Gordon Lyons
East Antrim · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“Implementing other recommendations will require further legislation that, I trust, will come in the next mandate, but I can confirm that 60 of the recommendations have already been separately addressed by either the Department or the commission. I hope that that answers his questions.”
“Yes, I do and am happy to share those. The issue has been raised in the Chamber and through Assembly questions. My position is that we want to make it simple and straightforward for people.”
“They also introduce greater flexibility in financial reporting, allowing requirements to be tailored more appropriately, reducing burdens on smaller organisations and ensuring that the system can adapt over time through secondary legislation.”
“If they want to constitute as a Northern Ireland-only charity, they are able to do that, if they believe that that will bring certain benefits.”
“That is similar to what we are trying to do with trustees. Even though you leave your position as a trustee or your position as someone who holds an office in a charity or who has employment in the office, the commissioner will still be able to make a determination that says, "Even though you have left, we are still making this order to t…”
“I do not believe that it was. That was maybe picked up wrong. We are happy to look at and explore that, but that is the information that I have on it. Again, we will have the Committee Stage of the legislation, so we can look into that then.”
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“At the end of her contribution, she expressed concern that there will be the potential for different councils to take different approaches to how they put in place their standing orders for this issue. I think that I could have got criticism either way. If I had mandated the way that councils operate according to what I think is right and proper, I would have been in for criticism if I had limited it to the specific circumstances that I might think are appropriate. I believe in devolution and that people should be making their own decisions at the right level. I would not want anybody dictating to the House how we should do our business, and I do not think it right that I dictate to councils how they do theirs.”
“This legislation should not be seen as an alternative to ensuring that our chambers are fully accessible and that we have the support for those who are in them. In my opinion, it is second best to be at home doing this work remotely. I understand that there are times when that flexibility is necessary, but I always think that it is better to have people, where possible, in the chamber where the conversations are taking place and the decisions are being made. I do not want anybody to think in any way that we should not be doing everything that we can to make our council chambers accessible and to make it possible for people to gather around when business is being done. <BR /> <BR />That takes us on to an issue that Sian raised.”
“I welcome the level of consensus that we have across the Chamber on these regulations, and I place on record my thanks to the Chair of the Committee and the Committee more widely for the positive way in which they dealt with the issue. <BR /> <BR />I want to raise a few issues that were brought up during the debate. It is correct to say that greater flexibility is now on offer permanently to our borough and district councillors. However, a number of Members mentioned issues around, for example, disabilities. I do not want in any way the message to go out to councils that they can roll back on their responsibilities and statutory obligations because these regulations are now in place. Council chambers should still be accessible.”
“I understand that allowing each council to decide its arrangements for remote meetings may cause inconsistencies across councils. However, the intention of the regulations is to grant councils the flexibility to conduct their meetings in the way that best allows them to meet the needs of the council, its members and their constituents.”
“The conditions are the same as those that applied under the 2020 regulations. The draft regulations also provide for hybrid meetings. Regulation 2(1) provides that a reference to a council meeting is not limited to a meeting at which all persons in attendance are present in the same place. <BR /> <BR />The draft regulations contain one provision that was not in the 2020 regulations. A council will be required, for the sake of openness and transparency, to make standing orders about its arrangements for remote meetings, including those:”
“I also thank the Communities Committee for its scrutiny of the policy and the draft regulations. <BR /> <BR />The proposed regulations are based on and very similar to the regulations that were in operation until 6 March 2024. They apply to council meetings, including committee meetings, subcommittee meetings and joint committee meetings. They will enable councils to hold meetings remotely or by hybrid means by, for example, videoconferencing, telephone conferencing, live webcast or live interactive streaming. <BR /> <BR />The draft regulations also define the conditions that a council member must meet in order to attend a meeting remotely, namely that a member must be able to hear and be heard and, where practicable, to see and be seen by other members or by members of the public who are in attendance.”
“Councils welcomed the ability to hold remote or hybrid meetings, and the Department has received representations from the local government sector asking that that flexibility be made permanent. The draft regulations that are before the Assembly today will do just that. <BR /> <BR />Whilst there is no statutory requirement to consult on regulations that are made under the 2021 Act and no formal consultation was carried out, my officials have engaged with councils on the draft regulations. An initial draft of the regulations was issued to councils on 12 March for comment, and a revised draft, taking account of comments that were received, was issued to councils on 3 May. Officials also engaged on the draft regulations with council legal officers. I thank councils for their responses on the draft regulations.”
