Peter Weir
Strangford · Ulster Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“Funding was secured for that scheme, and we have been able to take further steps on it. As highlighted by my colleague Diane Dodds, we have seen my successor, the current Minister, be able to implement it at the beginning of September 2021 and funding be made available for it.”
“One of the great fears — I saw it particularly, as Education Minister, from the point of view of children and the domestic setting between partners — was what was going to happen in families when the doors closed and the locks went on. What was happening behind closed doors?”
“There is another significant element of the Bill. I have spoken about it in the Chamber on a couple of occasions. There is always a slight danger that we, as legislators, see legislation as being the end of a process and think that we can pack it away, put it on the shelf and forget about the problem because it has been solved.”
“I welcome the passage of the Bill's Final Stage and commend all the campaigners who have pressed so hard for it and the Bill sponsor. For Pat Catney, hearing some of the tributes must be like hearing eulogies at your funeral, without having to go through the indignity of dying, which is always a double advantage.”
“As highlighted by a number of Members, the impact of period poverty, though not confined to it, has been particularly acute in young women's education. We know that the impact can lead to the missing of education and constraints within education, and that it does so in a disproportionate way.”
“I support the Bill's Final Stage, and I commend the Bill's sponsor for introducing it. I thank the Minister and the Department for the positive attitude that they have taken towards it.”
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“There has been a wide range of rationalisation in the movement and the Education Authority. In terms of the pressures that are there, the uptake of the voluntary exit scheme has been considerable; indeed, the bid that has been put in for voluntary exit in the Department of Education is greater than that in any other Department. So there has been a reduction of staff in the Department and in the Education Authority, and that is an ongoing issue. However, given where we are with school budgets, that in and of itself will not match all of the gap. That is why we need to be responsible when it comes to levels of pay. I will try to drive out any additional cost that is in the system, but that cannot simply happen overnight.”
“However, if fantasy figures are produced for what should happen on pay, there has to be a realisation that that can only be paid for out of the budget for schools, which itself can only be paid out of the budget for education and the block grant. Such pay increases are not realistic. Instead of people grandstanding on issues sometimes, we need to ensure that we deal with things realistically.”
“No, I do not agree. Indications are given about cuts to pay: pay is actually rising. For example, in the last two years, pay has risen by 2·61%. There is no inexhaustible supply of money, and that is the same throughout the public sector, where there are big pressures. The overall education budget is down this year. Given the pressures on the Executive, we are not in a position to give the 15% pay rises that people are talking about. At one stage, one of the unions talked about how they needed 13% to be brought up to parity. Those are just not realistic figures. Quite frankly, all of us have to live in the real world. There have to be discussions about how we can best move forward.”
“If we put additional costs into the system — the vast bulk of expenditure in schools is pay, particularly teacher pay — unfortunately we will simply force more people out of the profession. We will increase redundancy levels. That is something that we need to bear in mind as well, and it is why people need to think again and act realistically.”
“There are obviously concerns out there. To be fair, despite any industrial action, children have achieved. We have seen good results in Education and Training Inspectorate inspections and in exams. The aim of this should always be to ensure that we put pupils first. The biggest concern that has been raised with me consistently, time and time again both before I came into office and since I came into office, is the state of school budgets. I have to be very wary that, as been highlighted on a number of occasions, there are schools that will move into greater deficit problems. I have to say that the solution to that, if schools are to live within budget, will be greater levels of redundancy.”
“When comparisons are made, they have to be made within the full context. It should also be indicated that the pay rises are not simply to basic pay; there is also 1% for 2016-17 on every teaching allowance, whether it is a management allowance or additional activities that the teacher does for which they are paid. That is also being increased.”
“In effect, it is not just a cut to Education but a cut across the board. <BR /> <BR />Other public-sector workers were mentioned. I indicated that the changes mean that, for 2016-17, everyone will get a direct pay increase and an increment, and everyone earning below £37,500 for 2015-16 will see a pay rise. Mention was made of the rate given to nurses. It should be remembered that automatic progression in teaching to the top point of the upper pay scale takes a teacher up to £37,900. For a nurse in a similar position, the maximum rate is £28,000, which is for longer hours. Indeed, a teacher's hourly rate is about 50% higher than that of a nurse when both are at the highest point of the upper pay scale.”
