Gerry Carroll
West Belfast · People Before Profit Alliance · Northern Ireland
“Yesterday morning, as others did, I stood alongside our resident doctors as they commenced a 24-hour period of industrial action. We often praise our healthcare workers in the House and more generally, saying things such as that they are invaluable and that we wish them well.”
“If we have learnt anything from the political events of the past week, it is that powerful people — powerful men, in particular — and institutions should always be held to maximum account when it comes to abuse, neglect and victims, and that victims and survivors should be believed and supported on every occasion.”
“Agency spend has, again, gone through the roof and is sky-high; locum spend has gone up and continues to go up — it has gone up by in the region of £0·5 billion over the past few years; and, almost every single year out of the past five to 10 years, hundreds of millions of pounds of public money have been pumped into the for-profit privat…”
“With bills increasing month-on-month and year-on-year, that is true, and those workers need a proper settlement that meets their needs and the ever-increasing cost of living. One striking doctor put it to me starkly yesterday. They said that they left Scotland and took a more senior position in the health sector in Belfast.”
“I commend Stephen and his colleagues in the Bill Office and the Executive Office officials, who worked closely with me to try to support, amend or help along my amendments — whatever way you want to look at it. I also want to commend the Member for Fermanagh and South Tyrone who spoke out during the last few stages.”
“I commend people for speaking out on the issue, especially Sharon Burke. I think that she might be in the Gallery. She has been emailing Members on that issue.”
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Every one of 4,137 lines we hold for Gerry Carroll, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 35 of 83.
“<BR /> <BR />DFI and councils should work together to support community-led development and to give local communities the investment that they need in order to bring alleyways up to an adoptable standard. That is why I tabled my amendment. Grants should not be solely for cleaning and greening. Although those measures are important, grants should cover ways in which to upgrade unadoptable and unsafe alleyways to a safe and better standard. I urge Members to support the amendment.”
“<BR /> <BR />I commend the work of the local communities in my constituency, which have stepped up to clean alleyways and back entries and make them safe and welcoming places, such as in the St James's area of west Belfast, the Three Sisters group in the Cavendish Street area and many more residents in south Belfast and beyond who are doing similar very important and valuable work. It is important that the proper level of funding is given to councils on an equitable and consistent basis, so that it does not fall solely to volunteers to do that work in the main. Residents know their areas best, so they can identify the local alleyways that are most in need of investment and work out ways in which to clean them up and make them useful for the people who live there.”
“In 2021, there were just 20 workers overseeing 3,470 live bonds plus enforcement cases. In 2015, there were 43 workers in the same team. Fewer workers means less action, with almost a 50% reduction in the number of workers in that section of the Department. Maybe the lack of enforcement action against developers is a bit of a conscious strategy and a consequence of austerity budgeting and efficiency savings as well. I think that we need a crackdown on developers in order to stop them from moving from one site to another until they can show that roads, street lights and sewers are in an adoptable state. We need to stop granting planning permission to developers who repeatedly abandon shoddy developments, leaving residents to pick up the pieces. There needs to be more of a role for councils: that is relevant to this debate.”
“Mortgage holders are locked into relationships with unscrupulous management companies, which can charge uncapped fees for maintaining communal unadopted areas, and that is completely unacceptable. People, including those with disabilities who need a more accessible home, are left unable to sell their homes, as are those who need to downsize or who are growing their families or those who just want to move somewhere with basic functional infrastructure. What takes more resources, time and effort: gently persuading private developers to finally finish or fix the job that they started, or starting enforcement action, using the bonds that are provided by developers for their intended purpose? I suggest strongly that it is the latter. <BR /> <BR />The reluctance to use enforcement powers may be connected to budget cuts.”
“I would ask the Minister how well that approach has been working. I do not think that it is working very well. We are talking here about private developers who fail to complete basic infrastructure works on a development because, often, they have gone bust or, as has been mentioned, because they simply lose interest and move on to the next project. <BR /> <BR />Those developers primarily care only about one thing, which is maximising their profits. They do not care about the chaos that they leave in their wake: those are problems for the residents or us, in this Building, to deal with. Private companies are literally profiting from the chaos that developers leave in their wake.”
