my intent to take that approach in my statement on 18 November, alongside the fact that reform of rating policy should support growth, make better use of property and ensure that the system is fair, proportionate and aligned with wider economic objectives.”
“The accelerator will operate alongside our highly successful Back in Business scheme, which has helped to bring over 100 vacant high street properties back into use since May 2024. Those issues have been the subject of considerable interest and comment in the Assembly, and it is right that we grasp the nettle now.”
“There are no circumstances in which a hard border would be good for the people of Ireland; it would not be good for anyone. Those who suggest that are being naive at best and dangerous at worst, in the sense of not understanding this society. <BR /> <BR />Rural communities along the border are one and the same.”
“This announcement represents the next step in that. That said, I also put on record my intention to strengthen support for small businesses. In that vein, £10 million has been set aside in the draft Budget to broaden the impact of the small business rate relief scheme in order to increase the number of businesses that can benefit from it.…”
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“It is not a case of me not listening to the Education Minister; in fact, I had a constructive meeting with the Education Minister last week. I am doing a round of bilaterals with all Ministers in preparation for, I hope, agreement of a three-year Budget. The Education Minister set out his pressures to me. <BR /> <BR />Let me put it in this context for you and others. The Education budget is currently £3·1 billion. The Education Minister has stated that he has pressures of £800 million next year. That is a 28% uplift. It is a huge uplift. When you look at the scale of that, you will see that it is the totality of the budget for the Department for the Economy.”
“In total, the Education Minister’s return to the Budget exercise included resource DEL bids of over £860 million for 2026-27. Compared with a baseline figure for his Department of around £3·1 billion, that represents a very significant uplift. <BR /> <BR />I acknowledge the increasing pressures on DE as a result of growth in demand for SEN support and other pressures on schools, and I will continue to work with the Education Minister and other Executive colleagues to find solutions.”
“That will enable the Education Minister to determine how much of that funding he wishes to direct towards the delivery of the special educational needs reform agenda. The draft Budget also provides a general capital allocation of over £1 billion in funding for the Department of Education over four years until 2029-2030. Again, that will enable the Education Minister to determine how much of the allocation he wishes to put towards special educational needs provision. <BR /> <BR />There is also a £24 million allocation in earmarked capital DEL funding in the Budget specifically for special educational needs. The Department of Education was also successful in securing a total of £27·5 million in funding for special educational needs from the public-sector transformation fund, as announced in March 2025.”
“The proposals that I have brought forward for consultation follow political engagement and have been developed against the backdrop of an exceptionally constrained financial position. They do not provide the level of funding that I would wish to see directed at our public services; instead, they reflect what is possible with the funding available. In that context, it has not been possible to provide any Department with the funding that it has requested. <BR /> <BR />The proposals set out in the draft Budget that I have brought forward provide over £9·7 billion in resource departmental expenditure limit (DEL) funding for the Department of Education over the period 2026-27 to 2028-29 that has not been earmarked for specific purposes.”
“I do not have an assessment in front of me, but the voluntary and community sector has proven its worth time and time again; indeed, I will meet the sector again tomorrow in relation to the local growth fund and the challenges that that will bring. I think that all Members can agree that the voluntary and community sector makes a huge difference across our communities.”
“Policies and strategies have their value, but, unless they deliver, they are just documentation. In this instance, over 7,200 people who were long-term unemployed or disadvantaged in the labour market have gained employment and over 370 social enterprises have been part of the supply chain in public-sector contracts. There have been over 11,700 hours of volunteering with the voluntary and community and social enterprise sectors, 27,700 hours of health and well-being initiatives and 2,600 hours of digital inclusion initiatives, and almost 700 environmental action plans have been delivered. It is making a significant difference in our society.”
“The Member will have heard me set out the comprehensive criteria that are used. As a result of the work that has been carried out, there has been success not only in my Department, with its role in procurement, but in other Departments. We are seeing success. As legislators, we will say that legislation has its uses, but it is not always necessary. If evidence is produced that statute is the best way forward, I will be more than happy to look at it.”
