David Ford
South Antrim · Alliance Party · Northern Ireland
“All I can say is that I remember officials coming back into the Department and saying, "You wouldn't have been very pleased with what Trevor or Stewart said at the Committee yesterday, Minister".”
“<BR /> <BR />When I listened to the start of the debate, I welcomed the comments that Mr McGuigan made, but, as Alex Attwood said so forcibly, even when he intervened and asked what had changed, there was an inability on the part of the Sinn Féin representative to explain anything other than to say that there is an election in six weeks'…”
“<BR /> <BR />No doubt, what we saw from in/out Ministers not so long ago and the failure of the outgoing First Minister to accept her role when she was Minister in DETI to deal with the issue has further added to that.”
“There is an inability in all that we face at the moment to recognise the public disgust at the behaviour of certain people in this place and, most particularly, in the Executive.”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. In his question to the Minister on that statement, Mr Paul Girvan suggested that some judges spin out cases inappropriately in their own financial interests.”
“Less than the full truth emerged and facts were eventually slowly dragged out from the bunker, sorry, from Stormont Castle. It is a classic example of why people have lost trust in the way that this place operates; it is a classic example of why the ministerial code needs to be enforced at least as rigorously as we enforce procedures agai…”
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“It seems to me that, at the moment, there is little incentive for people to deal with this waste properly because the penalties are almost non-existent for failing to deal with it properly and, indeed, the charges can be so high for doing things properly. <BR /> <BR />I probably should not mention in public the advice that I gave to Mr McMullan when this was discussed at the Committee for Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs a while ago, but the fact is that we all know that illegal burning is going on in huge quantities at particular times of the year, and, unless something is done to stop those tyres going into bonfires, we will see little to improve the environmental or human health aspects.”
“We all know that there are plenty of other uses for waste rubber, whether it is used for safety surfaces in playgrounds, various bits of athletic equipment and even things like carpet underlay, if it is not possible to do the retreading that was referred to earlier. <BR /> <BR />For me, the key question is this: why is the current system not working and how do we ensure that any changes that we make to it are made to work so that we protect the environment and protect human health? We cannot just assume that another set of regulations will automatically make things better when, unfortunately, the current set of regulations does not work.”
“Mr McMullan referred to the £1·50 charge for a car tyre, or the higher charge for commercial tyres, that is paid for recycling purposes. He also highlighted, as Mr McKee has just done, the issue of the cost of having an exemption certificate for people who, for example, wish to put used tyres on a silo cover. We all know that the practical reality is that, in many cases, when people pay the appropriate fee to have their old tyres recycled, they are not recycled but go out through the back door to criminal activity and to paramilitary groups and a variety of other people who burn them illegally. That is a key problem that needs to be covered if we are to make any changes in the legislation. We need to ensure that any disposal is done properly and that matters are regulated all the way through.”
“There is not just the short-term nuisance that all of us experience but potentially major chronic problems, respiratory diseases, skin diseases and even effects on the central nervous system. All of those can arise from the burning of tyres, which is another reason why the issue needs to be addressed very seriously.”
“I congratulate Mr McMullan and his colleagues for bringing the motion to the House today. This is clearly an issue of great significance to us, judging by the number of people who are in the Chamber, which is rather more than we generally get for Back-Bench debates. <BR /> <BR />There is no doubt, as highlighted in the motion, that failure to recycle tyres properly leads to a number of problems, particularly environmental damage but also very significant potential health damage. We have already heard that even proper landfill of tyres can create toxic effluent. There is no doubt that fly-tipping is a major problem where it involves tyres and other materials but, of course, a lot of the tyres that are not properly disposed of do not go to landfill or fly-tipping. They are frequently burnt in urban areas causing major human health issues.”
“I thank the Minister for his response to Mr Swann's question. Having on one occasion rendered first aid at a thankfully not-quite-fatal accident at Woodgreen, I endorse everything he said. There are other junctions further south, particularly at Tannaghmore and Creavery in the Antrim area, that are almost equally bad: is any action being taken on those?”
