Gerry Carroll
West Belfast · People Before Profit Alliance · Northern Ireland
“Yesterday morning, as others did, I stood alongside our resident doctors as they commenced a 24-hour period of industrial action. We often praise our healthcare workers in the House and more generally, saying things such as that they are invaluable and that we wish them well.”
“If we have learnt anything from the political events of the past week, it is that powerful people — powerful men, in particular — and institutions should always be held to maximum account when it comes to abuse, neglect and victims, and that victims and survivors should be believed and supported on every occasion.”
“Agency spend has, again, gone through the roof and is sky-high; locum spend has gone up and continues to go up — it has gone up by in the region of £0·5 billion over the past few years; and, almost every single year out of the past five to 10 years, hundreds of millions of pounds of public money have been pumped into the for-profit privat…”
“With bills increasing month-on-month and year-on-year, that is true, and those workers need a proper settlement that meets their needs and the ever-increasing cost of living. One striking doctor put it to me starkly yesterday. They said that they left Scotland and took a more senior position in the health sector in Belfast.”
“I commend Stephen and his colleagues in the Bill Office and the Executive Office officials, who worked closely with me to try to support, amend or help along my amendments — whatever way you want to look at it. I also want to commend the Member for Fermanagh and South Tyrone who spoke out during the last few stages.”
“I commend people for speaking out on the issue, especially Sharon Burke. I think that she might be in the Gallery. She has been emailing Members on that issue.”
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“Therefore, without political will and funding, representation alone does not change things .The austerity policies pushed by this Executive will see further erosion of health and social care, good jobs, wages and housing, and they will put more women at risk of violence. We need urgent action on gender-based violence. It has to be real action that is backed by real funding to eliminate its root causes from the top our society down.”
“At the same time, we watch political leaders from this place jet off to the White House to pose for photographs with Donald Trump, a man accused of rape and sexual assault by at least 28 women and whose name is littered throughout the Epstein files. Are those the actions of people who value women's lives, be they American, Iranian, Irish, British or Palestinian? <BR /> <BR />Over the past while, many people have pointed out that two women hold the highest positions of political power in the North. Yet, all the while, the epidemic of violence against women actually accelerates.”
“Unfortunately, this Executive do nowhere near enough to tackle violence against women and girls, whilst defunding the very services that help women to survive, such as Nexus and Women's Aid. Disgracefully, the North remains the only part of these islands without consistent public funding for groups such as Women's Aid. Does that sound like a Government who are serious about tackling gender-based violence? <BR /> <BR />There has been a lot of talk about education. Our young people absolutely deserve standardised, inclusive relationships and sexuality education (RSE) in every school: education that challenges toxic gender stereotypes and builds relationships rooted in respect, equality and consent. Instead, they get, at best, a postcode lottery of patchy provision.”
“Thank you, Mr Speaker, for selecting this important matter for debate. I extend my sympathy and solidarity to the friends and family of Amy Doherty, a young mother of two who was murdered in Derry at the weekend. As other Members said, she was the thirtieth woman killed since 2020, which is unbelievable when you say it out loud. She was the second to be killed in fewer than two weeks, with Ellie Flanagan also having been killed. <BR /> <BR />Those are shocking and shameful statistics, and those two names will go on the list of women who were murdered by men, mostly men whom they knew. Barely a day passes without another horrific story of a woman being assaulted, attacked, violated or killed, and those are just the stories that make the news.”
“Will the Member agree that the parties that are raising their opposition to the Iranian regime do not understand that bombing the people in Iran will lead to more people supporting the Iranian regime, as they will see it as an alternative to America, while that sugar-coating misrepresents what the regime was about? Does the Member agree that the Members to my right need to take that on board?”
“— says that there is no chance of Iran developing —”
“I agree. I also point to the Christian fanatics, if not fascists, in the US Government who cheer on, support and agree with Netanyahu. <BR /> <BR />I have a few seconds left. There are problems, to put it mildly, with the Alliance Party's amendment, although I recognise some of what Kate Nicholl said. Alliance, alongside other parties, defended the Ukrainian people's right to defend themselves against invasion and bombing by Russia, and rightly so. Its amendment No 2, however, equivocates on that point on Iran and fails to recognise the key aggressor. Ukrainians are therefore allowed the right to self-defence, but Iranians are not. The amendment repeats the myth about nuclear weapons. The IAEA —”
“I am answering the question, yet you are shouting at me. You need a short history lesson, but I do not have time to give one. It is up to the people of Iran to determine their Government and the future of their state. It is a bit rich to hear about theocracy and oppression from the party that supports theocracy and biblical interpretations of the oppression of women and many other minorities. People will find that rich and hypocritical, but I have no time to get into —.”
