John O'Dowd
Upper Bann · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland
“As I set out in response to the previous question, we have in place the vacant property rate relief scheme and the small business rate relief scheme, which are very successful. I set aside £10 million in the draft Budget for small business rate relief to be invested.”
“I am particularly keen to hear from those impacted by vacant commercial units and especially about how any phased increase can be implemented in a sustainable way that is fair, proportionate and sustainable within the tax system.”
“I outlined my intent to take that approach in my statement on 18 November, alongside the fact that reform of rating policy should support growth, make better use of property and ensure that the system is fair, proportionate and aligned with wider economic objectives.”
“The accelerator will operate alongside our highly successful Back in Business scheme, which has helped to bring over 100 vacant high street properties back into use since May 2024. Those issues have been the subject of considerable interest and comment in the Assembly, and it is right that we grasp the nettle now.”
“There are no circumstances in which a hard border would be good for the people of Ireland; it would not be good for anyone. Those who suggest that are being naive at best and dangerous at worst, in the sense of not understanding this society. <BR /> <BR />Rural communities along the border are one and the same.”
“This announcement represents the next step in that. That said, I also put on record my intention to strengthen support for small businesses. In that vein, £10 million has been set aside in the draft Budget to broaden the impact of the small business rate relief scheme in order to increase the number of businesses that can benefit from it.…”
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“I would much prefer to engage with the Department of Justice and see how we can support the Planning Appeals Commission rather than going down the road of appointing independent commissioners, but we have to keep that under review. <BR /> <BR />The delivery of major capital projects by the public sector has long been a source of comment by many. There has been some improvement. I accept that one swallow does not make a summer. The most recently published statistics, for the first six months of 2023-24, show that the average processing time for local applications was 19·2 weeks across all councils, against a target of 15 weeks, with four of the 11 councils meeting the 15-week target. For major applications during that period, it was 34·7 weeks across all councils.”
“While I will pursue the validation checklist, which is at an advanced stage, it is disappointing that we require legislation to cover it, but what has to be has to be. <BR /> <BR />We will continue to work together to address the challenges, whether that be with local government, statutory consultees or the Planning Appeals Commission, which, as you will understand, falls under the Department of Justice. It is wholly independent but sponsored by the Department of Justice. <BR /> <BR />We could use independent commissioners, as has been pointed out in the debate and by other bodies, but it is an expensive route to go down, and, at the moment, I do not have that option.”
“Some people tell me that they cannot get their car in for an MOT, but that is a debate for another day. No doubt, you will have me back on that one. When I was in the post previously, I commissioned work on a validation checklist. Work is at an advanced stage on that. Like any legislation that we bring forward, we have to make sure that we have got it right. We are engaging with partners on it. We are engaging with the Planning Appeals Commission on an appeals mechanism, but, surely, in this day and age, planning agents, architects and others know exactly what is needed when submitting a planning application. If you submit a planning application with the required information, the Department can deal with it more quickly, and the statutory consultees can deal with it more quickly.”
“Since those publications, good work has been done by my Department, working in collaboration — this is important — with local government and other stakeholders to address the recommendations in both reports. <BR /> <BR />A planning improvement work programme has been established and is being taken forward jointly by local and central government. The programme is broken down across key themes, including policy and legislation; local development plans; development management; performance engagement; and financial sustainability of the system. <BR /> <BR />In an area where we need improvement, there is what some refer to as "the MOT theory": you put in an application and see how it goes, in the same way as some people put their car in for an MOT and see how it goes.”
“I am clear that an effective and efficient planning system is key to growing our economy, protecting our environment, addressing the climate change challenge and ultimately creating successful places where people want to live, work and play and that meet all their needs for generations to come. <BR /> <BR />As has been noted, there have been many reports on our planning system, each with its views on what works well, what may not work so well and where improvements can be made. Members noted the Audit Office report on the planning system and referred to a report by the Public Accounts Committee from March 2022 that identified areas for improvement and change in the planning system.”