“The Member raises a number of points. There will be a mixed bag as a result of some of the changes. Income tax thresholds, for instance, have moved upwards, which means that a reduced level of tax will be paid on that side of things. With National Insurance contributions, there is additional pressure on the Executive. We always look at the headline figure on where we are with the block grant, but, because of changes made nationally to National Insurance contributions by employers, an extra £22 million burden has been placed directly on schools. Some £40 million has been placed on Education, but that is not unique to Education. I am sure that one of the Members opposite will look at the fact that a massive burden has also been placed on the health service because of those changes.”
“I agree with the Member that, if we can reduce unnecessary administrative burdens as much as possible and, indeed, remove them, we should embrace that.”
“We have much greater job security than in England, for example, and that is where a like-with-like comparison is not being made. There is better tenure and job security in Northern Ireland. In that sense, there are better terms and conditions in Northern Ireland than in other parts of the United Kingdom. <BR /> <BR />The Member makes a valid point about the pressures with paperwork. That is why, as part of the preconsultation exercise that I embarked on a couple of weeks ago, I wrote to every school, asking not simply where there should be greater autonomy but where burdens are being put on schools by the Department, the Education Authority or anybody else that are unnecessary and that duplicate work.”
“Let me make it clear: I want negotiations and discussions, particularly on how we deal with the rest of this mandate from 2017 onwards, but no additional money is available in-year. The Executive do not have the money, and, if it were to be injected into the system, given where school budgets are, it would simply lead to additional redundancies. If faced with the choice between additional pay and additional redundancies, I want to keep people in jobs and to put pupils first by ensuring that teachers are kept employed.”
“It should be noticeable that, for example, in Scotland, the pay rates are below those in Northern Ireland, and where annual increments are concerned, every teacher earning below £37,500 will receive a pay rise for 2015-16, but annual automatic increments were abolished in England a number of years ago. So, if we are looking to compare, we have to compare like with like. Even the more modest claim of a while ago of a 3% pay rise in-year would be three times what people get in England. If there has to be parity on the 1%, it has to be across the board. <BR /> <BR />There is no doubt that all of us would like more pay for a range of public-sector workers, but we are in tight financial circumstances.”
“With respect, you have not. This may be a little bit about grandstanding rather than having real interest in the subject. <BR /> <BR />On the 1%, let us be clear: across the last two years ongoing negotiations took place, and a realistic approach was not taken. The initial position taken on the trade union pay claim, including the 1·13% increase in increments, was for an annual increase of 8·23%. That was sought by trade unions. There was then an increase, including an increment, of 3%, with no indication of a removal of that increment. <BR /> <BR />The Member and others refer consistently to the 1%, and, in particular, parity with England, Scotland and Wales has been raised.”
“I am glad to see the urgency from the Member, given that I do not think he has been in contact with the Department to seek a meeting with me on the subject.”
“<BR /> <BR />The management side of the TNC issued a letter to boards of governors and school principals on 17 November 2016 that included guidance for helping schools to manage in the face of escalated industrial action. I understand that today, management side urged the Northern Ireland Teachers' Council to suspend its industrial action and engage with management side in urgent negotiations to resolve the matters that have resulted in industrial action, with a particular focus on 2017 and beyond. I think we need to see not simply settlements of disputes that have been ongoing for a number of years but whether we can reach a realistic position as we move forward from 2017-18 and for the rest of this mandate.”
“Industrial action by teachers has been ongoing since 2011. Very specifically, the last ballot by NASUWT was in 2011 voting for industrial action, and it has continued ever since. <BR /> <BR />The most recent escalation is linked to the recommendation by the management side of the Teachers' Negotiating Committee (TNC) regarding teachers' pay for 2015 and 2016. The total pay deal across those two years is 2·61%. The Teachers' Negotiating Committee is the recognised negotiating machinery for teachers' terms and conditions, represented on the trade union side by the Northern Ireland Teachers' Council (NITC), which encompasses the five main teacher unions, and, on management side, by the main managing authorities, particularly the Education Authority and the Council for Catholic Maintained Schools (CCMS).”
“It gives a statistical basis and, indeed, a professional judgement basis for deciding what actions need to happen next. That is why it is a very important document.”