“In the short time that I have, I will say that the reason that there is an Islamic republic in Iran is that its people were ruled by a brutal shah, who was backed by the US and Britain. They therefore created their own state. Would it be my state? Is it a socialist state?”
“<BR /> <BR />Many of us knew that the genocide would not be confined to the Palestinians in Gaza, and Israel has been central to the violence in recent days, never mind the past 50 or 60-plus years. Israel and America started this war, and that is why the UUP's amendment is quite delusional. It is as though no sanctions have been placed on Iran or bombs dropped on Iranian cities. When was the last time that the Iranian people or Government bombed a city in America?”
“Almost 1,000 Lebanese people have been killed by the Israeli state, and there has been no mention of those people either. Given all the focus and money spent on AI technology, sophisticated weaponry and other devices, it is quite remarkable that the decision of the Iranian state to close the Strait of Hormuz shipping route can cause so much financial havoc, panic and chaos to people here and across the world. However, obviously, the DUP cheered that on, and the closure is responsible for the price rises because of the bombing. It also illustrates that we need to move away from our reliance on fossil fuels, but, again, the DUP cries "green panic" when it hears that.”
“The motion calls those attacks illegal, which they absolutely are, but they are more than that: they are completely unwarranted, immoral and unprovoked. It is hypocritical and hard to stomach when parties in the House denounce and declare their opposition to terrorism but will then exchange shamrocks with Donald Trump tomorrow and shake his hand. He is the terrorist in chief across the world, so shame on them and their hypocrisy. <BR /> <BR />At least 1,440 Iranians have been killed, and almost 20,000 people have been injured. There has been no mention of those people by the parties to my right. There are about 10 million people who have been affected by poisoned air following the US bombing of oil facilities next to the Strait of Hormuz.”
“Despite the focus on the US being a bringer of freedom and democracy — people will parrot that stuff in the coming days and this year with the anniversary of the Declaration of Independence — it is worth asking what the US spends that money on. <BR /> <BR />The US is the biggest exporter of terror across the world, as well as terrorising its own black and brown communities with its Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) paramilitary gang. On the first day of the war with Iran, we saw what the so-called US defence support for human rights meant. We saw a school in Minab in southern Iran blown to bits, and 165 schoolchildren were killed. They count; they matter, even if they do not matter to some of the parties in the Chamber this evening.”
“I will address the motion and the amendments. The motion addresses some of the key issues in the very challenging and disturbing global situation, and it also outlines that the main aggressor in the world today is the United States. Despite all the scaremongering about China and other states across the world, while, historically, the US is a weaker empire and has suffered defeats in Afghanistan and elsewhere, it is still the biggest military power in the world and probably in world history. As an illustration of how big it is, the US spends at least $1 trillion a year on what it calls "defence" but everybody else calls "a military budget". That puts into context the scale of the US as a military power.”
“Does the Member's criticism extend to Saudi Arabia as well?”
“— women's health hubs. I support the motion and commend the Member who tabled it.”
“in respect of the so-called action plan. <BR /> <BR />At the end of last year, the Women's Resource and Development Agency (WRDA) produced research that clearly identified what women actually need: accessibility, especially to GPs; continuity of care in order to build strong relationships with healthcare providers; and —”
“When public waiting lists become intolerable, those who can afford it or who can get themselves into debt go private. Those who cannot, including thousands of women in West Belfast whom I represent, are left behind. England, Scotland, Wales and the South of Ireland all have dedicated women's health strategies, and the North does not. That is a political choice, and, once again, the North is a laggard. The Minister previously stated that he wants to deliver action, not another vague strategy of platitudes. To that end, he promised to produce a women's health action plan, but, as the motion rightly states, there is no:”
“Let us call it another name and what it is: medical misogyny. For generations, women's pain has been dismissed, their symptoms minimised and their conditions under-researched, as Members have said. As has been said already, it is a disgrace that endometriosis patients are waiting 10 years for a diagnosis. Gynaecology waiting lists in Northern Ireland are among the longest in these islands. The Getting It Right First Time review confirmed what women already knew and have been saying for years: the system is not working for them. <BR /> <BR />This is the logical end point of a system that was never designed with women, and certainly not working-class and poor women, at its centre. While we debate strategies and action plans, the privatisation of women's healthcare quietly accelerates.”