“The social value principle has six objectives, each of which is accompanied by a specific action and descriptor to ensure clarity and consistency in the delivery of the objectives.”
“<BR /> <BR />The social value procurement policy also requires Departments to develop a social value strategy to align social value objectives with their procurement pipelines and to look for other opportunities across their operational and policy responsibilities to improve social and economic outcomes. My Department is the first to publish its social value strategy and recently published its first progress report on the implementation of that strategy. <BR /> <BR />The public procurement policy statement (PPPS) published in June 2025 sets out the Executive's priorities for a more streamlined, simplified and accessible procurement environment. It has four principles, including social value.”
“<BR /> <BR />The policy ensures a consistent approach to social value in the public sector and mandates that, for services contracts above £500,000 and work contracts over the UK threshold, at least 10% of the total award criteria must be allocated to social value. The PPN further outlines requirements to incorporate social value in procurements under four themes: increasing secure employment and skills; building ethical and resilient supply chains; delivering climate action; and promoting well-being. To help maintain consistency in the scoring of social value, model criteria have been developed. That consistency also helps with reporting social value outcomes, which are monitored through the SIB portal.”
“The procurement policy note (PPN) 01/21 on social value in procurement was revised in February 2025 following reviews by the Strategic Investment Board (SIB) and key stakeholders, including the voluntary, community and social enterprise sectors, Departments and centres of procurement expertise (COPEs). The reviews identified the policy as having made a real difference to how contractors incorporate social value into their business models. However, they also identified some unintended consequences for small and microbusinesses that were finding it more difficult to compete with larger companies for contracts where social value was a scored criterion. Key changes were made to remove barriers for those businesses.”
“Mr Speaker, may I have an extra minute to answer the question?”
“Departments are aware that they must surrender all reduced requirements immediately and certainly before the final monitoring round of the year. To avoid capital being lost to the Executive, however, Departments have been advised to inform DOF immediately of any emerging easements. If further easements arise, I will consider bringing to the Executive recommendations for their reallocation. As I said, we carried out a further exercise this year as a result of Barnett consequentials and capital easements from Departments. I hope to make an announcement on that in the near future.”
“I presume that the Member is referring to the allocation in my statement on the draft Budget. I was responding to bids from the Department of Health in that instance, and it will be a matter for that Department to acknowledge why and for what purpose those bids were made. <BR /> <BR />The objective remains to deliver the children's hospital. I am fully aware of the commentary on that. The Minister of Health has addressed the Chamber on the matter on a number of occasions. To deliver the hospital will require further investment. It remains an Executive priority, so it is only right and proper that we make allocations to it. The proper use of that money is down to the Department of Health, and the Minister of Health will have to stand over its use, as will his accounting officer.”
“The amount that the Executive can carry forward under the Budget exchange scheme is limited to 1·5% of the final capital budget for that year. For 2025-26, that limit will be approximately £31 million. To reduce the risk of capital funding being lost, Departments were asked, as part of the January in-year technical exercise this year, to confirm any further capital easements that had arisen since December monitoring.”
“The Executive apply a zero-based approach to allocating capital in Budgets. That means that Departments must justify their capital requirements for each Budget period. Departmental budget allocations include earmarked funding that must be used for the purpose provided and general capital allocations over which Departments have discretion in how they are used. <BR /> <BR />Departments then have flexibility to move funding in-year between capital projects within their general allocation. Any reduced requirements relating to earmarked funding must be returned for allocation by the Executive. Departments should also surrender, at the earliest opportunity, any general capital allocations that cannot be used in the financial year. <BR /> <BR />Individual Departments cannot carry forward unspent capital into the next financial year.”
“If I caused Mr McNulty any offence, I apologise.”
“I am open to ideas for how we can support our businesses across all sectors with all matters. If that proposal is viable, I am open to hearing about it further.”