“Obviously, this is a key part of the PFG targets as well. It is important that, if we are looking at what actions are taken on underachievement, they are seen against a baseline of data that shows where some of the problems are. That is where the scoping exercise comes in. The other advantage is that the inspectorate, albeit against toughening conditions from a budget point of view, can give snapshots not simply of where we are today but of where we were in 2014 and 2012 etc. I have to say that, while there are challenges, there are encouraging messages as well. For instance, we have seen a driving-up of standards, particularly with improved exam results amongst those on free school meals. That is to be welcomed. We need to embrace the gains and see where there are further gaps.”
“At times, schools will be a little frustrated at the level of its independence. It is important that we acknowledge that schools are delivering against a very tight financial background, and some have been very successful. Some are improving, and some are remaining the same, despite the fact that their budgets are tighter.”
“The Chief Inspector will hold schools to a very high standard of account. A mixed picture emerged from the report, which talked about there being much to celebrate in our system. Primary schools have remained on a steady but fairly high level, and we have seen improvement in post-primary schools. However, the report also challenges us, saying that not everything that we have is fit for purpose. In part, that is because we need to ensure that educational resources are focused very directly on that. <BR /> <BR />The report highlights the need to ensure that opportunities for early intervention to make wider changes need to be taken. It is a useful document in the way that it drills down into that. While the inspectorate receives its budget directly through the Department of Education, it is an independent organisation.”
“On the basis of not repeating myself, I refer the Member to the answer that I gave some moments ago.”
“We need to have a sensible conversation, so I appeal, as the management side of the teacher negotiating committee, to the unions not to implement strike action that would be detrimental to pupils — indeed, in many ways, it would also be detrimental to their members — but to have that wider discussion on how we can take things forward from 2017. Let us try to put the past behind us and look to the future.”
“I am worried that Chris Lyttle might kill me if I answered this in detail, given that he has been given a question for urgent oral answer at 3.30 pm. The date referred to is, I think, 30 November. I will go into greater detail when the question for urgent oral answer is asked, but correspondence has gone out from the Education Authority to all schools in connection with this. <BR /> <BR />I appeal to the unions to suspend any industrial action and try to have discussions about it. I will not pretend that there is additional money in the budget, but the wider context of where we move to from 2017 onwards needs to be examined. We cannot have industrial disputes almost ad nauseam. The NASUWT, for instance, has been taking constant industrial action for the past five years. Its action on different things has been ongoing since 2011.”
“I understand that Helping Hands is currently registered with the EA's Youth Service and is, therefore, receiving resource funding. Additionally, a call has been made for the voluntary youth capital scheme to fund groups that are registered with the Education Authority, and Helping Hands is eligible to apply for that. There is a direct source in that, but there is no specific open call beyond that. I congratulate Helping Hands on its work so far and wish it every success for the future.”
“It covers a wide range, and can be between the ages of four and 25, which is very much within the remit of Helping Hands.”
“I very much enjoyed my trip there. There is tremendous potential in addition to what is already happening in Ballybeen. There is potential for the future there, and I know there is ongoing work. <BR /> <BR />I suppose there are two aspects to this. The direct-funding organisation in each case would be the Education Authority because it would have overall responsibility for special needs. There is specific education funding for special needs through the Education Authority budget. There is also £33 million of resource funding for youth services because this can also come under youth services. <BR /> <BR />Under article 37 of the Education and Libraries Order, the Education Authority has direct responsibility for the provision of those services, and, indeed, youth services.”
“<BR /> <BR />I think that there is training for other groups in east Belfast that support children with autism, including voluntary organisations, health professionals and youth centres. They also provide consultation and advice and work collaboratively, particularly with the Middletown Centre, which has a level of expertise. <BR /> <BR />In addition to the autism support that I outlined, there are other provisions and services in the Education Authority, including the early years inclusion team and educational psychology and behavioural support.”
“<BR /> <BR />I think that parent training is provided at various times and locations to accommodate, where possible, parental preferences. The training is advertised through the child's school setting, which includes the preschool setting. It is also advertised through email and local health trusts. <BR /> <BR />School training programmes in east Belfast include autism awareness, appropriate and effective classroom and school interventions and adjustments, inclusion for children and young people with autism, social skills, sensory processing difficulties in the school environment, enhancing communication skills in the school setting, and topical issues such as girls with autism. It is provided in the school setting or at an off-school site.”
