Gordon Lyons
East Antrim · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“Implementing other recommendations will require further legislation that, I trust, will come in the next mandate, but I can confirm that 60 of the recommendations have already been separately addressed by either the Department or the commission. I hope that that answers his questions.”
“Yes, I do and am happy to share those. The issue has been raised in the Chamber and through Assembly questions. My position is that we want to make it simple and straightforward for people.”
“They also introduce greater flexibility in financial reporting, allowing requirements to be tailored more appropriately, reducing burdens on smaller organisations and ensuring that the system can adapt over time through secondary legislation.”
“If they want to constitute as a Northern Ireland-only charity, they are able to do that, if they believe that that will bring certain benefits.”
“That is similar to what we are trying to do with trustees. Even though you leave your position as a trustee or your position as someone who holds an office in a charity or who has employment in the office, the commissioner will still be able to make a determination that says, "Even though you have left, we are still making this order to t…”
“I do not believe that it was. That was maybe picked up wrong. We are happy to look at and explore that, but that is the information that I have on it. Again, we will have the Committee Stage of the legislation, so we can look into that then.”
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“Yes. I do not intend to change the energy efficiency standards of social homes. We want to make sure that our homes are as energy efficient as possible. However, some additional measures have been put in, for example, around lifetime homes. I want to make sure that we have provision for disabled people in Northern Ireland, but it does not make sense to ensure that every home is built to that standard when doing so could add considerable cost to a home that, over its lifetime, may never be used for that purpose. <BR /> <BR />We need to be smarter in how we build our homes and how we allocate them. If we can build more homes that are appropriate for people, we should do so, rather than have a one-size-fits-all model that ends up being more expensive.”
“It is complex. In essence, there are total cost indicators (TCIs) and the housing association grant (HAG). The HAG reflects the uplifts that are identified by the Central Procurement Directorate's housing advisory unit. The HAG rate reflects the 30th percentile of rents and the average borrowing rate of 3·5%. Those are the benchmarks that are used to determine what is required, taking rental figures into consideration. <BR /> <BR />I am happy to provide the Member with more detailed information on that. It is not straightforward for those who are not involved in it every day, but it can be clearly set out. I will be happy to provide that to the Member, as I will to the Committee. I will perhaps also put it in the Assembly Library.”
“I am not always looking for more money; I am also looking for ways in which we can reduce costs. That is why today's announcement is so important.”
“If we had maintained the grant rate where it was, we would be building fewer homes, and that would not be good value for money. That is why we have brought forward these measures today. Maintaining the grant rate would have meant fewer homes. The changes mean that we will not only keep up with what we have done in the past but be able to build more homes. <BR /> <BR />We are also looking at the design guides and standards. That is important. Housing associations have told me that the guides require many things that are not really necessary or value for money. That is why I want to work with them. If they say that they can build more homes at better value and that not all homes need to be built to the same specification, I want to help them with that.”
“We will explore every option, as we are not yet at the stage of identifying sites, but that new and innovative way of doing things could go a long way to contributing to the proportion of the cost that would fall to government. It will enable us to build more homes. That is being discussed, and I hope that it can be progressed soon.”
“I have been engaging with the Department of Finance on the matter. It is complex, but we are getting to a good spot. I have not been directly involved in identifying such land, but the Housing Executive has some information. Moreover, the Department of Finance and, in particular, Land and Property Services (LPS) have information about where that land would be. As time goes on, we will be able to identify land that would make good sites for social housing. Ultimately, we need public subsidy in order to build social housing. If Executive colleagues say that they do not have any capital or cannot give up any in order for us to build, I will lean on them and say, "There's a site that you have" or, "Here's another way in which you can help".”
“I am happy to confirm that there is, as the Member would expect, regular engagement with housing associations. We hold quarterly meetings at official level, and I meet housing associations individually and collectively. The matter has been on the radar, and the housing associations have for some time been aware of the options that were in front of me. I met them a few weeks ago to outline the rationale behind what I am doing and the justification for it. I will continue to work with them. It will ultimately be for them to decide where they put their funding and where they build. They have the capacity to do that, however. The private finance is available that will allow us to do what this is ultimately all about, which is building more social homes.”
