Gerry Carroll
West Belfast · People Before Profit Alliance · Northern Ireland
“Yesterday morning, as others did, I stood alongside our resident doctors as they commenced a 24-hour period of industrial action. We often praise our healthcare workers in the House and more generally, saying things such as that they are invaluable and that we wish them well.”
“If we have learnt anything from the political events of the past week, it is that powerful people — powerful men, in particular — and institutions should always be held to maximum account when it comes to abuse, neglect and victims, and that victims and survivors should be believed and supported on every occasion.”
“Agency spend has, again, gone through the roof and is sky-high; locum spend has gone up and continues to go up — it has gone up by in the region of £0·5 billion over the past few years; and, almost every single year out of the past five to 10 years, hundreds of millions of pounds of public money have been pumped into the for-profit privat…”
“With bills increasing month-on-month and year-on-year, that is true, and those workers need a proper settlement that meets their needs and the ever-increasing cost of living. One striking doctor put it to me starkly yesterday. They said that they left Scotland and took a more senior position in the health sector in Belfast.”
“I commend Stephen and his colleagues in the Bill Office and the Executive Office officials, who worked closely with me to try to support, amend or help along my amendments — whatever way you want to look at it. I also want to commend the Member for Fermanagh and South Tyrone who spoke out during the last few stages.”
“I commend people for speaking out on the issue, especially Sharon Burke. I think that she might be in the Gallery. She has been emailing Members on that issue.”
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“I support the motion. We need a fully funded, purpose-built addiction treatment and recovery centre in the north-west. People in areas such as Strabane and Derry have some of the highest levels of poverty, deprivation, housing stress and inequality in these islands. It is worth saying that, despite repeatedly having political leaders come from those areas, there has been a litany of failure and refusal to deliver on the demands and needs of working-class communities, including the one that we are discussing today. I suggest that the failure is because of the type of politics that often dominates this place.”
“I thank the Minister for her answer. It is crucial that communities have access to public transport. I think that there is a demand for services after 6.00 pm in the Lagmore area and beyond. I understand that there may have been a recent change to Translink's decision. <BR /> <BR />Does the Minister agree that worker safety and protection is paramount, and will she indicate what measures her Department has put in place to make sure that, while there is access to public transport, workers are protected and safe in their place of work?”
“Céad leathanach sa Chlár Rialtais — alt amháin faoin Ghaeilge. Tá gach páirtí ar bord leis an nualiobrálachas anois. <BR /> <BR />So, fair play don na hoibrithe ar stailc. Ní bheidh réiteach ann ó Stormont gan pobal na Gaeilge a bheith ar na sráideanna.”
“Dé Céadaoin seo caite bhí oibrithe Gaeilge ar stailc. Bhí bród mór orm seasamh leo. Bhí siad ar stailc mar gheall ar na ciorruithe atá ag teacht. <BR /> <BR />Tá pobal na Gaeilge ag déanamh obair mhór gach lá leis an teanga a chur chun cinn. I mo cheantar féin, in iarthar Bhéal Feirste, tá grúpaí Gaeilge ag déanamh sár-iarracht. Baineann mo chlann féin úsáid as neart de na seirbhísí iontacha sin. Ach tá maoiniú ceart de dhíth anois. Tá pá ceart de dhíth ar na hoibrithe. Agus tá airgead ceart de dhíth ar na seirbhísí. Ní raibh ardú ann ar mhaoiniú Fhoras na Gaeilge le 20 bliain anuas. Tá sin scanallach. <BR /> <BR />Aontaím le mana na n-oibrithe: réiteach anois, infheistíocht chothrom. Ba chóir don DUP deireadh a chur leis an bhac atá siad a chur os comhair na Gaeilge. Ach tá locht ar an Choiste Feidhmiúcháin iomlán fosta.”
“I agree, but I remind the Member that his party was in the Executive for many years and failed in attempts to reduce poverty. However, I agree with his earlier point. <BR /> <BR />Like I said, the fact that the Lough Neagh report and action plan is in the document is a testament to the continued pressure from environmental groups and activists such as the Save Lough Neagh campaign and many other people. It was their and others' endless campaigning that brought us to this point. Without the necessary resources and funding, however, I am worried that the action plan is doomed to fail. If climate breakdown does not warrant quick and urgent action from the Executive, it seems as if nothing will. Time is of the essence, and the time for action is now.”
