Matthew O'Toole
South Belfast · Social Democratic and Labour Party · Northern Ireland
“I appreciate my colleague's giving way. Unfortunately, I was not here for all of the Minister's remarks — like her, I have been in the Chamber for a lot of today, so I had to pop out and attend to some other business. I presume that the Member will agree that these provisions could be more properly included in the Sentencing Bill.”
“Clearly, however, the regulatory and enforcement regime for all those watercourses and marine environments is way out of date ecologically and, indeed, economically.”
“We learned about the antics of Jeffrey Donaldson that were not criminal — so far — only after his conviction. Reporters have been able to go and find that information and people have been able to speak — felt able to speak — because Mr Donaldson has been sent to prison, convicted of appalling crimes, and is therefore less likely to seek r…”
“We are pleased, in broad terms, to support it at Second Stage. We welcome the move towards an approach to fisheries management that is ecosystem-based rather than narrowly species-based.”
“We were robust in opposing those who were not willing to deal with the nutrients action plan, for example, which should have been a core part of dealing with Lough Neagh. Of course, the farming industry needed to be engaged, and the Minister has been doing a lot of that work recently.”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. In just a few hours' time, the House will go into recess for more than two months. There are two outstanding and grave matters that the public in Northern Ireland want us to deal with, but we are walking away, so I want your advice on Standing Orders.”
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“Minister, you said that you did not have enough to cover the shortfall this year. You also said that difficult decisions would have to be made. One decision that you have flirted with and talked about is reviewing how our rates system works and taking a broader look at how we might raise revenue and use new fiscal levers. Nine months on from restoration and a month or more from the publication of a Budget sustainability plan, we have not heard any detail from you. When will you finally bring us detailed plans?”
“<BR /> <BR />I offer my condolences again to not only her family, who will be feeling the loss most acutely, but her friends and colleagues in the Alliance Party, who rightly treasured her contribution so much. We offer them our sincere condolences.”
“She represented extraordinary qualities in overcoming division. <BR /> <BR />It is often said by people who get frustrated by this place — sometimes by people who leave this place and wonder whether they should come back — that Northern Ireland never changes. In many ways, Anna Lo was the rebuke to that view. Anna Lo represented positive change. She was not just an emblem or symbol of that change; she helped to deliver it by working for her constituents, including but not limited to those from ethnic minority backgrounds, for all of South Belfast and, indeed, for all of Northern Ireland when she was Chair of the Environment Committee. The extent and depth of her achievement are evidenced by the warmth and sincerity of the praise that we have heard for her today. We are all the poorer for her loss.”
“Of course, Anna Lo represented that in a very obvious way in that she was not only the first and, so far, frustratingly, the only ethnic minority MLA to serve in the Assembly but as others, including Naomi Long, her party leader, have said, the first legislator from a Chinese background in all of western Europe. What an extraordinary achievement. If that were the sum total of Anna's achievement, that would in itself be remarkable, but it was not. She was a fierce advocate, a talented legislator, an extraordinary communicator and campaigner and a diligent constituency worker. People from all backgrounds in that wonderfully diverse constituency of South Belfast that we serve feel real affection and, as the deputy First Minister said, love for Anna Lo, because she was an extraordinary representative and an extraordinary human being.”
“I join everyone else who has paid sincere and fulsome tribute to Anna Lo on her passing. I extend the condolences of the SDLP and me to her family, including her partner, Robert, her two sons and her grandchildren, and to her colleagues in the Alliance Party, who will be feeling her loss most acutely, having stood with and worked with her so closely over the years. <BR /> <BR />When you become a representative for South Belfast, as I am proud to be — as are you, Mr Speaker, and others in the Chamber — one of the things that you are most proud of and feel most passionate about representing is the diversity of South Belfast.”
“I very much appreciate the Minister's giving way. I want to ask about the broader question of reform, including removing the veto and stopping this institution collapsing. Earlier this year, the First Minister and the former Finance Minister, Conor Murphy — the Minister's colleague — said that they were up for a conversation about reform, but they thought that it should happen in the Assembly and Executive Review Committee (AERC). That Committee has met once, briefly, and it did not discuss any detail. Would the Minister be open to that reform agenda going into the Programme for Government?”
“but I want to ask something specific since we are having a debate about achieving things. The Member's party put out a response to the Programme for Government yesterday. Why did none of that response, which was made public, call for specific, measurable reform proposals to be in the Programme for Government? I am not aware that there are any.”
“— of this place. I commend the motion. Thank you very much.”
