Matthew O'Toole
South Belfast · Social Democratic and Labour Party · Northern Ireland
“I appreciate my colleague's giving way. Unfortunately, I was not here for all of the Minister's remarks — like her, I have been in the Chamber for a lot of today, so I had to pop out and attend to some other business. I presume that the Member will agree that these provisions could be more properly included in the Sentencing Bill.”
“Clearly, however, the regulatory and enforcement regime for all those watercourses and marine environments is way out of date ecologically and, indeed, economically.”
“We learned about the antics of Jeffrey Donaldson that were not criminal — so far — only after his conviction. Reporters have been able to go and find that information and people have been able to speak — felt able to speak — because Mr Donaldson has been sent to prison, convicted of appalling crimes, and is therefore less likely to seek r…”
“We are pleased, in broad terms, to support it at Second Stage. We welcome the move towards an approach to fisheries management that is ecosystem-based rather than narrowly species-based.”
“We were robust in opposing those who were not willing to deal with the nutrients action plan, for example, which should have been a core part of dealing with Lough Neagh. Of course, the farming industry needed to be engaged, and the Minister has been doing a lot of that work recently.”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. In just a few hours' time, the House will go into recess for more than two months. There are two outstanding and grave matters that the public in Northern Ireland want us to deal with, but we are walking away, so I want your advice on Standing Orders.”
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“One of the points that some small retailers make about Sunday trading, whether or not this is borne out, is that, rather than supporting the high street, it would simply benefit big retailers. What practical progress are you making on schemes to support small businesses on the high street, such as the Living over the Shop (LOTS) scheme, given that we know that one of the things that can help to revitalise town centres is more people living in town centres, because they can avail themselves of local retail and hospitality? What practical action are you taking, and what money are you assigning to that end?”
“I have been talking about it for five or six years, so I am pleased that it will pass its Final Stage.”
“I tried to do that via the Bill, but we did not get the amendment on the Marshalled List. I will not complain about that, lest I be accused of questioning the decision of the Chair and slapped on the wrist. <BR /> <BR />In total, despite modest lost opportunities to improve the Bill, I welcome that, after this, the Bill will become an Act. I thank the officials for their work on it. Our job now is to keep working with the Fiscal Council. I encourage all Members to engage with its strong work. The Finance Committee will continue to engage with the Fiscal Council to ensure that all the promises that were made about its governance are kept following implementation. Although we wanted to improve the Fiscal Council Bill, we are pleased that it will pass its Final Stage.”
“I deeply regret that parties — not the Alliance Party or the Ulster Unionist Party but the two big parties — voted against those amendments. As a gentle rebuke to the Minister's statement that it was political interference to try to amend the Bill in the first place, I will say that we are legislators. We come here to scrutinise, and I make no apology for that. We are debating dozens upon dozens of amendments to the Justice Bill. That is not political interference in the Justice Bill but legislators passing primary legislation. That is our job, so I make no apology for that. <BR /> <BR />We tried to get an amendment accepted asking the Fiscal Council to provide the same kind of independent costing of Opposition policies. The Minister is keen that the Opposition provide fully costed policies.”
“We have a better grasp of all those things, however, even if we do not necessarily want to, because there is now an independent fiscal council that is able to provide clear analysis, evidence and numbers. <BR /> <BR />I had hoped that the Opposition's amendments on providing additional economic analysis to clarify the impact of certain policies, be they on employment, productivity or whatever, would be supported, but they were not. I had hoped that our amendments to give the public certainty that the Fiscal Council would look at the Programme for Government as a priority and at the Budget that was delivered would be agreed, but they were not. An amendment on the cost of division or the cost of duplicating public services was also rejected.”
“The numbers may not have been wrong, but some of them were clearly stacked and written up in a way that was designed to provide a jaundiced and slightly deceptive view of public finances here. One might wonder why the exercise was agreed to in the first place. It was the product of a devolved fiscal settlement that requires constant, dysfunctional bartering back and forward between London and Stormont and of an Executive who cannot sing from the same hymn sheet and agree a Budget. We now face the risk of a 5% cut on last year's Budget this year, because the Executive do not appear willing or able to pass a Budget in time for the summer recess.”
“The public are seeing at this moment that there is a real crisis in how we do Budget-making here. That crisis is not simply the product of poor decision-making, bad politics and a dysfunctional Executive, although that it is a large part of it; it is also the product of a cynical and dysfunctional attitude from London. That attitude reinforces and contributes to the Executive's dysfunctional and chaotic approach. Having an independent fiscal watchdog gives the public clarity about the choices that are being made and not being made. It also provides some degree of clarity when it comes to the claims and counterclaims that are made about, for example, Northern Ireland's funding position. <BR /> <BR />We had something called an "open-book exercise", the report of which was published recently.”