“Even if the Executive somehow manage to meet the aspirations in the Programme for Government, that will not make a bit of difference, if people still live in poverty without their basic needs being met. <BR /> <BR />On climate, the programme commits to increasing renewable electricity capacity by 40% by 2027. The Climate Change Act 2022 mandates a target of 80% renewable by 2030: does the Programme for Government put us on track to reach that target? I highly doubt it. There is also a goal of consulting this year on a draft climate action plan that was supposed to have been published over a year ago. By 2027, the Executive plan to deliver the actions in the Lough Neagh report and action plan. That is a testament to the continued pressure from environmental campaigning groups and climate activists such as the Save Lough Neagh campaign.”
“<BR /> <BR />Tackling poverty is still not defined as a key priority for the Executive; instead, we get a few vague, aspirational paragraphs with a fleeting reference to the Executive bringing forward an anti-poverty strategy. Will that come with funding attached? The same question applies to all the other social inclusion strategies and the language strategies. Will the anti-poverty strategy be based on objective need? Will it increase household incomes and reduce child poverty? We will wait and see. One in four children in my constituency of West Belfast lives in poverty. Poverty impacts on every aspect of their young lives: their health, their education and their social and emotional development.”
“<BR /> <BR />The goal of providing more social, affordable and sustainable housing is to be welcomed, but the Programme for Government misses many obvious opportunities to prevent homelessness, which would involve cracking down on profiteering private landlords, implementing a no-fault eviction ban and introducing rent controls. Unfortunately, once again, the Minister for Communities ruled that out today. Executive parties refuse to acknowledge the reality that preventing homelessness will mean questioning and challenging the power of landlords; instead, they adopt a firefighting approach, throwing good money after bad and spending over £34 million a year on temporary accommodation, most of which goes into the pockets of multimillion-pound companies and private landlords.”
“The Education Minister devised the rightly maligned RAISE programme to tackle educational disadvantage, departing from well-established and effective measures of income deprivation. At a time when all school pupils should have access to counselling and mental health support when they need it, the budget for Healthy Happy Minds was axed in 2023 and still has not been reinstated. The Executive will now produce a SEN reform agenda and delivery plan by 2027. Given the Minister's previous dismissive comments about the value of one-to-one support from classroom assistants, education support workers will be and are worried about the content and implications of the final SEN reform agenda.”
“I will continue to judge the Executive by their actions, not their words. <BR /> <BR />Some £25 million has been allocated to support parents struggling with the cost of childcare. Previously, however, the Education Minister said that at least £400 million would be needed to implement a childcare strategy. A pittance has been allocated so far, and the Programme for Government completely neglects the issue of school-age childcare, another glaring omission from the document. <BR /> <BR />Children with special educational needs from working-class communities are being badly let down by the Executive. The Executive signed off on the recommendations in the 'A Fair Start' report to address educational underachievement and disadvantage. Then, the Department of Education allocated just 6% of the funding needed to implement those recommendations.”
“The Royal College of Surgeons reports that it will take a decade of sustained investment to turn the catastrophe around. We need consistent, high levels of investment to finally put an end to people dying needlessly on waiting lists. <BR /> <BR />When it comes to early years provision and childcare, Ministers talk about the importance of early intervention and the crucial first 1,000 days of a child's life, yet they cut statutory services for early years, depend on the community and voluntary sector to fill the gaps and then deny core grant funding to charities and organisations working in early intervention, putting organisations doing vital work to support communities at risk of going under. The warm words in the document are completely at odds with the actions of Executive parties.”
“The final version is a minor improvement on the vague, aimless original, but it still lacks the detail and urgency needed to turn things around for the ordinary people languishing on health waiting lists, the people spending a fortune on childcare, the people who are homeless, the children with special educational needs, the women and girls experiencing violence and many, many more. <BR /> <BR />The Executive plan to invest up to £135 million a year to reduce health waiting lists. Where exactly will that money be spent? Will it help to address the workforce crisis and ensure safe staffing levels, or will it go, once again, to the burgeoning private health sector? Will it mean that our overworked and burnt out Health and Social Care staff are finally paid what they deserve?”