“I appreciate the Minister giving way. He has just highlighted the success of the 300 air-bus, which serves not just the airport but Templepatrick and Ballymartin, where a considerable number of passengers come from. In that context, when he is talking about the railway line, will he also talk about Ballinderry, Glenavy and Crumlin rather than just the airport?”
“I must say that I am delighted to hear the Minister's support for the NCA, given the circumstances of its introduction here. <BR /> <BR />Given the significant public concern in the community about a range of issues involving NAMA — issues that are not just those for criminal investigation by the various agencies, North and South — given the potential difficulties of establishing an inquiry on a North/South basis and given the lack of confidence that the public would have in any inquiry conducted solely by the Assembly or any of its Committees, will the Minister give a commitment to have a full, independent inquiry in Northern Ireland if it is not possible to have one on a cross-border basis?”
“I appreciate the points that the Member makes. I am just slightly concerned that he does not seem to recognise that there were services on the Knockmore line until they were closed by a former Minister for Regional Development by the name of Gregory Campbell, whom he appears to have described as a criminal whose work is folly.”
“Since my colleague was not a Member of the House at the time, I am sure that she is unaware that a few years ago — before the property crash — a private business was interested in investing in the line, given the development opportunities on it, which could well have provided a cost-effective service. It would undoubtedly have been significantly cheaper than the £100 million guesstimate that is being prepared, particularly in light of what Mr Aiken highlighted about the potential for growth.”
“I appreciate the Member giving way. Has she taken into account the difference between a railway system to serve an airport and a railway to serve the population between Antrim and Lisburn as well as the airport? That makes a fundamental difference to the numbers involved.”
“I thank the Minister for her statement. Whilst she was not able to answer Mr Attwood's question about the composition of the Independent Reporting Commission, I trust that, when she next reports on an IGA meeting, she will be able to tell us about the discussions that she and Frances Fitzgerald have had about the operation of that. <BR /> <BR />Two years ago, some of us remember the very great problem that this society nearly ended up with because of the opt-out engineered by Theresa May and Chris Grayling from European justice and home affairs measures, particularly the danger of very nearly losing the European arrest warrant. What discussions has the Minister had with Frances Fitzgerald on ensuring that we maintain a measure that is at least similar to the European arrest warrant if the UK were to leave the European Union?”
“In her initial answer, the Minister referred to looking at the strategic opportunities for work between her Department and the Department for the Economy to grow opportunities for processing produce. Whilst that is a welcome statement, is it not a bit disappointing that, three years after the fanfare around Going for Growth, so little appears to have happened?”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. At Question Time yesterday, Mr Wells tabled a question relating to the Ballynahinch bypass. Just before Ms Armstrong spoke, you warned her that it was a constituency issue, and she correctly pointed out that it was an issue that affected Strangford at least as much as South Down. On a subsequent question of mine relating to rail services in South Antrim and Lagan Valley, Mr Durkan asked a question that was completely outwith that constituency, and yet the Minister answered it. Will you give some thought to providing guidance, perhaps before we resume in September, to ensure that, when you make rulings like that, they are enforced in a way that stops other Members trumpeting specific constituency issues?”
“<BR /> <BR />There are key issues — massive issues — that need to be addressed, but they simply have not been covered. The challenges are real, and there is no point in people behaving like ostriches. The First Minister and deputy First Minister have an obligation to represent all of Northern Ireland, including the majority of us who voted "Remain". The UK is now a very divided society. It is up to the First Minister and deputy First Minister to supply a coherent negotiating team for the benefit of all of Northern Ireland, and the First Minister must live up to the promise that she has made.”
“The Department of Finance really needs to do detailed work on the impact of a potential reduction in corporation tax, and the Infrastructure Department needs to see what is happening to things like the York Street interchange and the A6. The Department for Communities will have a massive obligation to make up European funding for voluntary and community groups and housing associations. The Department of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs does not know what will happen after the loss of CAP funding. The Department of Health, as Paula Bradshaw said, has issues around medical research, cooperation and the massive numbers of workers in health and social care from across the EU. The Department of Education needs to provide assurances to the young people who, at this stage, are hopeful of going further in the future.”