“<BR /> <BR />As the proposer of the motion mentioned, some residents who live in unadopted streets are forced to take measures into their own hands that they would not normally do, including wheeling full bins of rubbish down steep lanes, causing all sorts of problems and health risks. The private streets Order provides DFI with powers to begin enforcement action, using a bond, as was mentioned, provided by the developer to fund the completion of roads and footpaths. However, what use are the powers to begin enforcement action if the Minister and the Department fail to use them enough? I do not think that they are being used adequately. The Minister previously said:”
“Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I am happy to support the motion, obviously. I think that the amendment strengthens it: I am glad that the proposers of the motion accept the amendment, and I hope that the House does as well. <BR /> <BR />The issue of unadopted roads, developments and alleyways is one that affects our communities on a daily basis, my constituency included. Unadopted roads and alleyways present major health and safety issues for local communities, such as deep potholes, raised manhole covers, bad paving, poor or no street lighting, flooding, poor drainage and backed-up sewers: the list goes on and on. Those are all health risks as well as a nuisance to experience and live with.”
“The Executive owe the public honesty and transparency about the implications of their decision-making, and they should be clear about the consequences of years of reconfiguration, privatisation and underinvestment and the impact that all that has on people's clinical outcomes, quality of life and health inequalities.”
“Being open and honest about unethical and unacceptable behaviour should be the norm. There should be a culture of transparency and accountability that allows workers to feel safe in speaking out and not to be targeted or victimised. <BR /> <BR />The ultimate focus of the duty of candour should extend beyond the workers on the front line to HSC bodies, organisations and senior management. A separate duty of candour should also apply to Ministers, who should have an obligation to be open and honest about the issues plaguing our health and social care system. A duty of candour might compel Ministers to explain cuts and closures, the downgrading of services and the creeping privatisation of our health and social care system and its effect on the standard of care.”
“That has long been fought for by working-class communities who experienced tragic injustice and had their good name besmirched by a rotten Tory Government.”
“Our health and social care system must develop a culture of openness and learning to improve patient safety, and an organisational duty of candour will be part of the change that is needed. <BR /> <BR />The Department of Health's 2021 consultation on the introduction of a duty of candour was severely lacking in detail about how the duty would be implemented and who would be responsible for its outworkings. It cannot be left to the underpaid, understaffed and overstretched workers on the front line. It should fall to the departmental heads, permanent secretaries and senior staff in the Department. <BR /> <BR />I also support the call for the Executive, as the motion says, to:”
“How many issues around standards of care and safeguarding are caused here? It is a system that breaks its promise to maintain pay parity for workers — I direct Members to their inboxes. <BR /> <BR />As people have said, we also need to see systemic culture change across our health and social care system. That is badly needed. It is basic common sense that our health and social care organisations and senior managers should reflect on existing systems and procedures when things go wrong. That does not always happen, to put it mildly. Workers report a culture of corporate protection, blame and cover-up on the part of senior managers in health and social care bodies. I have heard that far too many times.”
“I agree with the Member, and proper budgets that properly fund our health service are needed too. I agree with the Member on disappointment about the lack of legislation. <BR /> <BR />In the context of these broader pressures and systemic failings, it is unsurprising that mistakes are made. However, the focus should not be solely on the individual worker who is dealing with an unsustainable workload, persistently low pay and high pressure. The focus should be on the wider system that brings about those conditions. This is a health and social care system with — the last time that I checked — over 5,000 vacancies. That is just crazy. We have a system that contracts private companies to provide social care services and tells workers to deliver complex personal care during 15-minute home visits.”
“However, in reality, health and social care workers are scared to speak up because they know that they will be bullied and intimidated by management if they do. Multiple health unions have reported that their members do not feel supported enough to raise issues about unsafe staffing levels and high vacancy rates. Unsafe staffing levels, as has been mentioned, is just one factor contributing to massive amounts of pressure on the workforce. In the context of the —.”