“The Programme for Government is a clear indication that the Executive are out of touch with the people whom they claim to represent. As has been said, this is the first Programme for Government agreed by an Executive since 2011. The mere existence of the Programme for Government has been hailed as a cause for celebration, but is the bar really that low? Do ordinary people not deserve better? <BR /> <BR />It beggars belief that the draft Programme for Government was devoid of any real, measurable or time-bound targets. The fact that the Executive were forced to go back to the drawing board to add a few concrete goals shows what they would happy to get away with if given the chance.”
“I appreciate the Member's giving way. I concur with her sentiment. Does she express any concern about the Communities Minister's comment earlier when he went on to attack "gender ideology", seemingly sticking the boot into the trans community when asked a fair question about the gender equality strategy? Does she have any concerns about those kinds of comments being made in the Chamber?”
“That is a disappointing answer. Does the Minister think that it is morally acceptable that landlords can evict people and throw their life up in the air for no reason? What assessment has he made of the impact of no-fault eviction on growing waiting lists year-on-year?”
“I urge the Minister not to engage in trans bashing. It is not a good look. <BR /> <BR />As part of the gender equality strategy, has the Minister's Department discussed introducing a financial payment to help women to flee situations of domestic violence where they are at risk?”
“I welcome the decision not to go to the White House this St Patrick's Day, and I pay tribute to all the activists who put pressure on Sinn Féin and other parties not to go. Why is the First Minister allowing the deputy First Minister to go to the White House this St Paddy's Day, and will she join the calls to say that the Taoiseach and the Tánaiste should not go to the White House this Paddy's Day?”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. I note his reluctance to use rhetoric. Some would say that talking about supporting workers and families may be rhetoric from his end, given that public-sector workers saw their pay decrease by 2·8% in the last year. If the Minister would address that point, I would be grateful.”
“It is a political choice, and, earlier this month, despite the Executive's relentless attempts to copy and paste harmful UK economic policy across our public services, the Secretary of State complained that Executive parties were not doing austerity correctly or enough. He should be told where to go. <BR /> <BR />The Executive are making a truly half-hearted attempt at functional governance, waving through a Budget Bill to authorise spending without knowing what the money will be spent on. I will vote against it for that reason.”
“<BR /> <BR />Earlier this month, when I proposed a motion to support unpaid carers, every Executive party talked about the invaluable contribution that carers make to our society and to the economy. Not even two weeks later, the Department of Health has denied core funding to Carers NI, stripping the organisation of its ability to support and advocate for unpaid carers. I want to ask this: are those actions those of an Executive who value unpaid carers? Are those the actions of an Executive who value early intervention, prevention and support for our most marginalised communities? I would say no. <BR /> <BR />Budget cuts are a political choice, and the Executive are acting as a handmaiden to deadly UK austerity.”
“When contracting services out to private companies, Departments often cover the full costs incurred by those companies. Ministers and Departments would not expect a private company to deliver services if they did not cover the full cost, but, when it comes to the community and voluntary sector, it is a completely different story. Not only are those charities and organisations operating at a loss when delivering services, they are not given support to pay staff and keep the lights on. By denying core grant funding to 94% of the organisations that applied for it, the Health Minister, the Finance Minister and the wider Executive fail those organisations and the thousands of vulnerable people whom they support.”
“Just £47 million has been allocated for welfare mitigations, and, obviously, that is not enough to mitigate the two-child limit. Families with more than two children who are living in poverty will fall further below the breadline, and children will be punished for being born into a larger family. <BR /> <BR />Today, I met representatives of community and voluntary sector organisations that are losing core grant funding from the Department of Health. Those organisations are already running tight budgets, while providing life-saving and life-enhancing services for people in the community. They support our unpaid carers and people who live with chronic conditions or learning disabilities, as well as vulnerable babies and children and many others. They step in to provide services where the state fails to do so.”