“Putting it on a statutory footing and ensuring that it will continue to exist is therefore really important. <BR /> <BR />I welcome the fact that the Minister, after prodding from the Committee, introduced the legislation. In fact, I think that it was his predecessor who introduced it, and he is completing its legislative stages. I am not trying to take credit away from you, Minister. I am just not sure whether it was you or Caoimhe Archibald who introduced the Bill, as I do not have that information at my fingertips. You both did well to get the Bill through. There you go: I have said something nice. The legislation is welcome. <BR /> <BR />I will make a few points about amendments that were not made, because they would have improved the Bill.”
“<BR /> <BR />I will now make a few remarks with my other hat on. The legislation that we are passing today is important. It is legislation that the Finance Committee, in its current iteration and in previous iterations, has been talking about for an awfully long time. A commitment to setting up a Fiscal Council was made in 'New Decade, New Approach'. The council was established around 2021 and has become a vital part of the policy and scrutiny debate in Northern Ireland. The Fiscal Council has proven that it can improve scrutiny. As someone who has participated in probably every debate on Budgets since becoming a Member, I can say that its work has provided an additional source of scrutiny and clarity for Members, the media and the public at large.”
“Ultimately, the Committee as a whole concluded that the Bill, alongside the clarifications and amendments to the explanatory and financial memorandum, provided an appropriate framework for the Fiscal Council to carry out its role effectively and independently. It is important to put it on the record that those changes to the EFM came as a result of engagement by the Committee. <BR /> <BR />The Committee completed its detailed scrutiny of the legislation ahead of schedule — I think that I am right in saying that — and is content that the Bill provides a strong basis for improved fiscal transparency, strengthened accountability and better-informed debate on Northern Ireland's public finances. I again thank everyone who contributed to the scrutiny process and acknowledge the constructive engagement shown throughout.”
“The Committee secured important assurances and clarifications, including commitments that reports, accounts, data statements and relevant notifications would be shared directly with the Committee for Finance and laid before the Assembly where appropriate. <BR /> <BR />The Committee gave careful consideration to whether amendments should be made to the Bill. I will talk about that in my remarks in a party capacity. Members were mindful that changes to governance arrangements in this context could have wider implications across other arm's-length bodies (ALBs) and therefore approached potential amendments with caution.”
“<BR /> <BR />A recurring theme throughout the scrutiny was ensuring that the Fiscal Council remained operationally independent. The Committee welcomed the explicit protections in the Bill that provide that the council is not subject to the direction or control of Ministers and must operate transparently, objectively and impartially. <BR /> <BR />The Committee will continue to engage. It will regularly take evidence from the Fiscal Council, including, hopefully, in the not-too-distant future. We will be able to ask the Fiscal Council for its view on whether provisions and promises in the Bill, including interpretations in the explanatory and financial memorandum (EFM), some of which were altered after engagement with the Committee, were and are being upheld.”
“<BR /> <BR />Throughout the scrutiny, the Committee's focus was not on whether there should be independent fiscal oversight — there was broad support for that principle — but on ensuring that the framework established by the Bill achieved the correct balance between independence, accountability, transparency and practical operation. Members considered carefully the council's statutory functions and the arrangements governing how it will assess Executive Budgets and examine the sustainability of Northern Ireland's public finances. The Committee examined closely the provisions relating to governance and independence. Members explored issues regarding appointments, access to information, reporting arrangements, accountability mechanisms and funding structures.”
“It sought written evidence from key stakeholders, carried out an online public survey, commissioned research and took extensive oral evidence from economists and academics and a wide range of organisations including the Scottish Fiscal Commission, the Irish Fiscal Advisory Council, the OECD, the NI Audit Office and the Fiscal Council itself, as well as from relevant departmental officials. I record the Committee's sincere thanks to all who contributed to our scrutiny. Their input enabled the Committee to scrutinise the Bill thoroughly, including from a comparative perspective, and with reference to principles of transparency, integrity, accountability and effective governance. I thank the departmental Bill team for constructive input throughout the process.”