“Being open and honest when things go wrong is definitely the right thing to do, and I pay tribute to all the families who have campaigned for that — the families of former patients of Dr Watt, the Roberts family and all those who have been mentioned so far. <BR /> <BR />As the motion states, the vast majority of health and social care workers are committed to providing the highest quality of care. Many already work according to professional codes of practice under a de facto individual duty of candour, and placing a duty of candour for individuals and organisations on a statutory footing may help to ensure that more patients and their families get the honesty and transparency that they deserve.”
“To my and anybody else's reading, that sounds like the House asked him to review it. Can I ask for the record to be corrected in that regard?”
“On a point of order, Madam Principal Deputy Speaker. I believe that, at Question Time, the Education Minister misled the House by saying that the House did not pass a motion last week calling for him to review the eligibility criteria for the RAISE programme. The motion, which was passed last week:”
“I think that it did. Throughout the debate, Members made the point that they are for a change to the eligibility criteria. Can the Minister therefore confirm that no changes will be made to the criteria?”
“Minister, you said that Departments will have to make savings. You cannot issue a diktat to cut budgets and then wash your hands of the consequences. It is, by any definition, austerity. I share the concerns about money not being allocated to health workers who were promised it. <BR /> <BR />Minister, is the £17 million to mitigate the Executive's cut in winter fuel payments recurrent or a one-off?”
“I hope that her friends and colleagues can be proud of that legacy and of so much more that she did. I express my condolences on her sad passing.”
“It would have been easier for her to keep her head down and not speak up about women's reproductive rights, but keeping quiet was not what she did and rightly so. Before I was an MLA, some party activists and I were involved in some anti-racist activity with Anna Lo around, I think, 2014. We worked with Anna, speaking on platforms and organising protests that said that all racialised minorities were welcome in Belfast and beyond. It was really important. That was not the sum of her work, but it was an important part of it. Our city and our society are better for the work that Anna did. She was an important figurehead for anti-racist sentiment in Belfast and beyond, and that is more important today than it was in 2007 when she first became an MLA.”
“I extend my sympathies to Anna's family, friends and all her Alliance Party colleagues on her very sad passing. <BR /> <BR />There is no doubt that Anna was a tenacious trailblazer. She had many barriers in her way that were put in place by a society that makes life harder for women, particularly women from a racialised minority. One can only imagine the barriers and obstacles that Anna had to face and overcome every day, especially as an elected representative. She had to face brutal racism and hatred, but she stood against hatred, racism and the bullies. She was absolutely brave in doing so. <BR /> <BR />From my memory, Anna was one of the first pro-choice MLAs — certainly the first that I saw — to speak in support of reproductive rights.”
“People pay their taxes, their rates and their fair share, and Moy Park should do the same. We should never forget that, under the watchful eye of the Executive, whilst empty chicken sheds were heated, thousands of people died every year because of fuel poverty.”
“The Audit Office reported difficulties in accessing sufficient and adequate information as part of its review. Again, that is shocking but, in this place, not surprising. <BR /> <BR />As Members have said, the Executive subcommittee on reform last met in December 2020. Given the endless obfuscation, dither and delay in implementing the report's recommendations, it is time that that subcommittee is re-established and that all the recommendations from the Audit Office report are implemented. <BR /> <BR />It is also worth mentioning that it was recently announced that Moy Park, which was central to the RHI scheme and had half of its poultry houses benefiting from it, had made mega profits. Our public services and citizens should not be at the mercy of dangerous and profitable corporations like Moy Park.”
