Matthew O'Toole
South Belfast · Social Democratic and Labour Party · Northern Ireland
“I appreciate my colleague's giving way. Unfortunately, I was not here for all of the Minister's remarks — like her, I have been in the Chamber for a lot of today, so I had to pop out and attend to some other business. I presume that the Member will agree that these provisions could be more properly included in the Sentencing Bill.”
“Clearly, however, the regulatory and enforcement regime for all those watercourses and marine environments is way out of date ecologically and, indeed, economically.”
“We learned about the antics of Jeffrey Donaldson that were not criminal — so far — only after his conviction. Reporters have been able to go and find that information and people have been able to speak — felt able to speak — because Mr Donaldson has been sent to prison, convicted of appalling crimes, and is therefore less likely to seek r…”
“We are pleased, in broad terms, to support it at Second Stage. We welcome the move towards an approach to fisheries management that is ecosystem-based rather than narrowly species-based.”
“We were robust in opposing those who were not willing to deal with the nutrients action plan, for example, which should have been a core part of dealing with Lough Neagh. Of course, the farming industry needed to be engaged, and the Minister has been doing a lot of that work recently.”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. In just a few hours' time, the House will go into recess for more than two months. There are two outstanding and grave matters that the public in Northern Ireland want us to deal with, but we are walking away, so I want your advice on Standing Orders.”
The complete record
Every one of 5,909 lines we hold for Matthew O'Toole, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 40 of 119.
“Minister, I hope that you can give a specific pledge on the night buses. I appreciate that you are still meeting about the matter, but, further to Mr Brett's point, we would like to see specificity on it. <BR /> <BR />Will the transport strategy include actions from the all-island strategic rail review? It would be illogical to have a transport strategy to 2035 that does not mention the all-island strategic rail review.”
“— that is coming from the DUP and others.”
“— of the generationally nonsensical drivel —”
“People on this island from all backgrounds see the huge potential of greater North/South cooperation. They want it fulfilled. They want it to improve their lives.”
“He talked about Intertrade UK and the East-West Council: I remind him — Sinn Féin Members should be reminded too — that the East-West Council and Intertrade UK are products not of any agreement between all parties and the two Governments but of a dreamt-up, stitched-up bilateral deal between the DUP and the Tory Government to calm their nerves over a Brexit that they created. It was not my party that agreed to their being inserted in the Programme for Government with, as you will see if you read the text, apparent but spurious equality with the North/South Ministerial Council and InterTradeIreland. The parties that are in the Executive can account for that decision, because they agreed to it. <BR /> <BR />The rest of the century will involve enormous challenges and, yes, enormous opportunities.”
“It is 2025, and our Speaker, Edwin Poots, turned 60 today, but we might as well rewind 60 years to Paisley and his friends throwing snowballs at Seán Lemass outside, because that is where we are at with the DUP and its attitude to funding. It is pathetic. <BR /> <BR />It was fascinating to hear Mr Gaston, who, clearly, in effect, leads the DUP in many ways with his mentor, the long-lost former Member for North Antrim, talk about how awful the Loughs Agency is. It is terrible that we have bodies such as the Loughs Agency. I presume that his plan is that we pour concrete and cement into Carlingford lough and Lough Foyle, because it is awful that those bodies of water exist and have to be managed on a cross-border basis.”
“<BR /> <BR />I come on to our friends in the Democratic Unionist Party and their long-running dog in the manger act when it comes to the North/South bodies, which has crystallised in the past month or two because they are scared of the TUV's polling numbers. We have seen, I am afraid, a tragic vision of what unionism has to offer, with Member after Member standing up to say, "We do not want that money from the Irish Government". It is genuinely pathetic. I could give you a detailed policy account of why it is pathetic and the impact that it will have on public service delivery, but, to be honest, it all just feels like we have gone back 60 years.”