“The new rate will take effect from 1 December, so it will not affect houses that are already under construction or that begin construction before that date. Yes, the housing associations have the capacity. The borrowing facility is there, and the banks are satisfied that they will be able to provide the money. The Member talks about risk, but the bigger risk is in doing nothing, because that will result in fewer homes being built. <BR /> <BR />Time and again in the House, Members call for action — for things to happen — and action is what I am taking today. I am taking action to make sure that we build more social homes.”
“There is huge value from homebuilding for those who get the houses. That is why I have placed such emphasis on making sure that we have houses. I have said time and again in the Chamber that someone having a safe and warm home in which to live and grow up helps their life chances, and it takes pressure off other Departments. Huge economic value also comes from housebuilding in Northern Ireland. In 2024-25, the estimated economic impact of the social housing development programme was over £1 billion. It needs to be kept in mind that we are not just providing additional homes for people but creating economic benefit.”
“Altogether, there is a package of measures that, along with the changes that I have outlined, will have a net benefit and allow us to build more social homes, which is what it is all about. We have a target, and I am determined that we do everything in our power to meet it. Some of that is outside my control, but I will play my part, and today is another example of how I am working to achieve that.”
“I am confident that the borrowing capacity exists for housing associations to continue doing their work and, through the changes, make sure that we are building more homes. It is right that we share the burden, and I commend housing associations for the work that they have done, often in challenging circumstances. However, we all need to do more, which is why I have asked housing associations to shoulder more as we move forward. <BR /> <BR />Of course, in return, there will be additional benefits for them. We are looking more widely at the design guides, including Secured by Design, and are providing housing associations with the stability of knowing what is coming.”
“The Member has already has his opportunity to ask the question. <BR /> <BR />I am not cutting the money that is going to housing associations; the £177·5 million is still there. I am cutting the amount per unit, so that other sources of private funding can be looked at. The Member seems to be annoyed about what I am doing, but it is quite clear that if I stuck with the status quo, not only would we not be building more homes, we would be building fewer homes because the costs have gone up. Those costs cannot be left in their entirety for the Department to shoulder. What I am proposing is fair and will enable more homes to be built and more investment in public housing.”
“Rents have already gone up, which is one of the reasons why I am taking action today. Ultimately, success will be measured by the number of additional homes that would not otherwise have been delivered if we had stuck with the status quo. I am not cutting the funding for housing associations.”
“Those are changes that we needed, and I will continue to bring in changes so that we can deliver more for the people of Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />I have played my part. Now it is time for the House and my Executive colleagues to rise to the challenge and take the decisive action that is needed to ensure that our shared ambition truly meets the needs of the people of Northern Ireland. I commend the statement to the House.”
“I can assure the House that I am committed to delivering value for money in the social housing development programme and to doing everything in my power to ensure that a sufficient budget allocation is made to enable delivery of our PFG target. However, the House should take note that I am not prepared to keep doing things the way that we have always done them. I will always seek to be innovative and to try new things to maximise delivery. That is what I have been doing since I took up post. I have used more financial transactions capital (FTC) for homes with cheaper rents; used the Northern Ireland Housing Executive's reserves to reduce temporary accommodation costs; done away with intimidation points to create a level playing field; and found new ways to subsidise public housing.”
“I have also written to the other Ministers in the Executive to seek their support for a sufficient budget allocation to the social housing development programme to enable delivery against our commitments. I unashamedly make that case again today.”
“My housing supply strategy provides the framework for how we can do that, and, collectively, the Executive have committed to it. The quality of actions to implement it will determine our success in delivering the strategy vision. <BR /> <BR />I require an action plan that demonstrates real intent to remove barriers. Therefore, as it moves closer to being finalised, I have written to my ministerial colleagues to challenge them to propose actions that will genuinely deliver progress in meeting the significant challenges that we face.”