“The RHI inquiry report stated that departmental project boards should have representation from people who are not responsible for day-to-day project management and who can challenge decision-making. Again, the Audit Office says that that recommendation is unlikely to ever be implemented. <BR /> <BR />It is worth remembering that the key architect of the RHI scheme has embarked on a career as a public speaker. Arlene Foster recently advertised herself as a renewable energy expert for a fee of £10,000 a day: you could not make this stuff up. The Executive have not only failed to learn lessons from RHI, but some are literally capitalising on it. The term "failing upwards" comes to mind. The Executive also appear to be obstructing access to key information, as others have mentioned.”
“The fact that not reading the legislation was one of the key defences of the proponents of RHI at the time, and that that recommendation has not been implemented, is absolutely mind-boggling. There was a cacophony of excuses from the head of the Civil Service when I asked her why it had not been implemented. I am still none the wiser. Children are often scolded for not reading their homework, but Ministers who do not read their legislation are told, "Keep on not doing that". The fact that the Executive are incapable of meeting such a basic requirement beggars belief. <BR /> <BR />Another important recommendation that has yet to be acted on relates to the need for a level of independent scrutiny.”
“As we have heard, the Audit Office found that only 26 of 42 recommendations from the RHI inquiry report have been implemented more than four years after its conclusion and at a cost of tens of millions of pounds to the taxpayer, and that, based on the action to date, it is unlikely that all the inquiry's recommendations will ever be met in full — maybe that is the intention. The report uncovered an unacceptable lack of progress but also found that basic record-keeping by Stormont Departments has got worse since 2022, which is shocking but will maybe not be surprising to those who have received some interesting answers to Assembly questions in recent months. <BR /> <BR />At the Finance Committee recently, I highlighted the fact that recommendation 39 of the report has still to be implemented. Recommendation 39 states:”
“I wonder how far the £1·3 million will go, given the prevalence of debt in our communities. Will the Minister clarify whether that money includes training for new staff? In light of his announcement, how will he ensure that people get access to independent advice, including supporting people who may not feel comfortable going to get advice in churches?”
“I appreciate the Member giving way. On the theme of facts, facts, facts that the Minister alluded to, does the Member think that people may have gathered the Minister's intention on the basis of the list of schools that were deemed eligible put on the Department of Education website by the Minister's staff and team? Is that how people have drawn the conclusion that, as you said, some wealthy schools are gaining and some schools are not? It is from the Minister's own intervention that people have drawn those conclusions.”
“Minister, do you have any indication that there will be money to mitigate or reinstate the winter fuel payment or to mitigate or abolish the two-child tax limit?”
“If my TD colleagues are returned in the general election in the South, we will be raising this further and criticising the Minister's approach to it.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Minister recently gave the go-ahead for capital investment in seven schools out of a list of 28 that were identified in 2022. Again, questions are being asked about the Minister's methodology and how the Department has ranked the schools in need of investment. <BR /> <BR />The £20 million mentioned about the RAISE programme is obviously funded by the Irish Government through the Irish fund.”
“<BR /> <BR />The proposer of the motion also raised the issue of academic selection, and again — surprise, surprise — there is no sign from the Minister that he intends to end academic selection. It is worth repeating that academic selection perpetuates division and inequality. It amplifies middle-class advantage and acts as a barrier to a more inclusive education system. In that context and in the absence of plans to scrap academic selection, primary schools and non-selective secondary schools mitigate the worst impacts of our unequal system. When it comes to tackling educational disadvantage, our primary and non-selective secondary schools always do the heavy lifting. A scheme that fails to recognise that basic fact and fails to give those schools the resources that they desperately need is doomed to fail.”
“The scheme should benefit schools in deprived areas, including West Belfast, Ligoniel, Strabane, Downpatrick, South Down and West Winds Primary School in Newtownards as well, and its failure to do so is an indictment of the Minister's priorities and political decision-making. The Department has said that the fact that a school is not on the list of those eligible for funding does not mean that it cannot be involved in the programme. That is an attempt at damage limitation, to be frank. <BR /> <BR />It would be helpful if the Minister could explain in what capacity schools in deprived communities might eventually be allowed to avail themselves of a programme to tackle educational underachievement and disadvantage, despite it appearing that they were not allowed to apply in the first place.”