“If I have understood the Member correctly, it was not about increasing the monetary uplift in rates but about having a fair distribution of the rates burden across all sectors in recognition of their trading figures in April 2024. The exercise is not about collecting additional money. Rather, it is neutral, because it is spread across the sector. It is therefore not an underhanded way in which for me or anybody else to collect additional rates money.”
“For the record, businesses were first engaged with in April 2024. Representatives of the hospitality sector met the then Finance Minister in May 2024. Further letters were sent out to the hospitality sector representative bodies later that summer, alerting them to the fact that the COVID discount was to be removed and that, as a result, there would be significant uplifts in the net value of properties.”
“I sense that the Member is largely talking about retail. Each business will now go back to its 2023 valuation. As I said in my answer to a previous question, the debate has been around the hospitality sector, perhaps understandably, but, if we are to move forward with a fair, open and transparent rating system, we have to hear the voices of all sectors. The retail sector has seen significant changes in shoppers' patterns as a result of the growth of online shopping etc. When Members debate the issues, it is important that they are mindful of the fact that it was a reval of all non-domestic properties, not simply one sector.”
“Mr McNulty, I approach people as I find them. If those who speak to me treat me with common courtesy, I will treat them with common courtesy. You have an awful habit of standing in the Chamber and demeaning representatives of my party and other parties. Were you to adopt a slightly different tone, you would be surprised at how well you and I would get on.”
“My reference to you not knowing what you were talking about was a general comment.”
“<BR /> <BR />I am more than happy to equip Members with information on the system, because there has been a lot of debate on it, some of which has been informed and some of which has not been so informed. I accept that it is complicated. I have the assistance of my officials to steer me through it. I am more than happy to place in the Library information on exactly how the system works. I suspect that the issue about the percentage etc will be the focus of our discussions with the hospitality sector.”
“As I said, I conducted a safe U-turn, checking my rear-view mirror and looking across the road, paying attention to the environment around me at all times. <BR /> <BR />This is how the process of fair maintainable trade (FMT) turnover operates. Fair maintainable trade turnover is the turnover that an efficient operator could achieve running a business. The rental value is a small percentage of the FMT after operating costs are deducted. At every revaluation, LPS has engaged with the hospitality sector to help to review and update the percentages used. I suspect that the conversation that we will have with the hospitality sector in the time ahead will be about a number of areas, including the percentage used to evaluate the rentable value of a property after taking into account all the overheads that it faces.”
“Mr Brett, I have in front of me the Hansard report of our conversation in the Chamber last week. I am scanning through it, so you are at risk of being corrected. I see none of those terms used against you. We had a robust exchange of views, and your tone at the start was matched by my tone at the end. You are a bit like me: you are used to the rough and tumble of politics. <BR /> <BR />Treasury will inform us on around 3 March what the Barnett consequentials of their latest announcement will be. That announcement has been made on the back of its giving support to businesses there on the basis that the reval there is continuing. All that will have to be taken into account, but the final decision on what will be done with that money and other Barnett consequentials is for the Executive.”
“It has to be fair, open, transparent and capable of supporting our public services and the wider economy.”
“The Member will be that aware that I am going through a review of all rating policies, including for manufacturing. When we reach the stage at which I am doing a review of manufacturing, there will be an opportunity for you and others to respond to a consultation on how we should move forward with rating all businesses. At some stage over the next number of months, leading up to the end of the mandate, there will be an opportunity for everyone to have their say on a wide range of rating policies that will affect non-domestic ratepayers. <BR /> <BR />I firmly believe in having a fair, open and transparent rates policy that supports our public services and the wider economy. Those are the principles on which engagement with the hospitality sector will take place in relation on Reval2026 and on which I will engage with every other sector.”
“Reviews are taking place in Scotland and England, and, back in November, I said in the Chamber that I would take cognisance of those in deciding how we would move forward with future revals. As I have said, I met the hospitality sector on Thursday, and I am committed to having further engagement and working on any proposals that it is prepared to bring forward. My officials are happy to engage on that, but, if Members are going to make such definitive statements in the Chamber, there is a responsibility on them to bring forward proposals as well. If you are strongly of that view, there is a responsibility on the official Opposition to bring forward a counterproposal.”