“Before that, Conor Murphy was the Finance Minister, and, way before that, before the institutions collapsed, Máirtín Ó Muilleoir was the Finance Minister. Sinn Féin Finance Ministers have had the power to go further and faster on greater fiscal devolution. I acknowledge Conor Murphy's appointment of the Fiscal Commission, and I acknowledge the Minister's saying at the Dispatch Box that he intends to do more in that area. However, part of the answer to the underfunding from London and to the DUP's playing the dog in the manger on the North/South bodies is for the Finance Minister and the Executive to take more power over and show more purpose and vision on North/South funding and fiscal powers here, not for them simply to blame the UK Government, the DUP and Uncle Tom Cobley for everything.”
“We said that they are "nonsensical" — we do not change even that — so it is absurd to say that we are somehow blocking. What we are doing with our amendment, as my colleague Sinéad McLaughlin said, is taking responsibility. We are seeking to create a situation in which Ministers here — that means Sinn Féin, DUP, UUP and Alliance Ministers — take responsibility. That is our job as the Opposition. <BR /> <BR />It is all well and good for the Finance Minister and his colleagues to come and make assertions about blame. In this case, there is a lot of blame to go to the DUP. I have five minutes, I have plenty of blame to ladle on to the DUP, and I will do that in just a moment's time, but Mr O'Dowd is the Finance Minister for the North. Before him, Caoimhe Archibald was the Minister.”
“Before I came back to the Chamber to finish the debate, I spoke with a group of young people — I think that they are in the Gallery now — from Rockwell College in Tipperary. They are very welcome, and it is great to have them here, but it strikes me as embarrassing that, in 2025, a group of young people from a secondary school in Tipperary still have to come and endure debates like this about the basic tenets of North/South cooperation. The quality of some of what we have heard today has been — frankly, it has been drivel. <BR /> <BR />I will touch on a few points. The purpose of our amendment is not, as Ms Ennis incorrectly said, to deflect from the DUP's blocking North/South funding. In fact, the wording of our amendment is exactly the same as that of the Sinn Féin motion when it comes to the DUP's actions on that.”
“I appreciate the Member's giving way. He used the phrase "the primacy of strand one". Will he point me to where that phrase is used in the Northern Ireland Act, the Good Friday Agreement or any associated documents?”
“Why is there a contradiction and a difference between the robust way that your party holds the Government to account in the South and the idea that you simply want people in the North to accept inaction and drift?”
“The reason that I ask, First Minister, is that your party is making robust criticisms, many of which, perhaps, are legitimate, about performance in the South, but when it comes to social housing in the North, the Chartered Institute of Housing has warned today that there could be a £100 million shortfall in social housing investment. There is no plan for investing in waste water. In fact, there is denial from your colleagues that there is even a problem. There are chaotic, contradictory statements on the delivery of North/South infrastructure. You mentioned the lack of fiscal powers here, but your colleague the Finance Minister does not seem to want to take any new fiscal powers.”
“It has been said that the PFG is a critical delivery tool for people's priorities. Why does the Budget, on which we voted last week, commit only 2% of the Executive's entire Budget to PFG priorities?”
“Thank you, Mr Speaker. I did not get a chance to do this earlier, but I add the Opposition's good wishes to you on your birthday. The Opposition, unlike one of the members of the Executive, would not dream of naming the number, but happy birthday to you, in any case.”
“Minister, this very short statement is the only substantive Executive business today, so it would be good to hear some substance. Of the jurisdictions that you met at the British-Irish Council, Northern Ireland is the only one that does not have an independent environmental protection agency. Even the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands can prosecute environmental crime. Did you give your colleagues an update on when the environmental governance panel will report? When will the House see the outworkings of that?”
“They also want their public representatives, whether at Westminster, at Stormont or on any platform that they have, to register opposition to what, many of them feel, will define their generation's response not just to human rights abuses but to ethnic cleansing and genocide. Peaceful protest in Belfast city centre, even if it is a minor inconvenience, should not be criminalised. I respect the fact that people may have different views, although I do not know how people could have a different view on what we are witnessing in Gaza, which is, transparently, a crime against humanity. That is legitimate, peaceful protest. Police officers have a job to do in all these circumstances — I respect that — but let us, please, be proportionate and respect the rights of ordinary people to register dissent and protest.”