“I am not sure that I would describe it in that way. As I said, I can refer to my Department as the statutory consultees for whom I am responsible. They do not have the resources or the people to meet the demand. I have a responsibility to make sure that they are properly resourced, and that is one of the tasks that I will take on. When we have properly resourced institutions, we can go back to the conversation about what happens if a deadline is missed — Does the plan go ahead? Do you introduce penalties? — but we have to get the resourcing right first. <BR /> <BR />While my Department has an important leadership role in the two-tier planning system, it does not act alone or have direct responsibility for addressing all the issues highlighted in the motion or by Members. This is a collective issue on which we must work together.”
“Both are understaffed, so how can we expect them to respond in a timely fashion to the multitude of planning applications coming through? We need to invest in staffing numbers and move them up. <BR /> <BR />That brings me to the point raised by a number of Members about whether we should introduce penalties if consultees do not respond in time. That would be self-defeating. Should we move ahead with a planning application if a statutory consultee has not responded? There could be a significant danger in that, because, if we get it wrong, it could go spectacularly wrong, especially in relation to the environment. Those things need to be thought through.”
“Our councils have just set their rates: how many of them increased their investment in their planning department? I do not know the answer to that question, but, if we want to improve planning, we will have to improve investment in councils, and I will have to improve investment in the Department. We will need resources to do so. <BR /> <BR />Even in terms of statutory consultees, our planning system is driven largely by people. Yes, we have to look for investment in new technologies — the planning portal is beginning to show its benefits, although there are teething problems with all technology when it is introduced — but look at statutory consultees. I will use the Roads Service and the Rivers Agency in my Department as examples.”
“It is up to local people to respond according to how they feel about those matters. <BR /> <BR />When Members talk about planners, it is interesting to ask who we are talking about. Are we talking about planning officials in the council, about our colleagues who sit on planning committees, about the officials who work in my Department as planners or about me as a planner, in the sense of being the person who has to sign off on planning applications? Our planning system and how we deliver it is multifaceted. That exposes the responsibilities that we all have to improve our planning. <BR /> <BR />Mr Durkan referred to the resourcing of planning at council level. He said that it was properly resourced when he transferred it, and I am not in a position to argue with him: if he says it was, it was.”
“On Mrs Erskine's point on rural planning, it may comfort her a bit to know that I was born and reared in a rural community. That may alarm others who have different views on how to proceed with building in rural communities, but that shows the context of our planning system. <BR /> <BR />Under the review of public administration, the Executive agreed to transfer significant planning functions to local government. That allows local communities to hold their councillors accountable for how they discharge their planning functions. Mr Allister gave an example of how, because of that decision, there can be one decision in mid-Ulster and another one at the Antrim end of that council: that is local democracy, that is the devolution of those powers to local government.”
“The planning system can have an impact on all our communities, young or old, urban or rural. That is why it is important that we work together to deliver an efficient and effective planning system.”
“<BR /> <BR />As many have stated, planning has an important role to play in making the North a better place for us all. It is a key enabler for promoting economic growth. It helps us create attractive places and to protect and enhance our environment.”
“Before I start, I declare an interest in the debate. Councillor Mary O'Dowd, who sits on Armagh City, Banbridge and Craigavon Borough Council's planning committee, is also my wife. <BR /> <BR />I thank all the Members who spoke in the debate about the planning system for providing me with an early opportunity to address the wider Assembly about very important issues. I am delighted to have taken up the post of Infrastructure Minister and to have the opportunity to make a real difference and a positive change to people's lives. <BR /> <BR />I congratulate Mrs Erskine on her appointment as Chair of the Infrastructure Committee and John Stewart on his appointment as its Deputy Chair. I look forward to working with them and the other Committee members in a positive manner on this and many other issues.”
“I thank the Member for her question and her kind comments. In reality, it will fall on the general public. If I adopt the road without it being repaired, the general public will have to pay for its upgrade. One way or another, the residents of that area and of a broader area will pay for it. I never make policy on the hoof. I am happy to look at issues when they are brought to my attention, but I do not think that there is an easy solution to that one.”