“<BR /> <BR />Free school meals uptake is not a perfect indicator of deprivation, but it has worked well for some time. When it was the primary measure of deprivation, areas with some of the highest levels of poverty and housing need actually received funding. In effect, the Minister has made active, conscious choices to extend funding to wealthier communities and schools at the expense of making schools in deprived areas ineligible for funding. That is totally unacceptable. <BR /> <BR />The Minister has highlighted the fact that the scheme extends across the North, rather than focusing only on urban areas, but it is still possible to have a programme that benefits working-class communities across the North.”
“Some may even be eligible for free school meals, but, despite what the Minister says, RAISE is not simply about extending funding to more schools and more communities. Fundamentally, it is an initiative to tackle deprivation that sees grammar and fee-paying schools eligible for funding. The scheme includes the third most affluent school in the North, where just 4% of pupils are eligible for free school meals. It also happens to be in the Minister's constituency. At the same time, schools such as Bunscoil an tSléibhe Dhuibh, where 60% of pupils are entitled to free school meals are ineligible. Square that circle, please. That seems totally counter-intuitive for a programme that aims to tackle educational underachievement and deprivation.”
“The Minister has failed to explain his rationale for using new methodologies to define, identify and measure deprivation and educational underachievement. Under the new RAISE indicators, we see grammar and fee-paying schools in the lists of those eligible for funding. It is notable that the indicative list of eligible schools, which included 40 grammar schools and a prep school, as has been said, now appears to be gone from the DE website. To put it mildly, that suggests serious discomfort and a lack of confidence in the methodology used to identify the schools, or, to put it bluntly, the Minister has a bit of egg on his face. <BR /> <BR />There is no doubt that some pupils in grammar and maybe even in fee-paying schools may experience poverty.”
“<BR /> <BR />Given the disgraceful role of the state in Spain, I want to pay tribute to and recognise the role of all those volunteers and activists who helped out, who pulled bodies out from under cars and rubble and who have provided safety and refuge. What happened was an absolute tragedy: it was horrific and apocalyptic but, unfortunately, it will become the norm if Governments here do not act swiftly to prevent climate change.”
“Whilst there were warnings about the weather becoming more extreme last week, the Government refused to act. They refused to close schools or to tell people not to go to work, which was, in effect, a death sentence for so many. They said that the economy is not to be touched, and they said that it was business as usual. Really, what we have seen is a combination of neoliberal capitalism and climate denial leading to the deaths of hundreds of people. That is an absolute tragedy, but a preventable one. Whilst billionaires stayed at home, workers had to traverse treacherous weather conditions.”
“<BR /> <BR />There is no doubt that the extreme weather is directly connected to climate change. Warmer air holds more rain and, combined with the higher temperature of the Mediterranean Sea, it has created extreme weather patterns. In particular, we also have to criticise the role of the conservative party in Valencia, whose president abolished Valencia Emergency Unit, which was designed to help prevent and tackle wildfires and floods. I join the calls of many in the region to say, Mazón, dimisión.”
“The horrifying scenes that are coming out of Valencia and the wider region, where people are fleeing for their lives after flash floods have occurred, are a glimpse into our future if Governments do not act to prevent climate change. I want to express my heartfelt sympathy to and solidarity with the families of the, at least, 214 people who have been killed. People should not be killed because of bad weather. It is not solely the weather that has created so many casualties but the Spanish Government's refusal to act quickly or to properly invest in flood prevention and other protective measures. That has effectively ensured that hundreds of people have died when there should not have been a single casualty. The Spanish state has blood on its hands.”
“What did they know beforehand? Did they protect their handler and let a massacre go ahead when they could have stopped it? Those questions need to be answered, and I call on the supposed human rights supporting Prime Minister to release the files. However, given his recent announcements, I would question whether he is still interested in human rights. I am happy to support the motion.”