“I am pleased to bring the statutory rule (SR) to the Assembly for approval today. The draft regulations were laid before the Assembly on 7 June 2024 and are subject to the draft affirmative resolution procedure. The purpose of the draft regulations is to give councils the flexibility to hold meetings by remote or hybrid means. They will be made under the Local Government (Meetings and Performance) Act (Northern Ireland) 2021. <BR /> <BR />As Members will be aware, during the pandemic, provision was made under the Coronavirus Act 2020 to allow councils to hold remote or hybrid meetings. The Local Government (Coronavirus) (Flexibility of District Council Meetings) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2020 were introduced as a temporary measure under section 78 of the Coronavirus Act 2020 and were in operation until 6 March 2024.”
“I am grateful to the Member for raising that issue. It is not something that I have been made aware of. Unfortunately, from time to time, people find themselves, either through fraud or error, in a position where they have to repay. That is something that we are trying to limit, and a number of questions have been asked in relation to carer's allowance in particular. I am more than happy to look into the specific issue that the Member raised and see what can be done or what workaround can be put in place. If somebody has been affected in that way, with someone else being reimbursed on their behalf and the payment not being passed on, that is completely unacceptable. I am more than happy to engage with the Member and see what we can put in place to make sure that the issue can be resolved.”
“He will be aware of the constrained budget position that we are operating in. However, there are always novel ways in which we can examine those issues. If the Member would like to discuss the matter further, I will be happy to do that, perhaps along with some of the other Members who have raised issues about facilities today. <BR /> <BR />If I have forgotten anybody who is competing at the Olympics, we wish them all the very best and look forward to many medals being brought home in the coming weeks.”
“I am grateful to the Member for his question, which highlights a number of issues. First, the need for us to make sure that we are investing in sport in Northern Ireland. We have already highlighted the importance of grassroots sport, and that needs to continue. We also have a responsibility to make sure that the appropriate facilities are there so that we can help our elite athletes. I am disappointed to hear that that continues to be an issue. It is not fair: not having the proper training facilities harms the potential of some of our athletes. <BR /> <BR />The Member has identified the need in swimming, but I have been informed of problems elsewhere, where the physical facilities have not been available or there has not been the coaching capacity to make the most of the potential of some of our athletes.”
“Again, that is not a difficult question to answer, especially when there is a constituency link. The Member will not be surprised to hear that I do not disagree with him. Of course, I absolutely want to congratulate them, and I look forward to seeing further success. In fact, I will be meeting them very soon.”
“That data is important, and we have it to an extent in the Department, but it is an interesting idea to make sure that we have that across the Executive, because it is important that we are able to define exactly what the problem is, understand how we fix it and measure that against the targets that we set. Having the data will be important to doing that.”
“That is certainly an important part of the work that we do in the Department for Communities. Monitoring the impact of our work is very important, and we want to make sure that we have robust data when it comes to measuring the impact of the Executive's anti-poverty strategy in the short, medium and longer term. To support the development of the anti-poverty strategy, departmental officials have conducted a number of research projects as part of DFC's economic and social research programme. The research has shown that many factors are identified across the literature that increase the risk of falling into poverty. Many have been found to stem from early years, with multiple childhood factors heavily affecting the risk of poverty in the future.”
“I want to make sure that, as an Executive, we have alignment of approach, and a focus on prevention and early intervention will be essential.”
“Poverty has costs to the individual and to society as a whole. Research shows clear evidence that poverty affects a child's start in life. It increases the risk of poor health and well-being and of below-average educational outcomes, and it can impact on development in a child's early years. It is equally clear that intervening early to address the issues that people suffering socio-economic disadvantage face will have long-term positive impacts on those individuals, potentially freeing resources for use elsewhere. I am therefore determined to deliver an Executive anti-poverty strategy that helps children and young people to get the best possible start in life, have the opportunity to live in safe, stable homes, have a good education and get a good job. Those issues can be tackled only by collective action by our Executive.”
“I would be more than happy to do that. Perhaps the Member will get in contact with my private office so that we can get the arrangements made.”