“Direct funding for support services goes from the Department to the Education Authority, and it ensures that there is a range of educational provision to support children with autism, their families and schools in east Belfast. <BR /> <BR />The Education Authority's autism advisory and intervention service provides support to pupils in schools through training and advice to teachers, and individual interventions with pupils. It also provides support to parents and families. <BR /> <BR />Specifically in east Belfast, there are parent training and workshops available. They include autism awareness, appropriate and effective home interventions, autism and relationships, social and study skills, transition to post-primary school, sensory processing difficulties, and personal independence skills.”
“That would be the intention. There are ongoing discussions with the Department for Communities to be able to offer places on the scheme to youth and community groups. That would provide an opportunity for young people in the youth and community sector. <BR /> <BR />While our focus in education is quite often purely on schools, there is a remit, particularly at the youth level, that goes well beyond that. It is important that young people in youth and community groups can also benefit from the scheme, ensuring that as many of them as possible from here will have the opportunity to visit the World War I battle sites and remember the sacrifice of those who died there — who died, in effect, to ensure that the freedom and democracy was put in place that we are able to observe today.”
“This will ensure that the sacrifices of all who served in the war are remembered, and people from across the political spectrum and community were involved in that war. These are also their families, because a poignant visit will often be in order to recall or, perhaps, visit the graveside of, a relative who made the supreme sacrifice. It will enable the sacrifices of those who served in the First World War to continue to be honoured and remembered. <BR /> <BR />My officials are working with officials in the Department for Communities on the finer details. It is my intention that we will be able to launch the scheme before Christmas.”
“I thank the Member for his question. I have been working alongside the Minister for Communities to bring forward a scheme to allow schoolchildren and teachers from here to visit the World War I battlefields. That has been available to schools in England, but, although a few schools have done it, there has not been the same level of availability in Northern Ireland. I am glad that that will mean that schoolchildren from Northern Ireland will have the same opportunities as those in England and Scotland to visit the World War I battlefields. <BR /> <BR />The scheme will be open to every post-primary school in Northern Ireland that wishes to avail of it; it is not compulsory, but at least it is being allowed. It will allow for two children and a teacher from each post-primary school to visit the World War I battlefields.”
“There are wider Executive discussions on funding. Let us be honest: there is a difficult financial regime, so we have to ensure that we get the best possible value for our money. There will be serious engagement with the Department for the Economy and with the Minister for the Economy. <BR /> <BR />A number of steps have been taken, particularly on the skills barometer and the careers advisory side, as part of a good model of joint working between the Department of Education and the Department for the Economy. There is always the accusation that Departments operate in a degree of silo mentality, and the Department for the Economy and the Department of Education, through actions such as that, show that there can be a level of cooperation to tackle those problems.”
“<BR /> <BR />There is a wider job of work, as indicated, with the curriculum for the Department of Education and the Department for the Economy, working alongside those who have a degree of expertise at post-primary and tertiary levels.”
“Some of those issues are directly relevant to the economy, but they underline the need to ensure that there is a review of the curriculum. We have considerable success, particularly on IT issues. For instance, when we looked at the scope of exams that were available from exam boards at GSCE level, one of the direct concerns raised by Queen's University was what would be on offer if we excluded the exam boards from outside Northern Ireland. The exam in IT and computer science offered by CCEA was not as skills-based, which is why I took action to ensure that the examinations system was opened up again. That was done to try to ensure that we have the most appropriate choice to build on that skills base.”
“If Brexit is to blame, perhaps you can blame some of your colleagues as well.”
“Sometimes the Member will see bright skies but be looking for dark clouds on the horizon.”
“I will get you the lottery numbers for Saturday, Danny, and then you can retire.”
“So, good actions are being taken. The importance of early years is critical.”
“The Member was in Lisburn with me on Friday at a launch of an initiative for the Lisburn area on early intervention that looks particularly at communication skills. It is building on Talk Boost. I think that the scheme goes across four areas.”