“— meaningless motion after meaningless motion; our job is —”
“The two big parties united to kill that proposal, but of more concern is the fact that the third party in the Executive, which has talked consistently about reform, has clearly failed to put it on the agenda in the Executive, because it is not mentioned once in the Programme for Government. All of this is about clarity, honesty and accountability to the people who send us here. Before the election, the Alliance Party told the people who sent it here with a handsome complement of MLAs that it was going to prioritise reform. So far as I can see, not a jot or tittle about reform has been placed on the agenda at the Executive. We need to get serious in this place. Our job is not simply to come here and talk through —”
“Thank you, Madam Principal Deputy Speaker. I intend to speak clearly to our motion. It sometimes makes people uncomfortable when we talk about those things. Transparency and accountability matter, but Assembly reform also matters. That is why the Coghlin report was clear; it stated that the Assembly should consider the steps that are needed to strengthen its scrutiny role. One thing that would strengthen our scrutiny role is preventing parties from being able to collapse these institutions at the drop of a hat. <BR /> <BR />After we came back, on our first Opposition day, we prioritised Assembly reform.”
“It is the place of the head of the Civil Service and the most senior civil servants to defend Civil Service impartiality; to ensure that there is proper accountability; and to ensure that standards in this place and in our institutions, including pre-election guidance, are adhered to. If the speech that I am giving is uncomfortable for Members or senior civil servants, that, I am afraid, is not my problem. It is our job to do accountability and scrutiny properly. Since we returned, we have not done that properly. The Opposition intend to continue to do our job. <BR /> <BR />We have also seen, since we returned, a failure to deliver on reform.”
“We also saw a monitoring round being published in the days before a general election. In Scotland, it was made very clear that a financial statement — a statement that was of much less import than the monitoring round here, which was reported by the BBC as being a mini Budget — could not be published because pre-election guidance prevented anything that would compete for news with election candidates. In this place, it was rushed out. In the Great Hall, there was a press conference, at which the Finance Minister, the First Minister and the deputy First Minister presented what amounted to a mini Budget three days before the UK general election. <BR /> <BR />When I asked the head of the Civil Service about that just a couple of weeks ago at the Finance Committee, she told me that it was not her place to "critique" the actions of Ministers.”
“Whatever your persuasion and whatever party to which you belong, we have to be honest about the seriousness of that precedent. That was deeply discomfiting for me, not just as leader of the Opposition but as a citizen of this place, coming after the RHI debacle. We need to be honest about that.”
“In the past few weeks, we have seen more damning examples of the failure of this place to do accountability properly, including in a Committee, where the First Minister came to give evidence and members were prevented from asking questions. Those were questions that the First Minister had said that she had come to answer, on the basis of transparency, but then refused to answer, citing legal advice. No legal advice prevents any Member from asking a question. Unless there are live court proceedings and a clear legal imperative not to, legal advice would not prevent a Minister from giving an answer. A chilling precedent was set at that Committee. It was particularly chilling to see a First Minister appear to warn a Committee Chair that MLAs should be restrained from asking questions.”
“Therefore, it is incumbent on us all to do what we can to prove to the public who sent us here that we mean what we say when we say — people do say — that we are committed to a new approach and to improving accountability and transparency here. We need to redouble our efforts to respond properly — I hope that the Minister, in her remarks, will do so — to what the NIAO said in last month's report, and to re-establish, as our motion calls for, the Executive subcommittee on reform. However, that will not be enough. <BR /> <BR />I want to talk more broadly about the broad picture of accountability and scrutiny in this place. It is not just about the narrow questions of delivering against the Audit Office's findings.”
“Before others pull me up on it, there was an SDLP Minister in that Executive, so there is a degree of collective responsibility, but I hope that colleagues from other parties will be as fulsome and mature as the Opposition have been in taking responsibility for their parties' role in improving how we do things. Those are stark findings. <BR /> <BR />The report provides a fairly damning assessment of the Executive's seriousness about continuing the work of delivering good governance and delivering on the recommendations of the RHI inquiry report. That bleak picture has been painted. The RHI scheme has become synonymous with poor governance, poor financial management, mismanagement and lack of accountability and transparency here at Stormont.”
“Nearly half of the key recommendations of the Coghlin report have not been fully implemented. Of those, there are five recommendations where the NIAO finds that the planned actions that the Department of Finance and the Civil Service have undertaken to complete will not meet the conclusions and recommendations of Sir Patrick Coghlin. <BR /> <BR />Perhaps more startling is that the Executive subcommittee that was established to implement those reforms and, indeed, deal with the broader questions of Stormont reform and Civil Service reform has not met in four years. Four years. That says a lot about the commitment of the Executive that was created in 2020.”