“I assure the Member that the four divisions will each receive around £250,000. It will be up to the divisional managers to ensure that that is used to best effect. How it is used will be their decision; I will not interfere in any way. We have to look to the future, in medium- to long-term planning, and ensure that divisions get their finances on the basis of need and that the areas with most challenges get the most money, but, at this moment, for this short-term intervention, it is a simple division by four.”
“It would require the stabilisation of the DFI budget for me to make that commitment. The reason that we are in this scenario is as I set out earlier. The original starting point for carrying out emergency repairs was around £60 million; that is what we hoped we would have. We have £21 million to carry out the same repairs. If we are to get to a point where we look at lesser defects on the roads, we will have to have a significant increase in the Department's finances. When I look at the challenges around the Executive table, I see that I will have to work in a collective nature with my Executive colleagues. There are priorities upon priorities upon priorities, but I can assure you that I will fight DFI's corner.”
“I do not have the figures available, but I am happy to share them with the Member and lodge them in the Assembly Library so that other Members have access to them. We all know that the roads are in such a state of disrepair that vehicles are being damaged and compensation claims are being paid out. I need to rebalance that to ensure that our roads are being fixed and compensation claims are minimised. That makes economic sense.”
“I thank the Member for his kind comments. <BR /> <BR />Where we have the resources for long-term repair work to be carried out, it should be carried out properly. Unfortunately, some of our maintenance crews have to go out and literally pour a bucket of asphalt or tar into a hole, because that is all that they can do with the resources and the money that they have. Those repairs do not last. The scheme is about ensuring that we have a resurfacing programme whereby it is done properly, roads are sealed and the weather is kept out for a long time. There will always be financial pressures on all Departments, but I am of the view that, when you use public money, it should be used properly and efficiently and provide value for money.”
“I thank the Member for her kind comments and her question. <BR /> <BR />Which road network each division highlights will be a matter for the divisional manager. I encourage the Member to engage with the divisional manager on that. It is worth noting and reminding ourselves that our road network has fallen into disrepair over several years and been underinvested in for over a decade. Climate change and significant downpours of rain cause significant damage to our road network. If that is followed by frost, you are in for significant problems. I have taken a new interest in the weather forecast in my role as Infrastructure Minister. I hope that we are now heading into spring but there is still potential for heavy showers and frost, which cause significant damage to our road network.”
“This is for carriageways at the moment, but I am acutely aware of my Department's responsibility to promote active travel. When I look towards future funding rounds and stabilising my Department's budget, I assure the Member that active travel will be a priority. Improving footpath works and cycle pathways makes a significant difference. I can think of one area in my constituency around Craigavon lakes, which was years ahead of its time in developing a proper footpath and cycle network. In the past two years, it has been improved, and that has made a significant difference.”
“I thank the Member for his question. It is a serious issue for people who have bought a new home and moved in but the streets have not been finished off properly. It is on my radar. I am aware of it, and I will engage with officials over the time ahead on how we can deal with it, including whether the contractor should deliver the percentage of the bond or the size of the bond. The current situation is that homeowners are on the wrong side of the balance of justice, and that has to be evened out.”
“Yes. Ministers can make those decisions. Departmental officials did a sterling job when the Assembly and Executive were down, but the reallocation of funds such as these at the end of this period can be made only by a Minister. That shows the importance of Ministers and of what they can do. Without overstating the amount that we are spending here, while £1 million is a lot of money, in global terms it is not a lot of money. However, it is a statement of intent.”
“I thank the Member for his question. I am aware of the pothole that he refers to. Again, when you have limited resources and finances, you carry out emergency repairs. I have no doubt that even those who carry out those repairs will tell you that that is not the standard that they want to work to. We want to get to a position where we are able to equip our workforce to carry out the repairs properly and for those repairs to be long-lasting. <BR /> <BR />There is a balance to be struck. The Member is right: we pay out significant amounts of money on compensation claims. That money would be better used to make sure that the roads are in a proper state in the first place.”