“I am pleased to speak in the debate on the Final Stage of the Fiscal Council Bill, which we paid significant attention to in the Committee; indeed, it is something that I and other Members have been talking about for several years. <BR /> <BR />The Bill is not extensive in size, but it is significant in what it seeks to achieve. By placing the Northern Ireland Fiscal Council on a statutory footing, it completes an important commitment born out of the New Decade, New Approach (NDNA) agreement and provides a clear legislative framework for the council's functions, independence and governance. <BR /> <BR />The Committee undertook detailed and extensive scrutiny of the Bill.”
“Frankly, it is not a defensible position that the First Minister and deputy First Minister have not come here to give a statement. The Communities Minister is facing questions, but he has not come to make a statement proactively, and the leader of the Opposition has been prevented from making a follow-up statement, so I ask the Speaker's Office to look at those rights and privileges, given the seriousness of the situation.”
“On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. I had been hoping to get back in to make a Member's statement, in part because I had requested an urgent oral statement. I am not challenging the Chair's decision, but I am asking for the Speaker's Office to look at guidance after the request for a statement from the First Minister and deputy First Minister was turned down. <BR /> <BR />I have real concerns about the lack of accountability over the response to the riots. I wanted to address some of that in a Member's statement, but, despite my role as leader of the Opposition under Standing Orders, I was prevented from getting in with a Member's statement. I ask the Speaker's Office to look at the privileges offered to the official Opposition at moments like this.”
“What happened in Belfast and our region last week was a disgrace.”
“We should be talking about all of that today. The First Minister and deputy First Minister should be here.”
“We should be hearing how those people will be housed, because they are still homeless. Despite the myths, they are people on skilled-worker visas, so they cannot, in many cases, go to the Housing Executive. I want to know how we will deradicalise these communities and protect them over the summer. There is a range of things that I want to hear, but I only have three minutes.”
“We talk about people who save lives, who work in care homes and who educate our children as if they are abstract. We talk about legitimate concerns and say that communities have legitimate concerns. I have legitimate concerns when I have to drive children in the back of my car to a safe place because someone has tried to burn their house down. That is my legitimate concern. I have legitimate concerns when our entire society is shut down because of AI-generated graphics, when small businesses have to shut, when workers have to lose wages and when schools have to close. Those are my legitimate concerns. <BR /> <BR />I also have a legitimate concern about the fact that we come here to debate the issue but do not have Ministers here to make a statement about it. The First Minister and deputy First Minister should be here.”
“We brought blankets, made them tea and toast and tried to reassure them until we could establish the location of the council's safe place and how it was going to be stood up. There was no bus transportation, so we drove them slowly, in convoy, across Belfast. A nine-year-old boy was in the back of my car. I was trying to talk to him, with his parents. I was trying to imagine how it would feel for my nearly nine-year-old boy to be got up out of his bed at night by people who were trying to burn his house down. I drove past his primary school, and he asked his mum whether he could go to school the next day. He said that he loved school and had been awarded "Pupil of the Week". <BR /> <BR />We talk in the abstract about people who live in our society.”
“I want to talk about legitimate concerns over what happened on the streets of this city and in this region last week. <BR /> <BR />On Tuesday night, I was phoned by my colleague Councillor Dónal Lyons, who was with a number of families who had been put out of an apartment building on Sandy Row. They were standing in the rain. He asked me if I knew any keyholders nearby. I said that the only one I knew was me, so I opened my constituency office. There were about 30 people, including young families, amongst whom was a one-year-old baby who did not have nappies. I had to go home and get my child's nappies to give to that family. They sheltered in my constituency office. They were there for hours.”
“Once again, I extend my and my party's sympathy and solidarity to Stephen Ogilvie, who suffered that appalling attack last week, and his loved ones. That appalling attack was responded to by a number of people in a truly appalling way. Some people have talked about "real people"; other people have talked about "legitimate concerns". That phrase has been used again and again. To be clear, people can have legitimate concerns about any number of policies, and they are entitled to talk about immigration. Even if I do not agree with their views, they are entitled to raise those questions. People are entitled to a political opinion with which I disagree, and they are entitled to ask questions about how the perpetrator of the initial attack, for example, was in this place. I want to talk about legitimate concerns.”
“They want the absolute best for their community, and a residents' parking scheme would be a huge bonus for them, albeit they want a scheme that works for them and for the inner south Belfast communities. I hope that the Minister will look again at the way in which the scheme operates.”
“It works hard and is doing huge amounts of work to bring its community together through various community projects, including planting in alleyways.”