“Someone else reported waiting two years for gynaecology surgery, only for all her symptoms to return and for her to go to the back of the queue and have to spend another two or three years on a waiting list. Others talked about a lack of data on the number of women being diagnosed with ADHD and autism. Another woman shared her traumatic experience of misdiagnosis of a mental health condition and the wide-reaching impacts that that has had on her family life. <BR /> <BR />When you take all that together, it is abundantly clear that working-class women in particular, and women juggling caring responsibilities and navigating poverty, are not getting the healthcare that they deserve. That is the predictable outcome of a capitalist, profit-driven model that has always treated women's health as a secondary concern at best.”
“<BR /> <BR />Someone else said that she suffered with endometriosis all her life and was told that the pain was all in her head, something that, unfortunately, people are told regularly. It was not until she had a hysterectomy for cancer that her diagnosis was confirmed. Some women who were lucky enough to get a diagnosis report being left to deal with it, as the Member for North Belfast alluded to. With no help and no information, multiple women who live with serious, life-changing conditions such as PCOS reported that their pain was routinely dismissed. They were told, "Everything will settle down as you get older", which is patronising as well as dismissive.”
“One woman, who waited years on a PCOS diagnosis, finally received a telephone appointment only to be told to get back in touch if she wanted to get pregnant. Nobody has followed up with her since — and that was almost five years ago. Another woman reports being bedridden for days on end due to endometriosis. Her community-based pain management group is a lifeline for her, and she said that she would not be here without it. Another woman waited 12 years for an endometriosis diagnosis, and — it is quite shocking even to say this, but it is what I was told — she still takes her husband with her to appointments because she wants to be taken seriously. She is not taken seriously by her medical practitioner. That is a disgraceful, Victorian-era attitude towards women.”
“Yesterday, I posted on social media an answer from the Health Minister to a question that I had asked about the number of women in my West Belfast constituency who are receiving treatment for polycystic ovary syndrome (PCOS) and endometriosis. Apparently, the Belfast Trust does not hold even that very basic information. It is said that you count what matters, so, clearly — disgracefully — women in that situation do not count. <BR /> <BR />In the past 24 hours, I have been inundated with comments, messages and emails from women in my constituency and beyond about the issue. Medical misogyny is deep, but I was genuinely taken aback by the scale of the number of people reaching out and getting in touch. I want to raise some of the issues that people raised with me.”
“I thank the Member for tabling the motion, and I welcome her back here and wish her well. Obviously, I wholeheartedly support the motion, and I do so as someone who represents a constituency where the consequences of a broken, underfunded health system are hardest felt. It is a shame that the Health Minister is not here today. I understand that he is sitting with that enemy of women Donald Trump, but he should be here listening to the debate and acting today.”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. The British Government and the coalition in the South are not known for the speediness of their actions. In the absence of their acting to ensure that the Minister can establish an independent EPA, what is his plan of action to ensure that it is created before the mandate expires?”
“Maybe, if I have a second. <BR /> <BR />He should not dictate what mining companies should be allowed to get away with. I refer to Dalradian in that context. <BR /> <BR />There has been a lot of talk about public ownership of Lough Neagh in recent days. We said it last year, as did the Save Lough Neagh campaign —.”
“We should not let a disgraced former ambassador to the US and former Secretary of State — the prince of darkness — dictate what communities here should do.”
“People who are deprived and live in poverty in working-class communities can be fined quite hefty sums of money. People across the North can be fined, rightly, for dropping cigarettes in the street, but corporate polluters get away scot-free. That is an absurd state of play. <BR /> <BR />I agree with the Member for Lagan Valley who said that an EPA alone will not stop pollution, but I hope that it will be a step in the right direction when coupled with the sea change, or maybe a slight change, in some parties' endorsement of the Going for Growth strategy, which led to so much dumping and pollution. <BR /> <BR />In conclusion, we need to move away from allowing extractive companies to dictate terms to local communities here.”
“<BR /> <BR />I do not understand the rationale for the position of some Members, who attack the Minister in support of farmers but are not in favour of an independent EPA because it would not look at NI Water and other bodies. I do not bat for the Minister on every issue, but that does not add up, in my estimation. The body should be properly funded, staffed and resourced. It should have the teeth to properly intervene to stop pollution and ideally prevent it from happening. Moy Park obviously comes to mind. <BR /> <BR />There is an absurd state of play in my constituency and, I am sure, other Members' constituencies whereby constituents can be fined if their bins are not collected through no fault of their own. Often, they are not collected through no fault of the council workers either.”