“I intend to touch on not only the NIAO report but broader questions of accountability, reform and good governance. Five years into the new decade that we were promised in 2020, and nine months into the term of the restored Executive, it is remarkably better that we have a functioning Executive and Assembly, but, clearly, that, by itself, is not sufficient to deliver good governance. We need to be robust and honest about where we have, and have not, made progress. <BR /> <BR />I will start with the findings of the NIAO report. It is clear that most of the recommendations of the Coghlin report from the RHI inquiry, which cost millions of pounds of public money and consumed huge amounts of energy, have either been implemented or are being implemented. However, underneath that headline finding, we see a more concerning picture.”
“Now that we are halfway through that decade and have just had an update report from the Audit Office on delivery against those inquiry targets, it is an apposite moment for the Assembly to reflect on progress that has or, as might be the case, has not been made against those targets and recommendations and also to reflect on how well we have been doing on the connected challenges of accountability and reform.”
“Just a couple of months after I became an MLA and just as the COVID pandemic was breaking out, upstairs in Parliament Buildings, Sir Patrick Coghlin, a retired judge, presented his findings in a very long document, 'The Report of the Independent Public Inquiry into the Non-domestic Renewable Heat Incentive (RHI) Scheme'. He found that there had been multiple failures at official and political levels. <BR /> <BR />At that time, the institutions had just been re-established. We were told that we would have a new decade and a new approach. We are now halfway through that decade. The new approach that we were promised was a systems change in government performance, a more fit-for-purpose and professional Civil Service and an overhaul of accountability and transparency at Stormont.”
“Thank you, Madam Principal Deputy Speaker. I welcome the opportunity to speak on the Audit Office's update report on the implementation of recommendations from the RHI inquiry and on the broader subject of improved accountability and, indeed, reform of Stormont and its institutions. <BR /> <BR />When I became an MLA in early 2020, the institutions had been collapsed for three years. In large part, although not exclusively, that was a consequence of the RHI debacle, in which large amounts of public money were put at risk; severe failures in governance, transparency, accountability and Civil Service performance were exposed; and public trust in our institutions was disastrously compromised.”
“for months on end. Are you going to do likewise in Northern Ireland?”
“I acknowledge that bad decisions are made in London — it is important that I say that — but that cannot be all that we talk about in the Chamber. We have to talk about the power that you have to improve the lives of workers, families and businesses in the North. Let us be clear that you have the power to review the rating system. Last week, the Treasury announced that it will review how business rates work in England in order to put more tax on big warehouse businesses such as Amazon and to lower business rates on small retail and hospitality businesses in the high street.”
“Minister, your answer to Mr Brett threw up more questions. You said that the decisions have not been taken, but, if projects and bids are being taken off the table by the board — by the way, the board includes the permanent secretary of the Northern Ireland Office, which is pretty dubious when it comes to devolution — that is, by definition, making a decision. Can you be clear on when the proposals will be brought to the Executive? When will we have a final indication of what will be funded by the transformation fund? We are hearing lots of contradictory things.”
“I acknowledge this moment today and express hope for the world that we have the kind of outcome from the election that will be better than a return to the dark years of the Trump Administration and all that that meant. It would be hugely damaging for the United States and for those of us on this side of the Atlantic and around the world who believe in positive, multilateral engagement as the route to human progress on this planet, whether that is on climate change or conflict resolution. <BR /> <BR />In the context of a very difficult and awful year, particularly for human beings in Gaza, I want to say that the outcome of the election still matters —”
“We may not have returned last term to do our job had there not been positive, active engagement by the Biden Administration. In acknowledging and lamenting some of what has happened more recently, I also acknowledge the enormously important, positive and transformational role that an active US Administration can play and have played here in Northern Ireland and on the island of Ireland. <BR /> <BR />To that end, I want to say what many people think, which is that the outcome of the election matters, because, if we return to a US President who is committed to disengagement from the world, indulges in the worst kind of nativist politics and, frankly does not care what happens beyond the end of his nose, let alone what happens on the island of Ireland or elsewhere, it will be a dark moment for the rest of the world.”
“That has happened — it has to be said — with the tacit engagement of a US Administration that have at least attempted, or appear to have attempted at times, to try to restrain that but which has not been successful. That has been very difficult for those of us who believe that the US can play a positive role in the world. <BR /> <BR />Notwithstanding the judgement that we have had to make about the US's facilitation of what has happened in Gaza, it is important to say that the outcome of today's election is still extraordinarily important. When they operate at their best, any US Administration can play a hugely positive role in the world, including on the island of Ireland. These institutions and our agreement would not exist as they currently exist without a positive, active role by the United States and successive Administrations.”