“A high number of people who live there have short-term lets, or they are students or people who are relatively transitory. That means that it is almost impossible, if not impossible, to get a majority of people in some of those streets in that part of Belfast to respond. That is creating a challenge. It would be a huge regret for the Executive and the Minister if the areas, streets and neighbourhoods in inner Belfast that are most crying out for residents' parking schemes were unable to benefit from the scheme, in part because of the way in which the scheme is set up. Surely, that is not a desirable situation. I ask the Minister to look at the issue again. The applications for the scheme run until the end of July. <BR /> <BR />There is active representation from groups such as the Stranmillis Neighbourhood Association.”
“<BR /> <BR />I say this for the benefit of the people who walk around them: those are the areas for which the schemes are most essential, because they experience high numbers of people who want to use the local amenities, but, because of their proximity to the city centre, people often park there for commuting purposes. The residents have to deal with that extra burden and challenge, because, in those places, off-street parking is rare — in fact, it is almost non-existent in some areas. The people who live in those areas really want a residents' parking scheme. <BR /> <BR />The Rugby Road scheme has happened in the same part of the inner south of the city, but the system is almost designed to discriminate against residents.”
“We welcomed the principle of extending it to other parts of Northern Ireland, when Minister Kimmins announced it, but, at that time, I made the point that the levels of response required — an overall majority of occupants in a street in support of an application for a residents' parking zone — would specifically discriminate against many of the parts of my constituency that are most in need of residents' parking schemes and which, frankly, are crying out for them. I am thinking in particular of areas such as Stranmillis, the Holylands and parts of the lower Lisburn Road where people want residents' parking schemes.”
“I rise to raise an issue that is very important in South Belfast, particularly in the inner part of South Belfast. It relates to the residents' parking scheme, which is open to applications at the minute. It opened at the end of April and will run until the end of July. <BR /> <BR />A successful pilot scheme has been operating for a number of years at Rugby Road. That has been extended by the Minister.”
“It is also important, at a time of real anxiety about the safety of all communities in Northern Ireland, that we choose our words carefully. We cannot ignore the fact that there are dark actors who will want and are already trying to take advantage of the situation to create more tension and more fear. <BR /> <BR />Let me say that no ethnicity or race has a monopoly on violence. The scenes that we witnessed last night were utterly horrific, but we need to bring calm to our community and act and speak responsibly. Those of us in positions of leadership should reflect on our role. Today, we should seek to bring unity and a calm response to the public who are watching.”
“<BR /> <BR />The attack was so unspeakably depraved that it has shocked people. It is important to acknowledge that shock is a natural and understandable reaction to such images, but it is important for those of us in political leadership, which is an immense privilege for those of us in the Chamber who lead, to choose our words carefully and to reflect on our role as leaders and the impact that our words can have. <BR /> <BR />The person responsible for this should feel the full weight of the law. There should be nothing that prevents them from feeling the consequences and prevents public safety from being prioritised. I thank the police and the other emergency services for their response last night. It is important that the police are allowed to do their job without intervention or unhelpful public commentary.”
“The events that took place in North Belfast last night — the act that was carried out — were horrific and depraved. I have, unfortunately, seen the video that was widely shared, as, I am sure, many in the Chamber have. I hope that no one else sees the video, and I urge people not to watch it or share it, not just because it is depraved and shocking but because we do not want people to have to see that, and we do not want to compromise the dignity of the victim any further while, as we hope, they recover in hospital. My thoughts and those of my party and virtually everyone in the Chamber are with the victim who is recovering in hospital, with those who witnessed the horrific attack and with the brave soul who intervened to rescue the man and potentially prevent loss of life.”
“The original question was about the Saintfield Road in the constituency of Lagan Valley. Well, a mile or two east of that is the Saintfield Road in Carryduff, which is in my constituency and has been a hotspot for collisions. The community in Carryduff wants urgent action. An elderly woman died on the Saintfield Road earlier this year. That community is crying out for attention from your Department to traffic calming and road safety, particularly pedestrian safety measures. I ask you and your Department to take a hard look at what actions you are taking, particularly in Carryduff and that stretch down the Saintfield Road, because it is not safe enough for pedestrians in that community, and something needs to be done. I ask the Minister to look at that and to task her officials with prioritising road safety in Carryduff.”
“— the racist abuse and the spreading of toxic waste on the public road?”