“<BR /> <BR />The motion highlights a series of questions, and I will briefly put a few of them across the Departments. The Executive Office needs to give us a clear statement on the position of citizens from elsewhere in the EU working in Northern Ireland. The Department of Justice, as I said, needs to talk about issues such as shared intelligence and European arrest warrants. The Economy Department needs to talk about how we will maintain free movement of labour, particularly for those who cross the border regularly. We need to look at whether we will still get access to R&D funding under Horizon 2020 or student exchanges.”
“<BR /> <BR />I have a little recent knowledge of justice issues, and I know that we have major problems now. We will lose the European arrest warrant (EAW) and have no certainty about how we could reinstate something like that. The previous legislation in the Republic has gone and is no longer available to Northern Ireland. That is just a casual thing, because it is all about asserting our sovereignty, but, if we do not get something like the EAW back, some people will be very sore. Where are we on cooperation with Eurojust and Europol, on sharing information about justice and on asset seizures? These are all key matters that were lost by the vote last week and to which the "Leavers" gave no thought and, at this stage, have no answers.”
“It is simply not correct to say that we are in a state of business as usual, because business is adapting a lot more quickly than the politicians who led the "Leave" campaign. <BR /> <BR />Patsy McGlone highlighted a key issue — the peace process. It is an important issue: how peace was established between France and Germany, the expansion to central and eastern Europe a decade ago and the support for our peace process. None of us on our side of the argument talked about World War III, but the "Leavers" suggested that we did and got away with another bit of misinformation. <BR /> <BR />Some have aspirations similar to the vision expounded by Eamonn McCann. Despite the challenge by Naomi Long, he gave us a wonderful socialist vision, but he told us nothing about putting that vision into practice.”
“Steve Aiken talked about the cut in potential foreign direct investment, but, in fact, we have already seen 1,000 financial services jobs moving from London to Paris. If jobs are moving from London to Paris, who is to say that they are not going to move from Belfast to Dublin as well? It is not a cut in potential future investment; it is a loss of past investment. The First Minister has just highlighted a number of companies as successes. How much of a success will it be if those companies relocate to the EU over the next two, three or four years?”
“They will realise that straight away. Our students studying or hoping to study on things like the ERASMUS programme across the EU will also see problems. Mr Beggs highlighted the significant drop in the exchange rate to £1 equalling €1·20.”
“I would prefer to go on the basis of what the governor of the Bank of England says about the future of the UK economy than the pious aspirations that have been expressed by those who wished to leave. <BR /> <BR />We have also had patronising references to "little people" coming from the DUP Benches. On the "Remain" side, we did not talk like that, but that is the way that they have patronised the people. I suspect that, when some of the decent people who believed the stories told by the "Leave" campaign see what it actually means, they might change things. This was not the little people. This was a fight about the future leadership of the Tory Party, with all the problems that that involves. Those who are wishing to draw a pension in the near future will have real difficulties because of economic uncertainty.”
“We were absolutely right in what we said on that, and those who said that we were scaremongering have been proven to be absolutely wrong. <BR /> <BR />We have had a litany of "Keep calm" messages from the DUP Benches today. Frankly, Corporal Jones should have been in the Chamber. The messages were delivered with slightly greater calmness than Corporal Jones would have delivered them, but they were complete nonsense because it is clear that the "Leave" campaign nationally had no plan A if it won and the "Leave" campaign in Northern Ireland had no plan A as to what to do with it. We have had hopes, wishes and aspirations from the DUP Benches. We have had nothing of substance.”
“I think that we have had enough from your side of the House, thank you. <BR /> <BR />Some very specific issues show the inadequacy of what was said there. We have had an admission that the so-called immediate controls on immigration simply could not work if we are seeking to maintain access to the market. Funnily enough, that truth came out from some of the "Leave" campaign only last Friday. Philip Smith highlighted the work done by the governor of the Bank of England to provide stability in the financial markets, but we do not actually have a quarter of a trillion pounds every week to prop up sterling. That is the kind of issue that came up, yet when some of us talked about the dangers to finances and the UK economy, we were accused of scaremongering.”