“Yes. I did not realise that the term "quango" would cause such a stir, but we obviously need the organisation. <BR /> <BR />I pay tribute to Friends of the Earth, which has called for an independent EPA since 2004, before I and many others became elected representatives. Friends of the Earth led the way when it was not necessarily in vogue to call for an EPA. If, or rather when, an independent EPA is established, it has to be independent of the Department and the Executive, to go back to the previous point. The body should tackle NI Water and the other public bodies that engage in the nefarious behaviour that has been mentioned.”
“That was a good effort, Johnny Timex. Fair play to you on that, but, as I said, there is still a rationale for keeping an independent EPA.”
“I can give her several: Lough Neagh is toxic green, the Mobuoy dump was allowed to exist for years, corporate farmers pollute waterways every year and scores, if not hundreds, of people are dying because of air pollution. <BR /> <BR />During the debate, my quango meter was going off, because I lost count of the number of times the word "quango" was used by Members to my right. I am happy to give way if the Members want to describe what a quango is. Is the Education Authority (EA) a quango? Is the Housing Executive a quango? If Members view those organisations as quangos, do they want to end them, or is it only the green and environmental quangos that they are against? There are too many quangos, and it is too late in the day.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Member for Strangford asked for a cogent argument as to why we need an independent EPA.”
“In the last debate, I commented on how long it is taking the Assembly to implement free parking for people in hospitals. However, from this motion it is clear that we take longer and longer — the years have gone by, quite literally — to put an independent EPA in place. I say clearly that an independent EPA is long overdue, and I appeal to parties to stop blocking it. Obviously, I mean the DUP in this case. <BR /> <BR />I support the motion and the amendment. Executive parties signed up to this in early 2020, but, obviously, they were getting spooked by Timothy Gaston or by some of their own bogus arguments about the environment that they churn out daily. As a general point, agriculture and environment are often pitted against each other. That is a false dichotomy, a false debate. We should challenge that.”
“I thank the Member for giving way. I agree with a lot of what he has said. I said similar stuff, albeit more briefly, in the previous debate. <BR /> <BR />Is the Member concerned, as I am, that finance was mentioned in the Minister's rationale for introducing the Bill even though his Department has no problem giving hundreds of millions of pounds to private healthcare bodies every year?”
“It is worth reminding ourselves that all parties stood on electoral platforms and got re-elected by lauding the work that was done on free hospital parking. Really, the Bill is like 'Waiting for Godot'. I do not know in what year or decade free parking will actually be implemented. The attempt to rush deferral through again should be opposed, when the Department and trusts have had plenty of time to address the issues that were in the original Bill. I state my opposition to the Bill and oppose its accelerated passage.”
“I state my opposition to the Bill and to accelerated passage. The Assembly does not pass much good legislation, but the 2022 Act that removed parking charges at hospitals was one positive thing for which I voted, as did the Assembly. I will repeat now what I said then: it is a bit rich for MLAs, who do not have to pay anything to park in their place of work, to tell health workers and the public to pay to go into a hospital or other healthcare setting, especially when many of those workers are low-paid and have to fight or threaten strike action just to get fair pay, which is not always fully implemented. <BR /> <BR />Charging workers and the public for parking is a punitive charge that should be opposed. That is not just my view; it was the view of the Assembly four years ago.”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. With respect, we have been waiting for some time for your view on the matter, as we did that of your predecessor. You have been in office for a year and a bit, so when will we get your view? Furthermore, you cannot lump Caterpillar and Coca-Cola — huge multinationals that are capitalist organisations — in with small companies. When will the review commence? It is also worth noting that many trade unions that represent workers in those factories are against the industrial derating policy.”
“I say: leave it up to ordinary people to challenge the Budget through community mobilisation, unions and people power. I will do my best today by voting against it.”
“Stop giving rates breaks to huge multinational corporations; that would save in the region of £80 million a year. Those corporations also pollute the local environment, mistreat their workers and act in complicity with Israel and other rogue states. Complete the devolution of income tax and then increase income tax on higher earners. Create a fair rates system in which bills are calculated based on ability to pay. The likes of Amazon pay a pittance in rates when they come here, underpay workers and make a fortune across the globe. <BR /> <BR />The Executive must refuse to facilitate austerity and instead provide a Budget that improves the material conditions of working-class communities. This Budget does not do that. Most people out there will be waiting a long time for the Executive to change course.”
“Westminster's role in perpetuating underfunding is undeniable, but the Sinn Féin Finance Minister conveniently fails to acknowledge the fact that the Executive, including those from his party, are acting as handmaidens for British austerity. They are implementing cuts by choice, not necessity. At a time of record corporate profits across these islands, the Finance Minister has not made a single proposal or raised his voice to argue for higher corporate taxes on companies here. It is in our control to do that, but the Minister refuses to act. He claims that he wants to hear concrete revenue-raising alternatives from other parties. I have repeatedly said to the Minister — I will repeat it again today — that he could abolish industrial derating.”