“The decision was not taken in a vacuum; it was taken in the knowledge that a challenge existed and that Ministers have to take action in those circumstances. <BR /> <BR />I believe in open and transparent government. The report was finalised, and I believed that it deserved to be published.”
“You cannot rewrite it that quickly. Did I mislead the House? No, I did not, on any occasion. I gave you information to assist your constituents, and the challenge that I put to you was this: I said that the best advice that you could give your constituents at that stage was to engage with LPS if they believed that their revaluation was not based on the correct figures. <BR /> <BR />The process that was followed leading up to Reval2026 was sound. The challenge for us was the removal of the COVID support grants for businesses, which dated back to 2021. There was such a dramatic rise for some businesses that it was a challenge. However, I had already taken action and had put money aside in the draft Budget to help businesses. I had been going through reviews of small business rate relief schemes and other ways to support our businesses.”
“As I have said to other MLAs in the Chamber, Hansard has been printed. There is a video of the debate. Everybody is aware of what was and was not said. I can understand Members' desire to rewrite history, but you cannot rewrite it —”
“The response to the publication meant that we would not have been able to have the cool, level-headed debate and discussion that we required, so I have taken the decision to stop it. We will now engage more with the hospitality sector; indeed, I suspect that other sectors will want to — and should — have their voices heard in this as well.”
“Many other sectors were revalued as part of the process. Members may have received correspondence from some that feel that their voices have not been heard in the debate. Let us talk about the reval in its totality, rather than about individual sectors in it. <BR /> <BR />I believe in openness and transparency in government. LPS carried out the service. It was published, and we have seen the reaction to it. It was not published in a vacuum. I published it in the knowledge that I had money set aside in the draft Budget to help and support business. I do not suggest that that would have completely alleviated the pressures that businesses were under, but I had already taken action in that regard.”
“As I said to the previous questioner, I was aware of the figures in October 2025. I was aware of the challenges that they would bring to the hospitality sector and other sectors, and the opportunities that they would bring for some in those sectors. The conversation, perhaps understandably, has been solely around hospitality.”
“I was aware of the figures; I knew the challenges that they would bring; and, in my own way, I took action in the draft Budget.”
“The figures were first presented to me in October 2025. There were a number of meetings between officials and me following that, right up until the publication of the figures. Reval is a stand-alone process, so an economic assessment going side by side with it would not be part of the role of the Department of Finance nor, indeed, LPS. I knew the first time that I saw the figures that there would be a challenge, but I also believe in openness and transparency in government. I thought that it was only right and proper that the process was completed and that the figures were published. In addition, as part of my preparations for the draft Budget, I set aside £10 million to help businesses with the challenges that they face, not only from Reval but from other pressures.”
“Advocacy is important, supporting our local businesses as MLAs is important and speaking up is important, but the practical measure is to get a three-year Budget over the line and to make sure that, as part of that three-year Budget, there is a package to support our small and medium enterprises.”
“First, I hope that they bought them out of their own pocket; and secondly, I hope that they bought the other people in the bar a drink as well and left a few pounds behind the till for the staff <BR /> <BR />There is an old adage that there are no answers to be found in the bottom of a pint glass. I enjoy a pint or two myself, so I will not criticise anybody for having a pint. There are no answers in the bottom of a pint glass, but there are answers in delivering a three-year Budget. As part of the first year of the Budget, I have set aside £10 million to support small and medium enterprises, including those in the hospitality sector, in recognition of the challenges and opportunities that they face.”
“I noted last week that many Members were pictured with pints in hand in pubs and hospitality businesses across the North.”