“Let us be clear that accepting democracy cuts both ways. <BR /> <BR />Sixty per cent of those who contributed to the debate, more or less all of this corner except Mr McCann and Mr Allister, talked about the need for stability and certainty as we go into a very difficult future. It is clear that the only bit of economics that we have seen from some people on the "Leave" campaign is their being very, very economical with the truth. As highlighted by Naomi Long, it is clear that the reference to spending £350 million a week on the NHS was a complete fabrication that they retracted last Friday. We now have the further back-pedalling that it is supposedly an aspiration. It did not look like an aspiration on the posters and the bus.”
“Those are key issues on which we await answers from those who led "Leave" nationally and locally. Mr Eastwood and Mr Murphy talked about some of the benefits: the Peace programme, INTERREG and the European social fund. Those are key issues that need to be addressed but have not been properly covered. <BR /> <BR />We had some lectures from the DUP about democracy and accepting the will of the people expressed in the referendum. I just wish that members of the DUP had accepted the views of a somewhat larger majority of the people of Northern Ireland in the referendum on the Good Friday Agreement or of an appropriate majority in Belfast City Hall on how often the Union flag should fly on that building. Decisions that the DUP took led to mayhem on the streets and costs to this community of millions of pounds.”
“I will give way later. In opening the debate, Mr Nesbitt highlighted a few key points. He talked about the issue of corporation tax; and there is a fundamental issue, on the basis of what has just been said by Mrs Foster about skills and costs, whether we could now afford corporation tax, if we are not to get the benefit of having the wider EU market to companies based here. <BR /> <BR />Mr Nesbitt also talked about issues like funding from the European Union, of which there was very little talk from those in favour of "Leave". He referred to the potential consequences for the Barnett formula, with a potential change of track by the Government. He referred to the common travel area, which is a very significant issue for those of us who live in Northern Ireland, especially those who live close to the border.”
“So it is not half as simple, or simplistic, as has been presented by some speaking in the debate.”
“We are currently facing the biggest crisis in the United Kingdom since at least 1945. It is a political crisis, at least as far as it affects the two largest parties at Westminster; and it is an economic, financial, institutional and constitutional crisis. The decision that was taken last Thursday affects every part of the UK, and yet there are specific issues for Scotland and Northern Ireland that need to be addressed in a separate and distinctive way. <BR /> <BR />The issue highlighted just now by Mr Allister, about repealing European legislation, is one that may well come to this House. Mr Allister and his friends — well, his current friends on the DUP Benches — may find that they will have difficulty in getting a majority to repeal some aspects of European legislation that some of us would support.”
“I also welcome the Minister to his first Question Time, and I thank him for his response. Given that it is now in excess of 20 years since I discussed the reopening of the Knockmore line with a senior Translink engineer, is there any hope for my constituents in Crumlin and Glenavy that they will see something a bit more satisfactory than the 109A bus service, even if it were done on a limited and experimental basis using the existing line?”
“I also welcome the Minister to her first Question Time. In response to Mr Eastwood's supplementary question, she said that, having met the First Minister and deputy First Minister, she was "confident" that we would make progress on this matter in a short time. Given the fact that the First Minister and deputy First Minister failed to place this on the Executive agenda previous to the election and that they failed to allow me, as the then Minister, to make an urgent decision, will she explain on what basis she is confident, please?”
“I thank the Minister for her initial response, which detailed a number of cases. Some of them were cross-border issues around Altnagelvin, Enniskillen or Daisy Hill. Will the Minister highlight examples of specialisms that we have in Northern Ireland that could be offered to people across the entire island?”
“I was delighted that, just last week, Anne and I had the opportunity to have a brief conversation with Trevor and Liz to congratulate him on the award of the CBE, which was a richly deserved recognition of a full career in public service, not just in this place. We trust that he will have a long and very happy retirement in which to enjoy it.”