“<BR /> <BR />Earlier this year, I chaired a housing round-table meeting that brought together key stakeholders to share knowledge on how to increase social housing delivery in the current challenging environment. My officials are taking forward work with the Northern Ireland Housing Executive and the wider sector on proposals aimed at increasing or improving delivery of the new-build programme in future years. As previously advised, I am bringing a proposal to the Executive to make better use of public land in a way that can act in lieu of grant and support the delivery of more affordable homes. We must maximise supply with the resources that we have. The whole-system issues, such as waste water capacity, planning and land availability, must be addressed to unlock the homes that we need.”
“Our ambition is that at least some of the value-increasing measures that those reviews propose may be introduced to the development programme in the next financial year and that all the reviews are completed by September 2026. <BR /> <BR />Achieving the Programme for Government target of 5,850 social housing starts within this mandate will be extremely challenging, given the constrained budgets. Changes must be made. We must achieve more with less. I am fully committed to delivering on the PFG target and realising the longer-term ambition of the housing supply strategy to deliver at least 100,000 homes, of which one third will be social. Achieving those will require innovation and creativity and, ultimately, at the outset, adequate funding allocations.”
“The impact of that will be to make my budget allocation stretch further and enable us to build more homes with the funding that is available. I am asking housing associations to do more: drive innovation, find efficiencies and increase private financing to make up the small shortfall. However, let me be clear: I am not cutting funding to the programme. I am making changes to ensure that the £177·5 million allocated from my budget that will be spent this year on new social homes and the funds spent next year go as far as possible. Every new home matters. <BR /> <BR />I have listened to the housing association sector. That is why I have also announced reviews, which have been called for by the associations, of how we subsidise new-build social housing and the standards to which that housing is built.”
“As a result and in the interest of securing the maximum possible number of new social homes from the Department's budget, the proportion of grant paid by the Department for Communities for new social housing starts will decrease from an average of 54·2% to an average of 46·52%. To give certainty to the sector, those new benchmark costs and grant rates will be kept in place until the end of the 2026-27 financial year, unless there are very exceptional circumstances that require a change to the rates. <BR /> <BR />I have set out to the housing association sector my expectation that it, like the public sector, must deliver in challenging financial circumstances and strive for efficiencies. It will be for each individual housing association to decide how much private finance it can borrow and how much risk it can take on.”
“<BR /> <BR />New social homes are funded through a combination of grant from my Department and borrowing by the developing housing association, creating a match funding-style arrangement that gives value for the public money invested. Following careful consideration, I have decided to increase the benchmark costs — the assumed cost of building a new social home — by 13·7%, from an average of £181,164 to an average of £206,100. That reflects the increased costs to the sector due to inflationary increases, new building regulations and increases in Northern Ireland Electricity (NIE) connection charges, among other things. It is an acknowledgement that relevant costs have increased since the benchmark costs and grant rates were last changed, in 2023. However, while construction costs have increased, rents have also increased.”
“This is an opportunity to look at the programme afresh and identify opportunities to be creative. We need to do more with less, collectively working to address the barriers to finance and social housing supply. <BR /> <BR />I met the Northern Ireland Federation of Housing Associations (NIFHA), housing association representatives and the Northern Ireland Housing Executive in late October to give them advance notice of the changes that I have announced. At that meeting, I advised the sector of the new indicative costs and grant rates for new build social homes that will be effective from 1 December 2025 to the end of March 2027.”
“Despite my efforts to secure an adequate budget allocation to meet the need for new social homes and my intention to continue to maximise delivery, I, along with the sector, have not received sufficient capital allocations in any budget rounds. Every party in the Chamber talks of their passion for housing and support for more social homes. At the Executive, we agreed a housing supply strategy with clear targets for housebuilding. In the Programme for Government (PFG), one of the few targets agreed was on social housing, yet I continue to receive insufficient capital funding. I cannot be the only one to make the case for housing. <BR /> <BR />Today, I have taken the decision to review the funding allocation to housing associations to ensure that we get the most out of every pound that we spend.”