“A range of research and evidence highlights the importance of early years to the cognitive, emotional and physical growth of children. It is vital that children starting school have been and continue to be prepared, supported and encouraged to learn to take full advantage. There is no universal indicator of overall early childhood development. Work on that has been ongoing with the Department of Health through work stream 1 of the early intervention transformation programme, which is a Northern Ireland Executive and Atlantic Philanthropies programme. As part of that work stream, a named health visitor is now aligned with every preschool education setting. <BR /> <BR />I suspect that the Member may have difficulty getting to ask a supplementary question. There are good initiatives on the ground.”
“As I said, the value of programmes was a little over €500,000. There are other things that have been mentioned in the House in which there can be ongoing cooperation between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland, irrespective of the EU and Brexit, such as the Middletown centre. Those are things that, from the point of view of linkages in the Department of Education, are not dependent on membership of the EU and will be utterly unaffected by Brexit.”
“I travelled through the Member's constituency briefly on Thursday en route to a school in Strabane and when heading back. It was a very wet day. To be fair, nobody at that stage blamed Brexit, but that may yet happen. <BR /> <BR />The Member asked about the overall impact of Brexit. As I indicated, this is probably where my Department's levels of responsibility compared with other bodies are relevant. The Department of Education covers up to 18 — up to 19 for those with special needs — so more of the direct impact will hit, for good or ill, the Department for the Economy, for instance. There is minimal cost impact. As indicated, provision has been made in Peace IV funding, and the direct impact on schools and on, for example, the ERASMUS+ project that has been put in place is relatively minimal.”
“In the overall picture, we need the Executive to be cognisant of the need to ensure that the difficulties and benefits of Brexit are examined, and we need to harness the maximum potential while trying to protect as much as is possible those who are directly impacted on by it. That is a wider Executive responsibility, however, rather than specifically a Department of Education one.”
“I tell the honourable Member that that boat is already sailing, because the UK as a whole has voted to leave. There is work for the overall Executive to do. I will not compartmentalise that. I mentioned ERASMUS+: there is around €5 million from that. Off the top of my head, around €500,000 is going directly to schools. I am also conscious that Ministers should not sail off in their own direction with individual studies, and I am not sure that, if we were to spend a reasonable amount of money doing a study on something that, from an educational point of view, amounts to a relatively small amount of money, it would be good value for money.”
“Maybe that has happened — obviously, the Deputy Speaker is more prescient in these things than I am — but it has also been raised in bilaterals between me and the Education and Skills Minister in the Republic of Ireland. On the education side of things, the direct impact in Northern Ireland will be fairly minimal.”
“Directly speaking, this issue is part of the wider picture that the Executive are raising. We have received a level of assurance on Peace IV funding. Look at ERASMUS+, for example: the vast bulk of ERASMUS+ falls under the Department for the Economy, and the schools element of it is relatively small. It is an issue that was discussed on Friday at the North/South Ministerial Council. I do not want to spoil anybody's appetite for the full briefing on that. There will be a statement on that at a later stage, so I will not go further than that. However, I have spoken directly to my opposite number at the Department of Education and Skills.”
“More broadly, existing UK students studying in the EU and those looking to start in the next academic year will continue to be subject to the current arrangements.”
“<BR /> <BR />In relation to the other aspect of European funding that is directly relevant to Northern Ireland — the ERASMUS+ programme — the UK National Agency will continue to manage and deliver the programme across the UK, and all participants and beneficiaries should continue with their ERASMUS+ funded activities and preparations for the published application deadlines in 2017. The UK Minister of State for universities, Jo Johnson MP, has stated that the EU referendum result does not affect students studying in the EU, beneficiaries of ERASMUS+ or those considering application in 2017 and that the UK’s future access to the ERASMUS+ programme will be determined as part of the wider discussions that the UK Government will be having with the EU.”
“Some €35·3 million is made available for shared education through Peace IV, covering Northern Ireland and the border region of the Republic of Ireland. That comprises €30 million through the European regional development fund (ERDF) plus €5·3 million from both sides of the border in government matched funding. <BR /> <BR />Although not yet opened to schools and other educational settings, funding post Brexit for Peace IV is included in the guarantee by Treasury for structural and investment fund programmes signed before the UK leaves the EU. I anticipate that processing applications from programme delivery bodies will be completed by the end of this year, with agreements signed and implementation commencing in 2017. Programme funding will be provided until December 2020 to be spent by 2023.”