“I have had the pleasure of knowing Trevor and Liz in a slightly different way — as mutual parents of students at Queen's. One of the things that I find amazing about Trevor is that, whether at that kind of informal occasion, when you are rejoicing in the successes of your children, or during the work that he has done in very difficult times here, he has been relentlessly cheerful, relentlessly positive and always optimistic in looking for the way in which the best good can be done for everyone. That is something that does not sit easily with many public servants, but it is an exemplar that we have seen in Trevor's work here.”
“Those of us who have been here since 1998, as Alex and I have been, will recognise the very significant achievements that have been made by the secretariat in general in the last few years under Trevor's leadership and the excellent work that he has carried out, building on a career of dedicated public service over very many years elsewhere.”
“I have heard it said that Trevor Reaney is not the kind of person who appreciates being made a fuss of. Therefore, I probably should speak briefly and not repeat everything that has already been said, so as not to add to his embarrassment. However, I am delighted that he will be suffering a certain amount of embarrassment at present due to the positive words that have been said from all round the Chamber. In particular, I am very much reminded of the comments that Alex Attwood made about his role in the Policing Board and the crucial role that was performed there before he came to the Assembly. That was at a time when life was not particularly easy, and things were not terribly smooth.”
“We should be insisting on a genuine and meaningful consultation on the way that services will be delivered in the future, on the proper way of ensuring contacts with local communities and on the proper way of ensuring that online registration, as we move towards it, is carried out in a meaningful way. That does not mean that we can continue to pretend that we can provide services without any change whatsoever.”
“It is too easy to assume that we can continue to provide the pattern of services that we have been used to across a range of issues without giving any consideration to the realities of the difficult public finances we live with. Frankly, I am not sure how we are going to face up to the difficult decisions around health that will probably be required when Professor Bengoa reports if we cannot face up to the reality that we cannot simply react with a knee-jerk and protect the complete pattern of electoral services that we have. Yes, we need to ensure we have some proper plans for the future, and we need to ensure that we maintain local engagement, but to suggest that that is done simply by making no change whatsoever is unrealistic.”
“I fear that there is mixed language in the amendment. The functions of the Electoral Office comprise administrative functions and legal duties that it discharges on behalf of the Northern Ireland Office, which has responsibility for running elections in Northern Ireland. I am not sure how you transfer the administrative functions away from the NIO, when the NIO will retain the full legal and legislative functions for ensuring that elections in Northern Ireland are run properly. There is a mix-up in the way the amendment is phrased, which means that it is simply unworkable. <BR /> <BR />We have to be realistic in this Assembly.”
“There is no doubt that, when we switched to individual registration a few years ago, we saw a reduction of numbers on the electoral register. We need to ensure that we work hard to get the numbers as consistently high as they should be, because, sadly, I know from experience that it is much easier to ensure that somebody is removed from the electoral register when the person dies, which, of course, is the right thing to do, than it is to get somebody new who has moved into an area on the register. <BR /> <BR />The call in the motion to retain and fund adequately all regional offices currently under threat is unrealistic. I think of the comment made by Mr Swann, which was that we should not be doing this until we have worked out the long-term future and know more about what the need is, but that is not what the motion states.”
“It might well be that we do not need the network of offices that we currently have, if arrangements were made for partnerships with local councils, or if arrangements were made for registration events to be run in consultation with citizens advice bureaux or other organisations within the community. <BR /> <BR />Just because the existing pattern of offices has worked up to now does not necessarily mean that that is the right way. What concerns me is the fact that we are being presented with a scheme for closures that is being implemented, in some cases, without any consultation and a system that is being put forward without any real consideration of how to maintain the local contacts. They may not need a permanent office, but they do require some sort of local activity and some opportunity for the work to go on.”