“Tell that to the families of those who travel to attend a special educational needs school or those who are stuck at home for half the day because they have no suitable placement. <BR /> <BR />As the Minister and others have said in previous debates, we have limited devolved fiscal powers, so the British Government and the Northern Ireland Executive have a joint responsibility to make sure that long-term revenues are sufficient to meet people's material needs. It is not good enough for the British Government to accuse the Executive of fiscal irresponsibility. It is also not good enough for the Executive to place all the blame on the British Government for underfunding us.”
“In the past week, the cost of home heating oil has almost doubled. In that context, working-class communities are once again being asked to pay more while getting less. <BR /> <BR />The British Government are not coming to save us. There is a £400 million Treasury reserve claim coming this year, but that is, as I understand it, to be repaid over the subsequent three years, which means more financial punishment to come. We are getting an extra £380 million in Barnett consequentials over the next three years as well, which is connected to the SEND funding in England, but that is not being ring-fenced to invest in SEND here. No doubt, parents and carers of children here will be livid about that. That will probably be used to pay off the Treasury reserve claim as well.”
“It is also worth saying that allocations for Programme for Government priorities made up only a very small proportion of the total funding in the Budget, showing once again that the Programme for Government is little more than warm words, with no material substance or funding, even when it comes to the Executive's own priorities. <BR /> <BR />It is unconscionable that the big parties wanted, and today agreed, to hike the regional domestic rate by 5% for each of the next three years, which is above the current rate of inflation. Ordinary families still struggle to access basic public services. They see little meaningful improvement in health waiting lists, cannot access affordable childcare and, in many cases, cannot get an NHS dentist. They struggle to pay the rent, mortgages and household bills.”
“Public-sector pay settlements should be factored into budgets at the start of every year, but, obviously, that is not the case: we have yearly crises when it comes to funding pay awards, and we cannot afford to maintain basic parity. What message does that send to our workers? It is that they are worth less than people doing the same job because they live elsewhere. It is not acceptable to hold our classroom assistants, healthcare workers, civil servants and transport workers to ransom each and every year. We have to reject the language of efficiency savings, which, unfortunately, is trumped out in this Budget, as it was in previous ones. Budgets must meet people's needs as a bare minimum.”
“I was expecting a few more Members to speak before me, but I am happy to contribute to the debate. The draft Budget was not agreed by the whole Executive, but it looks as though the DUP will support it today. I am not sure what has changed for the DUP; I am happy for anybody to clarify that. <BR /> <BR />There are very small uplifts for Departments in the Budget, which is alarming in the context of rising costs, including pay claims, and increasing demand for services. It is worth outlining that only four Departments — Health, Education, Justice and Infrastructure — will receive any increase next year, while the rest of the Departments will not.”
“The Minister should maybe go and read a bit of James Connolly, and then he could answer this question. Are public-sector or private-sector workers going to get a 24% pay increase like MLAs are getting?”
“That is where you get the money from. Amazon is the world's largest company and the biggest company in human history, but it pays a tiny fraction of its income and profits on rates. Again, Minister, you do not need a review to tackle companies such as that. You need to make a decision on this stuff. <BR /> <BR />I welcome the fact that the Opposition will vote against the rates increase today.”
“Hundreds of millions of pounds, every single year, go from the Executive through the Department for Communities to landlords in order to subsidise rent increases, because the Executive refuse to implement rent controls. Hundreds of millions of pounds have come from Barnett consequentials as a result of the increase in the special educational needs and disability funding for councils in England, but will that go towards helping families, workers and communities? It is going to pay off the Treasury reserve claim, which is absolutely absurd. <BR /> <BR />I have one final point to make, which the Minister may address in his winding-up speech. It is worth noting that when Amazon had a facility in Belfast over a period of four or five years — several years at least — it paid a total of £1·6 million in rates.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Chair of the Finance Committee talked about the £47 million in extra finance that may be brought about as a result of this increase. To put that in context, it is almost half of what the Finance Department gives out every single year under the industrial derating scheme, which is a handout to big multinational corporations, many of which are engaged in, to put it mildly, questionable human rights practices. <BR /> <BR />Bills, mortgages and rents are up, and it looks as though MLAs' wages are set to go up. If you are a public- or private-sector worker, however, your income is down for the most part. There is no mention of from where income can be generated.”