“I wish to make a statement to the Assembly on the funding and development of new social homes across Northern Ireland. I begin by recognising the efforts of our key partners in delivering new social homes via the new-build programme in times of constraint and uncertainty. The solid partnership arrangements between my Department, the Northern Ireland Housing Executive (NIHE) and housing associations ensure that there is a steady and increasing supply of new social homes for people on the waiting list. I am grateful for their steadfast commitment to delivering the programme. However, the Department and the sector face many challenges in relation to the budget required to support that work.”
“I have already addressed the issue of clear outcomes and measured targets, and I understand that in relation, in particular, to food and fuel poverty, which he raised as well. I also associate myself with his remarks in relation to unpaid carers. <BR /> <BR />My time is coming to a close. I finish with the hypocrisy of Mr O'Toole, who complains about air passenger duty, yet his own party members support flights between the City of Derry and Dublin. Perhaps we can have more consistency from the Member.”
“She is right to highlight some of the issues that she has. I have no issue whatsoever; I do not bristle whenever she mentions Scotland. I am dealing with the basis of reality and the evidence that has been presented. That has not been overwhelming, nor is it a long-term solution. Our energies and our focuses, first and foremost, should be put on where we can tackle those root causes. That is why the strategy is formatted in the way that it is as well. <BR /> <BR />I was also very taken by the comments made by Maurice Bradley, as I have already outlined. It is important that we support people into work. I have mentioned that already. I thank Andy Allen for recognising that work has been done and that it has been taken forward further than it ever has been before.”
“We could have developed a strategy that was a wish list with no recognition of reality. I could have made vague promises for action five or 10 years from now that no one would hold me to. I am not here to make empty promises. I want to make promises that I can deliver on. That is also why we will have an action plan that will be a living document that changes and develops as our evidence base evolves and, importantly, as resources become available. I encourage all Members in the Chamber to join in that work so that we can make a real difference. <BR /> <BR />I will make a couple of comments on some of the issues that were raised. I am very keen to make sure that we put in place those things that actually make a difference. Sian Mulholland raised that: she talked about the lived realities. Absolutely that has been taken on board.”
“That is the right thing to do. However, there will be more changes to come, because it was a genuine consultation; it was not the final product. We, as an Executive, said, "This is what we are able to do. This is what is funded. This is what we're putting forward. It's over to you — the public, and voluntary and community organisations — to have your say and tell us what you think". I look forward to the feedback's being published when it comes to support for the policies that we have set out. <BR /> <BR />Of course, we will consider and analyse different recommendations that come forward and see what is doable and what will make a change. I look forward to that as well. I am very keen that we do not simply put together a list of policies that might sit on the shelf, not be funded and not make a difference to people at all.”
“<BR /> <BR />I will address some of the concerns and the comments that were made about the anti-poverty strategy, although I sometimes question whether I should; I feel that, given that I have said it so many times in the House, Members are not listening any more. Of course, there will be measurable targets and outcomes in the final anti-poverty strategy and/or action plan. I am more than happy to make sure that we are held to account on those issues. The Executive are not responsible overall for poverty, because it is not only the Executive who tackle those issues; there will be other worldwide factors outside our control. However, we should be held to account, and there should be objective measures and targets, which need to be recognised and implemented. I have no issue whatsoever with those being included; they need to be.”
“That has the potential to be a real game changer, never mind others who could work but are not working. We need to do something about that issue. Not only does that help our economic return but it is better for people in the long run to be in employment — it is good for their health, including their mental health, and well-being. The stats are astounding. There is an exceptionally strong correlation between the number of people who are unemployed or not working and deprivation in certain areas. We see that in our constituencies. We know that the most deprived constituencies are often those that have the highest levels of economic inactivity, so let us do something about that. That will release the funds to do some of the other things that we want to do.”
“<BR /> <BR />We talk about the tens of millions of pounds — sometimes, the hundreds of millions of pounds — that we need to deal with some of the issues that we are facing. Look at the disability and work strategy, and the plan that we have: if we can get the number of disabled people in work from 40% up to 50%, that will generate savings of £750 million a year. That is massive. One reason why we are in the position that we are in and do not have enough money to do all the other things that we want to do is that we have to support so many people who, although they can and, often, want to work, have not been given the help and support that they need. That is why I extended the JobStart programme this year. We know how effective it has been: over 80% of people on it either stay in employment or go into further education or training.”