“I thank the Member for her question and her comments. I am happy to review all those matters. It will not be one of the things that I look at in the next week or months, but it is certainly a programme of work that we should look at as I get my feet under the desk in the Department and move forward. As I said to Dr Aiken, if companies — utility companies or whoever — dig up our roads, they need to reinstate them in a fashion that lasts for the time that we would expect. <BR /> <BR />There is limited capacity in staff and resources in the Department, at this stage, to carry out the inspections that we would like. That is a matter for stabilising the budget and recruiting and retaining staff. The public-sector pay award, which we hope to resolve in the near future, will help me in that regard.”
“Yes, I intend to target the June monitoring round for further maintenance on our roads and for other matters. Maintenance of the roads will certainly be a high priority. Again, I emphasise that our roads are used by many different users: the motorist, obviously, the cyclist and the walker. We want to make sure that our roads are in a fit and safe condition for all who use them.”
“My understanding is that utility companies are supposed to work in cooperation with DFI Roads on a planned programme of work that understands when my Department will be carrying out work on a major resurfacing scheme or whatever. Where poor work is carried out, I encourage the Member to report it to his local division. It is important that work on our roads is done to the highest standards, whoever carries it out.”
“It is amazing how much information people feel free to send me on social media about new technology and how to fill potholes, but my officials are better qualified than I am to examine all the suggestions. <BR /> <BR />Why would we not invest in new technology that carries out the functions more effectively and efficiently? We could then do more, but all those things have to be examined and proven to be value for money. They have to prove what they can do. Some of that funding will come from my budget; I may have to bid for more funding. I have to have the finances to invest in that sort of equipment.”
“I thank the Member for his kind remarks. I am sorry to hear about his constituent's experience. It is worth emphasising again that our roads are used by many different users: the motorist, the pedestrian, the cyclist and others. The pothole situation makes cyclists and motorcyclists particularly vulnerable to serious injury. That is why I am keen to resolve the matter. <BR /> <BR />The scheme that we have announced today will start improving our road network. It is the start of a journey — pardon the pun — that we are on for the funding and improvement of our road network. Today's announcement shows what Ministers can do when they are in post. It is a small step, and I do not want to exaggerate it, but I assure the Member that I am looking for money elsewhere in my Department to see whether it can be spent on our road network.”
“I thank the Member. Even when I was previously in the Department, it was highlighted that new technologies and machinery for repairing potholes were coming on board. We will explore all those options to ensure that we use public finances most effectively. <BR /> <BR />We need money to invest in buying new equipment as well. There is limited opportunity for that for my Department. However, I am exploring all options to ensure that we are getting value for money and making the most impact that we can on the ground with the limit resources that we have.”
“I thank the Member for his kind comments. I do not think that anybody would say that the current method of repairing potholes is the best way, but we are using the method that our budget allows. This process will be more about properly designed patchworking schemes, so I think that the money will be invested properly. As we move forward, stabilising the DFI budget, I think that we will see an improvement in our road network.”
“I have already asked that question for Upper Bann, and I was turned down. <BR /> <BR />It will probably be divvied up so that each division receives a similar amount of this tranche of funding. It is worth noting that, despite the severe financial restrictions that my Department, like other Departments, is under, 7,000 repairs a month are carried out. That is quite impressive. I know that it is not enough, but 7,000 are carried out each month. <BR /> <BR />This funding will allow us to carry out proper resurfacing schemes, rather than the patchwork that we have seen over the last period of time. It will be in a limited number of areas, but, as I keep emphasising, this is historic; it is a statement of intent about how we want to move forward.”
“There is a particular argument in relation to rural roads. My predecessor, Chris Hazzard, brought forward a scheme that targeted rural roads in particular for resurfacing and improvement, and I hope to do something similar. It will take time to establish what finances are available for the time ahead and how we can best use monitoring rounds, but I am keen to invest in our rural road network.”
“Yes. It is important that we improve the road network for all its users. You make a good point about cyclists. Cyclists are particularly vulnerable to potholes along our roads. I want to see our road network improved for motorists, cyclists and pedestrians, particularly in rural areas where pedestrians have to use the road instead of the footpath. I am minded of all those issues when I make such decisions.”