“I do not trivialise the fact that, sometimes, in fast-moving situations, there are judgements that have to be made by police officers, but I do not think that anybody, certainly not the dozens upon dozens of my constituents who are, frankly, appalled by what is happening in Gaza and have emailed me in the past few days to ask, "What the hell's going on in our society when peaceful protest is met with the arrest of pensioners?", would see that as a legitimate or proportionate response. <BR /> <BR />I do not want to demonise individual police officers, who have a tricky job to do, but we are in the midst of witnessing a genocide. People in our society want to register peaceful protest.”
“<BR /> <BR />One of the people arrested is a woman named Sue Pentel, who is in her 70s. She also happens to be Jewish. She will be known to people here because she is often here peacefully and respectfully engaging with MLAs and others on the Middle East. Sue was standing peacefully next to an ATM. She put a sticker around that ATM, I believe, and was arrested for her trouble. I understand that the PSNI has a difficult job to do.”
“Today, I want to reflect on an incident that happened in Belfast city centre over the weekend: two peaceful protesters outside Barclays bank on High Street were arrested by the PSNI. It is important to say that there is no more profound right in a democracy than peaceful protest. Over the weekend, dozens more innocent people lost their lives in Gaza as a result of bombardment by the Netanyahu regime. We are witnessing an ongoing genocide in Gaza. People from all over this region, from all backgrounds, of all ages and from all perspectives are, frankly, in complete disbelief at what they see on their screens. They want some way of registering protest and dissent and of challenging what is happening in the Middle East. One means is through peaceful protest.”
“I am sure that we can also engage with people in London and the mobile phone companies to address the issue. We need to see practical steps for how we will address the issue that people in West Belfast in particular are facing. People travel into West Belfast from all over the city, all over the North and further afield. We want people to travel into West Belfast in order to make use of the brilliant hospitality, shopping and infrastructure there and, hopefully, a new Casement Park at some point in the years ahead, so we need to ensure that it has the mobile phone coverage that it deserves. I am glad that this debate was secured, and I look forward to hearing about the practical steps that we, including the Ministers, can take collectively to address the issue.”
“Órlaithí mentioned someone who goes out running and wants to have coverage in order to listen to a podcast or music or to be able to get in touch with someone in an emergency. They pay their mobile phone bill, so they are entitled to the coverage that their contract apparently provides. In West Belfast, they simply do not have that coverage at the minute. There clearly needs to be a policy response, because it is a particular challenge for the community in West Belfast. It affects not just local businesses but people's ability to feel safe, and it could create an issue when it comes to an elderly or vulnerable person or someone who needs to access healthcare. It needs to be addressed sooner rather than later. <BR /> <BR />I and my party will work with anyone, including the Economy Minister, who is here, and the Infrastructure Minister.”
“<BR /> <BR />The tinfoil hat brigade — that is probably the right term for them — has persisted. Wherever those people have got their misinformation, they are fixated by 5G and 4G, and they have burned masts in West Belfast, including on the Glen Road, the Andersonstown Road and elsewhere in the west. Their preoccupation with the issue, which they have taken as far as committing arson, has consequences for elderly and vulnerable people who are concerned, particularly if they fall in the middle of the night or need to get in touch with a relative; healthcare workers who may need to be in touch with their employer or are on call and may need to get to work quickly; and taxi companies. I know that Paul has engaged with Gransha Taxis, whose drivers need to go about their business. People need to live their everyday lives.”