“Although that matter has not come across my desk to date, I will be more than happy to get additional information or meet the Member to discuss it further. Whether people from Northern Ireland have to go to another jurisdiction or even to a town that is further away from them in order to compete or train, I do not think that that is acceptable. I want to make sure that we have the facilities for our sports here in Northern Ireland, and I am committed to doing what we can within the budget envelope that we have to make sure that we deliver in that way.”
“Moreover, if that money were not made available, I would simply be pushing problems on to other Departments — I would impact even more on the Department of Health and, in many cases, the Department of Justice — so the approach that I am taking to spending public funds is to make sure that they go to where they make the greatest difference. I know that others will not be happy with some of the outcomes and that we will face an awful lot of difficulty, but, as the Member set out, we need to make sure that we spend money where it can make the most difference.”
“Yes. The Member is absolutely right to raise the issue because we are in an era of constrained budgets, so it is important that we spend every pound as wisely as we can and in a way that most benefits people in Northern Ireland. Those are really difficult decisions. None of the budget process was easy. We have many good programmes that deliver for people across Northern Ireland, and it was a very difficult budgetary process, but I decided to increase the funding that is available for Supporting People because it makes a real impact and changes lives.”
“That funding, which the Northern Ireland Housing Executive distributed to accredited providers, was to help sustain those vital housing support services and support providers during the difficulties of the current economic situation. Notwithstanding the significant budgetary constraints this year, I have decided to provide a £4·8 million increase in funding for the Supporting People programme that goes above the 2023-24 final equality impact assessment budget position in order to help ensure its continued viability.”
“The Supporting People programme is a vital service that provides invaluable housing support to vulnerable people, enabling them to have better quality of life, live more independently in the community and maintain their tenancies. My Department works closely with the Housing Executive on resource allocation to analyse budget requirements and assess the impact of each year's DFC budget on the Supporting People programme. More than 70% of the Supporting People budget is used by providers to pay the salaries of Supporting People staff across 850 services. In March 2024, I announced £3 million of additional funding for the Supporting People programme for the 2023-24 financial year.”
“It is worth reminding ourselves of something that was certainly made clear to me when I was at the Sports Institute. We think of the individual athletes, but there is an incredible team behind every one of those athletes, and they deserve our thanks and appreciation for the work that they do. <BR /> <BR />I get some difficult questions in the House. Am I willing to wish Rhys well? Yes, I absolutely am.”
“Yes, absolutely. I wish him all the best — not just him, but all those from Northern Ireland who are competing in the games. Rhys is a fantastic athlete and an incredible competitor. He has had huge success in Europe and at the Commonwealth Games and is an inspiration to many people across Northern Ireland. Of course, I absolutely want to wish him well. <BR /> <BR />I recently took the opportunity to visit the Sports Institute at the Jordanstown campus of Ulster University. It was great to meet those who are going to the Olympics or hoping to go to the Olympics. I hope that I speak on behalf of the House when I wish them all the very best in the coming months, not just at the Olympic Games, but at the Paralympic Games in August and September.”
“<BR /> <BR />By way of comparison, I can advise that, of the funding paid out that year, the Irish Football Association received £500,000, Ulster GAA received £440,000, Ulster Rugby received £450,000, golf received £264,000 and tennis received £52,000. The £1·37 million of capital investment programmes that were administered included the Building Better Sports Facilities programme, the Your School Your Club initiative, stadia safety and the renewable energy fund, and nine different sports have benefited.”
“Over the past three financial years, up to March 2024, Sport NI has issued Exchequer funding of almost £39·4 million and National Lottery funding of just over £17 million. That funding consisted of 3,394 grant awards to over 1,963 bodies, which included grassroots sports governing bodies. In 2023-24, Sport NI invested £7·1 million of National Lottery funding into 37 sports governing bodies, and that figure will increase to almost £8 million. In 2023-24, Sport NI awarded just over £1·37 million of capital funding for the purpose of improving sports facilities, including those that will benefit grassroots clubs.”
“Temporary accommodation is not suitable for any family, especially in the circumstances that the Member described. If she would like to meet me afterwards or to contact my office, I will make sure that we look into that and see what we might be able to do.”
“It has, for example, initiated a housing solutions task and finish group to look for alternative and more financially sustainable options. I have asked the Housing Executive to focus on that work and to provide me with monthly updates on the use of temporary accommodation. I assure the Member and, indeed, the rest of the House that I will do all that I can to get the issue under control.”