“<BR /> <BR />We also should not forget the state's role in supporting and allowing paramilitary violence and the beating of people on the streets — Catholic, Protestant and neither — who dared to demand an end to discrimination. We should not forget that violence and the role played by the state in encouraging, supporting and, in many cases, taking part in it. <BR />We also should not forget the words of the sole survivor of the Kingsmills massacre, Alan Black, who has been mentioned a lot today, and rightly so. He has questioned the role of informers who were working for the security forces. I ask who knew what, and why have they not released the files? How much involvement did MI5 or the security forces have in the killing of 10 people at Kingsmills?”
“<BR /> <BR />Sectarian killings in the 1970s sparked further sectarian killings and led to a dead end and a depressive cycle of tit for tat. We all know that before the Kingsmills massacre the O'Dowd and Reavey families lost loved ones. Too many families and communities are left with the scars of paramilitary violence, and, too often, politicians use that real pain, not to build a consensus to bring people together but to keep the division going. All sectarian killings are wrong and cannot be justified, and we should oppose them whenever they occur. That is true, whether we are talking about today or 50 years ago, because too many people are living with the scars and the hurt.”
“The killing of 10 innocent people in the Kingsmills massacre almost 50 years ago was wrong, sectarian and should be condemned outright. The families who lost loved ones and the sole survivor of the attack all deserve justice, and they all deserve to receive an accurate account of what happened on that awful night and why it happened. They deserve to have all the files and documentation released to help them to achieve closure if that is what they need and if that is even possible. All victims of violence deserve to have their pain and anguish recognised and to have the information on the particular killings that have impacted on them released. That is true of the Kingsmills families, the Ballymurphy massacre families or whomever else.”
“I remind the Member that his party is in the Executive with one of those parties, just in case he forgot.”
“A third of our local workforce commutes into Belfast every day, and many others use public transport to get around the city. The high street task force recommended that the Executive implement an investment programme for blue-green infrastructure and sustainable public transport. Two and a half years later, we are still waiting for delivery. Free public transport should, ultimately, be the aim. <BR /> <BR />Thanks for the debate. I appeal to Members to support my amendment, and I am happy to support the others.”
“I respectfully say that it was a bit bizarre that the Member for North Antrim quoted the ICTU policy when the parties opposite seem happy to go against trade unions and workers' issues. That is a bit of a shame, but I welcome the support for the amendment. <BR /> <BR />Phillip Brett mentioned the pedestrianisation of Hill Street and other areas, which I and my party support. <BR /> <BR />People in city and town centres experience homelessness while buildings lie empty. That was not really mentioned in the debate, but it should be a source of shame for the Executive. A housing-first approach would help support people who are experiencing homelessness, tackle the issue and see housing as a human right. <BR /> <BR />Public transport was not mentioned in detail. Obviously, we desperately need to invest in our public transport system.”
“That is in part because of weather conditions, but if it is good enough for workers in those countries, why can workers here not have extended time when they are not in work? <BR /> <BR />I agree with Members' concerns about plans to erode existing Sunday trading hours. I mentioned Alliance's support for changing the hours, which has been pretty consistent over the years, although I oppose it. Through the debate, we learned that Sinn Féin members of Belfast City Council supported a Sunday trading hours pilot. I am not sure whether there has been a change in Sinn Féin's position — I am happy to give way if anybody wants to clarify that — but I think that it is a bad move. Some may ask, "What is the harm in commissioning a bit of research?", but why waste time and money on a bit of research for a pilot scheme that nobody wants?”
“For some, that may be the case, and on the side of big employers at that, but I do not think that that is acceptable, given the pressures that workers face and the fact that they are keeping our city centres alive despite challenges. Without those workers, however, there are no city and town centres of which to speak. <BR /> <BR />It is often presented as a modernising idea that we should squeeze every possible hour out of workers and that they should be in work every hour of every day of the week. That idea is unpopular with workers in the sector. They are opposed to it, as I stated earlier. It is also out of step with practices in other countries. In Spain, France and many other countries, people have longer breaks during the day.”