“When I came into the Department and spoke to my officials, I was keen to see whether we could secure additional finance to address issues with potholes and road surfaces. We are up against a tight timescale, as it is about six weeks until the end of the financial year. The money has to be spent in that time frame, so we have to be able to mobilise the workforce to do that and be assured that we can spend the money. At this stage, my officials have told me that we can handle around £1 million's worth of work. I continue to engage with my officials to see whether, if other finance becomes available, we can mobilise more of the workforce to carry out further schemes in different areas. I have no doubt that your phone will be busy today.”
“I look forward to working with her and her colleagues.”
“The backlog is growing every day. Every time that there is a downfall of rain or a heavy frost, the road maintenance backlog for potholes grows. We are currently operating on a limited budget. We have around £21 million in this financial year for fixing potholes and surfaces. Ideally, we would like to operate with three times that, but we do not have it. I listened to the Minister of Education on the competing priorities that we have around our Executive table. I have to work as part of the collective around that table, but I can assure the Member that I will do everything in my power to secure in-year monitoring funds and to stabilise the Department for Infrastructure's budget so that we can plan our road maintenance for the long term. <BR /> <BR />I end by congratulating the Member on becoming the Chair of the Committee.”
“DOE, then: it has changed that many times. This Department relies on monitoring rounds to uplift its maintenance budget. I hope that we are now in a position to start that programme of work, and I can assure everyone in the House that I will look to those monitoring rounds to get further investment in our road maintenance programme. <BR /> <BR />On the number of schemes, I emphasise to Members that it is not a case of our coming along with a wheelbarrow of tarmac or asphalt and tipping it into a hole; they will be resurfacing schemes in many areas. I estimate that between 40 and 50 schemes will be carried out. It is only a small start, but it is a start, and, as I said, I will continue to look for further finance to carry out the work.”
“There obviously has been an impact on road maintenance programmes, because, as the Member will be aware from his time in the Department for Regional Development (DRD) — I think it was DRD then —.”
“<BR /> <BR />In closing, I reiterate my commitment to addressing the historical underinvestment in the road network caused by over a decade of Tory cuts and austerity, and the £1 million of funding demonstrates that. This is the first step in what I see as the priority of improving the daily lives of people, communities and businesses by providing to our citizens the services that they expect and deserve.”
“However, that is only the beginning of much-needed investment in our road infrastructure, and my Executive colleagues and I will continue to work together to press the British Government for more funding to address the issues. There has been a growing backlog of work needed to bring our roads to an acceptable standard, and there is a pressing need to address that. That is something that I will be closely focusing on in the coming months. <BR /> <BR />This announcement is a positive one and reflects my commitment to do all that I can to repair our roads. It also reinforces the importance of having locally elected Ministers in place to make decisions such as this.”
“<BR /> <BR />As a driver and a constituency MLA, I am well aware of the frustrations and, at times, inconvenience that this has caused people and communities who rely on the road network to do business, go to work and school and connect to one another. I cannot overstate the value of our road network to our people, our communities and our economic well-being. Therefore, today, I am taking action to begin to address the issue. <BR /> <BR />Today, I am announcing the immediate investment of an additional £1 million in road maintenance to address the growing backlog of pothole repairs. That much-needed funding will be used between now and the end of the financial year to target areas of highest priority, with small resurfacing schemes designed to repair areas that have suffered the most and where localised repairs are less effective.”
“<BR /> <BR />Whilst my officials and maintenance crews have worked very hard to maintain the road network, they have, nonetheless, been forced to concentrate only on the highest-priority repairs. To be clear, that is not a position that any of us want to be in and does not represent good maintenance practice. As a result, we have all seen continued deterioration in the infrastructure, with large numbers of potholes and other defects developing across the road network, especially after periods of particularly cold or wet weather. However, despite that challenging position, on average, approximately 7,000 road service defects are fixed each month.”