“I will briefly touch on the subject that much of the world is focused on: the outcome of the US presidential election. In many ways, this segment of our day — Members' Statements — is for people to talk, as Nuala McAllister just did, about important local constituency issues. However, I want to reflect on something that is of global significance. For those of us who think that the US, when led properly and in the right context, can provide positive leadership, the past year or more has been extraordinarily difficult, because we have seen what has amounted to genocide in Gaza. We have seen unconscionable and almost indescribable cruelty and loss of human life.”
“Minister, you spoke earlier about the contribution that Ulster people made to the United States. Let me indulge in a good Ulster quality, namely straight talking, and encourage you to do the same, Minister. Are you saying that you will not budge from the £62 million that was agreed more than a decade ago? If that is your position, I am afraid that that is a real problem. You were in Washington DC talking about investment in sports. In Belfast — in this city — Gaels and everybody else who wants to see Casement Park developed deserve clarity from you. Are you or are you not going to invest in Casement Park beyond the £62 million?”
“Will he establish the diversity of language that was spoken by those Ulster-Scots migrants? Perhaps, in future meetings with stakeholders about Irish language schools, he could suggest to them that they reflect on that.”
“Minister, I am all in favour of your developing that agenda. It is really important. We should all be proud of the contribution that people from an Ulster-Scots background made to the United States. However, it would probably have been better to do that when we were not debating homelessness in the Chamber. <BR /> <BR />You talked about the importance of one tradition, as it were, in Northern Ireland, but, of course, many of those Ulster-Scots migrants spoke Irish. They also spoke lowland Scots and English. We are not necessarily all one thing in this place. I suggest that, when he was in Washington having conversations —”
“Minister, there is a disconnect here between the seriousness of what is happening at Belfast lough and the fact that you have said that it could or will be the next Lough Neagh with regard to ecological breakdown and the urgency or lack of urgency from the Executive. Lots of people are concerned that the Lough Neagh action plan is more of an inaction plan. I acknowledge that this is about waste water investment. What are you specifically doing, working with the Minister for Infrastructure and others, to make sure that it is dealt with expeditiously and is not simply about monitoring long-term plans and waffle, with the greatest of respect?”
“Will you commit to spending some or all of that £140 million on rates support for small businesses, particularly those in hospitality? That is a decision that you can make here.”
“Minister, we have all seen the impact of austerity from London and of chaos and collapse at Stormont, but now we have the opportunity to turn the page on both. This is not an austerity Budget and cannot be described as such. People want to hear about the decisions that you and your Executive colleagues are making, rather than hearing you simply rail against decisions made in London. To that end, will you confirm that, as seen in the annex, the roughly £140 million that appears to have been allocated to the Department for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities (DLUHC) and has been Barnetted here is a calculation of the business rates support that is going to businesses in England to support small businesses on the high street, particularly those in hospitality, which, as you say, have been hit by some of the other tax changes?”
“Minister, it is clear that there has been a significant loss of confidence among the legal profession in what you say is a process of consultation. How many meetings have you had about reforming access to justice, and why is the Assembly only being told of this on the morning of industrial action occurring?”
“On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker, I wonder whether any guidance exists for you or the other Deputy Speakers on ensuring that there is a plurality of questions, including from the official Opposition. Twice during Question Time, I was denied the opportunity to ask a supplementary question when time existed to answer it. I simply want to ask whether there is guidance on ensuring that the official Opposition, who are designated as such, have the opportunity to ask supplementary questions when they seek to ask them.”
“Clearly, there are big projects that need to happen. I will touch on two projects that are happening — the maintenance at the Sydenham bypass and Belfast Grand Central Station — and on all the disruption associated with them. I support both those things happening — I am clearly a huge supporter of Grand Central — but there is a risk of the entire city grinding to a halt. What are you doing, Minister, to ensure that the best possible information gets to people who use public transport? I tried to get on a bus the other day, near my constituency office in Botanic Avenue. The display at the bus stop said that no buses were running, but a bus showed up 10 minutes later. We need to get proper information to commuters who are in the city or coming into the city. What are you doing to minimise disruption?”