“I will do everything that I can on the issue because, if you get housing right and people have warm homes to live in, that will deal with so many of the other issues that we are facing. <BR /> <BR />We need to make sure that we have a strong and growing economy that provides well-paid jobs. Only a few Members touched on that issue during the debate. Maurice Bradley put it best when he said that we need to make sure that jobs are available to people and that there is a safety net if people cannot work. Working is the game changer. We have heard a bit about Tory austerity and the austerity from the current UK Government. We are in the difficulty that we are in right now because growth has been so low and because there are so many people who have not been helped and supported into work.”
“I have had conversations at ministerial level to highlight the demand that we have and make sure that that is met. Returns are also submitted to make sure that we can achieve our housing targets. More than that, I am not just saying, "Give me more money"; I am saying, "What are the other ways in which we can subsidise housing? How can other Departments help, maybe with public land?" If they are not able to give up cash, perhaps we can look at the transfer of public land. I hope that that will get Executive approval. Look at what we are doing to utilise financial transactions capital for intermediate rent in particular — a new programme has been brought in — and at what I am doing to revitalise the Housing Executive.”
“Again, I appeal to the Finance Minister and other Ministers to ensure that we have the money that we need to deliver properly on our housing targets.”
“It is one of the most effective ways in which to ensure that we get support to those who need it most. Make the Call generated £62·1 million extra of annualised benefits for 12,025 people in 2023-24. <BR /> <BR />Vital work is being carried out by voluntary and community organisations. Once again, I express my gratitude to those from that sector who continue to provide support and advice, which supplements what government can deliver. <BR /> <BR />Finally, one of the most important things that my Department does is help people to ensure that they have a safe and secure home to live in. Good housing is fundamental to the health and well-being of any society. Consistently, it seems as though I am the only one who is talking about that. I want to ensure that we have sufficient money for the social housing development programme.”
“Since its launch in 2015, the affordable warmth scheme has supported over 30,000 households, with more than £136 million invested to date. The discretionary support scheme delivers tens of millions of pounds of emergency financial assistance year after year. In 2025-26, £2·8 million was allocated to support social supermarket projects in every council area. There was a £100 winter fuel payment for every pensioner household in Northern Ireland after the SDLP's sister party decided to cut that support. That kind of support plays a vital role in safeguarding the well-being and dignity of people who are in financial distress, especially amid the ongoing cost-of-living crisis. <BR /> <BR />I ask everyone in the Chamber to remember the Make the Call service when they are speaking to constituents who are struggling.”
“We need them to come forward and use the Make the Call service to ensure that they get the support that they need. We need them to look at the opportunities that can be presented to them. <BR /> <BR />I will talk a bit more about the anti-poverty strategy shortly, but I want to first address some of the work that my Department is taking forward. Work on a fuel poverty strategy is well under way and due with the Executive before Christmas. Mr Gildernew, in particular, asked about that. That will contain a brand new energy efficiency scheme for low-income households. As I have said before, we cannot tackle poverty if we are not tackling fuel poverty. Fuel is one of the things that we spend most of our incomes on, so it is important that we tackle fuel poverty and bring that support forward.”
“It is true. It is also true that I was the one who brought forward the paper and secured that funding. Look, I am happy to work with others to ensure that that is the case. It is, however, important to remember that we all have to tackle poverty together. Even if we do that as an Executive, we alone cannot tackle it. It has been said in the Chamber that poverty is a political choice. With the best will in the world, and even with all the money that they have, the Executive are not going to be able to tackle poverty alone. It will require everybody working together; not just the Executive and voluntary and community organisations but the people who are affected. Many people out there are struggling with poverty, and there are things that we need them to do.”