“We have an immediate issue with the use of non-standard temporary accommodation. It is not good for families — they need the security of their own homes — and it is very expensive. There are far too many households in temporary accommodation — almost 5,000 — and, on any night, there are between 400 and 500 in hotels and B&Bs. The average stay in temporary accommodation is now over 34 weeks. These are children who are not near their schools and people who are away from families and support networks and who are unable to get to work. <BR /> <BR />The Housing Executive assures me that the use of non-standard accommodation is only out of necessity and is due to unprecedented demand. The Housing Executive has made it clear that it is committed to reducing the use of non-standard accommodation.”
“Again, I make the point that, when it comes to the links that we are trying to exploit and develop here, it is not just about language. I am certainly not trying to pit one against the other. I want to make sure that Northern Ireland benefits from this. That is what I intend to do, especially when it comes to the culture, the heritage and the language, as well as the values that contributed so much to the development of the United States. <BR /> <BR />The language strategies are with officials, and they are being progressed. I will have an update for the House in due course.”
“We want to make sure that PRONI is ready to help them, because we understand how important ancestry and family history are to many tourists. The group is about making sure that we do everything we can to exploit the links that are there and the fantastic history and heritage that exist between Northern Ireland and the United States.”
“First, I do not think that this is just a language issue; it goes into heritage, history and culture as well. Secondly, I do not think that it is about excluding anybody or pitting one against the other. We have very distinct links with the United States that have not been exploited very much. We see the influence of Irish America. It is there, and that is to be welcomed. However, I do not think that the Ulster-Scots influence in the United States has been there. There is a lot more work that we can do. That is something that I want to see happen, and it is something that I hope will happen. It is about developing and building those relationships, all for the benefit of people here. That is why we have included the tourism organisations. We would love to see more people from the US come here.”
“Yes, absolutely. I agree with everything that the Member has said. First, I think that councils play a really important role in helping to foster those social and cultural links. The sister cities projects are a great example of how you can establish those, and I think of Belfast and Nashville in particular. <BR /> <BR />I also take on board what she said about the Ulster-Scots Community Network. It is key that it is involved. There is huge potential here to exploit all the links, and I do not think that we have maximised that potential. I would love to see everybody involved in making sure that we make the most of it, especially as we head towards the 250th anniversary of the signing of the Declaration of Independence.”
“It will promote the role of the Ulster-Scots early settlers in influencing American society and commemorate the 250th anniversary of American independence in 2026. I am excited about the opportunities to develop a greater understanding of Ulster-Scots links with the United States and to build new partnerships to achieve cultural, social and economic objectives.”
“<BR /> <BR />The success of the Ulster-Scots Agency’s recent exhibition at the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland (PRONI), which celebrated the role of the Ulster Scots in shaping the events leading to the US Declaration of Independence, highlights the opportunities. We need to do better at exploiting those opportunities and the incredible potential that exists. I am therefore delighted to announce today that I have established a United States/Northern Ireland cultural working group, led by my Department. The group involves key agencies here and in the United States, including the Northern Ireland Bureau, the Ulster-Scots Agency, PRONI, Tourism Northern Ireland and Tourism Ireland. The group is working to identify new opportunities and to develop a programme of cultural engagement in the United States and in Northern Ireland.”
“The contribution and influence that the early Ulster-Scots migrants made to the traditions, values and history of the United States of America is immeasurable. From the American Revolution, including the signing of the Declaration of Independence and the war of independence, through to the establishment and development of a new nation, Ulster-Scots settlers played a hugely important role. Indeed, no fewer than 20 of the 45 men who have served as President of the United States can trace their roots to Ulster, including, of course, Andrew Jackson, whose parents left Carrickfergus, in my constituency, in 1765.”
“First of all, it is important to note that Casement Park is separate from the Northern Ireland football fund. Those are two separate issues. They are not linked to each other. The Member may not be happy with what I am about to say, but it has not changed since the last time we discussed it in the Chamber. The Casement Park redevelopment, in its current form, does not have the funding package together. We do not have that commitment from the UK Government. That is what is holding up any progression on that issue. I expect to get further information on that when the new Government are in post.”
“That work is ongoing. We hope to provide additional funding to help those that want to progress their case. If there are specific clubs or issues that the Member has in mind, I will be more than happy to provide that information.”