“Some £100 million was allocated for social housing, but it is highly unlikely that that will be enough to build at least 2,000 new social homes. Of course, there are far cheaper ways to prevent homelessness, including freezing and reducing private rents, but, yesterday, the Executive and the official Opposition showed that they cannot bring themselves to upset profiteering landlords. <BR /> <BR />The Budget looks set to fail women and girls impacted by violence. Just £2 million has been earmarked to tackle violence against women and girls. That will not fund the transformative, radical changes that are needed to create a society where women are free from all forms of violence, abuse and harm. <BR /> <BR />The Budget looks set to fail people in receipt of social security.”
“Next year, we might get a two-year Budget, if we are lucky, but, until the Executive muster the political courage to break with never-ending UK austerity, our public services will continue to fail every one of us. <BR /> <BR />Today, in the absence of anything concrete to debate, I will focus my remarks on the state of our public services and the draft Budget. The upcoming Budget looks set to fail everyone. Languishing on our health waiting lists, which are by far the worst in these islands, record numbers of people are using private healthcare. Winter pressures in our emergency departments are now year-round pressures. The morale of Health and Social Care (HSC) workers has plummeted almost as low as their pay in real terms, and the upcoming Budget looks set to fail everyone who is struggling to pay their rent.”
“An underwhelming and vague draft Programme for Government with no clear objectives went through a period of public consultation that ended four months ago, and still there is no sign of a final draft. Yet, we are here to debate a Budget Bill without a Programme for Government. It is worth taking a second to reflect on the utter pointlessness of a Bill that authorises spending in the absence of agreed spending priorities. We still wait for multi-year Budgets to address the systemic, chronic issues in our society: waiting lists, health inequalities, the housing crisis, a childcare offering that does not meet the basic needs of families, crumbling school buildings, inadequate public transport and climate breakdown, to name but a few.”
“I will look at that, Minister, and I certainly will send through any matters of concern. If, for example, when discussing issues of farming or agriculture, senior officials in your Department had a financial interest, directly or through family members, in those areas, would they have to declare those at every meeting or at some meetings, or where would that generally take place?”
“I am not sure that I will get such a long answer.”
“I share the disappointment of communities unable to avail themselves of public transport. I declare an interest as a regular user of the Gilder line; I used it this morning to get here. <BR /> <BR />Minister, you said that full funding is not available. My understanding is that a large sum of money is being spent on importing hydrogen from Europe for the use of buses here. Is that an area that you are looking at to provide adequate funding for an alternative local form of sustainable transport?”
“— a huge proportion of the public remains committed to neutrality.”
“Regrettably, countries across Europe have folded and dropped any pretence of military neutrality. Thankfully, in the South of Ireland, despite a deluge of propaganda that has been waged —”
“That is the result of US and all imperial adventures. No doubt Biden or Harris would have tried something similar. <BR /> <BR />What has been the result of the war? It has been carnage, death and destruction. We need to call out consistently the aggressive bullying and dominant role across the world that the US and its EU allies have planned regardless of current tensions between them. We should not paint Putin or anyone else who has their own empire as an alternative to the US. We need a world without empires and capitalism. <BR /> <BR />NATO, which has been expanding exponentially from the 1990s right up to the present day, should be disbanded. It is an aggressive, offensive military organisation that causes death and destruction across the world, while Members to my right laugh at it.”
“They believe China to be the economic rival, and any way in which to undermine China and Russia is worth pursuing to the advantage of the US. Trump is demanding a £400 billion payback from Ukraine. In turn, the US will loot the country of its resources. It is the same as it ever was; Trump is just more aggressive and upfront about it. <BR /> <BR />A leaked report to 'The Telegraph' has shown what motivates the US. It wants to set up a US-Ukraine investment fund, with 50% of the resources that are taken going directly to the US. A source close to the negotiations described one clause to mean:”
“There is always money for war, but when we demand money for services, we are told, "It is not available, sorry". <BR /> <BR />Putin's actions were rightly condemned and called out across the board. We opposed the war and Putin's actions whilst others fell over themselves to welcome him to the G8 summit in Fermanagh and opposed a ceasefire every step of the way. Imagine that: they opposed a ceasefire every step of the way. They wanted other people to spill blood for the purpose of imperial rivalry and a carve-up. <BR /> <BR />In the US, Donald Trump's recent manoeuvres are not necessarily pro-Russian, as they have been described. Like every other aspect of his Administration, they are ruthlessly pro-American and a direct expression of the current US grand strategy.”