“— so, I repeat, deputy First Minister, are you not ashamed of those images —”
“I repeat, deputy First Minister: people saw what they saw with their own eyes. They did not see that MP de-escalating a situation. They saw a Member of Parliament from your party right in the middle of a scrum of masked men. I repeat: masked men, shouting racist and sectarian abuse. They did not see de-escalation. Deputy First Minister, you talk about a positive image for our future, and that is one that I wish to share in, but those images looked like they were from a Paisleyite past. That could have been Burntollet Bridge. It is shocking and unacceptable that you, in that role, cannot accept the gravity of those images —”
“Crisis? What crisis? We are two and half months into the financial year and no Budget has been set. We all agree — the Opposition included — that we want a maximum settlement from London. You talked about not having a £1 billion gap, but will you confirm that if you and your colleagues cannot or will not set a Budget, you will have to cut more than £1 billion on last year's Budget? Is that the legal position? If you do not set a Budget, you will have to cut services and wages and plunge this place into crisis. Is that the reality of the crisis that the Executive are creating?”
“— and step back from this grotesque rhetoric.”
“As we discovered last year in Ballymena, when people of colour or people who are not from this part of the world are burnt out of their homes, when pogroms are launched against them, when they are told that they do not belong here or are not allowed here, the comment that we often hear from people who take no responsibility for those actions and then, of course, condemn acts of violence is that we should listen to the legitimate concerns that are being expressed. When someone has invested legally in a business in a disused building, there is no legitimate concern that justifies torching that building. I will say to people in the Chamber and outside it who have positions of responsibility to think about where we are going and the society that we want our communities and our families to live in —”
“It is a risk to the constituency that I share with Paula Bradshaw, who just spoke, which is probably the most diverse on the island of Ireland, but it is a risk to all of us who want a society for our children and grandchildren and the people whom we represent based on respect, tolerance and equality. Instead, we are being dragged back into something much, much darker. <BR /> <BR />I want to challenge the idea put forward by some that there are legitimate concerns.”
“Those decent people, the vast majority of whom will be utterly disgusted by the events over the weekend, have been dragged into the mire by a small number of people who are consumed by hatred and violence. As my colleague Mark Durkan said, we know that the end point of hatred in this society is nothing good, so we should be standing against it. However, it is depressing to see the double-talk and the talking out of both sides of the mouth from some in the Chamber and from some in our society more generally about this, as there was last year. <BR /> <BR />The rise of racism and far right nonsense online is an extraordinary risk.”
“The working-class people of that community have been burnt out of the opportunity of additional investment and jobs in their area.”
“I thank the Member for West Belfast for tabling the Matter of the Day. We are having the debate with a depressing sense of resonance and symmetry, because the riots in Ballymena last summer, which scarred and shamed this society, began on 9 June 2025, which will be one year ago tomorrow. One year on, what has happened to mark that anniversary? A gentleman from an Indian background who brought his family here decades ago to contribute to this society and wanted to invest, create jobs and opportunity in a working-class part of Belfast has been burnt out of that opportunity.”
“Are we genuinely, seriously saying that, until the chaotic, shambolic and utterly leaderless Starmer Government return your calls, the public of the North will have to put up with a 5% cut?”
“Minister, I will always challenge the British Government, but I also challenge you, because that is my job and that of the Opposition. If, as we heard today, small business rate relief money cannot be spent; if, as the deputy First Minister said recently, support for integration, community relations and race relations cannot be disbursed; and if, as the Communities Minister said, money cannot be disbursed to support people in housing need who are suffering domestic violence, it is my job to challenge you and your colleagues on the absence of a Budget and the consequences for the people here. <BR /> <BR />London is in complete chaos, as your colleagues have outlined, and there is no functioning British Government.”
“Minister, can I just double-check a point of fact? You have just confirmed that if the Executive do not or will not agree a Budget — we all want the UK Government to engage with you; they are in chaos at the minute, so whether they are focusing or not is anyone's guess — there will be an automatic 5% cut imposed by the Executive on public services. Is that a fact?”
“I declare an interest: my child is at an integrated school. It happens to be an integrated school from which the Executive, taking the lead from you, took rebuilding money at the beginning of the mandate, in 2024, so I will take no lessons about standing up for integrated education. Minister, you just said that neither unmet demand nor, apparently, oversubscription are indicators of demand. Even when parents vote for transformation, as in the case of schools in Bangor, that is not a satisfactory indicator of demand. What do parents have to do to convince you and others in your party that there is demand out there for integrated education?”
“But it is not. Members talked earlier about vermin control and pest management. The Member is repeatedly conflating any form of pest management and control of wildlife with the Bill, which specifically outlaws hunting with dogs. Is that not true?”
“I, too, have family members who are keen pigeon racers and pigeon fanciers, and it is important to them. What the Member is talking about would not be —.”