“Again, I emphasise the point that we want to work with clubs. We are not trying to catch anybody out. We are not trying to make sure that clubs cannot avail themselves of the fund. We will help them through the process so that they can indicate how their application will make a difference, how it will fulfil a need and how it will improve the community overall.”
“The criteria are still being finalised. I hope that the Member listened to the speech that I made at Windsor Park, although, unfortunately, it may have been overshadowed somewhat by an announcement that the Prime Minister made on the same day. We will be setting out a number of criteria against which clubs will be scored. Clubs will need to make a number of commitments. First, a monetary commitment will need to be made. We need to make sure that clubs are financially viable, because there is no point in building something that they are not able to maintain. They will also need to demonstrate how the facility is going to improve their community and how they will get more young people and women involved, and they will need to make sure that there is disability provision. Those are all factors that will be taken into consideration.”
“I am absolutely committed to working in partnership with clubs and other important stakeholders, such as councils, to make sure that funding is delivered.”
“First, I put it on record that I am sure that every constituency across Northern Ireland has fantastic football clubs that do fantastic work, and I am sure that they are all in need of resource. The Member mentions her constituency and makes an important point about the council. In many cases, councils have been essential partners in some of the development that we have seen take place so far. Under the Northern Ireland football fund, that will also be the case. It is important that councils work closely with the Department to deliver funding. It is worth making the point that, when it comes to applications to the fund, it is not about a pass or a fail. Rather, we want to work together with clubs to ensure that they get to the position that they need to get to so that they can avail themselves of the funding when it becomes available.”
“Sport, and participation in sport, can go a long way to ensuring that we have happier and healthier citizens in Northern Ireland. There is clearly a need in East Belfast, as there will be in many other constituencies, and we stand ready to help. I look forward to accepting the Member's invitation.”
“Yes, I am more than happy to meet the Member in his constituency. He has already had me down to visit a club or two, and I am happy to go again. He highlights an important issue — the lack of provision in East Belfast — but, unfortunately, the issue is not unique to East Belfast. It is very much the case in East Antrim as well. In fact, I know of many examples of young people who are being turned away from playing, simply because clubs do not have the pitch capacity that is required. It is important for me that performance clubs get the support that they need, but it is also important that we make a difference to grassroots provision. I say that because football has an impact on people's mental and physical health and well-being.”
“The Northern Ireland football fund — formerly called the "subregional stadia programme" — will provide investment for football at all levels. I want to roll out the first funding awards as quickly as possible. However, it is important that the funding is disbursed in a fair and transparent manner. Therefore, my officials are finalising plans for my approval, and I plan to make further announcements later this year.”
“I will also look at novel options that may be available to us to enable us to increase the supply of housing.”
“Yes, I did so in my engagement with the Finance Minister prior to the Budget's being set. In conversations with Ministers, I made clear the impact that that would have. I am not sure whether I gave an exact number for the impact that it would have on housebuilding, but it was always clear that a constrained capital budget would impact on housebuilding, given that the majority of my capital budget is and always has been spent on building houses. <BR /> <BR />I understand that there are pressures in every Department. I would like to have had more money. We have to work together. We have to do the best that we can with what we have. It underlines the need for us to ensure that we get that fair funding agreement with the Treasury. In the meantime, I will do the best that I can with what I have.”
“At this point, we are in real danger of allowing some of our existing stock to simply become uninhabitable. I absolutely want to see that change. <BR /> <BR />I have been pressing Executive colleagues. Obviously, it will require engagement with the Treasury, and it is not appropriate for any Department other than the Department of Finance to do that, but, from discussions with Executive colleagues, I believe that there is cross-party support to see that change, because, ultimately, it will allow us to build more homes and to make a real change and difference to people's lives. That is what we should be here to do.”
“When I first came into office, this was one of the first things that I raised with officials, because we are not in a good enough place right now when it comes to housing. I fear that we will be dealing with constrained budgets for the foreseeable future, and the status quo just is not acceptable. We need to do things differently. We are exploring options. Last week, there was a useful Innovation Lab meeting, and I look forward to getting a read-out from that. <BR /> <BR />There are not many real game changers in this place, but one that we can have for Northern Ireland is the transformation of the Housing Executive's borrowing powers. That would be good for two reasons. The first is that it would be able to build more social homes. The second is that it would be able to renovate or refurbish social homes as well.”
“I assure the Member that I will do everything in my power to ensure that we continue to invest in social homes and make the most of the funds that we have.”