“I do. I am grateful to the Member for doing that. Maybe it highlights the fact that it is only Sinn Féin that is unaware, or unwilling to admit, that it is an Executive strategy. I had to laugh when Mr Gildernew was speaking, actually, because he exposed that. When something good happens, the Executive can take the responsibility. When something bad happens, it is all down to me. He said that, in 2022, Deirdre Hargey brought forward welfare mitigations. However, last year, when I brought forward welfare mitigations, it was the Executive who did that. That exposes where he is coming from. Fair enough that he wants to highlight that, but the important —.”
“No further actions were added to it, and Ministers agreed that the strategy be published and go out for consultation. It is important that we recognise that it is not the strategy of one Minister alone. I am more than happy to take forward our proposal and stand in this place answering questions on it.”
“We all signed up to its publication and its going out to consultation. I asked all Executive parties whether they wanted further strategic actions to be included.”
“<BR /> <BR />We all know, as I certainly do from the contact that I have had with my constituents and with community and voluntary organisations, how deeply the increase in the cost of living is affecting everyone across Northern Ireland. Financial pressures are particularly acute as the winter weather sets in and as we find ourselves in the run-up to Christmas. The whole Executive, including Ministers from the party opposite, which tabled the motion, must recognise that. I have said this before, but I find myself having to repeat it: my Department alone cannot tackle poverty and socio-economic disadvantage. The motion mentions my anti-poverty strategy, but let me again remind Members — the SDLP did so, as did Kellie Armstrong — that all parties in the Executive have collective responsibility for the strategy.”
“Thank you very much indeed, Mr Deputy Speaker. I welcome the opportunity to respond to the debate. First, it is clear to everyone in the Chamber that we all care about the issue; of course we do. I certainly do not question anybody's determination or ambition to tackle it. We have deep care and compassion for those who suffer most, because we all, I hope, got into politics because we wanted to make people's lives better. That is certainly where I am coming from. I want to enhance and uplift our communities and make Northern Ireland the best possible place for people to live and bring up their families. I do not doubt the sincerity and commitment of others in the Chamber, and I trust that they do not doubt mine.”
“Of course I want to see more money for sport and sporting infrastructure. However, I am aware that there are other pressures in my Department and across the Executive. Do I want to see more money for sport in Northern Ireland? Absolutely. Should it be allocated on a fair and equitable basis? Absolutely. However, there is a huge financial requirement on us right now. Those increases in and of themselves will not meet some of that need. Those things have to be weighed up together.”
“It absolutely is the case that the funding is not worth as much as it was in 2011. That was the commitment that was made at that time, and I am disappointed that progress has not been made. In the case of the football fund, Ministers did not take it forward when they should have, and, in the case of Casement Park, Mr Durkan acted unlawfully and the project was held up for that reason. Obviously, any further allocations would be subject to Executive agreement, and we have to balance those against other pressures.”
“Obviously, all work with the Treasury goes through the Department of Finance. That is how the Executive operate. I assure the Member that there has been strong support from across the Executive, including me, for the issues that the Finance Minister is raising. I know that that does not bring much comfort to the organisations that are so badly affected, but it is clear that we need answers on the matter and very soon. I will play whatever role I can in that.”
“That is an issue about which we will all have been contacted. I am concerned about it because so many really good organisations that do brilliant work have had uncertainty for some time. There does not seem to be any clarification coming their way. The Executive, with the Finance Minister taking the lead, will continue to make those representations. Those organisations do brilliant work and deserve to have long-term certainty, which they do not have right now.”
“Yes, there certainly will be an evaluation. I hope that the scheme can be funded again next year. <BR /> <BR />I apologise that I did not answer the second part of the Member's first question, which was about funding from other Departments. I have had correspondence and discussions with the AERA Minister, and I will write to him formally to request his support for the fund because the majority of the applications come from rural communities. As the Member knows, the primary responsibility for policy in the area falls to DAERA. I hope that we can work together on the fund, because there is huge demand and it will have a hugely positive impact.”
“Yes. I am pleased to confirm that the fund has received over 800 applications. I am also encouraged by the fact that we have had interest from a wide range of sectors, spread across every council area in Northern Ireland. That is a clear indication that we have a great need for the fund, and my officials are working to ensure that it becomes a rolling programme of support, which is much needed by the voluntary and community sector.”