“Yesterday marked three years since the war in Ukraine began. The result has been devastation for ordinary Ukrainians and Russians, with hundreds of thousands killed and millions being forced out of their homes. War is futile and a colossal waste of human life. The resources that are spent on war could instead be funnelled into protecting people in this country from dying in their homes at wintertime because of the cut to the winter fuel payment. That is not to mention the extra money that could be funnelled into the health service to save and enhance lives rather than destroy them as has happened with the billions that have been pumped into keeping the war going. Keir Starmer has pumped at least £8 billion of military assistance into Ukraine whilst forcing people to freeze during this winter.”
“It is remarkable that, as a member of a party that traces its legacy from the civil rights movement, the Member seems to be against rent reductions and controls. I remind the Member that people did not march to end sectarianism in housing to be ripped off in the private rented sector. I commend my amendment to Members and ask them to support it.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Member who proposed the amendment cheekily asked about landlords in my party. I remind him that, for years, his party had as a member on Belfast City Council one of the worst landlords in the Holylands and, seemingly, had no problem with it. It is remarkable that the party —.”
“<BR /> <BR />I will move on to the SDLP amendment. Grants to help tenants make up the shortfall between LHA and the market rent might be welcome in the short term, but it is a sticking plaster. Tenants would not see any of that money, which would go straight into the pockets of landlords. To subsidise increased rents is to throw away good public money. The UK Government already spend over £30 billion per year on subsidising private landlords via housing benefit and the housing element of universal credit. In the North, we top that up. Executive parties take every opportunity to talk about efficiency, use of resources and managing constrained budgets: I suggest that funnelling large sums of public money to landlords who charge huge rents is not good value for money.”
“<BR /> <BR />Even if some landlords leave the market, the house still exists. It does not disappear. It may be bought by another landlord, a first-time buyer who is leaving the private rented sector or the state, if the will were there to step in to buy homes that landlords sell and convert them into social housing. <BR /> <BR />The report recommended strengthening the social security system and significantly increasing the supply of social housing. Almost three years on, the Executive have absolutely failed to act on either recommendation. The housing crisis has got worse since the report was written. I urge Ministers to listen to tenants, who tell us clearly and repeatedly that they want rent control, rather than to landlords who make unfounded threats to leave the sector. Politicians cannot pick and choose from that report.”
“It would be good for renters, but that has been missing from the debate. The CIH report stated that between 41% and 60% of landlords would leave the market if rent controls were introduced; the Member for North Belfast referred to that. I maintain that that is scaremongering. There is no evidence whatever to support that claim. If you look at Housing Executive data, you see that the majority of landlords do not — I repeat: do not — have mortgages to cover. The data shows that just over 33%, just over a third, rely on rent to cover mortgage payments. What does that mean? It means that about two thirds of landlords are directly, massively profiteering from the huge rents that they charge. The Minister and other Members should remember that when they talk about the issue.”
“Thank you. I concur with the Member. She will probably agree that quite a lot of those asylum seekers want to work in our health service but, due to a racist immigration and asylum policy, are prevented from working. They have skills but have been prevented from contributing to the health and education sectors. <BR /> <BR />Often used in the debate and referred to by one or two Members today was the Chartered Institute of Housing report from, I think, 2002. A few quotes were read out from that report, but this one was missing:”
“I say to the Member, through you, Mr Deputy Speaker, that it is landlordism causing the crisis, not immigration. Asylum seekers and migrants contribute so much to our society, but they often live in the worst housing possible with damp and mould riddled throughout their homes.”
“Critics said that introducing those basic protections for workers would cause mass unemployment, but, 25 years later, rates of unemployment have fallen. The minimum wage increased living standards and boosted the economy, so I suggest that there is a bit of scaremongering going on. I repeat the point: rent controls exist in Europe, and the sky has not caved in. Housing markets have not collapsed, and, in fact, the private rented sector in those countries is growing. The fact that one in five MLAs is a landlord also tells us all that we need to know. I suggest that there is a lot of looking after their own interests and those of their wealthy and powerful property-owning friends. <BR /> <BR />The Member for North Antrim talked about immigration.”