“It will require consultation. I am keen to get out to consultation, but I suspect that it will be the spring before we can go out to consultation on that matter. However, it is an important policy direction for us to go in, because we obviously want to see our businesses expand, both in turnover and in physical capacity and size. One factor as to why some businesses see a dramatic increase in their rates, be it 100%, 200% or 300%, is that they have increased in size. In many cases, it is down to the fact that a business has put on a major physical expansion. As part of the proposals that I want to consult on, such businesses would be given a grace period on their rates for those expansions to allow them to absorb the cost of the building as they move forward with their business plans. I will consult on it in the spring.”
“There is a sector average, and there is a variety of different sectors in the valuation list. Some properties will be above that sector average and some will be below it. That will be for a variety of reasons, but it will be down to the characteristics of each business. Now that the Reval has stopped, there is little opportunity at this initial stage to query what individual businesses have been facing. However, I am sure that LPS will be open to a discussion with you, if those businesses are content for you to represent them, to help you understand the varying characteristics and why those businesses in your locality are so far above the average. However, it will be about the characteristics of the individual business.”
“I will continue to analyse how I, in my role as Finance Minister, can support our small and medium-sized businesses.”
“The Member will have heard my opening remarks on the small business rate relief consultation that we have just conducted. My officials are analysing the results of that. A factor that has been lost in the noise is that, in acknowledgement of the Reval that was taking place and of the information that I had to hand, I set aside £10 million in the draft Budget to support small and medium-sized business. My vision for that £10 million was that it would assist those businesses that are the most challenged by the economic circumstances in which they operate. <BR /> <BR />As part of an ongoing programme of work, around a quarter of a billion pounds of rate relief is offered to businesses here in recognition of the value that they bring to our society and economy and the challenges that they face.”
“In the absence of those evaluations, there are sound sources of evidence upon which to make your decisions.”
“At the start of the Reval process in April 2024, all businesses were contacted with area-specific questionnaires, which they were asked to return. For a variety of reasons, unfortunately only 30% of those were returned by the hospitality sector . When you do not get a return from a specific business, valuers then look at returns to Companies House, evidence of the premises around the individual property and the trading relationships and market values in the area. They look at a wide range of factors, which are evidence-based, and then determine the rateable value of the property. That is a firm basis upon which to operate, but, ideally, if each business returns its evaluation, it will be allowed to tell its own story. That was the bone of contention in the Chamber last week.”
“As I said, I met representatives of the hospitality sector last week. It is going to produce proposals. I will consider them with an open mind to see what the best way forward is for what is a very important policy area for the entire Executive and our economy. I am open-minded about any proposals that come forward, but, at the risk of repeating myself, the method used to evaluate rates will have to be open and fair to all sectors of our economy. If we can work on that basis, I have no doubt that we will make progress.”
“Hansard will speak for itself. I know that a week is a long time in politics, but it is a long time in history as well, because history is being rewritten as we stand here today. <BR /> <BR />My comments, and those of Members, are clearly recorded in Hansard. I said last week that the methodology that my officials used was correct. It was correctly used. The outcome of that methodology's usage has caused deep concern in the hospitality sector. I have reacted to that concern, as I should, but the evidence base is firm, solid, open and transparent. If it is to be replaced, what replaces it must also be firm, solid, open and transparent.”
“Following my engagement with the hospitality sector last Thursday, it is going to produce proposals for a way forward. I have said that my officials will engage with the sector in a constructive way. If we continue to engage with each other constructively, we will be able to find a landing zone in which everyone accepts that they are being treated fairly and in an open and transparent manner. The objective is to ensure that we have a rates base that supports not only our businesses but our public services and the wider economy.”
“A U-turn that is carried out in a safe manner is part of the Highway Code: the political highway code and the Roads Order. I am sure that the former police officer across the Chamber has examined it more closely. <BR /> <BR />What is important is where we are at now. I listened to the concerns of elected representatives and the hospitality sector and have stopped the revaluation process. I met the sector last Thursday. Its representatives said that they will bring proposals to me. I have offered them the services of my officials. If we have constructive engagement, I believe that we will be able to move forward. Any future method that we use to evaluate rates, however, must be open, fair and transparent, and it must meet the needs of our public sector and the wider economy.”