“I have spoken extensively to my Black Mountain colleague, Councillor Paul Doherty, who, as well as being a councillor, runs a food bank and community outreach operation in the area, and it is clear that there is a particular issue in West Belfast. There are connectivity issues in urban and rural areas of the North, but West Belfast has a particularly acute challenge that can be linked to persistent arson attacks — I have a list in front of me of the attacks that have taken place — on mobile masts that damage them and limit coverage capacity. Then we are told that there are challenges with the cost of rebuilding those masts. I think that Cornerstone is the company that builds or supplies that infrastructure on behalf of Virgin Mobile, EE and other such companies.”
“I am glad to be able to speak today about this important subject. I welcome the fact that the Economy Minister is here. I commend the Member for West Belfast for securing the debate, and I hope that we will see some positive and practical steps arising from it. Notwithstanding the fact that telecommunications is a reserved matter, there clearly are steps that the Minister for the Economy and the Minister for Infrastructure can and should take, and I hope that they will do so. <BR /> <BR />Obviously, I do not represent West Belfast, but I represent the constituency next door and I am frequently in the west of the city, so I am aware that mobile phone coverage is an issue there.”
“— there were no serious practical proposals.”
“Despite the jeering from Members opposite —”
“What we heard today was, I am afraid, an indulgence in pocket Powell politics rather than serious solutions”
“He is going to talk about the Rwanda policy and that judgement. That is one area of immigration policy, and that policy has now been changed by the UK Government. He should reflect on this: if the UK Government's immigration choices are so awful, he might ask himself why we are placed in a position of having to debate them in the Chamber while having very little control over them. He has one MP in the Commons: he might draw some conclusions in that regard. He said that the Gaston family came from elsewhere. I presume that that means that they are the 'Beauty and the Beast' Gastons. I will not ask him which section his family arose from. <BR /> <BR />It is important, when we talk about all of these things, that, first of all, we reflect on basic humanity and practicality.”
“I do not have time, I am afraid. I normally give way, but I will not on this occasion. <BR /> <BR />I want to pick up on a couple of other points that were made. Mr Gaston, somewhat absurdly, blamed the protocol. Somehow, the protocol is now responsible for immigration. I would be genuinely fascinated to hear how that happened.”
“I respect what you said, Madam Principal Deputy Speaker, about the ruling of the Chair, but I want to challenge the idea that I said anything about working-class communities or individual constituents not being able to have concerns about immigration and about that being racist. It is not, and I did not say that. I want to be absolutely clear about that. What I said —.”
“Of course I want more money to be spent on other policy priorities, and I am concerned about the amount of money that Mears, for example, receives in profits. Yes, I want to see more support and spending on a lot of those things. Your party is in charge of the Executive. You have the power, first of all, not to collapse the Executive every five minutes, and you have the power to direct the priorities of the Executive in a different way. Those are powers that you have here that, I am afraid, you are choosing not to use. <BR /> <BR />Somewhat absurdly, the argument — and I just want to capture this point.”
“I will not give way, because I have a limited amount of time. I normally give way. As he knows, I am generous in that regard. <BR /> <BR />On multiple occasions, the amount that the UK Government are spending on asylum seekers and illegal migration, as it is called, was cited. It is important to say that that is a decision made by the UK Government. If you want us to have more control over migration policy, frankly, you should advocate an entirely different arrangement for this place, because we do not control immigration policy here. <BR /> <BR />It was also said on multiple occasions that money that was being spent on asylum seeker accommodation could have been spent on any number of other policy priorities.”
“I will address a few of the substantive points, Madam Principal Deputy Speaker.”
“No, no, you are heckling from a sedentary position. I did not say one word — not one word — about ordinary constituents.”
“No, I did not. Go back and check the record. I said that your party is chasing the TUV down a right-wing rabbit hole because it is desperate about polls and is playing to a populist gallery. I did not say anything —.”
“That was not mentioned in the DUP's motion or in its speeches. That party has, in effect, called a Minister who has the most marginal — I spend a lot of my time holding this Minister and others to account — and relatively small responsibility, in statutory terms, for any of the issues that it is talking about. That reveals to me that the entire exercise is about playing populist, right-wing games, as I said, and I regard much of what various DUP Members have said today and the theatrical umbrage that was taken to people robustly calling them out as, frankly, synthetic. <BR /> <BR />Members on the DUP Benches, including Mr Brett and Mr Frew, said repeatedly, as did Mrs Erskine, that we were calling people who expressed concerns about migration "racist": that is a lie. It is an outright lie.”