“I understand that some Members may not have received the statement in due time. I apologise to the Speaker and the House for that error. In compliance with section 52 of the Northern Ireland Act 1998, I wish to make the following statement regarding the provision of additional funding to address potholes. <BR /> <BR />Having previously served as the Minister for Infrastructure, I am very aware of the long-term underfunding from which our road network has suffered due to over a decade of Tory cuts and austerity. As a result, my Department has been operating in a very difficult financial position that has been compounded by the recent two-year collapse of the Assembly. That has had a significant impact on the ability to deliver essential maintenance functions.”
“I confirm that I am willing to take up the office of Minister for Infrastructure, and I affirm the terms of the Pledge of Office as set out in schedule 4 to the Northern Ireland Act 1998.”
“I will, yes. <BR /> <BR />I would be wrong for this reason: we have shown in the last two years what a difference we can make to people's lives through Bills such as this one. I urge the Members opposite to reconsider their position, come back to a fully functioning Assembly and Executive and ensure that we collectively make differences to people's lives and create the equality for women and others in our society that has been missing for far too long.”
“We will not be able to do the same in some form of shadow Executive or shadow Assembly. I appeal to the Members opposite. I am as good as anyone at lambasting my political opponents — I can do it, and I can take it — but I appeal to my colleagues across the Chamber. I, as an Irish republican, could stand here and make a very sound speech and statement as to why I should not come into the Assembly because there is a border on the island of Ireland. I could be self-assured and confident in my contribution and say that I was right in what I said, just as Members across the Room are deeply concerned about what they see as a border down the Irish Sea, but I will tell you now that, if I were to do that, I would be wrong.”
“I suspect that, in reaction to the passing of this Bill, there will be a quiet sigh of relief in many living rooms and workplaces across the North when victims realise that they have support in place. Many of them will not be able to cheer, because it will only bring attention from their abuser, but the recognition and support for this Bill is as loud in its own way as it was for the previous Bill. <BR /> <BR />Unfortunately, the Chamber will fall silent for the next six weeks. There will be no cheering in the Hall or elsewhere, and my concern is that it will fall silent for much longer than six weeks. We may return to some form of shadow Assembly or shadow Executive, but we will do people a great disservice by doing so because we can pass legislation such as we have passed and make massive change through the Executive.”
“For the reasons that I have outlined, the Bill is important, but the purpose of the Bill is the most important reason why the Bill is coming forward today. It gives an avenue to the victims of domestic abuse to escape the abuser, because one way that abusers hold on to their victims is through financial control. Now, victims of domestic abuse can be assured that they will not lose their job because they have to take time off or because they are unable to go into work or whatever it may be, and the abuser cannot then hold on to them through financial control. We now recognise that domestic abuse impacts on the person in the workplace, and we will support them through that avenue, which is a huge step forward. <BR /> <BR />At the end of the previous debate, there was cheering and applause from the Great Hall and understandably so.”
“It is clear that the vast majority of victims of domestic violence are women and the vast majority of perpetrators are men. That includes when men are the victims of domestic violence: in the majority of cases, it is a man who is carrying out that violence against a man. Of course, there are men who suffer domestic violence from women as well. I say that because it is important that men who are victims of it come forward and seek the support that is there; it is not a sign of weakness or of being unmanly to do so. <BR /> <BR />We, as men, have a lot of catching up and repair to do for what we have done to women over generations. Much more legislation needs to come through the Assembly and future Assemblies for us to achieve true equality of the sexes in our society. We have made a significant step forward in this mandate.”
“I support the Domestic Abuse (Safe Leave) Bill at Final Stage. This Final Stage debate and the previous one have provided a useful insight into how our society, governed largely by men, has treated women for generations. I was watching the previous debate — I assure you that I will come to this debate, a LeasCheann Comhairle — and was thinking to myself, "Every day is a school day", because, even though I have been involved in politics for many years and see myself as a liberal, moderate individual, I got an insight into women's experiences in relation to period products that I did not really understand previously. <BR /> <BR />With regard to the Domestic Abuse (Safe Leave) Bill, I, as a man, am having an insight into the lives of the — mainly — women who are abused by — mainly — men.”