“First Minister, the fact that this and other victims-, survivors- and abuse-related issues sit in the Executive Office underlines the importance of your credibility in relation to safeguarding and related matters. Further to Connie Egan's question, can I be absolutely clear on the point that you will appear before the Executive Office Committee this Wednesday?”
“Why are you doing something that contravenes what the independent review recommended for simplifying our education system rather than creating more complexity and more bureaucracy?”
“Minister, there is lots in the independent review, lots in your response and, indeed, lots to support. I particularly single out the move to raise the leaving age to 18. That is an important step forward, and I commend you on it. <BR /> <BR />However, one thing that is not in the independent review at all is something that you have signalled an intention to do: to create a separate authority for controlled schools. You also said that the Education Authority had failed controlled schools. The independent review did not find that. Indeed, it said that the system should be simplified, and it wanted a specific directorate within the EA, rather than a new one to bring new complexity.”
“— and see what can be done to either repeal or amend it.”
“We must understand how serious it is. The law makes it illegal for media organisations to report that a murder victim has also been raped. I would like the Justice Minister to address that legislation urgently —”
“A court rightly ruled that that was not just a violation of press freedom but was wholly counter-productive. Section 8 of that Act includes a provision for post-death anonymity for victims, which, in many ways, is understandable. Lifetime anonymity for victims of rape is, of course, something that we all support, but there is a concern that has been brought to me by members of the media in Northern Ireland that we face a serious situation: in a case where a woman has been raped and murdered, the media is now, legally, not able to report the fact that she was raped. <BR /> <BR />It is a grim subject to have to discuss, but it is important. A high proportion of women who are murdered by men are also raped by them. As we deal with issues surrounding sexual violence and violence against women, we must understand the full scope of it.”
“What is happening and has happened to women is almost beyond comprehension and words. It shames us all. It calls on us to do everything that we can, as legislators but also as human beings, to stand for both a serious criminal justice response and a more fulsome policy response that tackles the root causes of misogyny. <BR /> <BR />I raise specifically a connected issue that touches on the work of the Justice Minister and the Justice Department. It is one that, I hope, the Executive and the Minister will take forward. The Justice (Sexual Offences and Trafficking Victims) Act (Northern Ireland) 2022, which was passed in the previous mandate, included a provision, which has now been in part disapplied after a court ruling, relating to anonymity of suspects after their death.”
“I want to raise, as Emma Sheerin did, the epidemic of violence against women and femicide in this society. On the front of the 'Belfast Telegraph' today, we see listed the 42 women who have lost their lives in recent years. They did not just lose their lives; they had their lives violently and brutally taken from them. It is extremely important that the cancer of violence against women and femicide is dealt with. That will require a multi-level approach, led by the Executive. I welcome the fact that the First Minister and deputy First Minister and the Executive writ large have set that as a priority, and I say that sincerely. It is extremely important. <BR /> <BR />In my constituency in recent weeks, we have seen murders, including that of Mary Ward, who was taken violently.”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. To be absolutely clear, is his intention to publish the river basin management plan subject to Executive agreement, or is he able to publish it without Executive agreement?”
“— going to change everything. We acknowledge that the Minister cannot solve the problems overnight, but the first step is to publish the plan and meet our legal obligations. I think that the Minister wants to do that, but he will respect the fact that we have a job of scrutiny to do by holding him to account for delivering on it. The Executive need to get serious about the environmental catastrophe that is unfolding in our region and do something about it.”
“Much of it can be traced back to the implementation of the Going for Growth strategy, which multiple parties, and the serving First Minister, had a role in delivering. <BR /> <BR />The absence of a robust river basin management plan therefore threatens water quality in our rivers, lakes and coastal waters. Any further delay is unacceptable. As I said, a plan is critical for the delivery of any improvement in Lough Neagh and a whole range of assorted issues. The Lough Neagh action plan, such as it is, was hailed as the solution to the issues facing the lough, but it displays many of the same fundamental weaknesses of which the Office for Environmental Protection has already been critical. <BR /> <BR />We acknowledge that this stuff is not easy and that the motion is not —”
“I welcome the fact that it is doing just that today, and that it has done that over the past few days. It was scathing about the Department's attempt at developing an effective management plan. It criticised the plan's weak and generic objectives, the lack of clear and specific plans to achieve the targets that it set, and the lack of clarity on funding for any meaningful delivery of the river basin management plan. In summary, the body tasked with holding the Government to account here in relation to their environmental duties casts strong doubt on whether the river basin management plan will meet any of its targets. It raises concerns that DAERA could be in breach of the water framework directive regulations. That is a damning indictment of the Executive's environmental performance. It goes back a long time.”