“Thank you, Madam Principal Deputy Speaker. Today's debate has been robust, which it needed to be. It has not always been cool-headed, and the purpose in tabling the motion in the way that it was tabled was, in fact, almost revealed by something that was said by a speaker from the DUP Benches: it was designed to be provocative and to provoke a reaction, which it has. <BR /> <BR />The reaction has been, frankly, to remind the DUP, first of all, that the Executive have not published a refugee integration strategy. That is what our amendment says clearly. The primary mechanism in policy terms that the Executive have to address issues that there may be around the impact of irregular migration — asylum seekers who are human beings fleeing war and conflict — is the publication of an unpublished refugee integration strategy.”
“their lives. Those two young men, who were born in Africa but made their lives in Ireland, were given a guard of honour by Scoil Mhuire and the community in Buncrana. That is the island on which I want to live. That is the future that I want to build for the rich, diverse communities that live on this island, rather than have the pocket Powell nonsense that we have heard today or the Farage-driven future that the UK Government, other parties across the water and, I am afraid, the DUP and TUV wish to subject us to. That is a different future. By all means, we can discuss issues of public service provision, but that is not what today is about. <BR /> <BR />In opposing the motion, I submit our amendment, which I hope that the Assembly can pass.”
“Keir Starmer said "island of strangers", but I do not live on his island, and I do not want to live on an island of strangers. I want to live on an island that is cognisant of its past, which is a past in which human beings, through economic necessity and conflict, were forced to flee. They were forced to leave and find opportunities and safety elsewhere. I want to live on an island where people are not just tolerant of but deeply connected to the fate of people who come to our shores. <BR /> <BR />We do not live on an island of strangers. We saw that in the past week or two. In Buncrana, Emmanuel Familola, who was 16 and originally from Nigeria, and Matt Sibanda, who was 18 and originally from Zimbabwe, died in tragic circumstances in Lough Swilly. At one of their funerals, Father Bradley said that their passing had a:”
“I will not give way. Your colleague did not give way to me. <BR /> <BR />Mr Buckley is a pocket Powell who is determined to drag us back to divisive identity politics. I am afraid that it says a lot about the state of unionist politics when the best that the DUP can offer to working-class communities, and, indeed, all people in Northern Ireland, who, we are told, are supposed to be sold on the benefits of the UK, is that kind of miserable, divisive, populist, right-wing nonsense. <BR /> <BR />It has to be said, however, that it is not just the DUP. Language has become darker and more concerning in other parts of these islands. Mr Buckley quoted the Prime Minister, Keir Starmer, who talked about "an island of strangers".”
“However, let me be clear: what we see today from the DUP is part of a populist right-wing game to stymie the TUV and promote the careers of young right-wingers in the Democratic Unionist Party. When I was a child, my MP was a man named Enoch Powell. I did not know it at the time, but he was my MP. He was a man who was so right-wing that even the Tories got him out of the Commons. The Ulster Unionist Party imported him — he was a migrant, in a sense — to Northern Ireland to represent South Down. One of the proudest achievements of my party was, via an honest, tolerant public representative named Eddie McGrady, getting Enoch Powell out of the politics of Northern Ireland. In the Chamber, we have our own pocket Powell from Portadown in Mr Buckley.”
“If it were really so keen on improving public services for them, it would not have collapsed political institutions here multiple times, forcing public services into an even worse state than they were already in. If it were serious about the neglect of working-class areas and high streets, it would not have allowed the high street task force to be abandoned or been so blasé about economic improvement in those areas. <BR /> <BR />These are important issues. It is important that working-class people and all communities feel that they can talk about issues, including migration. There should not be any prohibition on that, and I do not think that there is.”