“Thank you, Deputy Speaker. Quite a few comments need to be challenged and rebutted. I do not know whether I have time to do justice to all of that, but I will do my best. <BR /> <BR />In the general thrust of the debate, Members who caution against third-generation rent controls, as they are called, show us where their true priorities lie. Clearly, they believe that a landlord's right to extract profit from the tenant at all costs is more important than a tenant's right to a secure and affordable home. Members warn against landlords fleeing the sector or the risk of rent control destabilising supply in the private sector, but similar arguments were used against the introduction of the minimum wage.”
“Landlords do not, and should not, have unqualified rights to profiteer from a person's fundamental human right to a home or to evict a tenant from their home for no good reason. Those statements should not be controversial, but they may be to some in this place.”
“In the decade up to 2022, European countries with rent controls had a faster-growing private rented sector than countries without rent controls, which really exposes the misinformation that is spouted by some when talking about rent controls. The idea of rent control is not outlandish or unworkable. In fact, all private tenancies in the North were subject to rent controls until 1978, so it was the norm for decades upon decades. If we agree with the basic principle that the right to housing is more important than the right of landlords to make a good profit, we need to implement rent controls now. <BR /> <BR />A new deal for private renters must do what the Executive and previous Executives have failed to do, and that is to challenge the scourge of landlordism in the North.”
“A stronger system of rent controls would begin with a freeze, followed by a gradual reduction over time to a predetermined, affordable level. It is called first-generation rent control, although, tellingly, it is not often called that when we talk about it in the Chamber; we hear of hard or extreme rent controls or versions of that. <BR /> <BR />The total lack of rent control in the North and in Britain makes us outliers compared with the rest of Europe. Denmark, Sweden, the Netherlands, Spain, Germany, France and the South of Ireland have some form of rent control system in place, and the sky has not fallen in. Landlords have not fled the market, despite the scaremongering that is touted when rent controls are talked about.”
“The National Union of Students - Union of Students in Ireland (NUS-USI), as part of its fix student housing campaign, showed that students are paying through the nose for poor-quality, overcrowded housing. Some 44% of students surveyed have less than £100 left each month after paying their housing costs, and half of students need to rely on a credit card or a loan to just get by. I commend NUS-USI for its work in highlighting those issues. It does not take an economist to see that that is totally unsustainable and a powder keg waiting to explode. <BR /> <BR />Third-generation rent controls are a step in the right direction, but they limit rent increases only in a tenancy. There is nothing to stop a landlord massively hiking the rent once a tenant leaves and before the property goes out to let again, so there is a limitation with it.”
“Environmental health teams have enforcement powers, but, in practice, councils are generally underfunded and under-resourced, meaning that those powers are not worth the paper that they are written on. We need to learn from that shambolic system and make sure that any new deal for private renters is backed up by a strong enforcement body. <BR /> <BR />In the past year, rents in the North increased by 10%, which is higher than that in any UK region. In the same time frame, average wages increased by just 1·2%. Public-sector workers actually saw their pay decrease by 2·8%. Rents keep rising, but wages and benefits are stagnating. Furthermore, students face an acute affordability crisis.”
“It is a disgrace that those homes lie empty while people are sofa-surfing, living in insecure, temporary accommodation or sleeping rough on the street. <BR /> <BR />As well as the housing ombudsman that is proposed in the motion, which I obviously support, a well-resourced and effective rental board should be set up to enforce minimum fitness standards, a no-fault eviction ban and a system of rent controls. Those are questions that we explored during the consultation stage of my Member's Bill, the people's housing Bill, that I will, hopefully, bring through the Chamber. <BR /> <BR />Currently, tenants have almost no recourse when a property is riddled with damp or mould or when a landlord steals or refuses to register a deposit.”
“At that rate, it will take 50 years to build enough homes for everyone on the waiting list, and that is if the waiting list magically freezes instead of growing year-on-year. At the same time, the housing sales scheme continues to decimate the supply of social housing stock. <BR /> <BR />The failure to expand the supply of social housing has forced more and more people into the private rented sector. There is one very easy solution that is staring Executive parties and the Minister in the face: bring empty homes back into use. According to Land and Property Services (LPS), there are at least 22,500 empty homes in the North, but the latest census report states that there are over 52,000 households with no usual residents. I hope that the Minister can clarify which it is.”