“I have certainly cooperated with them to ensure that all schools in South Antrim take the opportunity to see that those who are of rising voting age get the chance to register and are encouraged in that direction. We have seen good work being done by electoral offices, but we also need to be realistic and acknowledge that just because something has worked well does not necessarily mean that the current pattern will continue to work well. <BR /> <BR />I have concerns about the way in which the proposals have been put forward. It is absolutely clear that we have not seen any detailed strategic planning. We have seen an instant response and ad hoc decisions taken to deal with financial problems without proper consultation and without proper consideration of what the best way to provide electoral services might be.”
“There is no doubt, particularly coming just a few weeks after the Assembly election, that there will be considerable support in the Chamber for the work that is done by the staff of local electoral offices. We all have a relationship with our local office and tend to get to know the staff over a period of years, although I do recall an occasion five years ago when I called into the Newtownabbey electoral office and a temporary member of staff looked at me and asked me whether I had a connection with any of the political parties, so it is not perhaps always that clear. I am, however, happy to say that the permanent staff know me, possibly rather too well. <BR /> <BR />In that context, we can also welcome the work that they have done on issues such as registration and election running.”
“I also welcome the Minister to her first Question Time and declare my interest as part-owner of a small herd of cattle and land on which a badger sett stands. What lessons have she and her officials learned from the failure of the cull in England, where, according to Owen Paterson, the badgers moved the goalposts.”
“That would be a real, living tribute to her.”
“<BR /> <BR />Too many public representatives are subject to a tide of vilification for the work that they do, and it seems to be an issue that particularly affects women in public life, who are subjected to torrents of abuse from men who feel that they have some sort of right to spew out hatred. We need to recognise what has happened in this context. <BR /> <BR />Finally, let us remember the words of her husband when he paid tribute and said:”
“That came following a route to Westminster that was not the easy route taken by some, of working for the party and then inheriting a safe seat. She had a substantial career, in which she worked on behalf of some of the world's poorest people in her capacity for Oxfam, where she campaigned on Syria and worked with people in Sudan, and she had a very significant effect on public opinion and on the formation of public policy. I believe that she then showed all that is best in politics. It was her wish and desire to serve her own neighbours: the people of the constituency in which she lived, where she had her roots and where she had been brought up. That perhaps made her more approachable than some MPs, but it may also, tragically, have made her more vulnerable.”
“As you have just said, she was a much-loved daughter, sister, wife, mother and friend, and her death has clearly touched a very wide circle in her constituency and far beyond. The circumstances of the death are well known and do not need to be rehearsed in detail: a Member of Parliament shot and stabbed outside a library where she regularly held a constituency surgery, meeting the needs of her constituents. That is the norm for public representatives in every part of the UK. <BR /> <BR />What has emerged since that tragedy is that Jo Cox was a very exceptional person. Although she had entered Parliament only last year, she had already established a very strong reputation and made a very considerable impression on her fellow MPs through her courage, compassion and commitment.”
“Last Thursday, we were all shattered to hear the news that, in the early afternoon, a Member of Parliament had been attacked and then, in that rather sombre statement from the police, that she had died. It is right this morning that, as MPs prepare for an almost unprecedented sitting at Westminster, those of us in this democratically elected Chamber take time to pay our tribute to Jo Cox, the MP for Batley and Spen. I thank you, Mr Speaker, for the remarks that you have already made about the letter that you have written on behalf of us all to the Speaker of the House of Commons. I am sure that that action will be endorsed by everybody here today. <BR /> <BR />Of course, Jo Cox was much more than an MP.”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am seeking clarification on the ruling of members of the Opposition asking supplementary questions. At the start of Education questions, Mr O'Dowd and Mr Middleton had questions that were grouped. Each of them was able to ask a supplementary before Mrs Dobson was called for the Opposition. However, on the second question, Mr Lyttle and Mrs Long had questions grouped, but Mrs Barton asked a question before Mrs Long. Whatever the case may be about Mr Middleton — I understand he is certainly not a member of the Opposition, formal or informal — it is my understanding that all those who have tabled questions that are taken will be taken before the question of Opposition supplementaries comes up. I would appreciate your guidance on that.”