“<BR /> <BR />It is also the case that, as I said, the refugee integration strategy, which was published for consultation in 2021, has been sitting on a shelf, unpublished by the First Minister and deputy First Minister and the Executive Office, for four years. The motion does not mention the refugee integration strategy. Nor does it mention any of the other policies that would help working-class communities, including the ones that I represent and the ones that he and others in the DUP represent but have failed for so long. The DUP is very keen on blaming others for problems that it does not want to solve. If it were really serious about giving opportunity to working-class kids, it would not be so keen on forcing them through the transfer test.”
“First of all, on the cost of asylum seekers, let us be clear: those costs are neither borne by the Executive nor directly related to policy choices here. My party and I are not enthused about the level of profits that Mears earns from its management of asylum seeker contracts. If there are legitimate questions about HMOs, they should be dealt with. Mr Buckley could have dealt with them during his speech, but he barely touched on them. It has been a consistent decision of the Home Office to prevent asylum seekers from working, thereby preventing their moving on to contribute economically to society here.”
“Rather than empower working-class communities with strong public services and economic opportunity, it is easier to tell them that they are struggling because some other community, whether it is local or is made up of people who arrived here from elsewhere, is winning at their expense. It was the same last summer when we saw shameful displays of race hate in this city. The reaction to brazen displays of racism and violence on the streets of Belfast, especially in my constituency, including the area around my constituency office, was to say, "There are legitimate concerns to be addressed". To be clear, no legitimate concern can ever be addressed through wanton violence. <BR /> <BR />I will look at the concerns that are expressed in the motion so that I am not accused of dismissing them.”
“However, in one sense, all that is irrelevant, because the DUP is not interested in practical strategies to integrate refugees and ensure that migrants are given the best possible chance to contribute to this society; it wants to play the same populist games as right-wingers all over Europe. It wants to tell working-class communities that feel disempowered by declining public services and a lack of economic opportunity that they should be angry not at the DUP but at migrants — others — many of whom have arrived here fleeing persecution. <BR /> <BR />Of course, parts of unionism have been playing that game, or versions of that game, since time immemorial.”
“It has the highest density of asylum seeker accommodation in this region, including very high numbers of HMOs literally on the street that my constituency office is on. My team knows and deals with the challenges that are created, including for asylum seekers who are fleeing conflict as they try to access services and ultimately make a life for themselves here. If the DUP motion were serious about that issue, it would not simply focus on one symptom: the density of HMO accommodation — I note that Mr Buckley barely talked about HMO accommodation when proposing the motion — it would suggest practical leadership via the Executive through the publication of a refugee integration strategy. Its Assembly leader — the deputy First Minister — has joint responsibility for that, and the Executive Office has been sitting on it for four years.”
“<BR /> <BR />In approaching these questions, our approach should be focused on two core principles: common humanity and practicality. The DUP motion does not deal with either of those things. It is part of a political strategy to play the same populist right-wing tunes of Farage and Reform in the hope of stymieing the even more right-wing TUV in the polls. Let me counter in advance the accusation that I am not aware of public sentiment on these issues or, as is a common right-wing populist accusation — indeed, one levelled already by Mr Buckley in the debate— that I am somehow out of touch by opposing or amending the DUP motion. My office is in the most diverse part of Northern Ireland — probably the most diverse part of this island.”
“The challenges only get more acute as other challenges compound one another: conflict and war in other parts of the world — most recently in Ukraine, Syria and, of course, Gaza — forcing human beings to flee conflict; an aging population placing greater dependence on healthcare services; labour demand that struggles to be met locally; and, increasingly, climate change making parts of the world less liveable or, as we will probably see in the future, entirely uninhabitable, creating new waves of forced migration. Those are only some of the challenges that are forcing all kinds of movements of people now, and will do in the decades to come. There is simply no way to close ourselves off and wish away those issues, and trying to close ourselves off is not only impractical but immoral.”